Aos 2 - Lumineth Realm-Lords Discussion

[ArchaicArc]

Hey all, I have my first ever lumineth/AoS game this weekend!

My list is what you can see in the photos I uploaded earlier, it’s just a small practice game do 600 points.

i have 

Eltharion,

2 Units of wardesn

 1 unit of sentinels.

Im planning on going zaitrec just because I don’t really have a dedicated wizard and so the extra magic boost will help.

Any neat little strategies or tactics that you guys could offer me in advance (spell selections etc).

[Joseph Mackay]

Decided I’m going to start Lumineth Realmlords. I usually prefer the Dark Aelves, both from a model and lore point of view, but these are the first High Aelves that I liked the look of. Didn’t get into them at release because I was working on other stuff at the time.

played a test game yesterday to work out if I like how they work before I buy them (I’ve bought a few full 2000pts armies in the past and then found I don’t like the armies playstyle). My assessment is that there’s a bit of a learning curve and I’m not used to casting that many spells (definitely need to make some quick reference cards or something for all the spalls 😂). I think I liked them, I just need to learn what to do with everything lol

this is the list I ran (it’s based on the order I’m planning to buy things-Direchasm>Eltharion>Teclis>1 of each unit). I was of course using proxies for everything so I didn’t use the endless spells as I thought that’d be a bit too confusing for my opponent (the second Eltharion represents the Direchasm units that aren’t on warscroll builder)
Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords
- Great Nation: Ymetrica
Mortal Realm: Hysh

Leaders
Alarith Stonemage (130)
- Artefact: Mountain's Gift  
- Lore of the High Peaks: Assault of Stone
Archmage Teclis and Celennar, Spirit of Hysh (660)
- General
The Light of Eltharion (220)
Myaris Purifiers (Underworlds) (220)
The Light of Eltharion

Battleline
10 x Alarith Stoneguard (200)
- Stone Mallets
10 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels (140)
- Lore of Hysh: Total Eclipse
10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens (120)
- Lore of Hysh: Solar Flare

Units
10 x Vanari Dawnriders (260)
- Lore of Hysh: Speed of Hysh

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 95

played against new Slaanesh in Gift From The Heavens. I was given first turn. Dawnriders got off Speed of Hysh and moved 28” across the board and charged a unit of Hellstriders. Due to terrain in the way and trying to avoid dragging other units into combat (which I failed as I unfortunately dragged in new Seekers unit too), only 6 got to fight and only did 5 wounds 😂. The Hellstriders and Seekers then killed 4 dawnriders and I lost another 4 to battleshock (I spent their ‘crystal meth’ for +1 to hit). Teclis got mobbed by a Keeper and 5 of the new Seekers (who got to attack twice) and died turn one 😥. Turn 2 Stoneguard charged the keeper who was 4.5” up terrain, just made the 10” charge to reach him then he Locus’d them so I couldn’t pile in, so only the champion and banner both with dual hammers got to hit him, the unit then got wiped lol. Sigvald spent most of the time running away from Eltharion, until the opponent had weakened him via shooting. Sigvald then charged him along with that mirror thing with the 2 daemons on it? The mirror thing used an ability so Eltharion couldn’t attack until after the mirror had and sigvald killed him. I got tabled turn 3. A unit of new seekers charged the Wardens and I killed 3 of them, which was probably the highlight for them lol

[OkayestDM]

5 minutes ago, Joseph Mackay said:

My assessment is that there’s a bit of a learning curve and I’m not used to casting that many spells (definitely need to make some quick reference cards or something for all the spalls 😂). I think I liked them, I just need to learn what to do with everything lol

The box set they released last year has a pack of spell cards, which I found to be incredibly helpful in the game I've played with them. You can probably find the cards for a decent price on Ebay.

