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HollowHills

Aos 2 - Lumineth Realm-Lords Discussion

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7 minutes ago, Atreides said:

It's been discussed earlier, but can Vanari units cast spells from the Lore of Hysh?? Thanks all. 

I built Eltharion and he is magnificent!! Love the model.

They absolutely can! Playtesters confirmed they are intended to have access to the Lore of Hysh (whereas it's been confirmed Eltharion having access is an editing mistake.) 

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3 hours ago, LuminethMage said:

All the Temples are Teclian-aligned.

I dont see that. The temples do not really feel aligned to any of the Twins. 

Sure, Teclis is the one who found out about then but it doesnt look like they are only workshiped at Teclis nations. The way it was described feels like all the Lumineth follow this doctrines.

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28 minutes ago, Thiagoma said:

I dont see that. The temples do not really feel aligned to any of the Twins. 

Sure, Teclis is the one who found out about then but it doesnt look like they are only workshiped at Teclis nations. The way it was described feels like all the Lumineth follow this doctrines.

I assume all 8 nations have Aelementiri Tempels, at least it looks like that. My original reply was to a post about how much more awesome the Tyrion side would be in comparison to Teclis. That’s all. 

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3 hours ago, Jaskier said:

They absolutely can! Playtesters confirmed they are intended to have access to the Lore of Hysh (whereas it's been confirmed Eltharion having access is an editing mistake.) 

Thank you! Makes things really interesting. 

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13 hours ago, ArchaicArc said:

You might not need a zénithal highlight on these guys, especially if you are using the turbo shift stuff. I’m pretty sure you want to just paint it on straight to a glossy black primer. It’s not really something you can shade/highlight anyway. 

this was also my experience, when I used the greenstuff world colorshift (I used them on an eidolon armour), I didn't find it necessary to do any further highlights or shading, it just seemed as the effect would be ruined and it looked cool anyways

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Posted (edited)

Does anyone else find it intriguing that we're really lacking in unique command abilities (Teclis and both our mage heroes don't have one) but a non-hero monster in the Alarith Spirit of the Mountain gets one? They make up for this somewhat with the Great Nations, but otherwise as the playtesters point out, it seems they want you to use those CP on the core set available to all factions. 

 

It also just makes me even more curious as to why the Alarith isn't a hero choice, as it would open up so many options for us with regards to artefact usage (many of ours are combat-based, but only available to squishy, slow wizards.) It very well may be intentional, but it just strikes me as odd. Loving the book otherwise!

Edited by Jaskier
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Does the new tome go into the whole thing about souls? How did Teclis manage to create a somewhat stable Group of elves. are there any negative consequences from the time in Slaanesh’ belly? Are the Lumineth aware their souls are from te old world? Do these souls reincarnate? 

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Posted (edited)

What would also interest me if there is any Lore about the Sphiranxes which got corrupted and became the Mindstealer Sphiranxes we know from Warcry. Sphinxes are an unexplored Design Space in AoS right now, I think. Also I really liked the Mindstealer Sphiranx Design, so otherwordly and creepy and regal.

Now imagine smaller Celennar like Sphinxes fighting alongside the Lumineth for example or Sphinx-Riding Lumineth Mages (a bit like Evocators on Dracolines), man I would really dig that. :D 

Edited by Aloth_Corfiser
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1 hour ago, Jaskier said:

Does anyone else find it intriguing that we're really lacking in unique command abilities (Teclis and both our mage heroes don't have one) but a non-hero monster in the Alarith Spirit of the Mountain gets one? They make up for this somewhat with the Great Nations, but otherwise as the playtesters point out, it seems they want you to use those CP on the core set available to all factions. 

 

It also just makes me even more curious as to why the Alarith isn't a hero choice, as it would open up so many options for us with regards to artefact usage (many of ours are combat-based, but only available to squishy, slow wizards.) It very well may be intentional, but it just strikes me as odd. Loving the book otherwise!

Yup, likely intentional - maybe the Sprit was a a hero at first, and it turned out to be too strong. Not having hero options besides slow, squishy mages it likely on purpose, I doubt that's something they just missed. 

1 hour ago, elfhead said:

Does the new tome go into the whole thing about souls? How did Teclis manage to create a somewhat stable Group of elves. are there any negative consequences from the time in Slaanesh’ belly? Are the Lumineth aware their souls are from te old world? Do these souls reincarnate? 

Teclis improved the process after the Idoneth, it doesn't go much deeper than "practice makes perfect". Difficult to say if there are consequences, the Lumineth could say, all the issues that let to the civil war occurred because of Slaanesh's influence, but then they pretty much just behaved like High Elves. Official fluff is that the Lumineth are the most stable, sane and whole of the saved souls, but still have some lingering dark stain which can always become prominent in Hysh (because where there is light there is shadow). So they always have to guard against that. But to be honest, those negative traits are not really different from High Elves/Eldar (pride, hubris etc.). What is cool is, that they are trying to overcome them, and the whole story is more positive, optimistic. I like that for once it's not always about dying out next month. They still can be arrogant ****** though, that point is made very clear. 

The Lumineth vaguely know that they are from another world (there are legends about that time), but no real remembrance. I don't think the book touches upon them reincarnating or not. I might have overlooked that though. It doesn't look like it, considering all the cloning etc., re-incarnation is not mentioned. 

@Aloth_Corfiser Nothing about that in the book, if I haven't overlooked it. It's possible that some of the other temples ride something like that, the Wind Temple warriors are mentioned to ride some kind of mount, but those do sound a bit different ("long-limbed riding beasts"). We know nothing about the spirits of the Zenith faction though. Just that the Zenith Mages become incorporeal and angelic (which could just mean something like Eltharion, because the Lumineth as such as described as angelic, or really angel-looking like). 

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51 minutes ago, LuminethMage said:

Yup, likely intentional - maybe the Sprit was a a hero at first, and it turned out to be too strong. Not having hero options besides slow, squishy mages it likely on purpose, I doubt that's something they just missed. 

Teclis improved the process after the Idoneth, it doesn't go much deeper than "practice makes perfect". Difficult to say if there are consequences, the Lumineth could say, all the issues that let to the civil war occurred because of Slaanesh's influence, but then they pretty much just behaved like High Elves. Official fluff is that the Lumineth are the most stable, sane and whole of the saved souls, but still have some lingering dark stain which can always become prominent in Hysh (because where there is light there is shadow). So they always have to guard against that. But to be honest, those negative traits are not really different from High Elves/Eldar (pride, hubris etc.). What is cool is, that they are trying to overcome them, and the whole story is more positive, optimistic. I like that for once it's not always about dying out next month. They still can be arrogant ****** though, that point is made very clear. 

The Lumineth vaguely know that they are from another world (there are legends about that time), but no real remembrance. I don't think the book touches upon them reincarnating or not. I might have overlooked that though. It doesn't look like it, considering all the cloning etc., re-incarnation is not mentioned. 

@Aloth_Corfiser Nothing about that in the book, if I haven't overlooked it. It's possible that some of the other temples ride something like that, the Wind Temple warriors are mentioned to ride some kind of mount, but those do sound a bit different ("long-limbed riding beasts"). We know nothing about the spirits of the Zenith faction though. Just that the Zenith Mages become incorporeal and angelic (which could just mean something like Eltharion, because the Lumineth as such as described as angelic, or really angel-looking like). 

Does the book mention anything about the soul wars?  Also can you talk about the moon Spirit? Does it have a rivalry with a bad moon?

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Posted (edited)

Soul Wars, mentioned at several places, mostly though the Lumineth were still focused on fighting Chaos in Hysh. For example I don’t think there is anything in the book about the Gate to Eightpoints, for example. 

Now the Bad Moon, yup! The Great Nation of Zaitrec (the most magical of the Lumineth factions) is all about Celennar and moons in general. They talk to them etc. And their biggest enemy, which they try to control (so far in futile), is the Bad Moon. 

Edited by LuminethMage

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39 minutes ago, xking said:

Does the book mention anything about the soul wars?  Also can you talk about the moon Spirit? Does it have a rivalry with a bad moon?

The Soul Wars are mentioned, yes. But more in the form of the aftermath of the Necroquake. Even though the Lumineth erected spires of aetherquarz to stabilize the realms, the wave of necrotic energy still animated hordes of skeletons and set free legions of Nighthaunt. Wild Endless Spells roam the realm now and the edges of the realmsphere are destabilizing at an alarming rate. 

This event lead to the Lumineth ending their isolation. They realized that events that happen in one realm, can still affect them in Hysh. 

 

We dont know Celennars opinion on the Bad Moon. But the Great Nation of Zaitrec worships Celennar, the true Moon, and the other moons of Hysh. But they fear the Bad Moon. Against all their efforts to force him into orderly patterns, it still moves as it pleases, which terrifies the people of Zaitrec. 

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Planning my first lists, I'm really liking the idea of a bravery bomb combined with the cathallar scroll spell and vertigo spell to pin important units in place and hit them with a rune of petrifaction for as many mw chances as possible.

1984148166_Screenshot_20200628-124238_SamsungNotes.jpg.d3ace143aab3d638ec0650fc9a7ec5bb.jpg

Teclis list run as syar to spam the aetherquartz reserve to get -1 bravery on as much as possible and autocast the -2 bravery spell, pin 2 units and hit them with the rune and teclis nuke through the spell portal. 3 drops so a good chance of first turn choice.

1099074048_Screenshot_20200628-124636_SamsungNotes.jpg.19c3ab2eae85c08c8aeaa30989a3c75b.jpg

No teclis run as generic so I can put the -1 bravery bubble on a stonemage for a potential -4 bravery. Twinstone buffs the casting to make sure i get the bravery and 2cp spells off and the dawnriders are there to cast solar flare to prevent the rune being unbound. Eltharion is just there for funsies and as a troubleshooter piece. 7 drops but more bodies and movement at the cost of some mw output and worse 5++ bubble.

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50 minutes ago, Gecktron said:

The Soul Wars are mentioned, yes. But more in the form of the aftermath of the Necroquake. Even though the Lumineth erected spires of aetherquarz to stabilize the realms, the wave of necrotic energy still animated hordes of skeletons and set free legions of Nighthaunt. Wild Endless Spells roam the realm now and the edges of the realmsphere are destabilizing at an alarming rate. 

This event lead to the Lumineth ending their isolation. They realized that events that happen in one realm, can still affect them in Hysh. 

 

We dont know Celennars opinion on the Bad Moon. But the Great Nation of Zaitrec worships Celennar, the true Moon, and the other moons of Hysh. But they fear the Bad Moon. Against all their efforts to force him into orderly patterns, it still moves as it pleases, which terrifies the people of Zaitrec. 

So  the battletome confirms that there are multiple moons in  Hysh?   Also anything on the other elemental groups and what their warriors look like?

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28 minutes ago, xking said:

So  the battletome confirms that there are multiple moons in  Hysh?   Also anything on the other elemental groups and what their warriors look like?

Yes. As far as I understand it, there are multiple moons, waxing and waning. These moons are only partially physical. They periodically materialize and fade into incorporeality. Only Celennar, the true Moon, always orbits above the realm sphere (Its important to remember that the sky above the realmsphere is just as magical as the edges).

 

Other groups are mentioned. The Aelementari of the Zenith temple can turn into beings of pure light, while the warriors of the River temple are described as swift dexterous warriors. There is a short tale that features horse archers and a "fox-faced" bow wielding spirit of the Wind Temple. 
Oh, there is also a mention of a River Spirits, but they arent described in any detail. 

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Man I wanna stay engaged with this forum but I wanna read everything unspoiled first! Such a dilemma... I don’t even wanna write more lists because I am pretty sure I have everything I wanna try!

 

will ask, has anyone else been practicing ‘formation’ for their shining company? Like moving bases around, making sure every unit is in base to base, how to pile in effectively etc. I may be crazy for doing it, but I am keeping myself occupied at least....

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1 hour ago, Acid_Nine said:

Man I wanna stay engaged with this forum but I wanna read everything unspoiled first! Such a dilemma... I don’t even wanna write more lists because I am pretty sure I have everything I wanna try!

 

will ask, has anyone else been practicing ‘formation’ for their shining company? Like moving bases around, making sure every unit is in base to base, how to pile in effectively etc. I may be crazy for doing it, but I am keeping myself occupied at least....

Nope, but I’d love to hear what you’ve learned.

 

also, I’m loving this faction, like the ranks of spear men, mass volley fire, charging cavalry it’s got everything that I miss from my old high elf days EXCEPT one thing: customization in heroes.

 

Back in 2nd/3rd Ed HE days you could really creat any kind of high elf noble you liked, from cavalry lance dude, to agile archer dude. It was almost like d’n’d vibes. It is the only thing this release is lacking, they even have my old blade of leaping gold!!!

 

I know it’s not really the done thing in AOS, but man, I would have LOVED to have some really customized nobles to lead my forces.

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I received my pre-order yesterday and having digested the battletome I'm pretty happy with what Games Workshop have delivered. Sure, the range of miniatures is a little limited, but between the nations, spell lores and artefacts there's enough available to engage in some fun list building.

I've enjoyed the fluff. It's nice to finally see Hysh, Tyrion and Teclis fleshed out, also to see a more optimistic High Elf/Aeldari style faction - one on the ascendant rather than simply holding off an inevitable decline (though there are still hints of that).

Page 22 provides flavour for Realm-lord armies and hints at what we could expect to see in future, should the faction prove popular:

  • Tyrionic
    • Lord regents / Lady regents / Champions - Combat heroes
    • Archers - Vanari Auralan Sentinels
    • Spearmen - Vanari Auralan Wardens
    • Charioteers
    • Knights - Vanari Dawnriders
    • Artillery
    • Scouts
  • Teclian
    • Loreseekers - Loremaster style spellswords
    • Aelementiri Temples
      • River - tens of thousands of river warriors, presumably some kind of river wizard and river aelementor?
      • Mountains - the Alarith we have seen already, ~ a thousand
      • Wind - rare, air wizards/aelementor? Rare.
      • Zenith - angelic aelves, beings of light/thought. Almost none.

