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Stormcast Eternals 3.0 - There is no "a" in Vindictors


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1 hour ago, Marcvs said:

this is the episode I assume https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxwbcfT1fF8 but I can't tell what's the specific point to which the other posters are referring -I stopped watching when they suggested to use the Imperatant to have a 7" charge with the dragons.

 

Yup I've seen that. Seems like they had a look at the codex a month ago, formed their opinion and misremembered most of the rules while claiming things are OP. Good times. ^^

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18 hours ago, Celestantpants said:

I don't even know what to say about that reveal from facehammer.  What an absolute joke.  This is literally the worst battletome release they have ever done.  Can't wait for the next tomes to release with broken stuff that stays broken for most of the edition while continuing nerfs to Stormcast occur.  After all, Stormcast don't need to be play tested, just wait to see what loud people say and then nerf accordingly.  Who needs data?  I mean, besides every other army in AOS and every army in 40k.  

I mean, if GW isn't going to play test and instead do whatever the anti stormcast mob suggests, what should be next?  Since they are going to change the dragons warscroll tge sky is the limit!  Maybe change fulminators to damage 2 on the charge with 4 attacks and rend 1 on the charge in addition to the points nerf? 

Maybe change the imperitant's deep strike ability to only work on redeemer units?

Maybe get rid of save stacking for Stormcast only because we already have good saves? 

Maybe reduce the shots longstrikes get by 1 for each model in addition to point hikes?  

How about reducing the vindictors save to a 4+ and make the shield a 6+ ward against mortal wounds from magic spells only?  

I mean, like I said, if they are just going to abdicate playtesting and do what angry haters suggest then why not those changes sooner or later?  What an absolute farce.

I 100% disagree with that. If we are speaking about how competitive stormcast are, they are in a good spot now. In 2.0 it was one of worst army in the game, now in every single tournemant all over the world they pretty mutch always got 4-1 . Sometimes 5-0.

I dont think translocation prey nerf is a big deal in this army. Fulminators and logstrike are prob the best units in the game and tgere are many playable list/ units amd combos.

About stormdrakes their warscroll is the same. Prob one of the best warscroll in the game. You can still fit into a list 4 drakes and 6 longstrike , so I dont see a reason to cry about STCE!😓

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14 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

I 100% disagree with that. If we are speaking about how competitive stormcast are, they are in a good spot now. In 2.0 it was one of worst army in the game, now in every single tournemant all over the world they pretty mutch always got 4-1 . Sometimes 5-0.

I dont think translocation prey nerf is a big deal in this army. Fulminators and logstrike are prob the best units in the game and tgere are many playable list/ units amd combos.

About stormdrakes their warscroll is the same. Prob one of the best warscroll in the game. You can still fit into a list 4 drakes and 6 longstrike , so I dont see a reason to cry about STCE!😓

Thanks for this sensible opinion

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22 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

I 100% disagree with that. If we are speaking about how competitive stormcast are, they are in a good spot now. In 2.0 it was one of worst army in the game, now in every single tournemant all over the world they pretty mutch always got 4-1 . Sometimes 5-0.

I dont think translocation prey nerf is a big deal in this army. Fulminators and logstrike are prob the best units in the game and tgere are many playable list/ units amd combos.

About stormdrakes their warscroll is the same. Prob one of the best warscroll in the game. You can still fit into a list 4 drakes and 6 longstrike , so I dont see a reason to cry about STCE!😓

..........you completely misunderstand what I meant by worst battletome release.  It isn't the worst ever as far as being competitive.  It's the worst ever because it has had so many changes in so short a period of time that completely outdate and invalidate a very expensive book.  It's the worst ever due to how half ***ed and poorly they did with internal balance, wording, and play testing.  No Tome should have this many changes this quickly unless it's free.  Certainly not at the price they are asking.  It just shows how incompetent they are that this many changes needed to happen this fast.  The book should have been released in a better state.  

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3 hours ago, Andrethegreat said:

Yeah, but that sucks on GW part, how do they know what works and what do not?

They dont. They have a general idea how things 'should' work but thats what play testing and beta periods are for. And that goes for anything no matter what it is.  When something new is made you put it through trials for a bit a time to iron out any bumps that might raise up. 

GW doesnt play test anything. My guess is they send out a rough draft of rules to certain youtuber's and influencers, they read it, give feedback, then GW ships it.