[LuminethMage]

12 hours ago, zombiepiratexxx said:

This is what I was working with as an idea at the moment; 

LEADERS

Alarith Stonemage 

Scinari Cathallar  - General

Avalenor, the Stoneheart King 

The Light of Eltharion 

UNITS

10 x Alarith Stoneguard - Stone Mallets

5 x Vanari Dawnriders

10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens

10 x Vanari Auralan Sentinels

10 x Vanari Auralan Wardens

BEHEMOTHS

Alarith Spirit of the Mountain

1900/2000 no room for a battalion but plenty for Endless Spells

It's just an idea because I know there's new stuff coming and I already want AirFox and the new Mounted Hero for sure. And obviously no idea what larger changes may come as the result of the new tome. I can get hold of the Starter Box for less money than it would cost to buy just the models, even with a discount, and while the book will be replaced, the extras will likely still be of us, and, if they're not, I'd still be using the units from the box so it's almost a win/win. I want something that will compete with the OBR my friend is looking at without either stomping them into the ground, or being stomped into the ground as that's not fun for anyone. 

 

Sounds good. Personally I think even the old BT is not really a waste, because of all the art, lore, painting guides etc. in it. It likely will have some use for you if you can get is that cheap : ). 

If you take this a base for more things to come it's pretty good. Otherwise you likely do not need 10 Sentinels (10 alone don't do much)  and could use a second Stonemage instead of a Cathallar. That would open your list up for more Stoneguard for example. But if you anyway plan to broaden your list with new models, then having a Cathallar and some Sentinels is good. 

13 hours ago, OkayestDM said:

So, here's a thing I've been mulling over.

It's bothered me ever since I assembled them that Wardens have a big ol' sword strapped to their backs, but no weapon profile for it.  Dawnriders also all have a sword attached to the saddle that doesn't feature on their warscroll.

I'm wondering whether or not this is going to become relevant when Tyrion gets a release? (Presumably a few years down the road.) Vanari are meant to serve both Teclis and Tyrion, I'm curious if we're going to get something like a Seraphon style Starborn/Coalesced split in the faction, where the Teclian faction abilities give the Vanari their magic, and the Tyrionic faction abilities make them more martially proficient in the form of additional weapon profiles?

That would be a good idea to provide something special for Tyrion, make the martial side more pronounced. They have set-up the Lumineth perfectly to do something like the Starborn/Coalesced with them if they want to. 

@Joseph Mackay Your timing has been great. I also find the spell and ability cards mentioned by Okayest DM incredibly useful, but just yesterday AoShorts released their new ability cards for the Lumineth. If you do not mind printing them yourself they are a great alternative (and free : ) ). This link goes directly to a google drive to download: Cards 

If you rather want to see first what's this about here, is AoShorts Twitter account: AoShorts 

Edited March 2, 2021 by LuminethMage

[Joseph Mackay]

Question about Assault Of Stone spell, when it says roll lower than the targets armour save, if their save is 4+ does it work off 5s and 6s because 5+ or 6+ is ‘lower’ than a 4+ or would it only work on 3s because that’s lower than a 4 (since the spell says 1s and 2s always fail)?

[GrimDork]

No, it would only work on 3's with a 4+ save. Not the best target for this spell.

[Joseph Mackay]

27 minutes ago, GrimDork said:

No, it would only work on 3's with a 4+ save. Not the best target for this spell.

This was how we thought it worked to. Found that out the hard way sadly. Tried casting it on Sigvald too only to find he has a 3+ save so the spell doesn’t even work on him 😂

[LuminethMage]

It’s happening!?!? : )

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/03/02/hit-your-local-warhammer-shop-in-march-for-these-lumineth-themed-goodies/

Edited March 2, 2021 by LuminethMage

[JustAsPlanned]

 

17 minutes ago, LuminethMage said:

It’s happening!?!? : )

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/03/02/hit-your-local-warhammer-shop-in-march-for-these-lumineth-themed-goodies/

Nice! I’m really hyped for the Wind Temple stuff and the Loreseeker, so those are gonna be insta-buys. When do we reckon they’ll be pre-ordering?

[Wickie De Viking]

thats the million* dollar question  in the Lumineth app-group current thought is end of the month, more or less.

