Soulblight Gravelords News, Rumours and Speculation

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

On 3/29/2021 at 1:38 PM, Chikrit said:

According to the How to paint video just posted, the bats in Cursed City box are Dire Bats, not Bat Swarms

 

 

They are bat swarms after all:

EDIT: Spoke too soon! It seems the champion is called a Direbat.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Neil Arthur Hotep

[Urauloth]

I hope there's a wat of adding bats to FEC armies, especially in light of the Grymwatch models.

[sandlemad]

6 minutes ago, Urauloth said:

I hope there's a wat of adding bats to FEC armies, especially in light of the Grymwatch models.

Um excuse me, surely you mean noble hunting hawks.

(that's a solid idea, they'd fit well)

Edited April 1, 2021 by sandlemad

[Sception]

4 hours ago, Cronotekk said:

I have a sneaking suspicion that the Mortis Engine will be moved into nighthaunt since it's very likely they're getting a new battletome alongside their new hero

This is certainly possible, but I doubt it.  Nothing in the nighthaunt range, apart from the hexwraiths, looks anything like the mortis engine.  Visually, it would be exceptionally out of place there.  But with the Gravelords still having black knights and necromancers the mortis engine fits visually here.  Necromancers are supposed to still be an important subtheme in the Gravelords book, and the mortis engine gives death-mage-heavy gravelord armies a big centerpiece to call their own.

Again, it's certainly possible that the engine could be moved to nighthaunt.  It's been paired with nighthaunt models multiple times - both in the malignant start collecting box and, iirc, in the mortal realms magazine collection.  I just don't think it's terribly likely.  If anything, maybe a shared custody arrangement, like the unridden terrorgheist and zombie dragon currently have?

[warhammernerd]

It would also be the only mortal in the entire nighthaunt range. Be very surprised if it happened.

[Gitzdee]

I thing the old fantasy centrepieces just need to be somewhere and the mortis engine is in a weird spot at the moment, just like the Mortarch models. They (the mortarchs) have Spirit Hosts on half the model but isnt Nighthaunt playable for some reason. This makes me wonder if Spirit Hosts will be included in the Gravelords book.

I wouldnt mind some more haunted objects like the Black Coach in Nighthaunt though.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Iksdee

[Sception]

19 minutes ago, warhammernerd said:

It would also be the only mortal in the entire nighthaunt range. Be very surprised if it happened.

If the mortis engine were moved to nighthaunt, I'm sure it's description would change to make it a ghostly unit, not a mortal one.  The same way the Black Coach changed from a physical unit with a ghostly driver to a ghostly unit altogether back when AoS was first released.

[Sception]

8 minutes ago, Iksdee said:

I thing the old fantasy centrepieces just need to be somewhere and the mortis engine is in a weird spot at the moment, just like the Mortarch models. They have Spirit Hosts on half the model but isnt Nighthaunt playable for some reason. This makes me wonder if Spirit Hosts will be included in the Gravelords book.

I wouldnt mind some more haunted objects like the black coach in Nighthaunt though.

They don't really have spirit hosts on half the model, though.  The ghostly cloud supporting the engine don't look like spirit hosts or any other nighthaunt models (apart from hexwraiths, which also don't look like anything else in the nighthaunt range).  Every death army has access to some degree of necromantic magic and with that some channeling of souls and spirits.  You see this not only on the mortarchs and nagash (naturally, as the most necromantically potent characters in death as a whole), but also elsewhere, including for example the mortisan soulmason in OBR, which also isn't a nighthaunt model despite including a much more recognizable spirit host style ghost.

So I really don't see any sort of significant disconnect in the mortis engine, coven throne, or palanquin being in Soulblight.  The core of those models aren't ghostly.  They've never counted as ethereal, for instance.

[Gitzdee]

Sorry i wasnt clear but i meant the Spirit Hosts on the Mortarch models.

I wanted to say that they could have put most older models everywhere with a different story because they were not designed for the armies they are included in now.
The hexwraiths are also a good example. They are old units and gw made them fit somewhere. They could just as wel have been put in Gravelords with a different story.  Same with the Black Coach.

Edit: It just made me wonder what they are going to do with Spirit Hosts.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Iksdee

[Sception]

Spirit hosts will remain in highthaunts.  The executioner in particular is made to go with them, so they fit there, certainly better than hexwraiths.  Though I suppose they could be shared with the gravelords.

I've also been wondering if some ghostly units might stick around in the gravelords.  Spirit hosts and hexwraiths being the most obvious, cairn wraiths and banshees being possibilities as well.  I kind of doubt it - I think SGL will keep access to them as allies, but not native, but there's just no telling right now.  Especially since the gravelord battletome will also apparently include rules for 'nagash's undead legions' and 'grand alliance: death' - though the comment stating that was ambiguous enough that both could be referring to the same rule set rather than two separate allegiances.

