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Posted (edited)

So my takes after a quick skim through the leaks:

Cursed City models all for one price still sucks and is just lazy.

At a glance most of the spells are the same.

pretty much every vamp on foot has the exact same attack profile, lazy again!

honestly feels that whoever wrote this just had zero time to really sink their teeth into it and actually come up with fun and interesting rules and they’ve just balanced the book based on how they performed 2-3 years ago. 
 

GW seem to put all their love into these beautiful models but then are happy to release half assed rules for them. 40K gets less love models wise but it feels like they put real effort into the rules, not from a balanced view but at least you can see they actually bother to look at each unit and make significant changes. Well I was ready to drop a shed load of money on this but seeing these half baked rules I’ll think I’ll save myself for those awesome new 40k Orks! 
 

if you’re happy with these leaks then I’m truly happy for you but me and others having sour grapes about the army is just as valid an opinion as yours. 

Edited by GutrotSpume
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14 minutes ago, warhammernerd said:

But there are lots of other ways to get their damage and wound rolls increased, plus they are battle line now. An improvement.

......

Bats have move 14”, and work nicely within a new batallion. They almost never saw action before, now they will. Improved.

I too love the new improved Black Knights! They're so much stronger! They even left their shields at home so they wouldn't be burdened as much! 

Same for the fell bats, they're just so badass! I can't wait to see them try to make it through at least one round of combat to try and use their retreat and charge rule! 

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not to mention that are no more NH or morghasts or arkhan - and don't tell me I can still bring nh as allies because as far as I know most of the Lon players had tons of chainrasps, grimghasts and hexwraiths since they were the units which enabled us to survive the meta at all.

this is the second time in like 2 years time where a new book invalidates a part of my collections. First one was my transition from WHFB to aos2 and now this ******. 

Outrage.

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It seems my fears have been confirmed..... I can't see me sinking my cash into this army right now..... Unless there's something huge we've missed?

Sigh .... Now i need to figure out a new army again....... Maybe i'll just give in and play stormcast :/ 

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2 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said:

So no Change on generic V Lord on Dragon?

Got the same +dmg from charge Prince V got. Lost the Chalice. Shield is baked into the profile now. Lost the CA. Slightly cheaper points

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Just now, Malakithe said:

Im kinda leaning towards this as well assuming the dont f-up their new stuff too

Isn't that rewarding GW for ****** up our faction? ;)

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Posted (edited)

have anyone seen the Neferata or skeletons warscroll?

I think that Covern Throne, Blood knights, zombies, Mannfred and a few more are useful. I'm not sure that Princess V would be better now

A lot of attacks on +4 (the bats are a joke, 3 attacks per model on +4+4). 

Edited by Sartxac
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One thing I’ve spotted that is hilarious is Varghiests now being able to deepstrike which is a better ability than the alliegence that they become battleline in 🤷🏻‍♂️🤣

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I´m not sure about if I will change vampires for IDK for the ETC, and I´m waiting for battalions/Skellies/Neferata, but...

Mannfred is so god.

Zombis are amazing.

BK...uff. Cool.

 

I´m thinking about BK clan with Avengori+First Strike zombie dragon, some zombies (40-80) with corpse chariot, some RD vargheist and knigths (not sure if 15 or some units of 10). Vampire hero for sure in order to boost zombies. If we have points, even some grave guards too. Lot´s of horde models with mortal wounds, fast chaff, and heroes. Probably avengori general (alpha strike with run&charge dragon, later we can do the same with the avengori, during the first turns the avengori can heal the dragon). I need to see 

 

Also Mannfred wizard conclaves can be so good too, but too many paints for a phase that can be good or bad depends of the OP army that we can have in front.

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4 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

Buying units with sh*t rules is letting them get away with it imho

Basically, it's lose-lose if you're buying from them ;) 

Nah I'm really hoping that GW will address the issues in the book, I'm just wondering if the drop in sales will be enough to make them pause and look into it. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, warhammernerd said:

But sure, I couldn’t give a dogs dinner about those who wanna sulk and feel it’s all terrible. As I said prev, all feelings are of course valid, but there is AS ALWAYS those amongst us who massively overreact and fail to see the good and instead wanna focus on the negative, which in this case I hand on heart can say is very little.

That’s a bit self-righteous isn‘t it?
To summarize the good and the bad - All of this is just my opinion and no fact!

If you loved your black knights for example (I have 20 of them), then the book is a wet towel slap to the face.

