Idoneth Deepkin Petition

[HollowHills]

Please sign this petition.  We need to show Games Workshop that we won't be silent! The Idoneth deserve respect.

http://chng.it/zdVkZL8Xkw

[Saxon]

1 hour ago, HollowHills said:

Please sign this petition.  We need to show Games Workshop that we won't be silent! The Idoneth deserve respect.

http://chng.it/zdVkZL8Xkw

At least you have new models. Some of my sculpts seem older than i am. 

[azdimy]

Be careful what you ask for, They  could give them the sylvaneth or slaanesh treatment

Edited March 1, 2021 by azdimy

[Icarion]

This is a joke right? 

I play Idoneth.

And not only do we still have a large/full new range of models released only 3 years ago, more than most factions, we have sat near the top of the meta for most of that time. We got more love in Broken realms Morathi than any other faction, with amazing warscroll updates as well making us even stronger, and more rounded.

On top of all that, we have a new underworlds warband coming out in two months.

Honestly as a faction we seem pretty spoiled, and the thought that anyone could make a petition like this seems absurd. Lets see Ironjaws, Sylvaneth, Kharadron and Fyrslayers get a big second wave first, then we can talk.

 

[Joseph Mackay]

Games Workshop didn’t toss you aside, Teclis did 😛

[yukishiro1]

IDK are in a weird spot because they have a tiny range, but every single thing in that range varies from good to great (well, except Reavers), and the army as a whole is one of the very strongest in the game. 

So yeah, it'd be great to see the range expanded...but there are a ton of factions that need it more.

Lumineth getting a second book and a whole additional range of models less than a year after the first one is insulting to everyone - including Lumineth players themselves - but it's no more insulting to IDK players than to anyone else. 

[Joseph Mackay]

Controversial opinion: until Eels + Volturnos are nerfed, you don’t deserve new models as no one will take them anyway 

Eels are too cheap. They have too many wounds, do too much damage, and the defensive eels aren’t paying the same premium for Ethereal that Nighthaunt have to pay.

Volturnos command ability, I don’t care that it’s only usable during High Tide, the fact is it adds +3 attacks to EACH weapon per command point he spends. 99% of +1 attack command abilities aren’t allowed to stack, but you all get a free pass for some reason.

Deepkin have the worst balance in the game. The internal balance is atrocious. Namarti units aren’t bad if you compare them to the other aelves (except Lumineth), the only real negative vs the others is 32mm base and 1” range. The Eels are just so good and undercosted that there’s no reason to take anything else. External balance, the Eels are undercosted and are playing a completely different game to other 60mm based Calvary. The 4 wounds is my biggest concern in regards to their points cost.

sadly, Deepkin were an army that all the waac players rushed out and bought straight away, so gw were too scared of the backlash to properly correct the points in the GHB and haven’t really touched them since. Going from 140pts to 160pts was a sick joke

[Doko]

Seems a joke this post omg.

Idoneths are the top army rigth now tied to seraphons.

Got overpower new scrolls in br morathi.

Have 6 diferent units + heroes when armys with 3 years older as fyreslayer only have 3 units.......

Oh also in 6 years fyreslayer got 0 boxes where idineths in 2 years got one battleforce and one broken realm box.

 

People are allready tired of all the elf attention and post as these dont help

 

Edited March 1, 2021 by Doko

[yukishiro1]

I think most IDK players would bite your hand off if they limited the command ability to not stack, but removed the high tide only limitation. That'd make it stronger, not weaker. These days AOS is so deadly you don't make it to T3 with much stuff against the top lists anyway, so being able to use it T1 and T2 would be better than being able to stack it T3. 

Eels probably still need to go up 10-20 points, but they're no longer nearly as oppressive as they used to be, given how much power creep there has been in the game in the past 3 years. Fixating on their wounds is a really weird take given their wounds to points ratio is not good at all, and given we're apparently now in a world where you can get 20W of super fast moving ranged cavalry for 180 points. Wounds are actually the weakest part of of an IDK eel army, not the strongest. 

IDK are powerful right now because they are the only army that counters shooting effectively, and shooting is very powerful right now. If GW pulls out its finger and does something about the situation, they'll naturally fall back down to the upper-middle tier. They don't actually trade particularly oppressively vs other combat armies. 

 

[Baron Klatz]

58 minutes ago, Joseph Mackay said:

Games Workshop didn’t toss you aside, Teclis did 😛

That's actually even more to put in the Deepkin's favor besides the Broken Realms updates and UnderWorlds warband. Whenever God-Tyrion shows up with River aelementals they're gonna be a shoe-in for more Deepkin allies as fellow aelves that can breathe underwater and numerous water spirits whose light god was the one that stopped his brother from destroying the tragic race.

