Doko Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I started the army only hoping that they didnt nerfed anything and i didnt mind if they didnt buffed nothing,but so far all have been nerfed. Only grave guard was buffed. Healing overall nerfed Revive nerfed Every scroll nerfed in stats or points(only grave guard have been buffed) Every dinasty is similar than old alegiances but some are worse as legion of blood Overall the tome seems worse than actual leguion of nagash tome and we have seen all allready. Yes legion of blood with grave guard inmune to rend and with insane damage maybe gonna be competitive.....but thats gonna be all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 This is miserable. Vampire Lords got worse and they didn't get any more customisation. GW what the hell? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) They couldn't bring themselves to do it. They simply couldn't make themselves go away from the usual 3+ 3+ -1 2D profile for a vampire. Every vampire seems to hit like that no matter what they're holding. Even the Vengorians... When GW wrote the VC book they really cared about individuality and customisation for vampires, you could make them so incredibly different. Whereas now...it's all just the same cookie-cutter unit, whether you're a vargheist or a Vengorian Lord or a vampire lord on foot. Edited May 13, 2021 by Aren73 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Mortis engine is 20 points more expensive, no longer buffs allied death wizard casting, no longer debuffs non-death casting, no longer heals your units when you pop the reliquary, which is shorter average range (flat 12" instead of 4d6). it's scream range is 3" longer, but yeah, even some of the least used units from LoN got nerfs on top of price hikes. This looks really bad. They nerfed us hard, and we were already one of the bottom books. Somebody wrote a knee ****** reaction to feelbads at the very dawn of second edition, but it in a box for a few years, and sent it to the publisher today utterly unchanged. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Aren73 said: They couldn't bring themselves to do it. They simply couldn't make themselves go away from the usual 3+ 3+ -1 2D profile for a vampire. Every vampire seems to hit like that no matter what they're holding. Even the Vengorians... When GW wrote the VC book they really cared about individuality and customisation for vampires, you could make them so incredibly different. Whereas now...it's all just the same cookie-cutter unit, whether you're a vargheist or a Vengorian Lord or a vampire lord on foot. Less customization than before, since no steed option. 😛 Very few of the leaked units seem designed with a thought to why anyone might want to field them. They took extra care to prevent you from stringing out reanimated models on units, then limited them to a single invo per turn and killed gravesite healing so it wouldn't matter anyway. it is actually kind of funny how terrified the author was of this faction being even remotely effective. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Heh, you reckon we can still play with the LoN book? I know it's meant to be "replaced" by SG but aside from the LoN book not being sold anymore can it not be played at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) Turns out Avengorii is pure monster mash, they do nothing for Vargheists at all. Even Lauka's command ability only works for monsters. So much for lore I guess. Edit: ok some good news. Coven throne command ability is broken +1 to hit, wound and save for a unit. Nuts. Blood Knights where half their profile is a 2+. Edited May 13, 2021 by Aren73 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Envyus Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Doko said: Blood knigth same stats that old but 15 point expensiver Don't know what you are talking about we already saw them and Blood Knights are way better. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Called all of this a bit earlier before the leak... But that seemed to really upset some people who just want hype. Soulblight gravelords is pure bin-guy.... Yes the meme is based on truth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 10 minutes ago, Aren73 said: Heh, you reckon we can still play with the LoN book? I know it's meant to be "replaced" by SG but aside from the LoN book not being sold anymore can it not be played at all? You can do anything you want in casual/home games so long as your opponent us cool with it. ... vhordrai and only vhordrai keeps the chalice. zombies are maybe ok? One attack each, but 6's cause mortals, and they pile in 6", and they're the only unit that can get to 40 modrls so if you get galf a unit vack it'll still be sort of a unit, with maybe a vampire for +1 attack and anecro for fight twice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Envyus Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Doko said: Blood knigth same stats that old but 15 point expensiver Don't know what you are talking about we already saw them and Blood Knights are way better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Envyus Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I also think a lot of you guys are over reacting. Also I am expecting a points hike for pretty much all armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Okay so the healing is largely the same. All they did was streamline the warscrolls and added Invocation to the overall allegiance abilities based on keywords Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) Fair few mortal wound abilities. Zombies can deal mortals on 6's, grave guard can deal mortals on 6's, lauka/vengorians/black knights/wight king have mortal imoact hit on the charge. Though in black knights case its per unit, not per model, so if you take tgem at all it should only be min squads. And you probably just shouldn't. The author apparently forgot they have shields because they've only got a 5+ save. Still, might be able to make... something out of that. Edited May 13, 2021 by Sception Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Malakithe