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HollowHills

Aos 2 - Lumineth Realm-Lords Discussion

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2 hours ago, Jaskier said:

Re-read the page. The rules for playing in a realm are separate from the rules for choosing a realm for your army to hail from. Remember that artefacts are selected when you write your army list, whereas choosing a realm to play in is determined after determining what battleplan you are using.  

 

But then it means that actual malign sorceries artifact will disappear. Otherwise it  doesn't make sense!

 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, EMMachine said:

Then I have interpreted to much into that part of the Idoneth Battletome:

I mean the "split into factions" could have been the splitting into the elementary Aspects.

I will most likely get the box with my Battletome today, so I have the chance to work my way through the Background.

Like Tiger mentions the Aelementiri aspect comes in much later. And it also doesn’t really split the Lumineth. The sects are part of the same way to enlightenment. And not all Lumineth are part of these sects. You’ll see when you have the Battletome. 

Edited by LuminethMage

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17 minutes ago, Maturin said:

But then it means that actual malign sorceries artifact will disappear. Otherwise it  doesn't make sense!

 

They won't be playable in Matched Play anymore. In Open and Narrative Play the Malign Sorceries Artefacts are still usable.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, EMMachine said:

They won't be playable in Matched Play anymore. In Open and Narrative Play the Malign Sorceries Artefacts are still usable.

This is more than a letdown. I really enjoyed tailoring my army lists with different artifacts. Some stormcast battalions/list who were subpar were made incredibly fun to me and challenging to my opponent, just because of artifacts.

The disappoint is strong in me

Edited by Maturin

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I honestly think it speaks more to bad battletome design when generic RelicTM  is the best choice for your army over anything in your own book.  I am sad that my Akhelian King will no longer have his 3+ unrendable save, but I guess I can find some new relics to use from the battletome.

Back on topic, I have to say that I love how they didn't skip out on talking about the Element temples. it rubs a little salt in the wound that we don't have the models, but I love the little excerpts we got, and we would have a lot less info on the society as a whole...

 

Which considering how little we know of society for the Lumineth it is saying something.

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Yeah I also really like the little Element Tempel teases.
Hey at least we know that the Vanari are a Citizen Militia! 😁 If I got that right - I don't have the Tome to confirm.

Kinda offtopic: considering the Warhammer Community Article "Beyond the Box" released on 19th of June --> GW talked about the full release being "later this year". This makes me think that we will get the Rest of the Lumineth in early September, but what do you all think?

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Just now, Aloth_Corfiser said:

Yeah I also really like the little Element Tempel teases.
Hey at least we know that the Vanari are a Citizen Militia! 😁 If I got that right - I don't have the Tome to confirm.

Kinda offtopic: considering the Warhammer Community Article "Beyond the Box" released on 19th of June --> GW talked about the full release being "later this year". This makes me think that we will get the Rest of the Lumineth in early September, but what do you all think?

I think I really jumped the gun thinking I'd get my armies on parade board done by this year....

 

I just want a little more info to satisfy some world building needs. For Example, are the nations run by the spiritual leaders of temples? is the majority of the government within each nation a City State where each city controls their land? Is the society Feudal? or is there freedom of movement and social mobility?

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Yea indeed I feel your pain. Because this are such basic cornerstones of how we expect a Nation to function. I would be disappointed if such details where left out in the Battletome, but it seems that we would nee to wait for the Black Library "Realmlords" Novel to gain some more context. :(
I dont want to sound overly nitpicking - but when I thought up Fantasy Stories as a 15year old I made up my mind about such structures. 😅

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37 minutes ago, Aloth_Corfiser said:

Yea indeed I feel your pain. Because this are such basic cornerstones of how we expect a Nation to function. I would be disappointed if such details where left out in the Battletome, but it seems that we would nee to wait for the Black Library "Realmlords" Novel to gain some more context. :(
I dont want to sound overly nitpicking - but when I thought up Fantasy Stories as a 15year old I made up my mind about such structures. 😅

I just hope the bloody author reads the battletome before he wrote that book. I don’t want it to end up like court of the blind king, where the entirety of the novel fails to realize the Whole premise of a game of thrones style court intrigue plot doesn’t make sense because A.) each enclave is run by a council of ishraan and B.) the title of King isn’t hereditary or even a formal part of the government. It’s literally just what they call the general of a phalanx. There can be multiple Kings in one idoneth enclave, and the fact that the entire book treats the title of king like we do makes it possibly one of the worst AoS books out there.