If you have a hell lot of converted generic foot vampires: Slap in the face

If you‘d actually loved to play Nagash: Third slap in the face

All the Chariots and Palanquins remained boring and overcosted: Slap 

Magic Lore: Slap

Actually Creative new rules, since this book is new, no longer a gap filler: Massive slap

Magic Items, about 40-50% are one use only with a chance to do nothing: Slap

Bat Swarms: Slap

Mortarch Stats: Slap

Neferata actually using her spy network in the rules: Slap

Most Battle Traits and abilities have a too small wholly within range: Slap

Almost no synergies (why should a Wught King grant a Bonus to deathrattle as their Leader, that‘d been absurd!): Slap

Gravesites: Slap

Fell Bats: ???

If you expected well adjusted points: Massive Slap

That‘s the negatives.

——————-

On the Good side:

Blood Knight became better

Some Battle Traits are actually cool and thematic (Kastelie), Vyrkos, Legion of Night (partly), Vyrkos (this faction might be the best)

Zombies + Corpse Carts are good

The Vamptaures are good (yet not everybody likes them)

that‘s it imo.

 

——

A little background: I‘ve been playing Vampires since 2012. I loved LoN, though it had its weaknesses. Yet it was fun to play.

When I compare these two books I feel that the fun has been replaced by blandness and unnecessary rules changes (no more lance charge for Black Knights, yet they cost a bunch of points)

overall: Yes I am angry. I don‘t feel like I overreacted, yet this book is truly one big slap in the face. The rules seem outdated.

I‘d wished for a reimagining of the warscrolls with actually cool new abilities that make the army and its units viable and fun. Especially the Coven Throne and the Palanquin would have needed a complete overhaul imo. The way things stand now they made unity no body played before worse or insignificantly better, which avails to nothing. 😕


I love that at least some people like it, all the best to you guys and girls. Yet I am feeling unexpectedly disappointed especially since this book will be around for another 2-5 years before anything will change. 

 

Edited by JackStreicher
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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

That’s a bit self-righteous isn‘t it? If you loved your black knights for example (I have 20 of them), then the book is a wet towel slap to the face.

If you have a hell lot of converted generic foot vampires: Slap in the face

If you‘d actually loved to play Nagash: Third slap in the face

All the Chariots and Palanquins remained boring and overcosted: Slap 

Magic Lore: Slap

Actually Creative new rules, since this book is new, no longer a gap filler: Massive slap

Magic Items, about 40-50% are one use only with a chance to do nothing: Slap

Bat Swarms: Slap

Mortarch Stats: Slap

Neferata actually using her spy network in the rules: Slap

Most Battle Traits and abilities have a too small wholly within range: Slap

Almost no synergies (why should a Wught King grant a Bonus to deathrattle as their Leader, that‘d been absurd!): Slap

Gravesites: Slap

Fell Bats: ???

If you expected well adjusted points: Massive Slap

That‘s the negatives.

——————-

On the Good side:

Blood Knight became better

Some Battle Traits are actually cool and thematic (Kastelie), Vyrkos, Legion of Night (partly), Vyrkos (this faction might be the best)

Zombies + Corpse Carts are good

The Vamptaures are good (yet not everybody likes them)

that‘s it imo.

 

——

A little background: I‘ve been playing Vampires since 2012. I loved LoN, though it had its weaknesses. Yet it was fun to play.

When I compare these two books I feel that the fun has been replaced by blandness and unnecessary rules changes (no more lance charge for Black Knights, yet they cost a bunch of points)

overall: Yes I am angry. I don‘t feel like I overreacted, yet this book is truly one big slap in the face. The rules seem outdated.

I‘d wished for a reimagining of the warscrolls with actually cool new abilities that make the army and its units viable and fun. Especially the Coven Throne and the Palanquin would have needed a complete overhaul imo. The way things stand now they made unity no body played before worse or insignificantly better, which avails to nothing. 😕


I love that at least some people like it, all the best to you guys and girls. Yet I am feeling unexpectedly disappointed especially since this book will be around for another 2-5 years before anything will change. 

 

I agree except for the part of Covern Throne, i think that has a extraordinary useful spell. You coult stop any miniature during 1 turn (obtain a +10 with 3 rolls is easy).

Maybe in AOS3 every miniature that charges would fight first (like 40k). Very useful for Mannfredd and Blood Knigts.

The problem is that we haven't mount traits again. I'm not sure that Vampire Lord On ZD and Vhordrai will be good miniatures and the stats of the vampire dragon with +4 to hit... I think that Vhordrai need her spell in hirself and +7 whithout plusses is too bad in the actual meta... You need a corpse cart or a mortis engine to do this best. And now the mortis Engine is worst... (now can't heal death miniatures)

 

Edited by Sartxac
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5 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

That’s a bit self-righteous isn‘t it?
To summarize the good and the bad - All of this is just my opinion and no fact!

If you loved your black knights for example (I have 20 of them), then the book is a wet towel slap to the face.