This is a pretty frivolous want compared to the other early armies like Ironjawz, Fyreslayers and Skaven that need attention.

[Vasshpit]

@HollowHills I do salute your enthusiasm but I have to agree with the majority that quite a few other factions could use the love more at this time.

I dont collect them but will say this, I love your infantry models, it's the flying sea creatures I've been unable to get on board with.

Here's to hoping your new Underworlds warband is everything you hope it to be. 🍻

Edited March 1, 2021 by Vasshpit

[Chikout]

As others have said they are one of the strongest armies in the game. They have a good range of minis with options in infantry, cavalry, monsters, and both mounted and on foot heroes and with the warscroll change in broken realms they have had the kind of substantive changes that other armies have been begging for. If Beasts of chaos players got a warscroll change to make the cygor even as good as the reavers they would be overjoyed. 

They even have new models guaranteed to be coming soon. 

The only thing the army really needs is a need to the eels. 

[Drazhoath]

Ridiculous 🤦🏻‍♂️

[HollowHills]

7 hours ago, Athrawes said:

This is a joke right?

I'm only clarifying this because some people seem genuinely annoyed, but yes this is a joke. 

The new lumineth models combined with the frequent elf hate / general negativity towards idoneth (eel spam, flying sharks are bad etc) inspired me to make a petition from the point of view of a bratty, bitter, entitled sibling.

Of course I wouldn't mind some new sculpts, but Idoneth are in a better spot than ever since Morathi. I'm really looking forward to taking Mr. Turtle out the cabinet when lockdown finally ends.

[Feii]

8 hours ago, Athrawes said:

This is a joke right? 

I play Idoneth.

And not only do we still have a large/full new range of models released only 3 years ago, more than most factions, we have sat near the top of the meta for most of that time. We got more love in Broken realms Morathi than any other faction, with amazing warscroll updates as well making us even stronger, and more rounded.

On top of all that, we have a new underworlds warband coming out in two months.

Honestly as a faction we seem pretty spoiled, and the thought that anyone could make a petition like this seems absurd. Lets see Ironjaws, Sylvaneth, Kharadron and Fyrslayers get a big second wave first, then we can talk.

 

the top of the meta argument is so flawed, kinda disappointed how many people subscribe to the idea of punishing a faction just because they had it good, pathetic. 

Nobody wants to play 18 meele eels and that was what you were doing the last 3 years, I know many people who didn't buy into idoneth armies because everything except the eels sucked. (myself included) 

I think a vampiresque soul stealing faction of elves who tame and ride all kinds of underwater horrors have such a nice potential for new and interesting sculpts. (also the only lore explored realm are Ghyran elves, there are also Asquy and Shyish idoneth. (I think even some Ghur elves living in a giant underwater turtle)

[Klamm]

I agree that IDK shouldn't be considered at the front of the queue for expansion. Being so new, there isn't a bad quality sculpt in the range (Beast of Chaos, Seraphon or Skaven players are sobbing into their finecast) and the faction has more variety than the likes of Sylvaneth, Fyreslayers or Flesh-eater Courts. They're in a similar boat as Kharadron Overlords (pun not intended). Room for expansion, but not a priority. 

However, there is an obvious part they should flesh out. Since the soul harvesting and resultant caste stratification is their most unique narrative aspect, I'd hope GW expands the namarti range. At the moment we just have infantry, which is fine but not really the reason anyone likes Idoneth. 

Proud Akhelians ride surface water beasts like Sharks, Turtles and Eels, so it'd feel right if Namarti were shunted off to the sunless depths to retrieve creatures monstrous fangtooth fish, bioluminescent jellyfish and hell, maybe even sea urchins. Remember how the original IDK rumour emphasised the Lovecraftian "deep one" element? Deep sea creatures would be perfect for that.

And it would create a strong contrast between the Akhelian and Namarti side of the range. Akhelians ride fierce creatures of war,  whereas Namarti should be associated with weird monstrosities that are primarily used for construction or infrastructure. The lore already mentions bioluminescence as lot, so maybe Namarti are tasked with subduing dangerous Jellysfish that can also be used in war. And who doesn't want to see a sea urchin warscroll?!

And there's one more reason this makes sense. At the moment, the Idoneth roster resembles a 'raiding party', those tasked with going abroad to get souls.  But as Slaanesh's power grows and order's alliances fracture it would make sense that their enclaves are besieged. The situation would get so dire that raiding parties wouldn't be enough, so Namarti labourers would be pushed onto the battlefield to use their sea beasts of burden for battle instead. 

tl;dr Idoneth shouldn't be next in line for update, but it would be cool, specifically a deep sea namarti update that emphasises the cruel hierarchy of their society while making their narrative staus quo even more fraught. 