* = ok, not a million but it might get expensive...

[Aelfric]

22 minutes ago, Wickie De Viking said:

thats the million* dollar question  in the Lumineth app-group current thought is end of the month, more or less.

* = ok, not a million but it might get expensive...

Expensive enough for me to not buy Cursed City.  Nice as it is, Fox Spirit and Rooriders ( and all the rest) must come first.  

[Howdyhedberg]

I will pick up the lore master hero, the realmlord and probably a new book.

Down the line I would like to add the ballista and swordmasters.

 

[LuminethMage]

It’s really hard to say, originally it was definitely meant to happen probably early/mid March. 

The novel is going to be released, they have the White Dwarf following along (hopefully) or following up on BR Teclis, a Warcry BR Teclis special, and the model/coin. 

So, very likely we’ll at least see the pre-order announcement or, if they split it, the first wave of models in March. 

[Wyliekyote]

Oh man.... this is kinda making me a wee bit giddy that we could see them end of March/start of April!?!  😱🤑💸

And speaking of coins.... I’ve found some on thingverse that are way sweet.  Go there and search for Warcry tokens or maybe even Age of Sigmar.  The designer has almost all the factions avail to download for free.  
 

I’ve been having trouble keeping track of who’s cast, who’s used their aether.... etc. so I’ve printed some out ( along with a token from Warcry for Aetherq). Here a shot of different sizes. Think they are 50mm/40mm, 32mm, and 25mm... I liked the 25mm version and printed and painted them. I’ll get and post a pic of them shortly.

 

But I’m still damn tempted to get that cool coin... cause it’s not like I’m not gonna blow great wads of cash on these models. 💸💸💸

[Jeremierty]

Hi guys, 

I'm so excited for the incoming release !! I just wish they would start to share some tidbits about the rules

What do you think our lovely army needs the most right now ? And how the incoming release might bring us new tools ? 

for me I secretly hope that the banner will give us even more tankiness like a +1 save à la Katakros would be incredible and maybe a immune bravery ?

the ballista is expected to be a heavy hitter I expect maybe bonus against big blobs and heavy rend like -2 to differentiate from the archers ? 

I also really hope there is a way to buff Teclis or synergise with him in there because as of right now... For 660 points he is just not worth it... Too fragile not killy enough he only has his 4 spells going for him and 4 spells for 660 points I think is too much when that could represent almost 40 wardens that would make you win the game by actually controlling objectives ! I always compare him to Katakros which I absolutely love and for 500 points of Katakros teclis is a no match in term of abilities he doesn't synergise much of the army, and aside being polyvalent he isn't that good anywhere else relative to its point cost

Otherwise I think our army lacks primarily a way to control objectives and own the table but I don't quite see a remedy to that in the upcoming release (aside maybe the teleportation of the wind spirit ?). I'm fine with lumineth not being able to controll the table that much as it's also the problem of the ossiarch and that balances their ability to tank and win by attrition

What do you think ? 

[Joseph Mackay]

Don’t worry everyone, I’ve done you all a favour - I bought the current Lumineth Realmlords battletome, so knowing gw they’ll put the new one up for pre-order next week 😂

[OkayestDM]

1 hour ago, Jeremierty said:

Hi guys, 

I'm so excited for the incoming release !! I just wish they would start to share some tidbits about the rules

What do you think our lovely army needs the most right now ? And how the incoming release might bring us new tools ? 

for me I secretly hope that the banner will give us even more tankiness like a +1 save à la Katakros would be incredible and maybe a immune bravery ?

the ballista is expected to be a heavy hitter I expect maybe bonus against big blobs and heavy rend like -2 to differentiate from the archers ? 

