Playing after being tabled

[Zamik]

I was playing with my Khorne army yesterday, and I got tabled. My opponent said that was the end of the game, but I insisted we keep playing, because there was still one round left in the scenario, and I had some tricks available to me. My Wrath-Axe judgement had made the roll to stay on the table, and I had blood tithe to summon (and blood tithe summoning does not specify that you need a Hero, you just need a Skull Altar). A few people at the table told me I couldn't keep going, but I still had things I could do, even without an army. The league organizer ruled I could keep playing that game. But is it true that you just have to stop playing when your army is tabled? Anyway I still lost the game, on points, but I just want to make sure there isn't some core rule that I shouldn't have been allowed to continue, even though I had things I could do. Thank you!

[AverageBoss]

The game always plays out its full number of turns unless the mission states other wise. Even if you are completely tabled and have 0 game interaction (even if this is somehow true for both players), and the games turns play out and you can still win.

Edited February 5, 2020 by AverageBoss

[TheMuphinMan]

if the game isn't over and each side has a way to win still, I don't see a reason to end it. The only reason I could see to end a game early is if a player is unable to score enough points to catch up even if they got every possible remaining point from objectives 

Edited February 5, 2020 by TheMuphinMan

[AverageBoss]

So you don't even need judgements/spells on the table or anything, and can keep accumulating VPs if you still control objectives (since unless otherwise stated, you control them unless they are captured by the opponent).

Edited February 5, 2020 by AverageBoss

[The_Dudemeister]

Quote

If the battleplan does not explain how to win the battle, you must slay all of the models in the opposing army to win a major victory.

- Core book, page 236

If you play without a battleplan, that's the victory condition. However every battleplan has its own victory conditions from holding two objectives to immediately win, to getting the most points untill the end of the fifth turn. In these cases every single round has to be played out even if you have literally nothing to do and you can absolutely still win long after being tabled. Just check what your battleplan says for major victory, because that's what overrides the blank rule.

Edited February 6, 2020 by The_Dudemeister

[Aelfric]

I agree, if you can still do things then it's not over.  Perhaps your opponent was getting confused with 40k.  I don't play it, but I think there's a rule that the game ends if one side has no units left on the table.

[NauticalSoup]

8 minutes ago, Aelfric said:

I agree, if you can still do things then it's not over.  Perhaps your opponent was getting confused with 40k.  I don't play it, but I think there's a rule that the game ends if one side has no units left on the table.

It wasn't when 8th launched but I think they brought it back because null deployment was such a problem. It was a part of most previous editions of 40k. I think it might apply on like turn 3 or something now? Been a while since I played.

But yeah Sigmar is a different game. You can be tabled and still win, so your opponent has to actually see if he can score enough by playing the objectives once you've been removed. If you're behind in score and you get tabled though, I would imagine you'd call it just to save time.

[Aelfric]

1 minute ago, NauticalSoup said:

If you're behind in score and you get tabled though, I would imagine you'd call it just to save time.

I agree, but that's your call to make, not your opponent's.  You may want to achieve some secondary goal like killing their general or something, even though you've already lost.

[Zamik]

Thank you all! Yes, the guy who was pushing me to end the game the most is mostly a 40k guy. The main thing was just knowing that there's no specific prohibition on continuing as long as you have things to do (such as moving a judgement in my Hero phase or summoning in my Movement phase). And if I'd rolled the damage of the judgement well enough, I could have killed his general. Ah well. Thank you again!

Edited February 5, 2020 by Zamik

[Isotop]

34 minutes ago, The_Dudemeister said:

- Core book, page 236

If you play without a battleplan, that's the victory condition. However every battleplan has its own victory conditions from holding two objectives to immediately win, to getting the most points untill the end of the fifth turn. In these cases every single round has to be played out even if you have literally nothing to do and you can absolutely still win long after being tabled. Just check what your battleplan says for major victory, because that's what overrides the blank rule.

Fun fact: Endless Spells and their equivalents are models in the opposing army, are they not? 

[Daramiz]

6 hours ago, Isotop said:

Fun fact: Endless Spells and their equivalents are models in the opposing army, are they not? 

Endless spells are treated as friendly models by all armies.

[Isotop]

8 hours ago, Daramiz said:

Endless spells are treated as friendly models by all armies.

I thought "models in the opposing army" meant "models listed in the opponents army list". I guess you interpret it as "enemy models"? I am not sure if and how we can check which way is correct.

[#SteveJames]

In matched play battle plans both player should always play all five battle plans. You could dominate the battle fields turn 1-4 and score so many points your opponent can't catch you even if they table you.

Sometimes one player might have to run/teleport to capture an objective. So it's important to roll the dice and see if it's possible. 

Also endless spells prayers can still be in play and potentially kill something changing the outcome. 

[Midjithero]

Since we are in this topic of being tabled: let’s say you are playing a battle plan like Total Conquest where you score at the end of your turn the number of objectives your hold.  
My opponent tables me top of turn 4, and we both have had 2 objectives the entire game.  He did not take my 2 objectives on top of turn 4.  Bottom of turn 4, do I score the two objectives I held previously, even if I’m tabled?  

Or would those points disappear into the eather and no one scores them??

this is purely hypothetical this hasn’t happened to me, but the discussion got me thinking  

[EMMachine]

5 hours ago, Midjithero said:

Since we are in this topic of being tabled: let’s say you are playing a battle plan like Total Conquest where you score at the end of your turn the number of objectives your hold.  
My opponent tables me top of turn 4, and we both have had 2 objectives the entire game.  He did not take my 2 objectives on top of turn 4.  Bottom of turn 4, do I score the two objectives I held previously, even if I’m tabled?  

Or would those points disappear into the eather and no one scores them??

this is purely hypothetical this hasn’t happened to me, but the discussion got me thinking  

It depends on the wording of the battleplan. After Total Conquest uses the standard Objective Rules of the Corerules this sentence comes into play

Quote

Once you gain control of
an objective, it remains under
your control until the enemy is
able to gain control of it.

As long as your opponent doesn't bring 1 model in range of the marker to take control of it you can control it with zero models and gain points at the end of the turn.