[Paladin of Khorne]

Why can’t a vampire count have ghouls or spirit hosts like the old days? I will be disappointed if the corpse cart and Black Coach aren’t in the book. The coach carries a vampire after all, yet its distinctly nighthaunt, yes? Also, I noticed dire wolves are off the website. New kit or just repackaging you think?

[Gecktron]

4 minutes ago, Paladin of Khorne said:

Why can’t a vampire count have ghouls or spirit hosts like the old days? I will be disappointed if the corpse cart and Black Coach aren’t in the book. The coach carries a vampire after all, yet its distinctly nighthaunt, yes? Also, I noticed dire wolves are off the website. New kit or just repackaging you think?

Well, Vampires have access to Ghouls. Its just that nobody else wants to associate with that kind of Vampires. Ghouls in AoS are explicitly linked to the insanity passed down along Ushoran's blood line. 

Dire Wolves will probably get a new kit considering how prominently they have featured in the new material. 

[lare2]

I must admit, although I own a considerable number of NH models, I really hope that they differentiate between the two. I would like to see all NH units pulled out of Soulblight and for the army to develop along its own path, incorporating new ideas like those seen in WHQ. 

[JackStreicher]

I would actually prefer if the unit roster would be very different to the old Vampire Counts. I am not into copy-pasting I want the SGL to be AoS-ifyied instead of a AoS-rework of the Vampire counts ^^

[Sception]

1 minute ago, JackStreicher said:

I would actually prefer if the unit roster would be very different to the old Vampire Counts. I am not into copy-pasting I want the SGL to be AoS-ifyied instead of a AoS-rework of the Vampire counts ^^

I understand this desire, even if I don't personally share it, but it's best to make your peace with it now, as a re-work of the Vampire Counts is absolutely what we're getting.

Every grand alliance has ~at least~ one of these retro oldhammer-style factions.  Eg Seraphon in Order, Skaven in Chaos, Ogres in Destruction.  And while we're lucky enough to be seeing a significant model range overhaul instead of just a new book for an oldhammer line, the Gravelords are still one of these oldhammer throwback battletomes, just as the legions were before them.  This is clear not only from the new models (apart from a handful of Cursed City units and characters, every new model we've seen so far has been for an old vampire counts unit), but also from the style of those models - very grounded.  Very classic gothic horror.  Not at all over-the top AoS style extraplanar fantasy.  The new Gravelord models would have been right at home back in the old world.  The Wight King in particular has an very 3rd/4th edition 'warhammer armies: undead' style to it, a throwback even among a faction of throwbacks.  You can even see it in the cover art of the battletome itself, which basically a direct visual update of the 7th edition vamp counts army book:

Spoiler

No doubt will see some new stuff.  The blood-born and Vargskyr are promising in that regard (though the latter really could have been a new model for the old varghulf and nobody would have batted an eye).  But in terms of the overall thrust of the faction and the line?  Yeah, the Gravelords might as well have just been called "Vampire Counts", because name change not withstanding that's exactly what they are.

[idn0971]

I know it almost certainly won't happen but I want the new necromancers to be undead liches not humans reanimating dead.  Something close to the new gravekeeper in cursed city rather than the traditional necromancer. A fully undead army is much more interesting to me than 90% undead and some random mortal wizards being in the army because that's how things used to be.

[Sception]

2 minutes ago, idn0971 said:

I know it almost certainly won't happen but I want the new necromancers to be undead liches not humans reanimating dead.  Something close to the new gravekeeper in cursed city rather than the traditional necromancer. A fully undead army is much more interesting to me than 90% undead and some random mortal wizards being in the army because that's how things used to be.

I mean, lore wise that's basically what they are already.  But yeah, I'd love to see a more liche/skeletal mage style look to them.  Based on the Cursed City necro, though, that's not happening.  At least not right now.

[Paladin of Khorne]

Yeah I can see both sides and arguments. It will definitely be interesting to see what direction they go. Starving for information here haha. Started reading Vampire Wars, with Mathias Thulmann on deck for a reread to prepare lol

[BaylorCorvette]

I just hope Nighthaunt will be able to be allied into Soulblight Gravelords. The ability to take the Dolorous Guard as an allied battalion is huge, shrugging wounds from your general onto hexwraiths on a 2+. Although, becomes weaker if Gravelords do not have a way to replenish them via Deathly Invocations. I expect the VLoZD to only get stronger. Think if it had the killing power of a Frostlord on Stonehorn and then could pass its wounds off on Hexwraiths on a 2+, lol

Edited April 1, 2021 by BaylorCorvette

[Sception]

I'm sure Nighthaunts will be an ally option for the Gravelords, but I wouldn't count on the Dolorous Guard surviving the transition to the next Nighthaunt Battletome, which really can't be that far out now.

[BaylorCorvette]

4 minutes ago, Sception said:

I'm sure Nighthaunts will be an ally option for the Gravelords, but I wouldn't count on the Dolorous Guard surviving the transition to the next Nighthaunt Battletome, which really can't be that far out now.

