Aturox Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 There are no skeleton warriors leaked right now or am i mistaken? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotz Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 lots of posts this morning and I don't know if this has been discussed yet, but there is a slight change with the generals. Now its not mandatory for the bloodline named character to be the general. Just gains the general treatment in addition to whatever we've designed as army general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 8 minutes ago, warhammernerd said: Beginning to feel we need two separate threads, the lovers and haters. No, that would just be sad and so unproductive. How about, instead of bashing what I have to say you instead try convincing me why you think some things are good? I'm somewhat reasonable I'm up for convincing. Just give me a good argument. We can try approaching this like two adults, both of whom see an aspect of what's there, where we can both learn from each other? If you lock all the negative people in one place then it will just make an echo chamber and no-ones opinions will change. But if we're all talking together then maybe we can cool off each other's extreme opinions and arrive at a reasonable consensus? 2 minutes ago, Raptor_Jesues said: it really depends on how many knights you have. You need some battleline for vrykos so consider adding skellies/zombies/wolves or running kastelai instead with bloodknights battleline I was thinking wight king to make the grave guard batteline, but then I sacrifice the command trait... Legion of night would make the Vargheists battleline but I don't like the rest of their rules sadly Kastellai would be cool to make the Blood Knights battleline, I'll probably still have to take some tax units there though, not into running 3 units of BK. In think really I have two options. Either I push into Vyrkos and have a wight king and a large block of Grave Guard (with that +1 to wound they are tasty). Or I go for the full vampire route with Kastelai, which I do think is probably weaker but does sound more fun. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptor_Jesues Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, GutrotSpume said: You’re more than welcome to set up a separate thread where you all high five each other for unconditionally loving a product a billion dollar company have released with the sole purpose of extracting as much money as possible from you. we definetly need both sides, that is how you find the gold. And when you get the gold you get the power and when you get the power you get the ladies 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Raptor_Jesues said: oh boy, just noticed that vargheits are vampires (TITANIC DUH FOR ME) my kastelai army got even better, yay Holy hell, you are right ❤️ Mind changed about Kastlai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptor_Jesues Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Just now, JackStreicher said: Holy hell, you are right ❤️ Mind changed about Kastlai it is FAIRLY OBVIOUS when you think about it, i feel a bit dumb for missing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Syf Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 The only things I find really strange is mounted vampire lord being gone and Grave guard staying with an old kit when the new skegs look more elite than they do. Everything else I'm pretty happy with, wich is weird as I spent most of my time before we had any info doom mongering, whereas now a lot of people who were optimistic beforehand are rubbishing it. I blame Tzeentch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aturox Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I hope it wont be faqed to affect only specific units like LoB used to be :X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptor_Jesues Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 minute ago, El Syf said: The only things I find really strange is mounted vampire lord being gone and Grave guard staying with an old kit when the new skegs look more elite than they do. Everything else I'm pretty happy with, wich is weird as I spent most of my time before we had any info doom mongering, whereas now a lot of people who were optimistic beforehand are rubbishing it. I blame Tzeentch! DANG YOU TZEENTZCH YOU CHEATY WEENIE yeah i have gripes with that too, on the other hand shield GG are pretty cool now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkhan Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) I'll just leave this LEAK here: https://imgur.com/a/DZzNTTl?fbclid=IwAR3fqDZeD5Nu7s8hAPxw30LW-vE-xJm_2udT64zVQ5drmYWk4HLWNDcNx4o Edited May 13, 2021 by Darkhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warhammernerd Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, Aren73 said: No, that would just be sad and so unproductive. How about, instead of bashing what I have to say you instead try convincing me why you think some things are good? I'm somewhat reasonable I'm up for convincing. Just give me a good argument. We can try approaching this like two adults, both of whom see an aspect of what's there, where we can both learn from each other? If you lock all the negative people in one place then it will just make an echo chamber and no-ones opinions will change. But if we're all talking together then maybe we can cool off each other's extreme opinions and arrive at a reasonable consensus? I was thinking wight king to make the grave guard batteline, but then I sacrifice the command trait... Legion of night would make the Vargheists battleline but I don't like the rest of their rules sadly Kastellai would be cool to make the Blood Knights battleline, I'll