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11 hours ago, Celestantpants said:

..........you completely misunderstand what I meant by worst battletome release.  It isn't the worst ever as far as being competitive.  It's the worst ever because it has had so many changes in so short a period of time that completely outdate and invalidate a very expensive book.  It's the worst ever due to how half ***ed and poorly they did with internal balance, wording, and play testing.  No Tome should have this many changes this quickly unless it's free.  Certainly not at the price they are asking.  It just shows how incompetent they are that this many changes needed to happen this fast.  The book should have been released in a better state.  

Are they that diferent from when the tome was released? I mean, yes, points can change in the first FAQ (that happens a lot), and some mechanics are explained a bit better (Ex.: Translocate). But I don't know if SCE has any "Grundstock Thunderes syndrome" (that means, changing a loadout and invalidating 25% of your troops choice).

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19 hours ago, Celestantpants said:

..........you completely misunderstand what I meant by worst battletome release.  It isn't the worst ever as far as being competitive.  It's the worst ever because it has had so many changes in so short a period of time that completely outdate and invalidate a very expensive book.  It's the worst ever due to how half ***ed and poorly they did with internal balance, wording, and play testing.  No Tome should have this many changes this quickly unless it's free.  Certainly not at the price they are asking.  It just shows how incompetent they are that this many changes needed to happen this fast.  The book should have been released in a better state.  

Yes, tomes shouldn't need this much fixing. But that's just bog standard GW. I don't think you've been in this hobby long if you genuinely believe this was their most catastrophic rules launch ever. It's not even in recent memory, even if we restrict ourselves just to just AoS lol

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What you doing guys.

I gonna get one big dragon to keep company to my black dragon and dragonlord but i cant decide how build it(i gonna see id posible magnet the options)

Rule of cool:kazaly(melle dragon)

Rule of competitive: krondys

I prefer the visual of the melle but not for big gap and play every game as proxy to krondys feel im better building krondrys

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Alright, I have my three gamer tomorrow and here's what I've settled on if anyone has any last minute advice!

Hammers of Sigmar, Scions of the Storm, Pillars of Belief, Thunderbolt Volley.

Lord Relictor - General, Mirror, Translocate, High Priest

Lord Castellant - Arcane Tome, Chain Lightning

Knight Incantor - Lightning Blast

3x2 Fulminators

2x3 Aetherwings

2x5 Vindictors

1x6 Raptors - Longstrikes

I chose to go with the Castellant to try to get two units of Fulminators on 2+ just to keep them living longer. Aetherwings and Vindictors make a castle around the Longstrikes(if I deploy them) and can teleport the Aethwings around as needed.

I am considering dropping the Castellant in order to take 2x10 Skinks for some more chaff, but don't think I will this time around. I sit at 99 wounds and 7 drops.

 

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The lance is probably preferable, same potential damage output on a charge (or slightly better for the Prime) with -2 instead of -1 rend. Given the unit's role as a kind of alpha striker with the hero phase charge potential, it seems the ideal situation is to hero phase charge, delete a unit, then charge again in the charge phase and delete that unit, and you have a bit of a better chance with lances. The way the lance ability is worded though, is that it increases damage and rend if you made a charge "that turn", so getting a hero phase charge and not totally eliminating the target does mean you'll still be on the higher rend + damage for the fight phase.

That said, since you're rolling fewer attacks the variance is a bit higher, and they are obviously quite a bit weaker if you get bogged down in a long combat. I think that's somewhat unlikely with decent target selection though.

In addition, although points changes were confirmed already, there are also rumours of warscroll changes in the winter FAQ. If you can, it might be better to hold off on building them until then just to be sure (or magnetising if you like to do that).

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Played my first game with the new book last night, just against a friend who is new so we forgot a fair amount of stuff. Overall was pretty happy with how it went although I did have to grind out the VPs to win in the end.

My list was:

Scions (Celestial Vindicators)

Lord-Relictor / Lord-Castellant / LA on Tauralon / Knight-Incantor

3x 5 Libs

6 Longstrikes / 4 Fulminators

His list:

FEC (Blisterskin)

AAR / AKoTG / AKoZD / Infernal Courtier

6 Flayers / 2x3 Flayers

Battleplan was Savage Gains.

I was 2 drop, went first, used Thunderbolt Volley to shoot off the Zombie Dragon, wiggled about a bit and dropped the Liberators in to screen / claim objectives. I should probably have gone for the Terrorgheist though because he got his spell off, ran 22'', charged another 11'' and managed to drop right in a gap, killed my Knight Incantor, ate 2 Fulminators, piled in again and ate another one, luckily Unleash Hell and the last Fulminator had him down to 9 wounds.

