Sons of Behemat Discussion 👣

[Moogypies]

1 hour ago, Sigmarusvult said:

Found on facebook.

Take it with the usual pinch of salt although the prices  for the non gargants items seem legit, we might just assume that...

I have to say my excitement for the big lads has dropped significantly, hopefully the rules will pull it back up. 

Honestly I don't see what the salt is about frankly.

We have some of the most impressive, large scale models that matches the previously biggest model (Archaon, £100) with three times the customisation options, people should've assumed gargants would be abou his price, and after teclis made a showing of the new costs, upped expectations in accordance with that.

Compare the cost to another army,

We will cost £510 for 3 megas and 3 aleguzzlers for a 2k army.

Randomly plucked, lets say a khorne Tyrants of Blood army, you got your 4 thirsters which are £340  and still have 800 points to make up which will likely, come up to about £100-£160 choice dependant which doesn't really make us that much more expensive then other individually built armies. 

You got outliers like BCR who offer incredible value/pt , but £510 for a complete 2k army, I honestly don't think is too bad in the scheme of this hobby. With such few units, we won't ever have to really buy more to be "in the meta", we're pretty much a 1 purchase and done situation.

I'll be buying the three, the tomes and cards and audiobook on release for sure, and may still increase the mega's to 9 in time for alternate poses and different loadouts as I love the gargant race. Heck I'm still buying more aleguzzlers despite having more then the max amount I can even use. If they're my army for the next years worth of gaming, well, well worth the price to me, but everyones hobby is different and we got to respect their views  
 

Edited October 5, 2020 by Moogypies

[KingBrodd]

8 minutes ago, Moogypies said:

Honestly I don't see what the salt is about frankly.

We have some of the most impressive, large scale models that matches the previously biggest model (Archaon, £100) with three times the customisation options, people should've assumed gargants would be abou his price, and after teclis made a showing of the new costs, upped expectations in accordance with that.

Compare the cost to another army,

We will cost £510 for 3 megas and 3 aleguzzlers for a 2k army.

Randomly plucked, lets say a khorne Tyrants of Blood army, you got your 4 thirsters which are £340  and still have 800 points to make up which will likely, come up to about £100-£160 choice dependant which doesn't really make us that much more expensive then other individually built armies. 

You got outliers like BCR who offer incredible value/pt , but £510 for a complete 2k army, I honestly don't think is too bad in the scheme of this hobby. With such few units, we won't ever have to really buy more to be "in the meta", we're pretty much a 1 purchase and done situation.

I'll be buying the three, the tomes and cards and audiobook on release for sure, and may still increase the mega's to 9 in time for alternate poses and different loadouts as I love the gargant race. Heck I'm still buying more aleguzzlers despite having more then the max amount I can even use. If they're my army for the next years worth of gaming, well, well worth the price to me, but everyones hobby is different and we got to respect their views  
 

I was a bit suprised at the Megas price, the Mancrushers are cheaper than buying 2 individually which is very welcome so I'm happy about that, I just thought the Megas would be around £110. Still I agree with you and am picking everything up for the Sons.

[Oreaper84]

1 hour ago, KingBrodd said:

I was a bit suprised at the Megas price, the Mancrushers are cheaper than buying 2 individually which is very welcome so I'm happy about that, I just thought the Megas would be around £110. Still I agree with you and am picking everything up for the Sons.

This is pretty steep. Archeon is priced because there is 1 in your army, Teclis...also only one. For those of us that will want/need 3+ of these for an army thats a little nuts. Especially when i know im going to have to pay the Yankee markup in addition to the conversion. God help the Aussies...

[KingBrodd]

8 minutes ago, Oreaper84 said:

This is pretty steep. Archeon is priced because there is 1 in your army, Teclis...also only one. For those of us that will want/need 3+ of these for an army thats a little nuts. Especially when i know im going to have to pay the Yankee markup in addition to the conversion. God help the Aussies...

