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combat movement ability


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It also says "instead of moving normally" - and you then remove the models from the board and (it does us the term) set up elsewhere on the board.

So Nico's logic is that the model doesn't "move", you get to "set up" the unit somewhere else. The unit isn't 'travelling', using it's M value or paying attention to intervening terrain or models between start and destination, so (and I'm aware this argument is semantics, but hey it's rules) if looks like a duck and sounds like a duck and all that - it's not a "move", and retreating is specified as a move with restrictions on final position.

My logic was retreating is part of the normal movement rules, and you get to do Realmroots instead of that - but as I pointed out, I went against my own interpretation because of an apparent edict from the AoS FB page.

But then I have Nico to keep me up to speed on what the cool kids are ruling these days! ?

In answer to your final question - whilst there may be a to-and-fro on whether it counts as a retreat, there isn't any argument against using it to escape combat that passes scrutiny.

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Again I disagree - it's a "setup" rule not a "move", so it's not a retreat (compare this to rampaging destroyers to move out of combat - that's a retreat). Significantly this is why you have to be more than 9 inches away from the enemy - so it's very hard to charge again. This is also consistent with the fact that you roll a dice and I think on a 6 on the navigate, you can do your normal stuff (including charging) thereafter. This would be a huge nerf to teleporters if this was the other way.

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Again I disagree - it's a "setup" rule not a "move", so it's not a retreat (compare this to rampaging destroyers to move out of combat - that's a retreat). Significantly this is why you have to be more than 9 inches away from the enemy - so it's very hard to charge again. This is also consistent with the fact that you roll a dice and I think on a 6 on the navigate, you can do your normal stuff (including charging) thereafter. This would be a huge nerf to teleporters if this was the other way.

This is my preferred reading of it.

But as discussed elsewhere (I don't have FB) there was apparently a statement that leaving the 3" bubble of an enemy unit is always considered a "retreat".

As a Sylvaneth player, happy to be corrected on this! [emoji6]

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But as discussed elsewhere (I don't have FB) there was apparently a statement that leaving the 3" bubble of an enemy unit is always considered a "retreat".

It's things like the Vexillor and the Verminlord Deceiver that make it clear to me that this must be wrong. Particularly when it's a spell-like teleport in the hero phase. It's the "set-up" wording that seems key.

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There's two issues I can see. The navigate realm roots ability doesn't mention 'set up' it says " if a sylvaneth unit is with 3" of a wyldwood at the start of the movement phase it can attempt to navigate the realm roots" so it's a movement ability. In addition to this the treelord models all have the spirit paths ability which is exactly the same as the navigate one just without the dice rolls. 

With both this is their movement for the phase.

As mentioned above, the first point is not right as it goes on to say "setup". 

The second point is also wrong, since the unit gets to roll and on a 6 can do its movement as normal for the rest of the turn (which would also imply that it can move and then charge). I think the fact that there's the 9 inch rule away from the enemy is another telling point - this is the standard language used to limit the effectiveness of summoning or infiltrating - you have to make a difficult charge roll. This is hardly gamebreaking (cf. if Rampaging Destroyers allowed a Stonehorn to retreat out of combat and charge again every turn for D6 mortal wounds - this is clearly a move - that would be gamebreaking otherwise). 

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But as discussed elsewhere (I don't have FB) there was apparently a statement that leaving the 3" bubble of an enemy unit is always considered a "retreat".

It's things like the Vexillor and the Verminlord Deceiver that make it clear to me that this must be wrong. Particularly when it's a spell-like teleport in the hero phase. It's the "set-up" wording that seems key.

Hmmm. I think the "instead of moving normally" in the Navigate Realmroots is probably the trigger there then - as retreating is part of moving 'normally', and Navigate Realmroots gives you an option outside of that?

Is that consistent with other similar abilities?

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There's two issues I can see. The navigate realm roots ability doesn't mention 'set up' it says " if a sylvaneth unit is with 3" of a wyldwood at the start of the movement phase it can attempt to navigate the realm roots" so it's a movement ability. In addition to this the treelord models all have the spirit paths ability which is exactly the same as the navigate one just without the dice rolls. 

With both this is their movement for the phase. I understand why a retreat would be arguably just a backward move away from combat but can a movement such as this get the tree out of combat if needed? 

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Thanks both so what's the final verdict here? I'm in combat, I'm next to a wood, it's now my turn. I can navigate realmroots the hell out of there if I'm getting trounced or it's convenient? If I do get to the favoured wood I carry on with the ability as it states?

 

Sorry if I'm being infuriatingly dumb here but I'm still not entirely sure on whether the abilities a go or not.

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I think even if you roll badly you still get to the destination, but then you cannot do anything else.

We're not debating that you can escape combat using the ability - the only debate is over whether this counts as a retreat or not. I don't think it does count as a retreat.

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