probably still have to take some tax units there though, not into running 3 units of BK. In think really I have two options. Either I push into Vyrkos and have a wight king and a large block of Grave Guard (with that +1 to wound they are tasty). Or I go for the full vampire route with Kastelai, which I do think is probably weaker but does sound more fun. Firstly please take it all with a truckload of salt. I’m deliberately being provocative and having a poke. That said, I have tried, and tried and tried. And it’s a bit like Brexit or Antivaxxers, it’s a lot of effort for very little comeback. If you don’t wanna play them, cool. If you wanna play them, weeeee. It’s not really an argument, it’s just opinions and this format isn’t conducive to changing opinions. Plus, my meme wins the internet today. X We don’t really need to reach a consensus, cos it’s all opinion and all are fine. Doesn’t mean I need to agree with yours tho. +++ MOD EDIT +++Warhammernerd has been contacted about this post and has agreed to not be abrasive in the future. I’m leaving it as is so people can see what has happened and I don’t want to pick apart the thread and ruin the flow. Edited May 13, 2021 by Gaz Taylor Mod message - Gaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, Aren73 said: In think really I have two options. Either I push into Vyrkos and have a wight king and a large block of Grave Guard (with that +1 to wound they are tasty). Or I go for the full vampire route with Kastelai, which I do think is probably weaker but does sound more fun. Yup! Vyrkos seems to be the coolest due to rerolling casts and the +1 to wound. I‘d imagine Radukar the beast, 30 Dire Wolves, 1/2x 30 Grave Guards, 1-2 Wight Kings, and some support pieces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezzhil Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, JackStreicher said: Yup! Vyrkos seems to be the coolest due to rerolling casts and the +1 to wound. I‘d imagine Radukar the beast, 30 Dire Wolves, 1/2x 30 Grave Guards, 1-2 Wight Kings, and some support pieces I think Radukar + Vengorian Lord General with the CT to use his wounds to capture objectives is a must. Vyrkos army is absurd at the moment you can see 5 generals at the same time on the board without counting Nagash. Edited May 13, 2021 by Nezzhil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuneBrush Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 3 hours ago, lare2 said: Calling it now, LRL style split release incoming within a year. Funnily enough my local group are predicting the same. If it's true it's a bit frustrating as it'll likely invalidate the book - however does give hope that we'll get some more replacement models (please be black knights) and endless spells and scenery 2 hours ago, JackStreicher said: Did they randomly determine point costs? The whole if cursed city was already too expensive at 650, yeah add another 12%! I think we're going to see loads more point changes coming in AoS3. Not only are we getting 5 point increments (finally), but according to the leaked points there are no horde discounts! Skeletons are also a max unit of 30, so it's possible this may be the beginning of a shift in playstyle. 2 hours ago, BoneHeart said: not to mention that are no more NH or morghasts or arkhan - and don't tell me I can still bring nh as allies because as far as I know most of the Lon players had tons of chainrasps, grimghasts and hexwraiths since they were the units which enabled us to survive the meta at all. I think the writing was on the cards for morghasts and Arkhan when it came out that Arkhan was responsible for the bonereapers creation. Grimghast and hexwraiths don't surprise me, but spirit hosts and chainrasps do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beliman Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) Looking at Vyrkos dinasty, what do you thunk about them? Belladamma has +1 base spellcast and reroll (warscroll+vyrkos) and can go up to +3 (mortis engine + Corpse cart). Really easy for her to do cheap dmg and summon more wolfs. And movement 10" for a support is awesome!! Edit: not +1 cast, reroll spell for vyrkos! Coven Throne seems awesome: CPs for +1 hit/+1 wound/ +1 save (and completely free with one trait) and rerolls of spell cast (with possible +2 spellbonus without knowing any Vyrkos artefacts) giving him an easy shudder for more resilience. Zombies seems to need volum of attacks than quality buffs to fish some mw and I can only see vampire lords giving that juicy +1atk but not sure that Zombies should be the target. But Corpse Cart+Necrodancer or the Deathstench Drove can surprise a lot of people... Direwolfs have a 3+/2+ attacks (if charging) and really good move. They don't need any babysit to chew infantry units and can be easy summoned by a lot of things. They are going to be a really good utility tool!! Blood knights are... just blood knights. Btw, any combo that makes them a bit more special in a Vyrkos bloodline? Belladamma giving exploding 6 but that's a bit meh in comparison to summon more wolfs. And let's be honest, if they need to be in range of someone, it should be the Coven Throne (2+/2+ attacks and 2+ saves...). Corpse carts are awesome (both variants). Not sure what is the one clearly made for Vyrkos family but they are awesome (probably +1spell and +1save to zombies/ wolfs/ skeletons). Deathstrench trove seems good on paper too. Vargheist are nice too, free DS! Felbats...are...nice...models (?) Maybe just a tax for Fellwing Flock? What combos do you think that we are going to see? I really wanted for the Mortis Engine and Corpse Carts to be a Mount for Necromancers, but it is what it is. Edited May 13, 2021 by Beliman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 