I also really hope there is a way to buff Teclis or synergise with him in there because as of right now... For 660 points he is just not worth it... Too fragile not killy enough he only has his 4 spells going for him and 4 spells for 660 points I think is too much when that could represent almost 40 wardens that would make you win the game by actually controlling objectives ! I always compare him to Katakros which I absolutely love and for 500 points of Katakros teclis is a no match in term of abilities he doesn't synergise much of the army, and aside being polyvalent he isn't that good anywhere else relative to its point cost

Otherwise I think our army lacks primarily a way to control objectives and own the table but I don't quite see a remedy to that in the upcoming release (aside maybe the teleportation of the wind spirit ?). I'm fine with lumineth not being able to controll the table that much as it's also the problem of the ossiarch and that balances their ability to tank and win by attrition

What do you think ? 

I imagine the banner will give use a movement or bravery buff, or possibly an after save (though I think that's less likely.)

Teclis is actually very good, but he's meant to be a support piece that dominates the magic scene.  His warscroll spells are excellent, as are his additional abilities. If you're looking for a beatstick however, he'll let you down every time as that's not what he's designed to do.

I think the main things our army would benefit from are speed and offensive punch. We have a lot of strong defensive units, some of which are quite deadly, but we don't have many units that we can just hurl at the enemy and tear them apart with. 

Hurakan is going to be focused on speed, which might allow us to make other units faster as well.  

The ballista will definitely give us a ranged weapon that our enemies have to close the distance to deal with, and the Bladelords are supposed to be pretty deadly, so our army should be in a really solid place once the units come out.

I'm excited to see what command abilities our new heroes give us, as we don't actually have much in that regard currently. We'll also probably be getting a new spell lore with the Hurakan, opening up even more options for our army.

[LuminethMage]

Yeah exciting times, and thank you @Joseph Mackay for your sacrifice, appreciated 😆! 

I think Teclis is in a pretty good spot, if you take him, he’ll change the way you play and can pull his weight. On the other hand, he has some disadvantages and is not a “must” if you want to play Lumineth successfully. He’ll likely get stronger if we we see a new spell lore. The Bladelords also might have a “guard Wizard“ ability. But Teclis is walking on a fine line, if he can dish out a lot more mortals or becomes just a bit too tanky, he’ll be too good for his points.

Things I hope we get are speed and some good, old fashioned punch (hopefully not only via mortals). I really hope the Bladelords are the heavy hitters they should be, and we can play a more fragile, but more heavy hitting and more maneuverable play style. 

With so many new heroes, if they don’t all have bad rules, we should see a lot more options to play then right now. 

Between BR Teclis and all the new units they’d have teasing material for ages, so hopefully we start seeing some of it soon. After all the named March the month of the Lumineth, so please enlighten us : ) 

[GrimDork]

On the subject of Teclis, can he cast Zaitrec's Overwhelming Heat spell?

[LuminethMage]

18 minutes ago, GrimDork said:

On the subject of Teclis, can he cast Zaitrec's Overwhelming Heat spell?

Yup : ). 
 

And this has to be shown here of course : ) 

[GrimDork]

10 minutes ago, LuminethMage said:

Yup : ). 

Is it specifically stated somewhere that I have missed?

(Edit, just found it myself. Telis gains the Zaitrec keyword)

Edited March 3, 2021 by GrimDork

[Jeremierty]

1 hour ago, OkayestDM said:

I imagine the banner will give use a movement or bravery buff, or possibly an after save (though I think that's less likely.)

Teclis is actually very good, but he's meant to be a support piece that dominates the magic scene.  His warscroll spells are excellent, as are his additional abilities. If you're looking for a beatstick however, he'll let you down every time as that's not what he's designed to do.

I think the main things our army would benefit from are speed and offensive punch. We have a lot of strong defensive units, some of which are quite deadly, but we don't have many units that we can just hurl at the enemy and tear them apart with. 

Hurakan is going to be focused on speed, which might allow us to make other units faster as well.  

The ballista will definitely give us a ranged weapon that our enemies have to close the distance to deal with, and the Bladelords are supposed to be pretty deadly, so our army should be in a really solid place once the units come out.

I'm excited to see what command abilities our new heroes give us, as we don't actually have much in that regard currently. We'll also probably be getting a new spell lore with the Hurakan, opening up even more options for our army.