 

but yea back on topic, I still wish we had more insight into society outside the temples. What is your guy’s favorite faction so far fluff wise?

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Posted (edited)

Yes I heard about the Court of the Blind King fiasco and it is making me anxious. :/
So far Zaitrec is my favorite. I always liked the Moon Conncetion as an Elven Fantasy Trope and the fact that they are overly fascinated by magic and like to research stuff is just so fitting for Hysh and a People who have something other/better to do, than to wage war. :) It is also nice that the Zaitrec-Realmlords seem so fascinated with the magic that it is bordering on naivety - and oddly I can relate haha :D

Also - quite a nice Paint Scheme!

Edited by Aloth_Corfiser
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Acid_Nine said:

I think I really jumped the gun thinking I'd get my armies on parade board done by this year....

 

I just want a little more info to satisfy some world building needs. For Example, are the nations run by the spiritual leaders of temples? is the majority of the government within each nation a City State where each city controls their land? Is the society Feudal? or is there freedom of movement and social mobility?

We know that Iliatha is a matriarchy, with mothers that have successfully raised a new generation ranking the highest. 
We also know from the Syar entry that their capital is called Ar-Ennascath, which implies that there is some form of centralized government. 

EDIT: Speaking of Iliatha, I also gave Iliathas Coat of Arms a try:

Spoiler

Iliatha3.png.c85342c4d63cdf21d0b27eb30b9f8ca9.png

The sun and the droplets of blood represent their belief that knowledge and enlightenment grows, not by individual feats, but by raising each new generation in a way that they can grow and surpass their fore bearers. While the split in the middle represents the iliathans fascination with twins. 

 

Edited by Gecktron
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55 minutes ago, Aloth_Corfiser said:

Yes I heard about the Court of the Blind King fiasco and it is making me anxious. :/
So far Zaitrec is my favorite. I always liked the Moon Conncetion as an Elven Fantasy Trope and the fact that they are overly fascinated by magic and like to research stuff is just so fitting for Hysh and a People who have something other/better to do, than to wage war. :) It is also nice that the Zaitrec-Realmlords seem so fascinated with the magic that it is bordering on naivety - and oddly I can relate haha :D

Also - quite a nice Paint Scheme!

yea you hit why I love that faction on the head. I can also see them being the "Nicest" lumineth you can meet as long as you are a wizard or wizard-adjacent. They may treat you like an idiot or a child, but they will at least see what kind of magic you can do and be interested in it while treating you like a toddler. 

Also, I must say that it is pretty amusing that our faction has a noble goal (cleanse land with burning light and stop allowing chaos to punch holes in things) but we do not do it so nicely, or really with permission. I guess the Lumineth are so smart that they think everyone can logically think through what they are doing, but forget that not everyone has the same train of thought.

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42 minutes ago, fenriswolf2003 said:

Gecktron. Could you make one for zaitrec too?

Im already working on it! Zaitrec has a lot of usable symbolism, Syar on the other hand not so much. I really have to think about how to represent them. 

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2 hours ago, Gecktron said:

Im already working on it! Zaitrec has a lot of usable symbolism, Syar on the other hand not so much. I really have to think about how to represent them. 

I'd probably go with a crossed hammer and tongs to represent their being master craftsman.

This is my alternative Zaitrec paint scheme. I didn't think the official one really suited their background so I did this one to really emphasize the "Moon Magic" aspect to them. Do in all contrast plus Leadbealcher and Retributer Gold. 

 

hsbmtiguqs751.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&a

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I think I may be going for an Alarith build backed up by Sentinels, which will mean Ymetrica to get my battleline.  I was commited to this army the moment I saw the Stonemage.  I'll also want at least one mountain spirit and I love the Stoneguard models, so it makes sense to go all in.

I quite like the Sanctum of Amyntok.  Unlike the Balewind, it doesn't stop you moving and the idea of having my Stonemage inside serenely floating up to the front with their increased bubble range for the troops seems like it's worth giving a go for 30 points.   With a Mountain alongside they'd be -2 to hit with a 4+ save and the Mountain's gift gives more survivability.  