minute ago, warhammernerd said: I have tried, and tried and tried. And it’s a bit like Brexit or Antivaxxers, it’s a lot of effort for very little comeback. If you don’t wanna play them, cool. If you wanna play them, weeeee. It’s not really an argument, it’s just opinions and this format isn’t conducive to changing opinions. Plus, my meme wins the internet today. X We don’t really need to reach a consensus, cos it’s all opinion and all are fine. Doesn’t mean I need to agree with yours tho. Perhaps one of the most frustrating mindsets to exist. "Opinions have no value" while at the same time "I am right and virtuous and on the good-guy team". How about instead: Opinions are based on reality, so while they can be biased or influenced, largely they tell you some aspect of the truth. I'm taking your opinions seriously, however given just how hard you are pushing in the "everything is perfect" direction I find it hard not to think you are just deluding yourself. It's ok to like the book while also noticing the problems with it... I certainly think there are positive aspects to it, at the same time I do think the writing is lazy and uninspired. There will be some playable and competitive lists for sure, I was hoping for more flavour though. 3 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boar Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Blood Knights seems to be surprisingly tanky (assuming with 6+ FNP). Their effective wounds per 100pts (ie. counting how many damage you need to kill unit) puts them significantly higher then other cavalry, right with tough or numerous infantry. Those are only selected (>120) warscrolls (I don't have data entry slave you now) assuming mix of rnd 0 and rnd -1 with 1in6 IIRC being MW on incoming damage. Of course when enemy has lot of MW it won't be that good. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, RuneBrush said: I think we're going to see loads more point changes coming in AoS3. Not only are we getting 5 point increments (finally), but according to the leaked points there are no horde discounts! Skeletons are also a max unit of 30, so it's possible this may be the beginning of a shift in playstyle. Indeed! I played around with a Vyrkos List I‘d like: Radukar the beast 1x Necromancer 1x Wight King 3x10 Dire Wolves 2x 5 Blood Knights 1x 30 Grave Guard 1x 20 Skeleton and enough points left over to switch out the Necro for Belladamma (just units I like, no hard synergies or anything) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidsteel Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I'm actually feeling a bit spoiled for choice, yes this book isn't so creative, but there's going to be depth in list building with plenty of options. Going to take a bit of time to figure out lists with command traits and artefacts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodylan Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 An initial read I think kastellai and vyrkos are the big winners out of the bloodlines. Kastellai for more elite, hard hitting units with some great command traits and artefacts. Vyrkos seem like a great bloodline for more tradition LoN type armies with some awesome named characters. I’m struggling to see the monster mash being overly viable competitively, the buffs to the monsters just aren’t that huge in comparison to the FEC version. And they also miss out on being able to summon small objective grabbing units like the FEC counterpart. The mortarch bloodlines themselves I don’t see great benefit to, vargheists being battleline for mannfred as an example, when they’re far better in kastellai. Of course this could all change in about 2 months! Keen to see how it all plays out in 3.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beliman Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, JackStreicher said: Indeed! I played around with a Vyrkos List I‘d like: Radukar the beast 1x Necromancer 1x Wight King 3x10 Dire Wolves 2x 5 Blood Knights 1x 30 Grave Guard 1x 20 Skeleton and enough points left over to switch out the Necro for Belladamma (just units I like, no hard synergies or anything) I'm working on something like this! I will switch to 40 zombies instead of skeletons (just for fluffy reasons) and vampire lord+corpse cart instead wight king maybe (I want to use the batallion, 3 atk zombies fishing for mortal wounds seems fun)? I need to put a Coven Throne somewhere and maybe another cart...? Edited May 13, 2021 by Beliman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Bob Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Is 40x Zombies and a Corpse Cart going to work with this wholly within 12”? I haven’t wanted to use them since 6th edition but the urge has returned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frowny Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Can someone PM me the leaks? or where I might find them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Syf Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, Frowny said: Can someone PM me the leaks? or where I might find them? Done, if the link works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Just realising how lazy the writing is...the warscrolls have been just tweaked. We have some new allegiance abilities. We didn't even get faction terrain or endless spells....daaamn. The modeling team were working their asses off to make amazing models and then the rules team delivers this. And before anyone comes at me for saying GW author was lazy: it's their job, they get paid to do this, there are expectations that they do a good job. Here it feels like someone did the bare minimum. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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