Turn 2 he won priority, took the double, used the big unit of Flayers to kill half the Longstrikes, who killed 3 back, the TG then massively whiffed and couldn't kill the last Fulminator who, combined with the Castellant who had got dragged in on his second pile in turn 1, brought him down. My turn I TP'd the Longstrikes out of combat and killed a smaller unit of Flayers to get my battle tactic.

After the bloodbath of the first two rounds the game went the total opposite direction and pretty much nothing else died, got the AAR with the last Fulminator and he cleaned up 2 of the Liberators, but the two Lords in particular just refused to die and the Infernal kept bringing back Flayers everywhere.

Ended the game at the end of turn 4 when I won the priority roll and the FEC wouldn't have been able to secure enough points to get the win. Got the win 29-23.

Overall I like this list a lot, I think I just need to play it out a lot more. Made too many silly little mistakes especially with my positioning.

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Hey guys, preordered my dragons today. Have an upcoming event in 2 1/2 weeks. This is the list I will try to run. You have any suggestions, tips? Not sure about which command trait I should take. What do you think?
 

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: Hallowed Knights
- Grand Strategy: 
- Triumphs: 

Leaders
Gardus Steel Soul (160)
Knight-Draconis (300)
- General
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
Lord-Relictor (145)

Battleline
4 x Stormdrake Guard (680)
- Swords
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Liberators (115)
- Heavens-wrought Weapon and Shield
5 x Liberators (115)
- Heavens-wrought Weapon and Shield

Units
6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (480)
- Reinforced x 1



Total: 1995 / 2000

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2 hours ago, Erdemo86 said:

Hey guys, preordered my dragons today. Have an upcoming event in 2 1/2 weeks. This is the list I will try to run. You have any suggestions, tips? Not sure about which command trait I should take. What do you think?
 

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: Hallowed Knights
- Grand Strategy: 
- Triumphs: 

Leaders
Gardus Steel Soul (160)
Knight-Draconis (300)
- General
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
Lord-Relictor (145)

Battleline
4 x Stormdrake Guard (680)
- Swords
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Liberators (115)
- Heavens-wrought Weapon and Shield
5 x Liberators (115)
- Heavens-wrought Weapon and Shield

Units
6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (480)
- Reinforced x 1



Total: 1995 / 2000

Battle lust I think it's called. Reroll run and charge rolls. If you're doing amulet, that's what I'd go with along with retreat and charge mount trait.

Otherwise Master Of magic, arcane tome, scintillating trail is an option for a mystic shield on the drakes and a rerollable unbind.

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Shock and Awe is the other choice for a general who's not a priest, wizard, or stardrake. It's not amazing, but it does some interesting things if you get first turn, which you should be able to shoot for.

Arcane Tome+Flaming Weapon does give the Knight-Draconis a pretty spicy melee weapon, though.

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4 hours ago, mojojojo101 said:

Played my first game with the new book last night, just against a friend who is new so we forgot a fair amount of stuff. Overall was pretty happy with how it went although I did have to grind out the VPs to win in the end.

My list was:

Scions (Celestial Vindicators)

Lord-Relictor / Lord-Castellant / LA on Tauralon / Knight-Incantor

3x 5 Libs

6 Longstrikes / 4 Fulminators

His list:

FEC (Blisterskin)

AAR / AKoTG / AKoZD / Infernal Courtier

6 Flayers / 2x3 Flayers

Battleplan was Savage Gains.

I was 2 drop, went first, used Thunderbolt Volley to shoot off the Zombie Dragon, wiggled about a bit and dropped the Liberators in to screen / claim objectives. I should probably have gone for the Terrorgheist though because he got his spell off, ran 22'', charged another 11'' and managed to drop right in a gap, killed my Knight Incantor, ate 2 Fulminators, piled in again and ate another one, luckily Unleash Hell and the last Fulminator had him down to 9 wounds.

Turn 2 he won priority, took the double, used the big unit of Flayers to kill half the Longstrikes, who killed 3 back, the TG then massively whiffed and couldn't kill the last Fulminator who, combined with the Castellant who had got dragged in on his second pile in turn 1, brought him down. My turn I TP'd the Longstrikes out of combat and killed a smaller unit of Flayers to get my battle tactic.

After the bloodbath of the first two rounds the game went the total opposite direction and pretty much nothing else died, got the AAR with the last Fulminator and he cleaned up 2 of the Liberators, but the two Lords in particular just refused to die and the Infernal kept bringing back Flayers everywhere.