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Finished my first warden. Bit of a test colour scheme but I like it well enough to do the rest the same way, although white clothes are a bit tricky. 
 

no particular great nation as I probably won’t focus on just one to start with. 

C3BF394C-D72D-44DB-9330-B1DDB2FDF70E.jpeg

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56 minutes ago, Azamar said:

Finished my first warden. Bit of a test colour scheme but I like it well enough to do the rest the same way, although white clothes are a bit tricky. 
 

no particular great nation as I probably won’t focus on just one to start with. 

Looks good! The light blue on the armor works very well with the golden details!

I also finished painting some miniatures today. Here my first Dawnrider:

1269500893_YmetricaRider.jpeg.b078f0dde44075caad2453d1ada413df.jpeg

I really like the idea of the Ymetrica Aelfs making heavy use of triangle patterns. So I added some to the little backbanners of the Dawnriders. 

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47 minutes ago, Gecktron said:

Looks good! The light blue on the armor works very well with the golden details!

I also finished painting some miniatures today. Here my first Dawnrider:

1269500893_YmetricaRider.jpeg.b078f0dde44075caad2453d1ada413df.jpeg

I really like the idea of the Ymetrica Aelfs making heavy use of triangle patterns. So I added some to the little backbanners of the Dawnriders. 

Man seeing all these great painted models and knowing  mine will look like Mr.Blobby is fantastic but disheartening lol 

I should be starting mine on Thursday when I have access to my kit again 

What Blue is that?

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3 minutes ago, Chumphammer said:

Man seeing all these great painted models and knowing  mine will look like Mr.Blobby is fantastic but disheartening lol 

I should be starting mine on Thursday when I have access to my kit again 

What Blue is that?

Dont get demotivated! Remember, Practice makes perfect! And for every nicely painted model you see online, there are at least 10 test-runs you dont see. 

The dark blue is GW Kantor Blue, and the lighter one is Caledor sky.

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8 hours ago, Aloth_Corfiser said:

....
So far Zaitrec is my favorite. I always liked the Moon Conncetion as an Elven Fantasy Trope and the fact that they are overly fascinated by magic and like to research stuff is just so fitting for Hysh and a People who have something other/better to do, than to wage war. :) It is also nice that the Zaitrec-Realmlords seem so fascinated with the magic that it is bordering on naivety - and oddly I can relate haha :D

Also - quite a nice Paint Scheme!

100% agree with you there. It's like someone from GW was in my head, put everything I like together and made it into the Zaitreci. And they even found a fitting mechanic for "studying all magic" within the rules.   

About the societal background of the Lumineth, we don't know much, but we got some information and can deduce some other things from what we have.

- All 8 nations have their own culture. So it's likely that they do not all have the exactly the same governmental system. Likely the Tyrionic societies are more fundamentally different from the Teclian than each of those are within themselves.

- The writers use the term "Scinari mage caste" in the book. If that wasn't just done without giving much thought to it, it does mean that there are castes. But the aelementiri temples could be a means to overcome the societal rank you were born into. This would fit with the information we have, that in the past a hermit who was very high on the Teclimentari ladder could order a King around. Or that Zaitreci who are favored by Celennar are held in high esteem. 

- Syan is a "Magocracy". It says so in the battletome. It isn't mentioned, but Zaitrec likely also seems to be a Magocracy. Same could be true for Ymetrica - with a special role there for the Alarith.

- Like in many of other Realms - most of the population seems to live in larger cities, because it's not safe outside of the larger population centers. But the Lumineth seem to have at least managed to keep a somewhat larger area relatively safe, as they managed to burn their huge guarding sigils into the ground (those can be seen on the Ymetrica map) to safeguard Chaos incursions, and all those mountain temples must be able to survive and there are even lone travelers showing up. On the other hand, the writers mention that Zaitrec's capital(?) Tor Xillion is still beleaguered by Chaos, and the territory around Ar-Ennascath is so messed up and haunted by endless spells that it's almost impossible to get there. It generally looks like that in the safer places, where Chaos has less influence, roaming endless spells are the biggest threat. 