My heart goes out to my Aussie brothers back home, I only came back into the hobby because it was cheaper here in the UK then it is at home in Oz. I wouldnt be suprised to see the Megas be well over $230AUD.

[Overread]

12 minutes ago, Oreaper84 said:

This is pretty steep. Archeon is priced because there is 1 in your army, Teclis...also only one. For those of us that will want/need 3+ of these for an army thats a little nuts. Especially when i know im going to have to pay the Yankee markup in addition to the conversion. God help the Aussies...

The flipside is that you don't need 3 boxes of £35 models to make a single unit that might be half the cost of a Giant to put on the table in points. I suspect that, cash wise, a Sons army is going to wind up being roughly the same as if you'd bought another regular army. Only you'll have a handful of massive high detail models instead of more, smaller models. 

[Ganigumo]

9 minutes ago, KingBrodd said:

My heart goes out to my Aussie brothers back home, I only came back into the hobby because it was cheaper here in the UK then it is at home in Oz. I wouldnt be suprised to see the Megas be well over $230AUD.

yeah I'm not sure what the exchange rate is, but its probably going to be around 230 canadian, Part of what makes australian prices so high is that they need to apply the tax to the display price, so I suspect it will be around 260 AUD? Thats around what it will be in canada after tax.

[novakai]

2 hours ago, Moogypies said:

Honestly I don't see what the salt is about frankly.

We have some of the most impressive, large scale models that matches the previously biggest model (Archaon, £100) with three times the customisation options, people should've assumed gargants would be abou his price, and after teclis made a showing of the new costs, upped expectations in accordance with that.

Compare the cost to another army,

We will cost £510 for 3 megas and 3 aleguzzlers for a 2k army.

Randomly plucked, lets say a khorne Tyrants of Blood army, you got your 4 thirsters which are £340  and still have 800 points to make up which will likely, come up to about £100-£160 choice dependant which doesn't really make us that much more expensive then other individually built armies. 

You got outliers like BCR who offer incredible value/pt , but £510 for a complete 2k army, I honestly don't think is too bad in the scheme of this hobby. With such few units, we won't ever have to really buy more to be "in the meta", we're pretty much a 1 purchase and done situation.

I'll be buying the three, the tomes and cards and audiobook on release for sure, and may still increase the mega's to 9 in time for alternate poses and different loadouts as I love the gargant race. Heck I'm still buying more aleguzzlers despite having more then the max amount I can even use. If they're my army for the next years worth of gaming, well, well worth the price to me, but everyones hobby is different and we got to respect their views  
 

yeah have 3 different variants (compare to the Knight kits that have 2 that are very similar to each other) and extra bits make the pricing a little bit justified. overall building a full army is about as expensive as other newer AoS armies

i not really fuzzing over this particular kits pricing and probably still buy the kits and battletome, just concern of this trend of GW ever increasing prices.

Edited October 5, 2020 by novakai

[KingBrodd]

5 minutes ago, novakai said:

yeah have 3 different variants (compare to the Knight kits that have 2 that are very similar to each other) and extra bits make the pricing a little bit justified. overall building a full army is about as expensive as other newer AoS armies

i not really fuzzing over this particular kits pricing and probably still buy the kits and battletome, just concern of this trend of GW ever increasing prices.

Yeah I'm not concerned over this pricing in general just the future of GW increases.

[Equinox]

Planning to buy one mega-gargant and battletome at release as I like the idea that they can be used in some fashion with every faction.  Means I can just throw the mega-G into a list while I build up the real units for the army.  

[Fellman]

Sprues

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/10/05/sons-of-behemat-gargants-evolved/

[Scotian Giant]

So assuming those are correct, this makes the the Mega Gargants $206 CAD (the currency ill use for the rest of this), and the box of 2 Mancrushers $129. Lets round these off to $200 and $130 respectively.

So with our known 3 of building a 2k army, here is what I came up with.

1 mega, 9 crushers: Total cost is $850/495pound, while leaving 1 mancrusher at home. 

