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Deadkitten

Which Faction has the best Battleline?

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This came up in the Slaanesh thread.  Which army has the best Battleline now after the FAQs and GHB20?  There's lots to consider.

I think theres Speed, Durability (both in terms of armor save and MW save), damage output, MW output, Points Cost, synergy with the rest of the army (access to buffs) and relevant battalions (to lower the drops).  There's also Battleshock (maybe healing goes here?)  OH! and base size is a thing, so there's reach (2" on a 32 vs 1" on 25 for example).  How well do they play the objective game (1 TG vs 20 Pinks for example)?

Finally, I know that some units rely on Battalion or Sub-Faction buffs to push them over the edge.  That's OK (just list it out so I can look it up!). Also, some unit's need a general to unlock them.  Again, that's OK too.  Basically, if you can list build them out as battleline, they're fair game.

I guess I should start......  

Rigth off the top of my head, I'm going to say Ghouls, due to both the synergy of the rest of the list with them and their ability to grow back.  They suffer in the speed and MW output, and are fragile in that they need all their support pieces.  I can see an argument that their dependency will knock them out of the running but I figured I should get the ball rolling.     

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I would say Pink Horrors are the best battleline.

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Surely it must be Hearthguard Berzerkers

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Posted (edited)

Ardboys (especially if supported) are one of if not THE best battleline so far IMO. Pinks, while great in many ways, lack a few key elements for the top spot...

Heathguard Berzerkers are also a great nomination.

Edited by MitGas

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Posted (edited)

What criteria are we using to determine this question?

If we are trying to determine which faction has the best battleline: I would argue Cities of Sigmar, as it has the most battleline units which are capable of fulfilling a diverse set of roles. Ironjawz and Flesheater Courts are pretty neat in this regard, as pretty much every unit in both faction has the potential to become a battleline option.

If we are talking about the best battleline unit in terms of utility: This is where units like Horrors, Hearthguard Berzerkers and Ghouls would fall.

If we are talking about individual battleline unit on a model by model basis ignoring points and objectives: I feel like Terrorgheists, Varanguard and a few other heavy hitters might take the slot.

Finally if we are discussing battleline in terms of preference: This would become a purely subjective debate and for me it would come down to aesthetics, probably propelling Chaos Warriors, Gloomspite Stabbas/Shootas, Tzaangors or Dryads to the top spot. 

There are of course other metrics to determine the best and I believe it is fascinating question. I think it would be fun for GW to do a batteline battle royal like they did with the heroes on Warhammer community.

Edited by Neverchosen
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Best to spam? Best to live? Best to deal damage? Best to speed? 

IMO Scourgerunners are the best, thats why i bought 18 of them. Fast, lost of wounds, cheap, shoots a ton, deals MW's, etc..

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Number one are unquestionably Hearthguard Berzerkers. Supported properly (which is easy, mind) they are easily among the strongest and scariest units in the game. Pink Horrors are comfortably second place even after the nerf. 

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7 hours ago, Maddpainting said:

Best to spam? Best to live? Best to deal damage? Best to speed? 

IMO Scourgerunners are the best, thats why i bought 18 of them. Fast, lost of wounds, cheap, shoots a ton, deals MW's, etc..

Maybe was true before but post nerf there's no way they're the best. They're still good but a 33% point increase definitely pushes them out of 'best thing in the game' land.

And of course it's conditional on taking a fleetmaster as your general which is basically just a tax.

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57 minutes ago, NauticalSoup said:

Maybe was true before but post nerf there's no way they're the best. They're still good but a 33% point increase definitely pushes them out of 'best thing in the game' land.

And of course it's conditional on taking a fleetmaster as your general which is basically just a tax.


The nerf helped them b.c other armies got hit with a nerf too it wasn't just that 1 unit, All of death no longer gets more than 1 after save for example, with less spells and worst artefacts on the table for crazy heroes is another example. I have 1 less unit of them in my army, and i can actually keep all of them in easily if i just remove a couple different units (I still take lots of Shadow Warriors b.c i like them).  15 chariots, 2 hurricanums, Fleetmaster and 30 Shadow Warriors works just as well as my list with 18.

Its still the best battleline IMO. Sure you need a Fleetmaster, but so what, its 60pts you want 2-3 heroes anyways for missions. I've never seen him as a tax. 
 

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39 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

A lot of post-hoc rationalizations of what might have not ended up the best long term investment.

Your 18 chariot army got a 360 point nerf. The 15 chariot one, a mere 300. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone running any list that got hammered more by the updates than that one. Since chariot spam wasn't grabbing all the podiums before the update, I'm very confident in saying it certainly won't after.

I'm sticking with Hearthguard Berzerkers.

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1 hour ago, NauticalSoup said:

Your 18 chariot army got a 360 point nerf. The 15 chariot one, a mere 300. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone running any list that got hammered more by the updates than that one. Since chariot spam wasn't grabbing all the podiums before the update, I'm very confident in saying it certainly won't after.