If you have a hell lot of converted generic foot vampires: Slap in the face

If you‘d actually loved to play Nagash: Third slap in the face

All the Chariots and Palanquins remained boring and overcosted: Slap 

Magic Lore: Slap

Actually Creative new rules, since this book is new, no longer a gap filler: Massive slap

Magic Items, about 40-50% are one use only with a chance to do nothing: Slap

Bat Swarms: Slap

Mortarch Stats: Slap

Neferata actually using her spy network in the rules: Slap

Most Battle Traits and abilities have a too small wholly within range: Slap

Almost no synergies (why should a Wught King grant a Bonus to deathrattle as their Leader, that‘d been absurd!): Slap

Gravesites: Slap

Fell Bats: ???

If you expected well adjusted points: Massive Slap

That‘s the negatives.

——————-

On the Good side:

Blood Knight became better

Some Battle Traits are actually cool and thematic (Kastelie), Vyrkos, Legion of Night (partly), Vyrkos (this faction might be the best)

Zombies + Corpse Carts are good

The Vamptaures are good (yet not everybody likes them)

that‘s it imo.

 

——

A little background: I‘ve been playing Vampires since 2012. I loved LoN, though it had its weaknesses. Yet it was fun to play.

When I compare these two books I feel that the fun has been replaced by blandness and unnecessary rules changes (no more lance charge for Black Knights, yet they cost a bunch of points)

overall: Yes I am angry. I don‘t feel like I overreacted, yet this book is truly one big slap in the face. The rules seem outdated.

I‘d wished for a reimagining of the warscrolls with actually cool new abilities that make the army and its units viable and fun. Especially the Coven Throne and the Palanquin would have needed a complete overhaul imo. The way things stand now they made unity no body played before worse or insignificantly better, which avails to nothing. 😕


I love that at least some people like it, all the best to you guys and girls. Yet I am feeling unexpectedly disappointed especially since this book will be around for another 2-5 years before anything will change. 

 

Well said. Perhaps a bit on the pessimistic side, the coven throne and corpse carts don't seem too bad. 
 

In general though, I am disappointed by how boring the new rules are. The warscrolls (aside from Blood Knights and Vengorian Lords) seem quite uninspired. 
I do think we can get some quite strong builds going with this army. However, to do so I think we'll have to resort to abusing units (such as grave guard) which is not what it should be about. 

And yeah, sure, list building on the competitive scene is all about taking advantage of the most efficient units and exploiting that to the max. However, I think we're going to have to do that just to compete in regular matched play games. 

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7 minutes ago, Sartxac said:

I agree except for the part of Covern Throne, i think that has a extraordinary useful spell. You coult stop any miniature during 1 turn (obtain a +10 with 3 rolls is easy).

Maybe in AOS3 every miniature that charges would fight first (like 40k). Very useful for Mannfredd and Blood Knigts.

The problem is that we haven't mount traits again. I'm not sure that Vampire Lord On ZD and Vhordrai will be good miniatures and the stats of the vampire dragon with +4 to hit...

 

Useful spell but still a giant easy to kill overcosted support unit

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1 minute ago, Malakithe said:

Useful spell but still a giant easy to kill overcosted support unit

That command ability though...

+1 to hit, wound and save for a unit from the start of your hero phase to your next hero phase. It's insane. And it works on Soulblight Gravelords units, not just on summonable, any unit...

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3 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

Useful spell but still a giant easy to kill overcosted support unit

My issue with spells is: 3 enemy armies won’t let you cast a spell. (Sera, LRL, Tzeentch). So I do not value spells at all (in this edition).

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Think there is some filth to be had with this book. Who else is thinking of using the new skellies as graveguard 😂 don’t see it being an issue if you don’t include normal skellies. 2 blobs of 30 with a coven throne popping their CA on both of them and they are 2’s and 2’s with a 3+

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6 minutes ago, Aren73 said:

That command ability though...

+1 to hit, wound and save for a unit from the start of your hero phase to your next hero phase. It's insane. And it works on Soulblight Gravelords units, not just on summonable, any unit...

Oh! I completely missed that! I thought it was a spell 😍

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On 4/4/2021 at 8:51 AM, Dracan said:

Hope might just be the first step on the road to disappointment... 

GW have done quite a few books from pre book era warscrolls in 1st till now that took warscrolls and kept them as is or with very few changes. Especially ones where there weren't inherent problems. 

While skellies/zombies/vampires might not be exciting or amazing, they are stable enough. 

So IMO warscroll not changing is more likely than not with this rewrite, esp since we have seen that they were unwilling to do said rewrite/update for CC. 

Faction rules will change though, so maybe there is still hope for changing gameplay style but hoping the warscrolls change i think is folly.

I sometimes feel like there are only 2 people writing books for AoS, one is obviously an elf fan and the other doesnt really like aos, but neither of them actually play matched play 2000pts games... 

Sad Panda for being right 😢 

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