2 mega, 6 crushers: Total cost is $790/445pound, nothing left over

3 mega, 3 crushers: Total cost is $860/510pound, yet another mancrusher left out.

I expected this to be roughly the cost, admittedly more than I would want, but compared to other armies, this is not all that bad. Surprisingly just buy 3 mega's is actually the most expensive route to 2k. Who would have thought that.

[Gutlord]

5 hours ago, KingBrodd said:

@Gutlord Looks as though the Warstompers back is actually the Gut Plate posted as a Rumour Engine all those months ago!!

Ahhhh so no decapitated monster.....still looks sick mate doesn't it💪

[Fellman]

 

 

[Gareth 🍄]

Sprues at last! 😎

[Gareth 🍄]

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

So I’m committing to these big fellas for a new army and want this to be flavorful and thematic. I realized that for three years since starting  this hobby, I’ve never had a cohesive paint scheme and much less a theme/narrative driven set of models. 
 

Any wisdom out there from experience when you went for a scheme? Perhaps you started one way and ended in another? Maybe you started too early and the rules just didnt quite match what you were going for? Not saying the rules were “bad”, but how did you adapt to completing the list/army?

at the end of the day, I really want to go for an elemental driven giant army. Perhaps green giants for a sylvaneth look or lightning Thunderscorn appeal

[Scotian Giant]

3 minutes ago, Gareth 🍄 said:

These lads are amazingly huge, like, his THIGH is the size of the Aleguzzler's torso!

[EasyArmy]

They look great! I'm ready to buy them now, GW.

[Moogypies]

12 minutes ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

So I’m committing to these big fellas for a new army and want this to be flavorful and thematic. I realized that for three years since starting  this hobby, I’ve never had a cohesive paint scheme and much less a theme/narrative driven set of models. 
 

Any wisdom out there from experience when you went for a scheme? Perhaps you started one way and ended in another? Maybe you started too early and the rules just didnt quite match what you were going for? Not saying the rules were “bad”, but how did you adapt to completing the list/army?

at the end of the day, I really want to go for an elemental driven giant army. Perhaps green giants for a sylvaneth look or lightning Thunderscorn appeal

Gargants are so wonderful in that we can perhaps look the most disjointed, taping bits of whatever faction onto us whenever we want and it still looks cohesive and in-theme overall. 

I went for a giant from each realm/faction and a few stereotypical patchy giants. 

I have a few more since this picture. 

Edited October 5, 2020 by Moogypies

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

@Moogypies that gargant on stonehorn is rediculous. I love it. But you did it, hit just about every faction. I’m envious of the death players Especially because they could 3D print the most epic skeleton giant

[Moogypies]

2 minutes ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

@Moogypies that gargant on stonehorn is rediculous. I love it. But you did it, hit just about every faction. I’m envious of the death players Especially because they could 3D print the most epic skeleton giant

Far, far more to do in time to get one for each faction ^^  But I think this is that faction that I find the most passion with. 
I've seen so many themes just work on gargants, for elementals I personally would focus more on maybe using tattoo's to express a connection with the elements, someone did an absolutely gorgeous Fire Gargant on the Facebook "Sons of Behemat Age of Sigmar" page. (Credit to the painter- Giacomo Simone) far eclipses my talent, but its incredible.

Part of me wonders about an earthy giant, with fire undertones covered in crackle paint/mordant earth and seeing how that would look. 

[PC Veteran]

U.S. prices are 195 for Mega and 125 for the 2 Gargants box. Source my flg.

 

[hughwyeth]

4 hours ago, Moogypies said:

Honestly I don't see what the salt is about frankly.

We have some of the most impressive, large scale models that matches the previously biggest model (Archaon, £100) with three times the customisation options, people should've assumed gargants would be abou his price, and after teclis made a showing of the new costs, upped expectations in accordance with that.

Compare the cost to another army,

We will cost £510 for 3 megas and 3 aleguzzlers for a 2k army.