Thank you so much for your answer ! I didn't thought of a movement buff but that sounds cool ! 

Someone previously imagined the lord regent being able to let you reform your shining company for a CP I would love some kind of synergies and cool abilities like that !

I know teclis isn't supposed to hit hard or tank.. and I'm fine with this design choice !  But the way I see it he provides +1 to cast (that can be given by the twinstones or zaitrec) and his 5+ fnp (that is really cool) his other signature spell is quite random and cannot really be relied on but that means that per turn he gives his 5+ fnp and then he only cast 3 spells and that's it, no real buff, no damage and definitely no tanking xD... he has no other utility than those 3 spells that can be easily cast by other units .. I find it quite bad that a 660 point model is only here to cast 3 spells + giving a 5+ fnp and a +1 to cast... I would expect of him to synergize the army the way a Katakros does or bringing some unique ability allowing for a unique playstyle like + 1 spell for vanari, or sun metal weapons are auto cast or he has 3 aetherquartz or maybe he can heal models ? give - 1 to wound ? I don't know something cool and thematic that I don't feel we quite get with his current rules with regards to his point cost because right now he doesn't do really more than an Arkhan while being almost double his point cost ;( 

But yeah with the wind lore spells maybe he has more utility or more synergies integrated with the new units 

I also can't wait to see the command abilities !

[Jeremierty]

27 minutes ago, LuminethMage said:

Yeah exciting times, and thank you @Joseph Mackay for your sacrifice, appreciated 😆! 

I think Teclis is in a pretty good spot, if you take him, he’ll change the way you play and can pull his weight. On the other hand, he has some disadvantages and is not a “must” if you want to play Lumineth successfully. He’ll likely get stronger if we we see a new spell lore. The Bladelords also might have a “guard Wizard“ ability. But Teclis is walking on a fine line, if he can dish out a lot more mortals or becomes just a bit too tanky, he’ll be too good for his points.

Things I hope we get are speed and some good, old fashioned punch (hopefully not only via mortals). I really hope the Bladelords are the heavy hitters they should be, and we can play a more fragile, but more heavy hitting and more maneuverable play style. 

With so many new heroes, if they don’t all have bad rules, we should see a lot more options to play then right now. 

Between BR Teclis and all the new units they’d have teasing material for ages, so hopefully we start seeing some of it soon. After all the named March the month of the Lumineth, so please enlighten us : ) 

That's the problem I have with him is that his 4 spells (because he only does that frankly) is not enough to justify the huge investment ;/ if he had maybe 5 or 6 ? But 5 vanari unit can cast those spells for the same point cost almost the same efficiency (with twinstones ) and actually control objectives

I don't want him to dish out more mortal wounds just to be a better totem and gives more  buffs to the army because that's what I would expect of him

Bladelords with a guard wizzards ability sounds awesome !! Maybe they are also a unit that can cast the sanctuary endless spell usefully ! 

I feel that if we get too many heavy hitter with our ranged capacities and our ability to hit with two unit in a row it would allow us to too systematically one shot any thing

[LuminethMage]

13 minutes ago, GrimDork said:

Is it specifically stated somewhere that I have missed?

He has the keywords you need, Zaitrec and Wizard. Or I misunderstood your question. He can only do it when you play Zaitrec. Otherwise no. 
 

@Jeremierty he does have more abilities, right? Auto-unbind and dispel alone is big, then the pluses on casting and unbinding, spell immunity on a 4+. But, yeah, right now he is not a must-take. But I’m sure, if we get a new spell lore, he’ll become better. So far our lores have been good. And some of the other heroes might provide something for him : )  

Edited March 3, 2021 by LuminethMage

[GrimDork]

1 minute ago, LuminethMage said:

He has the keywords you need, Zaitrec and Wizard. Or I misunderstood your question. He can only do it when you play Zaitrec. Otherwise no. 

Yeah, got it thanks!

Hadn't realised that Teclis gains the Great Nation keyword as well.