Maybe. But The Host of Syll'Esske survived despite Slaaneh's new battletome. It was included in the Errata for them last month.

[Sception]

Fingers crossed, I suppose, but there are many ways GW could get rid of the interaction apart from just dropping them outright.  They might include the battalion in a new nighthaunt book, with rules that restrict their bodyguard ability to nighthaunt characters.  Or they might just raise the points cost of the battalion until it's no longer usable as allies in 2k games.  Basically, I wouldn't count on an allied faction battalion to solve a problem within another faction, and I hope the writers don't either.  I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for an in-house solution to this problem.

People have been asking what the point of grave guard will be now that regular skeletons are armored up.  Maybe this could be part of the answer - put the 'guard' back in 'grave guard' with some sort of bodyguard rule?  I don't know.  But if the gravelords, or even particular units in the army (eg mannfred, neferata) are only made playable by allying in an obscure, outdated white dwarf battalion for another faction, then that'll be a pretty big fail from the author of the gravelords battletome.

[Siphon]

I’m really hoping the Black Coach is native to Gravelords, it’s visually an amazing model,  but I’m not holding my breathe (because I’m a vamp and don’t breathe....drumroll?  Sorry...). 
 

I’m also not counting on FEC getting totally brought back into Gravelords, bu I can totally see one of the sub factions being FEC grounded.  Hopefully more then the now usual 1/4 and more like...if your general is of the Ushoran bloodline, you may take any number of ghoul, crypt horror, crypt infernal units as you like in this army.

 

still holding out hope that every Vampire Lord gets a command trait based on their bloodline and that bloodlines are a thing.  

[BaylorCorvette]

21 minutes ago, Sception said:

Fingers crossed, I suppose, but there are many ways GW could get rid of the interaction apart from just dropping them outright.  They might include the battalion in a new nighthaunt book, with rules that restrict their bodyguard ability to nighthaunt characters.  Or they might just raise the points cost of the battalion until it's no longer usable as allies in 2k games.  Basically, I wouldn't count on an allied faction battalion to solve a problem within another faction, and I hope the writers don't either.  I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for an in-house solution to this problem.

People have been asking what the point of grave guard will be now that regular skeletons are armored up.  Maybe this could be part of the answer - put the 'guard' back in 'grave guard' with some sort of bodyguard rule?  I don't know.  But if the gravelords, or even particular units in the army (eg mannfred, neferata) are only made playable by allying in an obscure, outdated white dwarf battalion for another faction, then that'll be a pretty big fail from the author of the gravelords battletome.

Oh yeah I totally agree that there are many ways that The Dolorous Guard will not be usable. I was just saying if they remain usable my Vampires and assuming the buff VLoZD's are likely to get, it will be nuts.

15 minutes ago, Siphon said:

I’m really hoping the Black Coach is native to Gravelords, it’s visually an amazing model,  but I’m not holding my breathe (because I’m a vamp and don’t breathe....drumroll?  Sorry...). 
 

I’m also not counting on FEC getting totally brought back into Gravelords, bu I can totally see one of the sub factions being FEC grounded.  Hopefully more then the now usual 1/4 and more like...if your general is of the Ushoran bloodline, you may take any number of ghoul, crypt horror, crypt infernal units as you like in this army.

 

still holding out hope that every Vampire Lord gets a command trait based on their bloodline and that bloodlines are a thing.  

It would be kinda cool if one of the bloodlines had something similar to Cities of Sigmar, where 1 in 4 units can be FeC units and do not count as allies. I think there is A LOT of potential with the Soulblight Gravelords new book. I just hope it isn't too far in one direction (too fluffy and not competitive or too competitive and not fluffy). The Orruk Warclans book is decent in combining both thematic elements while remaining competitive.

[warhammernerd]

Off topic but also not at all.

DO I BUY CURSED CITY OR SAVE MY MONEY FOR SGL RELEASE?!?!

 
The nightmare is real.
 

Sold boatloads of old LoN models In last week and amazingly scraped together £400. Thing is, CC will take a big chunk out of that. And new models don’t tend to be cheap. That said, I already have pretty much everything I need apart from all the Fell bats, bat swarms, skelebobs, Zombros, Blood Knights and hero models. There Is no doubt more to come, endless spells, faction terrain and a centre piece model. Hmm, as I write this I feel the answer is crystallising... 

Nonetheless, I’m trying to work out (a) if I’ll regret it forever not buying a copy cos the models in it are sick af (b) whether the value of  SGL models in the box is roughly on par with what they’d cost to buy seperatly for AoS.

Sorry if this seems like a douchey post. I defo don’t have loads of dollar, just hype over these beautiful new models and will sell all my old stuff to make way. Even considering flogging my 40 man metal grave guard unit which I’ve held onto for f e c k i n g ever.

What are other people doing? 

Edited April 1, 2021 by warhammernerd