Randomly plucked, lets say a khorne Tyrants of Blood army, you got your 4 thirsters which are £340  and still have 800 points to make up which will likely, come up to about £100-£160 choice dependant which doesn't really make us that much more expensive then other individually built armies. 

You got outliers like BCR who offer incredible value/pt , but £510 for a complete 2k army, I honestly don't think is too bad in the scheme of this hobby. With such few units, we won't ever have to really buy more to be "in the meta", we're pretty much a 1 purchase and done situation.

I'll be buying the three, the tomes and cards and audiobook on release for sure, and may still increase the mega's to 9 in time for alternate poses and different loadouts as I love the gargant race. Heck I'm still buying more aleguzzlers despite having more then the max amount I can even use. If they're my army for the next years worth of gaming, well, well worth the price to me, but everyones hobby is different and we got to respect their views  
 

You know i really balked at the price, but will likely still get an army. The logic you're showing really only makes sense in the world of the GW hobby, in relative terms using points as a way to measure value. When you buy an army, you're getting a stack of boxes of different sizes and a load of different kits, likely 2-3x the amount of sprue. With Gargants you're getting 2 different kits in 4 boxes. In absolute, real-world value, it's really poor. It makes sense in the GW world, but in the "buying a product with reasonable profit margin taking into account manufacture, design and distribution costs" it's really poor value. I know that GW haven't actually increased prices above inflation in general as a principle, but this is definitely stretching any value proposal for buying plastic models for a game. Maybe we're too used to to buying 2/3 SC boxes and some other boxes to make an army for £300, but I personally feel the price too much. It should, at most, match a Castellan Knight at £100. 

The worst part is the 2 mancrushers at 75. That was £45 literally 3 years ago- £47.50 with inflation. A £30 increase in 3 years is ungenerous considering the age of the kit. They still come with a square base on the sprue!

Having said that, people (including, probably, me) will buy this. So who the hell cares. 

Edited October 5, 2020 by hughwyeth

[Gutlord]

Hmmmmm.....ok, it's fairly expensive as far a GW products go but the way I see it....the mega gargant kit is a work of art, a masterpiece from a design and sculpture  point of view. Its everything you would want from a model that represents a fictional giant and will definitely stand the test of time like its predecessor has (mancrusher kit) so for me I'm ok with that price.......might only be getting one every few months to get my 2k list mind you 😄

[Moogypies]

44 minutes ago, hughwyeth said:

You know i really balked at the price, but will likely still get an army. The logic you're showing really only makes sense in the world of the GW hobby, in relative terms using points as a way to measure value. When you buy an army, you're getting a stack of boxes of different sizes and a load of different kits, likely 2-3x the amount of sprue. With Gargants you're getting 2 different kits in 4 boxes. In absolute, real-world value, it's really poor. It makes sense in the GW world, but in the "buying a product with reasonable profit margin taking into account manufacture, design and distribution costs" it's really poor value. I know that GW haven't actually increased prices above inflation in general as a principle, but this is definitely stretching any value proposal for buying plastic models for a game. Maybe we're too used to to buying 2/3 SC boxes and some other boxes to make an army for £300, but I personally feel the price too much. It should, at most, match a Castellan Knight at £100. 

The worst part is the 2 mancrushers at 75. That was £45 literally 3 years ago- £47.50 with inflation. A £30 increase in 3 years is ungenerous considering the age of the kit. They still come with a square base on the sprue!

Having said that, people (including, probably, me) will buy this. So who the hell cares. 

Even if I don't just plop it in at GW pts/£ metric, I would still say personally for me it's decent value for the hobby I enjoy.
But that's a hole to go down for someone else, I don't care to talk about GW price points and derail the gargant thread. In the end everyone has their own views and choices for the hobby that is valid for each individual and I respect those viewpoints.

I've been saving for these boys since reveal, and I'm mega-excited to see some more rules as the week comes on