said: Okay so the healing is largely the same. All they did was streamline the warscrolls and added Invocation to the overall allegiance abilities based on keywords It's very much not the same. Grave sites don't heal, and a unit can only be the target of one invocation per turn. Before if a unit was in range of two graves & three heroes, you could heal them 5d3 wounds. Now, just 1d3. there's an extra spell to heal 3 more, but that requires a successful cast, burns a casting attempt, and can also hit a unit only once per turn, so even if you pull it off that's 3 +d3 instead of 5d3. Zomvies heal tgemselves if they kill stuff, but they only have one attack each, at 1" range, that are only tgreatening on a 6. skittles also have a self healing effect, but we haven't seen it yet. Moving invo from scroll to faction also means that allied vamps in nighthaunt atmies can't heal. Their CA doesn't work for other death armies, either. Edited May 13, 2021 by Sception Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warhammernerd Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Doko said: Yes im seeing the new tome in twitch. The mortarch seems buffed but almost all the other units nerfed seems,and blood knigth 195 are waaay overcosted,worse than olds than cost 180. Also radukar the wolf do around 10,6 damage and cost 320 and only 11 wounds with save 4, the t rex of seraphon do 14'4damage and have more wounds for 210.... So far every wsrscroll have been nerfed from leguion of nagash. Only grave guard seems great Ok..... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 hours ago, shinros said: I expect Nagash to be amazing if they're pricing him at 975...... Copy-paste from obr. He will benefit from the rumored return to old school arcane bolt and, especially, mystic shield, assuming those rumirs for 3e come true, so I wouldn't completely rule him out yet. He also gets full access to both vamp and necro spell lores, though the vamp lore only has one good spell for bonus movement. Necro lore is ok, but not 'if I cast every spell on this list in a single phase I win the game' ok, which is the level of ok nagash kind of wants to justify costing 1000 points. Old mystic shield *is* good though. But its better on units that already have good saves. He might actually be better in OBR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Mannfred now seems to be worse at magic, for some reason. Clearly, he was just too good before. Loremaster yeah right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Syf Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Loft said: Did you all see the Pitched Battle Points leaks? Confirmed NH allies and FEC, also battalions still exist so presumably they won't be scrapping those in Third ed after all. +++ MOD EDIT: Please no leaked photos +++ Everything else has a price reduction though? As previously stated Nagash for 975 needs to wreck everything, even though in the narrative he’s currently a disembodied spirit. 975 is way too much for Nagash unless there is something we just don’t know about his warscroll or how he interacts with the army. Edited May 13, 2021 by RuneBrush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KriticalKhan Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Every day I wake up and am glad I only play narrative 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Oh boy... This book is full of stealth nerfs all over the place. Like I imagined, vampire lord is now only M6 with fly, his save went up by 1point BUT: his command ability is now reduced from 15" to wholly within 12" and can only be used on summonable units instead of any units. And no points adjustments... Sad, but the humble foot vampire is really no longer worth it to field in a competitive setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aren73 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Elmir said: Oh boy... This book is full of stealth nerfs all over the place. Like I imagined, vampire lord is now only M6 with fly, his save went up by 1point BUT: his command ability is now reduced from 15" to wholly within 12" and can only be used on summonable units instead of any units. And no points adjustments... Sad, but the humble foot vampire is really no longer worth it to field in a competitive setting. And just like that, the lovely new plastic models for both the wight king and vampire lord are leaving my list of things to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Elmir said: And no points adjustments... Sad, but the humble foot vampire is really no longer worth it to field in a competitive setting. Where else are you going to get a +1 attacks buff? Most of these units seem a bit pillow fisted without it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Syf Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 So who’s just taking Vhordrai to get stuff done then? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, El Syf said: So who’s just taking Vhordrai to get stuff done then? He is about the only dude in the book who apparently still lifts. Shame he can't use his CA on itself. ... Doom and gloom aside, I still maintain they got the look and feel of this book right, and I like at least the surface level pitch for the subfactions. So we retreat to our coffins for a few years like Nagash, and wait for another, less snakebit rules writer* to have a crack at bringing those cool ideas to life. * because that's what this is. This is snakebit rules writing, this is 'legions of nagash 2' as written by someone who still has night terrors about the early days of AoS 2.0, not by someone who's been paying any attention at all to the tourney results in the last year or two. As a Chaos Marine player, I'm very familiar with this. Hopefully it only takes the Gravelords one book to move past it, unlike the... how many books did it take the 40k dev team to get over CSM 3.5? Have they even moved passed it today? Hard to say. I slept in my sarcophagus so long in that game the dang thing fused shut and I was never able to escape. Edited May 13, 2021 by Sception 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts