Aos 2 - Lumineth Realm-Lords Discussion

[Koradrel of Chrace]

Quick, someone get @Yondaime a Cathallar to deal with the psychic trauma!

In all seriousness, not really.  The generic battalions they've been teasing are actually rather intruiging.  And our battalions aren't really that amazing, they're mostly used to lower our number of drops.  One of the other little tidbits floating around is that battalions might not affect drops any more.  I'm honestly hoping this is all true so that it encourages more build diversity.  Maybe there will be a reason to take models that don't see competitive play more often (looking at you Bladelords!).

[Maogrim]

Sooo, what does everyone think about the new rules for Heroes and Monsters in regards to our own entries in those caregories, like the Archmage or the Spirits of the Mountain?

[Koradrel of Chrace]

First thing that jumped to my mind is, "Whelp, Sevireth just became significantly less unique."

[LegolasisKing]

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Helon
Mortal Realm: Hysh

Leaders
Alarith Stonemage (130)
- Artefact: Hearthstone Amulet
- Lore of the High Peaks: Entomb
Avalenor, the Stoneheart King (360)
Sevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (300)
Hurakan Windmage (120)
- General
- Command Trait: Skyrace Grand Champion
- Artefact: Metalith Dust
- Lore of the Winds: Transporting Vortex
The Light of Eltharion (220)

Battleline
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)

Units
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)
- Lore of Hysh: Solar Flare

Battalions
Hurakan Temple (180)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 91

is the list im running in  a 32 man tourney this weekend any particular matchups i should be wary of?

[Koradrel of Chrace]

@LegolasisKing KO and Changehost are going to be really tough for you, and you'll probably struggle with hordes.  You're going to be really light on bodies to score objectives, and nothing in your list can really take a punch.  I think this list will annoy a lot of people, but will struggle to go 3-2.

[Andalf]

I think Katakros and/or a well run OBR list will give you head aches as well because he can regenerate so much.

The Hurakan temple is great if you really have a game plan to execute with it.  I’ve been thinking about using a Lord Regent and Dawnriders, and could definitely see trying to reinforce a Loreseeker on a forward objective.  You don’t really have these kinds of tools to take advantage of the free move, except to stay out of combat.  At some point you need to catch what the opponent is trying to send your way and deliver a hammer blow and I’m not seeing it in the characters.  Only 3 wizards and no twinstones will leave those kangaroos dangling out there without much support.  I still haven’t figured out an answer for Stormfiends yet myself either.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Andalf

[chosen_of_khaine]

14 hours ago, Maogrim said:

Sooo, what does everyone think about the new rules for Heroes and Monsters in regards to our own entries in those caregories, like the Archmage or the Spirits of the Mountain?

If anything I think it made running the unnamed Spirits even less appealing than Sevireth and Avalenor. Teclis turning into a beatstick for a turn is neat too.

Also, giving all monsters the option to "scour" like sevireth will hopefully simmer some of the heat off of lumineth...

[Koradrel of Chrace]

I'm cautiously intruiged.  So far, I haven't really been a fan of the elementari, possibly because they aren't dragons.  That said, I could see having at least one monster being a starting point for competitive lists, if for no other reason than the utility.  In that scenario, I think Avalenor beats out Sevireth in most lists.  We have a plethora of harassement units, but few true hammers.

Now, what could change all of this is the rumor of secondary objectives for each army that has been floating around.  That could really flip things topsy-turvey.

Edit: When Lord Tyrion finally arrives, I hope he brings home with him the Phoenix Guard and Phoenix riders where they belong.  At which point I will once again have a Phoenix in every army list.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Koradrel of Chrace

[Ian Wallsh]

Yes I  would 'Love' to see Anaerion return too!!  Considering his 'thing' with Morathi, Malerion being his son and his connection with 'Khaine' it seems likely!

[Koradrel of Chrace]

If Aenarion's spirit manages to make it out of Slaanesh's stomache, then say combines with Tyrion, who could perhaps be riding on the Ur-Phoenix, I will be playing all of my AOS games with out pants on!

....because I'll be wearing shorts.  I get hot really easily.  I blame my Viking blood.

[JustAsPlanned]

1 hour ago, Koradrel of Chrace said:

If Aenarion's spirit manages to make it out of Slaanesh's stomache, then say combines with Tyrion, who could perhaps be riding on the Ur-Phoenix, I will be playing all of my AOS games with out pants on!

....because I'll be wearing shorts.  I get hot really easily.  I blame my Viking blood.

I’ll do you one better; what if Aenarion BECAME a big Phoenix (or Dragon) spirit that Tyrion rides on. That way you could have both Tyrion AND Aenarion on the table at the same time!

[Koradrel of Chrace]

You had me at Aenarion became a Phoenix!

[Lucur]

Would that be the king of phoenixes? One could say, a phoenix king?

Yeah, I'll see myself out.

[Yondaime]

On 6/4/2021 at 3:36 AM, LegolasisKing said:

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Helon
Mortal Realm: Hysh

Leaders
Alarith Stonemage (130)
- Artefact: Hearthstone Amulet
- Lore of the High Peaks: Entomb
Avalenor, the Stoneheart King (360)
Sevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (300)
Hurakan Windmage (120)
- General
- Command Trait: Skyrace Grand Champion
- Artefact: Metalith Dust
- Lore of the Winds: Transporting Vortex
The Light of Eltharion (220)

Battleline
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)

Units
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)
- Lore of Hysh: Solar Flare

Battalions
Hurakan Temple (180)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 91

is the list im running in  a 32 man tourney this weekend any particular matchups i should be wary of?

you have close to 0 objective control power, hurakan are made of wet paper, anyone with some decent shooting can close the game turn 1

Avalenor wont get helon buff since he is ymetrica, and the stonemage is basically useless here, and the light of eltharion is a cool piece but plays alone

Remove avalenor, LoE and the stonemage and put some warders/sentinels and a cathallar and you'll have a more solid list

Something like this:

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Helon

Leaders
Sevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (300)
Hurakan Windmage (120)
- General
- Artefact: Metalith Dust
Scinari Cathallar (140)
- Artefact: Silver Wand

Battleline
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)

Battalions
Hurakan Temple (180)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Umbral Spellportal (70)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 110

Here you have far more bodies, and with umbral+ lambent light you can seriusly kill anyone turn 1

Edited June 7, 2021 by Yondaime

[Ennio]

Hi everyone, I would appreciate your opinion and advice around a 2000 points list composed by these units:

Light of Eltharion
Cathallar
Calligrave

3 Ballistas
10 Sentinels
5 Windchargers
10 Wardens
5 Dawnriders
5 Dawnriders
5 Bladelords
5 Bladelords

Sharshard Battery Battalion
Bladelord Host Battalion
Dawnrider Lance Battalion
Floating shrine terrain

The generic idea that I think would make for fun games would be:

- Have the Ballistas taking out elite/max sized units/Leaders/tanks from afar with support from the Sentinels

- Windcharges would zigzag around peppering units, luring them into getting close to/charge defense lines; they would retreat closer to Ballistas and Sentinels in case of ambush units and such

- Wardens, Bladelords and Eltharion act as defense lines, with Dawnriders flanking and potentially also retreating in case anyone gets too close to Ballistas and Sentinels

- Scinaris stay close to Bladelords and do what they do best; one of them is also chilling in a Shrine

What mainly concerns me as a tactical newbie is:

1) What would be the most effective Nation for this list?
2) If I should actually go for no Nation, what Artifacts, Traits, etc. set up would you recommend?
3) Could this list be sufficiently competitive or is it just (or even barely sufficient) for casual games?
4) Which (limited) units/battalions could I replace to make this more competitive but keeping the same strategy conceptually?

I really like the aesthetic of the Bladelords and the Ballistas models in particular, that's why I would really love to have a list with lots of them, that can still be competitive. That's also why I would like to avoid the usual 40-80 Sentinels and Wardens; though I know that they are far more convenient, safe and effective strategically speaking.

Thank you for your thoughts!

[Yondaime]

17 hours ago, Ennio said:

Hi everyone, I would appreciate your opinion and advice around a 2000 points list composed by these units:

Light of Eltharion
Cathallar
Calligrave

3 Ballistas
10 Sentinels
5 Windchargers
10 Wardens
5 Dawnriders
5 Dawnriders
5 Bladelords
5 Bladelords

Sharshard Battery Battalion
Bladelord Host Battalion
Dawnrider Lance Battalion
Floating shrine terrain

The generic idea that I think would make for fun games would be:

- Have the Ballistas taking out elite/max sized units/Leaders/tanks from afar with support from the Sentinels

- Windcharges would zigzag around peppering units, luring them into getting close to/charge defense lines; they would retreat closer to Ballistas and Sentinels in case of ambush units and such

- Wardens, Bladelords and Eltharion act as defense lines, with Dawnriders flanking and potentially also retreating in case anyone gets too close to Ballistas and Sentinels

- Scinaris stay close to Bladelords and do what they do best; one of them is also chilling in a Shrine

What mainly concerns me as a tactical newbie is:

1) What would be the most effective Nation for this list?
2) If I should actually go for no Nation, what Artifacts, Traits, etc. set up would you recommend?
3) Could this list be sufficiently competitive or is it just (or even barely sufficient) for casual games?
4) Which (limited) units/battalions could I replace to make this more competitive but keeping the same strategy conceptually?

I really like the aesthetic of the Bladelords and the Ballistas models in particular, that's why I would really love to have a list with lots of them, that can still be competitive. That's also why I would like to avoid the usual 40-80 Sentinels and Wardens; though I know that they are far more convenient, safe and effective strategically speaking.

Thank you for your thoughts!

This is a interisting one

So, i was thinking something like this

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Syar

Leaders
The Light of Eltharion (220)
Scinari Cathallar (140)
- Artefact: Silver Wand
- Lore of Hysh: Protection of Hysh
Scinari Calligrave (100)
- General
- Command Trait: Goading Arrogance
- Artefact: The Perfect Blade
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh

Battleline
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
- Lore of Hysh: Lambent Light
10 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (140)
- Lore of Hysh: Total Eclipse
5 x Vanari Bladelords (120)
5 x Vanari Dawnriders (130)
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)

Units
5 x Vanari Dawnriders (130)
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh
5 x Vanari Bladelords (120)

Artillery
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)

Battalions
Starshard Battery (120)
Bladelord Host (100)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)
Hyshian Twinstones (30)
Sanctum of Amyntok (30)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 102

 

This can be a fun list, use the 2 bladelords to babysit the calligrave and the cathallar, cast the twinstones with the calligrave, cast  amyntok and protection of hysh with the cathallar (amintok makes the cathallar buble bigger), harrass with dawnriders (they do insane damage vs 1W infantry) and try to snipe heroes

 

1) you can go syar or zaitrec (personally i like zaitrec more because more magic, but syar is objectily better)

2) if you can, ALWAYS take the silver wand on the cathallar, +1 spell is just our best choice

3) competitive speaking no, by far, you can have some fun but dont except to win many games, you dont have many bodies to control objectives and you lack sentinels 

4) atm only 2 batalions are competitive auralan legion and alarith temple (but ONLY in ymetrica), maybe  even starshards but honestly i did tryed it

 

Bladelords are not so strong, they are perfect to babysit the cathallar (literally the glue of our army), so 5 max, they are really fragile and theyr damage output is hilariusly lacking

Balistas can be good but you have to play a lot of wardens and some sentinels to have some meat on objectives

Sentinels and teclis are literally the reason we are tier A

like i sayed you have three ways to play competitive

a)-the obvius one, teclis plus sentinels, atm, our strongest choice

b)-ymetrica, but its really hard and i dont recomend it if you are new to lumineth

c)-helon, i saw that some helon list did good at some tournaments, but i am kinda sceptic about it, and if ymetrica its hard helon its even harder since positioning is key

Edited June 8, 2021 by Yondaime

[JackStreicher]

I just stumbled upon this narrated battle report I simply had to share.

And btw: That Teclis Conversion looks sick! (in all the good ways)

Teaser image from Season of War

 

[Ennio]

1 hour ago, Yondaime said:

This is a interisting one

So, i was thinking something like this

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Syar

Leaders
The Light of Eltharion (220)
Scinari Cathallar (140)
- Artefact: Silver Wand
- Lore of Hysh: Protection of Hysh
Scinari Calligrave (100)
- General
- Command Trait: Goading Arrogance
- Artefact: The Perfect Blade
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh

Battleline
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
- Lore of Hysh: Lambent Light
10 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (140)
- Lore of Hysh: Total Eclipse
5 x Vanari Bladelords (120)
5 x Vanari Dawnriders (130)
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh
5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)

Units
5 x Vanari Dawnriders (130)
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh
5 x Vanari Bladelords (120)

Artillery
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)
Vanari Starshard Ballistas (100)

Battalions
Starshard Battery (120)
Bladelord Host (100)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)
Hyshian Twinstones (30)
Sanctum of Amyntok (30)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 102

 

This can be a fun list, use the 2 bladelords to babysit the calligrave and the cathallar, cast the twinstones with the calligrave, cast  amyntok and protection of hysh with the cathallar (amintok makes the cathallar buble bigger), harrass with dawnriders (they do insane damage vs 1W infantry) and try to snipe heroes

 

1) you can go syar or zaitrec (personally i like zaitrec more because more magic, but syar is objectily better)

2) if you can, ALWAYS take the silver wand on the cathallar, +1 spell is just our best choice

3) competitive speaking no, by far, you can have some fun but dont except to win many games, you dont have many bodies to control objectives and you lack sentinels 

4) atm only 2 batalions are competitive auralan legion and alarith temple (but ONLY in ymetrica), maybe  even starshards but honestly i did tryed it

 

Bladelords are not so strong, they are perfect to babysit the cathallar (literally the glue of our army), so 5 max, they are really fragile and theyr damage output is hilariusly lacking

Balistas can be good but you have to play a lot of wardens and some sentinels to have some meat on objectives

Sentinels and teclis are literally the reason we are tier A

like i sayed you have three ways to play competitive

a)-the obvius one, teclis plus sentinels, atm, our strongest choice

b)-ymetrica, but its really hard and i dont recomend it if you are new to lumineth

c)-helon, i saw that some helon list did good at some tournaments, but i am kinda sceptic about it, and if ymetrica its hard helon its even harder since positioning is key

Thank you!

I am definitely going to include more endless spells; not looking into aelementiri based lists yet.

So if I would want to have a good chance to win games there seems to be no alternative then having as many Wardens/Sentinels as possible atm.

Pity to ditch the bladerlords host (perhaps just 1 babysitting unit of 5...) because they and the ballista really look great to me.

Are there no competitive lists that include Light of Eltharion?

[whispersofblood]

12 minutes ago, Ennio said:

Thank you!

I am definitely going to include more endless spells; not looking into aelementiri based lists yet.

So if I would want to have a good chance to win games there seems to be no alternative then having as many Wardens/Sentinels as possible atm.

Pity to ditch the bladerlords host (perhaps just 1 babysitting unit of 5...) because they and the ballista really look great to me.

Are there no competitive lists that include Light of Eltharion?

You might see him included some now with the hero abilities (particularly the ability to dispell endless spells, and generate CP), and our heal spell from the Wind lore.

Depending what happens with Inspiring Presence his CMD might increase in utility as well.

[Yondaime]

1 hour ago, Ennio said:

Thank you!

I am definitely going to include more endless spells; not looking into aelementiri based lists yet.

So if I would want to have a good chance to win games there seems to be no alternative then having as many Wardens/Sentinels as possible atm.

Pity to ditch the bladerlords host (perhaps just 1 babysitting unit of 5...) because they and the ballista really look great to me.

Are there no competitive lists that include Light of Eltharion?

Wardens not neccesarily, sentinels yes, 40 is the sweet spot you need

Eltharion is a really strong piece, it depends what you mean by competitive, you want to win some games? absolutely yes, you want to be on the podium? most likely no, but that is hard even for the waac lists when seraphon/tzeech/ko are a thing

Remember that a list you like playing and you feel comfortable with is stronger that a net list you dont understand really well how it works

I brewed this for example

Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Syar

Leaders
Sevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (300)
Scinari Cathallar (140)
- Artefact: Silver Wand
- Lore of Hysh: Lambent Light
The Light of Eltharion (220)
Hurakan Windmage (120)
- General
- Command Trait: Goading Arrogance
- Lore of the Winds: Calming Zephyr
Vanari Lord Regent (150)
- Artefact: The Perfect Blade
- Lore of Hysh: Protection of Hysh

Battleline
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)
20 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (280)

Battalions
Auralan Legion (120)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Umbral Spellportal (70)
Hyshian Twinstones (30)
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 93
 

This can be a really solid list with eltharion, but you have to understand how these models work together, for example if you have the windmage 6" from an enemy the  fox is engaged with, the enemy cant attack neither, really usefull to block models like archon

 

[Yondaime]

1 hour ago, whispersofblood said:

You might see him included some now with the hero abilities (particularly the ability to dispell endless spells, and generate CP), and our heal spell from the Wind lore.

Depending what happens with Inspiring Presence his CMD might increase in utility as well.

True, listing now feels useless since aos 3 seems to shake the game A LOT

Edited June 8, 2021 by Yondaime

[Ennio]

2 minutes ago, Yondaime said:

True, listing now feels useless since aos 3 seems to shake the game A LOT

 

1 hour ago, whispersofblood said:

You might see him included some now with the hero abilities (particularly the ability to dispell endless spells, and generate CP), and our heal spell from the Wind lore.

Depending what happens with Inspiring Presence his CMD might increase in utility as well.

Ultimately I would like to create a fun-to-play Lumineth list that can also get me a good win-lose ratio more in local than in international context atm... not looking to join the national team just yet!

Though "local" doesn't mean easy at all, I'm based in a big city where there are lots of very skilled and experienced players in pretty much all clubs and stores (some of them actually do play in national/competitive teams). That's why I'd like to start by building something that can be dangerous in most scenarios from the get go while I get my very rusty wargaming skills back in shape and figure out what type of Lumineth force I feel more comfortable around.

At the same time, I really, really would love to field a fantastic and diverse AoS army from a visual perspective.
Don't get me wrong, I love Sentinels as models ... though 40+ of them may look a bit, let's say, old fashioned?
I'll always have in my heart regiments, square bases and regiment bases but ... yeah, I'll probably get back to that once and if Old World will really be "back".

You're totally right that AoS 3.0 is right around the corner, so I will definitely just wait and see how the game evolves before actually buying new units.

But again thanks very much for the enlightenment (he-hem) on the current Lumineth state of things ^^

I currently own:

- Launch Box models
- Cathallar
- 10 Sentinels
- 1 Ballista (🙄)
- 5 Bladelords (whooops 🙄🙄 oh well they'll look cool in a glass display and in casual games for sure!)


 

[Yondaime]

3 minutes ago, Ennio said:

 

Ultimately I would like to create a fun-to-play Lumineth list that can also get me a good win-lose ratio more in local than in international context atm... not looking to join the national team just yet!

Though "local" doesn't mean easy at all, I'm based in a big city where there are lots of very skilled and experienced players in pretty much all clubs and stores (some of them actually do play in national/competitive teams). That's why I'd like to start by building something that can be dangerous in most scenarios from the get go while I get my very rusty wargaming skills back in shape and figure out what type of Lumineth force I feel more comfortable around.

At the same time, I really, really would love to field a fantastic and diverse AoS army from a visual perspective.
Don't get me wrong, I love Sentinels as models ... though 40+ of them may look a bit, let's say, old fashioned?
I'll always have in my heart regiments, square bases and regiment bases but ... yeah, I'll probably get back to that once and if Old World will really be "back".

You're totally right that AoS 3.0 is right around the corner, so I will definitely just wait and see how the game evolves before actually buying new units.

But again thanks very much for the enlightenment (he-hem) on the current Lumineth state of things ^^

I currently own:

- Launch Box models
- Cathallar
- 10 Sentinels
- 1 Ballista (🙄)
- 5 Bladelords (whooops 🙄🙄 oh well they'll look cool in a glass display and in casual games for sure!)


 

5 Bladelords are fine to have, protecting a cathallar is a must even in competitive games

But yes if you have to buy more wait 3.0, so if you wanto to buy a competitive list you wont get dissapointed

if your friends are fine you can proxy with bases so you can try things out (i did that, A LOT xD)

[LegolasisKing]

So i went 3-2 in a tourney with my List got 16th place overall mainly had a hard time getting secondaries done. Stonemage did work Entomb is super worth it dealing with OBR or Tzeentch killing off the Hekatos or banner for pinks

[Austin]

On 6/10/2021 at 1:51 AM, LegolasisKing said:

So i went 3-2 in a tourney with my List got 16th place overall mainly had a hard time getting secondaries done. Stonemage did work Entomb is super worth it dealing with OBR or Tzeentch killing off the Hekatos or banner for pinks

I really liked that you tried out that list in a tournament.

Let me ask you this- how much utility did you get out of the 3 inch additional shots from the Roos?   As in, how often did you you get to use it and how many at a time?