- It seems that generally on the Teclian side mages are in charge. I guess, specifically the aelementiri mages of the higher levels should have much influence (we know one is/was the ambassador to Ulgu). It says that Syan is a Magocracy, the leading matriarchs of Iliatha are mages if I'm not mistaken, and mages also lead the citizen military in all 8 nations. The temples could function a bit like the buddhist temples in Japan during the middle ages. Standing relatively apart from the rest of society, but having political influence because of their cultural and military power. 

- Tyrionic nations I imagine are more like Prussia + Merlin. Their societies being build around the needs of the military, with lords and ladies formally in charge of  both, the nations as well as their armies, while being advised by Scinari/Aelementiri mages. But that's pure speculation as we almost know nothing about them. 

- All in all I get the feeling, GW was thinking of Hysh's societies being still somewhat similar to Ulthuan. Centered mostly around a few large cities. With Tyrionic societies being more like Caledor, and Teclian more like Saphery. Added to that, you have the Aelementiri sects. 

 

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Still conflicted about the Vanari helmets - They're growing on me, but the feather plumes still look silly. If I went with the Sentinel heads, it'd be a long wait and then a nightmare to search for those bits.. Sigh.

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Man I am still waiting for my paints to arrive... I just hope it’s worth it! Also need a non- humid day to go and spray paint... I decided to do sub assemblies for each dude so I can paint the face and cloth easier with contrast paints, and not worry about trying to do full detail on each face. 

 

@LuminethMage never considered a magocracy, which makes sense. I just want to know if there is one king and many princes like the old Ulthuan system of government for each nation, or is there a mage council for each city that rules as a governing body. I know it doesn’t matter in the long run, but it would have been nice to know about, especially during the spire fall event, whether or not the governments were the main cause of the mess or the individual land owners were. Maybe I missed something that said that, may have to re-read. How much the lumineth control now would be nice too, like certain boarders of nations / chaos territory, but that is something AOS struggled with for a while.

 

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12 minutes ago, Acid_Nine said:

Man I am still waiting for my paints to arrive... I just hope it’s worth it! Also need a non- humid day to go and spray paint... I decided to do sub assemblies for each dude so I can paint the face and cloth easier with contrast paints, and not worry about trying to do full detail on each face. 

 

@LuminethMage never considered a magocracy, which makes sense. I just want to know if there is one king and many princes like the old Ulthuan system of government for each nation, or is there a mage council for each city that rules as a governing body. I know it doesn’t matter in the long run, but it would have been nice to know about, especially during the spire fall event, whether or not the governments were the main cause of the mess or the individual land owners were. Maybe I missed something that said that, may have to re-read. How much the lumineth control now would be nice too, like certain boarders of nations / chaos territory, but that is something AOS struggled with for a while.

 

I'm waiting for my paints too, uggh. And have the same problem with humidity here. 

I totally understand what you mean, it's really vage. Pure speculation, but I imagine the Teclian nations being more of a council type government (as they are all about reflection, deliberation etc.), whereas the Tyrionic ones are more likely to have one noble/royal person on top who is calling the shots, but has an advisory council of sorts. But yeah it's not in the book, so we do not know. In the autumn, the Soulbound RPG will release a book which introduces the Lumineth to the setting (among other things). We might get a bit more information on the society there. The did that for the Aqshy, but it depends of course if they have more information or not. 

The Spire Fall seems to have been caused by what started as rivalries between really powerful individuals which eventually escalated until they involved whole nations. The source seems to have been those powerful individuals, not governments as such, but eventually governments also got involved (as is hinted in both the Iliatha and Syar sections).  It seems like at that point they had many super powerful individuals who weren't much restrained or concerned with the wider society anymore. Because all the examples are about individual rivalries. And you have small snippets of information like: "they wanted to transcended Hysh", "they learned to fight together again, with different troops types supporting each other". The Spire Fall picture also shows this. The Mage doesn't seem to be concerned at all by all the death and destruction around him. Whereas the normal population still is. This also fits with the surpression of emotion due to Aetherquartz (the whole rivalry thing fits much less with that though). 

How much they control - I think this is deliberately kept in the dark, as they write sometimes a bit contradicting things about this. 

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Painted up my Eltharion, I’m going for an Eternian Palace Guard theme for my army 👍

39E9198D-3F3F-4A05-A9D4-8A1CEFD41EDD.jpeg

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