Hopefully we will see a Tyrionic hero and another Aelementiri temple at some point! I would really like a combat hero, I was thinking of using an allied Idoneth Akhelian King (High Elf Prince on Griffon) to scratch that itch.

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4 hours ago, John Edwards said:

 

  • Teclian
    • Loreseekers - Loremaster style spellswords
    • Aelementiri Temples
      • River - tens of thousands of river warriors, presumably some kind of river wizard and river aelementor?
      • Mountains - the Alarith we have seen already, ~ a thousand
      • Wind - rare, air wizards/aelementor? Rare.
      • Zenith - angelic aelves, beings of light/thought. Almost none.

Good summary! 

Something interesting, the wind temple is described in detail. One section in the tome describes cloud riding wizards, archers on long-limbed riding-beasts and a bow wielding fox-faced spirit. If we compare that with the Alarith, thats basically the full temple (maybe add a named character or two). 

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Anything hinting at something about Ulgu? Or is it just the picture of the twin realms? 

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1 hour ago, Gecktron said:

Good summary! 

Something interesting, the wind temple is described in detail. One section in the tome describes cloud riding wizards, archers on long-limbed riding-beasts and a bow wielding fox-faced spirit. If we compare that with the Alarith, thats basically the full temple (maybe add a named character or two). 

Yup, even the name of the Wind Spirit. This almost looks like they have the models for those already. There is a big difference to the other two where it's much more vague ("lots of them" and "zenith mages become angelic incorporeal light dudes"). 

@Xil The Lumineth have an embassy of sorts there, but are also attacked by Malerion sent Shadow Demons (I don't have the book in front of me right now, so it might mis-remember this). And the Lumineth managed to blow a hole into their realm which leads to Ulgu (also on the map we have seen on WarCom which is also in the book) and causes some havoc on both sides. Otherwise not that much about Ulgu in the book. They have the whole Slaanesh story in there again so Malerion and Morathi are mentioned of course, but no real big news there. 

About the heroes - I 100% agree that we could use more generic heroes, but we might not see generic non-named melee fighters. I think the Lumineth are lacking those on purpose, and in the Battletome it's mentioned that after Tyrion re-organized the military and installed his Degree, all the hosts are led by the Scinari mage caste. I hope I'm wrong, or maybe at least a loreseeker-type could be something. Even in case of the mages, I really would like to see a more generic (Mage/Archmage equivalent). The Cathallar is awesome, but also very specific. Some goes for the Stonemage. 

 

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I just got my box today, and the only complaints I have is that the box seems to be made from the weakest cardboard, the spears are already pre-bent on the sprue, and there is one rein that somehow got popped out of a sprue... but outside of that I am super excited! can't wait to read the book and build those models!!

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8 hours ago, John Edwards said:

Hopefully we will see a Tyrionic hero and another Aelementiri temple at some point! I would really like a combat hero, I was thinking of using an allied Idoneth Akhelian King (High Elf Prince on Griffon) to scratch that itch.

I was thinking of using the same model for an Eidolon of the Storm! Might be small, though.

How does an Eidolon look as an ally to the Lumineth? 

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5 hours ago, LuminethMage said:

About the heroes - I 100% agree that we could use more generic heroes, but we might not see generic non-named melee fighters. I think the Lumineth are lacking those on purpose, and in the Battletome it's mentioned that after Tyrion re-organized the military and installed his Degree, all the hosts are led by the Scinari mage caste. I hope I'm wrong, or maybe at least a loreseeker-type could be something. Even in case of the mages, I really would like to see a more generic (Mage/Archmage equivalent). The Cathallar is awesome, but also very specific. Some goes for the Stonemage. 

 

Well, that's unfortunate. I was reading about the various probably future units and getting hopeful, but if they don't add more generic heroes including at least one melee option, it almost straight up doesn't matter what else they add.

Oh well. Hopefully Malerion's aelves are cool.

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7 hours ago, Gecktron said:

Something interesting, the wind temple is described in detail. One section in the tome describes cloud riding wizards, archers on long-limbed riding-beasts and a bow wielding fox-faced spirit. If we compare that with the Alarith, thats basically the full temple (maybe add a named character or two). 

Good point, I'd love to see these. It's curious that the river temple isn't described in any more detail, given the lore says it has the most members, but I guess River Aelves and Sea Aelves are too similar from an aesthetic/sales point of view.

3 hours ago, Atreides said:

I was thinking of using the same model for an Eidolon of the Storm! Might be small, though.

How does an Eidolon look as an ally to the Lumineth? 

I wouldn't object to the model size, though I'm a filthy casual :P

Eidolon of the Storm looks attractive to me if you can fit the points in your list: nice combat hero, can fly, only one minor ability using the IDONETH DEEPKIN keyword.

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