I'm sticking with Hearthguard Berzerkers.

Im still running 12-15 apposed to 15-18. Just b.c they went up X% points doesn't mean i don't think they are still not the best.  

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1 hour ago, NauticalSoup said:

Your 18 chariot army got a 360 point nerf. The 15 chariot one, a mere 300. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone running any list that got hammered more by the updates than that one. Since chariot spam wasn't grabbing all the podiums before the update, I'm very confident in saying it certainly won't after.

I'm sticking with Hearthguard Berzerkers.

Bro, the guy bought EIGHTEEN of them. Cut him some slack 😛

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I mean it hugely depends on what you want out of a battleline unit.

10 Skinks for 60 points with a 5+ save is quite amazing for screening your army or grabbing objectives with their 8" move.

Hearthguard Berzerkers are obviously disgusting in combat.

Pink Horrors is a proper tarpit. They die fast and it might not look like a lot when there is only 10 Pink dudes in front of you, but those guys are effectively 50 wounds. That's rather crazy.

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If I’m thinking pure battleline. I’m gonna say clanrats to argue an outside choice. 
without battleline if options I think they are at least top 3. 
To fill the requirements you take three 20 rat units. That means 60 bodies to screen, grab objectives with and generally get in the way for only 360 points. That leaves 5/6 of your army for goodies. Quite a lot of things you take to buff other units, like death frenzy, can apply to them as well. Making them surprisingly deadly in a pinch. 
The clincher however is the retreat and charge ability. That ability, on battleline!, is just so, so useful. Exactly what you want from battleline. (Although pink horrors do seem insane, but I haven’t played them) 

on a sidenote I think it’s a unit that GW got exactly right in matching fluff to rules. 
 

battleline if, I’d vote for hearthguard probably. 

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i think even after the nerf, mortek guard is one hell of a solid pick

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i dont know the best but i know the worst. Its SCE liberators xD. They are pricy, 90* now, hit like wet nuddle and die from a breeze of wind. Also they cant cap obj cuz there are only 5 of them... 

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Posted (edited)

Ogors Gluttons are still tough and fast, have a devastating charge, are good to buff and due to multiple wound models good to heal.  Not bad for an unconditional battleline.

Edited by Beastmaster

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Stegadon are conditional battleline and what could be better than a triceratops? That's what I thought, nothing. 

All jokes aside (although I do play battleline stegadon) surely the eels are up there? Conditional battleline as long as Volturnos is your general (which he usually is anyway), most tournament teams are literally just these guys and it works, can't think of a more ringing endorsement. 

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Blood knights are obviously the best because they are blood knights. Which are the best.

They are vampires, which makes them cool. They are also knights, which also makes them cool. That means they are two times cool, which is more than one so therefore they're very cool.

Also they are on horses because they are too cool and awesome to walk. 

I am definitely not biased and this has nothing to do with blood knights having been the first unit of AoS I fell in love with.

 

On a more serious note I don't think there is any single best battleline, and if there is it would probably change very quickly as often seems to be the case. If discussing battleline options I would second cities of sigmar due to not only the amount they get but the fact that you can build incredibly different playstyles due to the battleline all being quite different.

As a non competetive player who barely looks at a lot of armies I probably can't comment on any particularly strong battleline but I would like to give an honourable mention to the battleline for Lumineth being in my opinion pretty good in terms of internal balance between the options, which I think has to do with the fact they have similar abilities (mortals on 6's), it makes for less versatility in playstyle but allows multiple options to achieve the same sort of goal in combat but in different ways and with different additional versatility. Aka spears make great defence, hammers/picks can be taken in small units and receive different synergies, bows allow to attack from range and can ignore line of sight, and cavalry give mobility to get key targets or grab objectives a little easier.

 

But none of these options are blood knights so... y'know...

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3 hours ago, Nizrah said:

i dont know the best but i know the worst. Its SCE liberators xD. They are pricy, 90* now, hit like wet nuddle and die from a breeze of wind. Also they cant cap obj cuz there are only 5 of them... 

I don’t know.

Comparing them without any Buffs to let’s say  Chaos warriors, that aren’t being buffed by anything, kinda seem equally bad/good

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Gloomspite Gitz for me.  60 strong goblins are so great, and there are tons of synergies with them.

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Blightkings are pretty efficient battleline for their reduced cost in GHB 2020. Not as good at holding objectives, but they can weather some MW and retain high combat effectiveness. Still outshined by Hearthguard though, but surprisingly more mobile with Gnarlmaws on the table.

 

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Posted (edited)

Really should be best battleline at X job bc there is so much variance, but I would say clanrats are the best battleline in the game at doing their job. Cheap, retreat and charge, board control, easy to make battleshock immune, realtively fast, screening, and stealing objectives. The only thing that could contest clanrats as the best battleline are stabbas and skinks when they could retreat out of combat.

 

Edit:

Hearthguard: too expensive - they're the whole army, too slow and low body count

Pinks: too expensive, not as good at board control

Edited by Verminlord

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