Edited March 1, 2021 by Klamm

[Overread]

Gosh darn it don't do this! There's a line and dwarves are ahead of fish-aelves in the line! If you start this the dwarf lot will start kicking up a fuss!!! 

[Double Misfire]

LITTLE ELF BABY THINKS HIS ARMY IS BEING NEGLECTED BY GW

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

COME BACK WHEN YOU'VE BEEN LOCKED IN THE ATTIC FOR DECADES WITH ONLY YOUR OWN SPIT FOR SUTINENCE AND TWO RESIN SYMPATHY MODELS RELEASED FOR A SPECIALIST GAME FEEL LIKE SPACE MARINE LEVEL ATTENTION

[Zeblasky]

While this post is a joke, the idea that Deepkin need more models is true. They do need more new models along with a much better internal balance. Eels need nerfs, turtle needs small nerf, thralls need small buffs, and different units may be need a bit more synergy between each other. The "charge it all" eels meta is as stupid as one teleporting frog army. The fact that Eels can be 2+ save now on the first turn... How do you even fight this in the first battle round if you're not Lumineth?

 

You should not accelerate power creep with buffs only mentality, you fight it as best you can.

[JackStreicher]

I‘d welcome a petition which tries to achieve that GW is way more transparent with their release timeline.

[Souleater]

Idoneth were just GW trying to run with the Fishfolk rumour from way back.🙈

 

Pretty sure they didn't expect people to actually play the army. 😜

[Painbringer]

On 3/1/2021 at 1:53 AM, azdimy said:

Be careful what you ask for, They  could give them the sylvaneth or slaanesh treatment

I'm not really sure what is Sylvaneth treatment? I know that Slaanesh just got a lot of new models, but Sylvaneth range was only expanded with Endless spells and Arch-Revenant in recent years.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Painbringer

[Enoby]

4 minutes ago, Painbringer said:

I'm not really sure what is Sylvaneth treatment? I know that Slaanesh just got a lot of new models, but Sylvaneth raneg was only expanded with Endless spells and Arch-Revenant in recent years.

I'm gonna take a guess and assume they're commenting on the power of the new books - with Sylvaneth's book being notoriously disappointing to many fans. Slaanesh has a relatively luke warm reception to the rules too, though now people have actually played them they seem good.  

[Double Misfire]

2 hours ago, Painbringer said:

I'm not really sure what is Sylvaneth treatment? I know that Slaanesh just got a lot of new models, but Sylvaneth range was only expanded with Endless spells and Arch-Revenant in recent years.

Two Underworlds warbands  

(albeit one not-really-Sylvaneth-but-with-the-Sylvaneth-keyword one)

[azdimy]

2 hours ago, Painbringer said:

I'm not really sure what is Sylvaneth treatment? I know that Slaanesh just got a lot of new models, but Sylvaneth range was only expanded with Endless spells and Arch-Revenant in recent years.

Sylvaneth got a new  terrain piece that you have to buy 4 boxes of to replace the ones you already had as the newer ones are more effective for match play. Yet, the newer battletome  was significantly weaker with the loss of 1 drop battallions, no  more congo line to keep your dryads tanky with changes fromwithin to wholly within and less summoning available. The battletome was released at the same time as the Slaanesh battletome  that had a huge power level difference on telease.

  Slaanesh while no longer showing in tournament , got nerfed in every way. With this book It feels like they had a list of complaints from 2019 and applied the nerfs accordingly. Many warscroll abilities got weakened or removed. Artifacts of power and command traits got nerfed or removed. Locus ability changed to something that will do nothing 50% of the time when it goes off. Keyword changed from Slaanesh to Hedonites on all the allegiance abilities to push away (unsuccessfully based on lists having some success) slaves to darkness and beast of chaos marked units  from the allegiance. While all those restrictions were made, nothing interresting was added to the battletome ( Not accounting for the new units that are beautiful but way overcosted hence why people are running s2d or boc as their battlelines in many instances) . No new sub faction , still the same bland 3 ones. Did not include arguably for one of them the best subfaction within the wrath of the everchosen expansion, some dubious choice on list construction with some battleline if making it even more difficult to choose units from this book as your battlelines. Released at the same time comes the DoK that on the other end benefits from some big point reductions, some new interresting subfactions amd the battletome includes all the broken realm dok rules. Like at the time of the 2019 slaanesh and sylvaneth release, the power level gap between the two battletome is big

That is why I am not looking forward to have a new tome for my Deepkin based on what gw has done in the past to other re-releases