Ended the game at the end of turn 4 when I won the priority roll and the FEC wouldn't have been able to secure enough points to get the win. Got the win 29-23.

Overall I like this list a lot, I think I just need to play it out a lot more. Made too many silly little mistakes especially with my positioning.

Nice list and good game. I just got back from a couple games and the Fulminators were my MVPs, too bad you lost them early.

I only ended up playing two games and the first was Archaon Tzeentch with Kairos, savage gains.

We were both 8 drops and he finished first so he took first. My Longstrikes were placed kind of center of my deployment and in range of Kairos, and he was probably nervous of them so kept Archaon off to my left. He did his buff spells and I Voided Mystic Shield on Kairos. Moved up and took both side objectives and summoned more screamers and scored 7.

My turn, I knew Kairos was the lynch-pin so I TV'ed him down to about 4 wounds left. I kept one unit of Fulms in the sky and brought them down behind Kairos and 10 Acolytes. I charge 2 Fulms into a bunch of the screamers and magister on the right objective and moved up a bit on the left, blocking any moves by archaon with positioning.

Totally blew away Kairos with the Longstrikes, and then re-rolled the 9 inch charge into the Acolytes killing all 10 and taking his back objective. Got 8 points. With Bring it Down on Kairos.

Didn't get the double, so he needed to chase the 2 Fulms in his back lines with Archaon, and they survived with 3 wounds left. he couldn't move much and his magic phase was lackluster without Kairos. He did score 7 but thinkgs were going my way. He got another 7 points.

My turn I believe I sniped both his Blue Scribes and Magister with the Longstrikes. I think I finished off most of the screamers and got my Vindictors on the points to take it with conquer scoring me 7.

Still missed the double as it would probably be over, but the Fulm who was in combat with Archaon I retreated to the edge of the objective so he had to chase me. At this point I believe he had Archaon, the Sorc Lord, 3 Screamers on the left objective and a few left on the right. He summoned 10 Blues to take the left objective for conquer. He scored 5, killed the fulminator, I still had four left.

Bottom 3 I believe I moved up 2 Fulminators to charge Archaon but he redeployed 5 inches, which led me to make a mistake in that I didn't move my Longstrikes up in the movement phase and then they were out of range to shoot! I failed the charge on Archaon, but had the last two Fulms in position to counter charge once Archaon charged those other Fulms. Was able to kill enough Blue Horrors to take the left side objective and score Aggressive Expansion, scoring 7.

Still didn't get the double, but he charged the Fulminators, killing one. That's about it, tried to get the objective for killing a Battleline unit but wasn't able to. This was pretty much it, but we played my turn 4.

I was able to Translocate my Relicotor and move the remaining unit of Raptors into his territory for Savage gains. Then Took Archaon down a to something like 5 or 6 wounds left, charged in the remaining Fulminators and killed Archaon. We called it there. Fun game and great opponent, I can't really believe my plans came together, but killing Kairos I knew would be key.

Second game, there's not much to say. I played Giants for the first time and got doubled turn 2, so really had no chance and got stomped. Made a lot of dumb mistakes, but I didn't know what the giants would be like. I even forgot to TV on my first hero phase... ugh.

With AoD and the Latern from the Castellant on a unit of Fulminators, they were able to tank a gargant only taking 3 wounds in two round of combat. I did roll well though!

Take away from the Sons game, would be I should have killed his baby giants, and not forgotten Thunderbolt Volley, and also played much more conservatively after being given the first turn. He was a 2 drop, so I think if I specifically played him again, trying to get to a one drop would be beneficial, and taking some Annihilators. I also think a unit of 4 Fulminators or 4 Concussors would be really good, not just two.

Anyway, fun couple games, thanks for all the advice.

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2 hours ago, schwabbele said:

Am I too picky or are the paintjobs on warcom for the dragons just meh? I mean Vince did great but the orher ones 🤷‍♂️

It's all a question of taste. I thought several of them were stunning, bit there were a few that didn't really appeal to me. Vince's was stunning but I consider myself biased on that, as I enjoy Warhammer Weekly and occasionally indulge in his painting and hobby tutorials.

I think my favorite was Richard Gray's red Karazai, with special mention to Hannah Leppanen's purple and cream Krondys.

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Have only played one game against warclans since dominion and that was with the old book - has someone had some experience with playing against kharadrons? 1500P against a lot of sky vessels and flying dwarves. In second edition they always flew out of reach and shot at me... I hardly saw melee. Any suggestions for a list? Don't have the new dragon guys but what units might be good against them? We're not playing competitive but the last game against overlords shocked me quite bad.

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