Fazhak Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) Recently, in the Beasts of Chaos discussion thread, a post inquired about what opportunities arise when playing Beasts of Chaos battalions out of the various Chaos God allegiances. Rather than simply answer there, I figured it might be helpful to respond in a new thread. That way, we can hopefully grow the conversation in a way that is more accessible to both casual review and search attempts. Beasts of Chaos Allegiance Before getting to the four Chaos God allegiances, it might be helpful to note what a Beasts of Chaos player gives up when using those. The Beasts of Chaos allegiance itself is a collection of minor, albeit interesting benefits, each keyed to the main Beasts of Chaos factions: Brayherd, Warherd, and Thunderscorn. Note that the Beasts of Chaos' menagerie of monsters (cockatrice, jabberslythe, chimera, etc.) get nothing from the allegiance's battle traits, little from the currently available Greatfrays, and only slight buffs from the allegiance's spell lores (the "Titanic Fury" spell notwithstanding). Nor are these monsters involved in the four Chaos God battalions. The focus of comparison thus centers on how Brayherd, Warherd, and Thunderscorn play differently in each setting. Only Beasts of Chaos allegiance armies get to ambush, only Beasts of Chaos allegiance armies get the Herdstone and its related Primordial Call mechanic, and (perhaps most significantly) only Beasts of Chaos allegiance armies get to use Bestigors, Bullgors, and Dragon Ogors as Battleline if the general is either Brayherd, Warherd, or Thunderscorn. I think the latter point is probably the biggest factor in allegiance selection. Having the option to forego Gors or Ungors, in favor of more elite forces, is attractive. With the recent price discount of Warherd units in the December FAQ, fielding an exclusively elite unit Beasts of Chaos army is more accessible. It is also helpful to note that the Beasts of Chaos allegiance can field a surprising amount of high Rend. The Herdstone itself creates an ever-increasing Rend effect. Further options include: fielding Warherd with Great Axes, the Brayherd spell "Tendrils of Atrophy," the Thunderscorn spell "Sundering Blades," and several artefacts. In fact, not many armies can have two Heroes with -3 Rend, which a Beasts of Chaos allegiance army can do by fielding two Dragon Ogor Shaggoths (one with an “Ancestral Azyrite Blade” and one with either Chamon’s “Rune Blade” or Ulgu’s “Dimensional Blade”). Much is said elsewhere about ambushing and summoning. Brayherd units often contribute the most to these two features. Beyond the Brayherd, the Beasts of Chaos allegiance's capacity to make Thunderscorn run and charge (via the artefact “Horn of the Tempest”), along with the Creatures of the Storm battle trait, results in Thunderscorn being one of the game’s faster heavy cavalry choices when used in this allegiance. The Warherd’s Bloodgorge battle trait is somewhat underappreciated, too. By the way, while earlier conventional wisdom seemed to recommend fielding Bullgors and Dragon Ogors in MSU, I think running units of six alongside their respective Hero option is the way to go. Bullgors benefit from having a Doombull nearby, not just for Slaughterer’s Call, but also for Inspiring Presence. Dragon Ogors are strong with the ability to re-roll ones when near a Dragon Ogor Shaggoth. Such seems applicable to all the possible allegiance options. Khorne Allegiance The biggest benefit to running a Brass Despoilers-heavy army out of the Blades of Khorne seems to be Khorne’s capacity to give units additional attacks. The Bloodsecrator (especially when buffed by the Gore Pilgrims battalion) and Wrathmongers make this possible. Both Bestigors and Warherd are the strongest recipients of this resource. Large units of Bestigors, if their charges maximize frontage, can produce a startling amount of -1 Rend attacks. When fully buffed, Tuskgor Chariots can also be surprisingly good in Khorne. Warherd probably gain the most, though, complementing their already high Rend and the battalion’s re-roll benefits. A solid unit of Bullgors in Khorne can put out a lot of damage. In range of both the Bloodsecrator and Wrathmongers, a fully-engaged unit of six with unit leader has 25 attacks at a stat line of 4+ re-roll 1s/3+/-2/3. A Ghorgon is particularly nasty in Khorne when fully buffed, with three potential Huge Slavering Maw attacks. Remember that the Wrathmongers’ buff helps the Cygor’s missile attack, too. Tzeentch Allegiance Warherd are going to come up several times in these discussions, because several Chaos God allegiances provide ways to address the Warherd’s weaknesses. Those weaknesses include few attacks, average accuracy, and no innate ability to run and charge. Khorne addressed the first by doubling, when fully buffed, a Bullgor’s attack output. Tzeentch addresses the accuracy issue. Destiny Dice can help ensure the Bullgors hit their targets. Even better, note that the new Tzeentch book explicitly states that Destiny Dice count as unmodified dice. This means that when used by Warherd to score 6s for their to Wound rolls, Destiny Dice activate Bloodgreed/Ravenous Bloodgreed. A Fatemaster’s innate command ability is arguably a better buff for Warherd than the Doombull’s. Also of note is the Hosts Duplicitous Change Coven: an armywide buff that prohibits enemies from retreating seems helpful in a Warherd-heavy army. Lastly, successful completion of agendas can result in different Warherd units that increase considerably in potency as a game progresses. Nurgle Allegiance Once more, Warherd benefit arguably the most in Nurgle, gaining increased maneuverability thanks to both the Great Unclean One’s “Doomsday Bell” and the Feculent Gnarlmaw’s run and charge buff. When combined with a maximized run, a Ghorgon can reliably move 17” on its first turn, making first turn charges a real possibility. This is without factoring in an additional 2” movement bonus from the Cycle of Corruption, and also without further speed buffs from endless spells. Effective management of the Cycle of Corruption is a key to getting the most out of a Pestilent Throng in a Nurgle allegiance army. Its wizards gain access to the “Foul Regenesis” spell, just like all Nurgle wizards in a Nurgle allegiance army. If cast successfully, pick the bonus needed at the moment, with an eye to the next turn, too. An armywide +1 to Wound is helpful, especially for those units like Bestigors and Warherd that are already at 3+ to Wound. Alternatively, if defense is needed, the capacity to neuter opposing forces’ exploding 6s might be more useful in some circumstances. Healing should not be ignored; remember, the Great Unclean One’s innate spell also heals Nurgle units, which include a Pestilent Throng’s multiple wound Warherd, Thunderscorn, and even the Brayherd’s Centigors. Centigors (and, to perhaps a lesser degree, Bestigors) in a Nurgle allegiance army have a particular combination available to them when buffed by a Rotbringer Sorcerer’s “Blades of Putrefaction” spell. These Brayherd units both have an innate capacity to gain +1 to Hit (Bestigors is dependent on opposing units). That bonus means that the additional mortal wounds made possible by “Blades of Putrefaction” trigger on 5+ to Hit rolls, rather just 6+. With the amount of attacks Centigors and Bestigors inflict, such results in a high likelihood of many mortal wounds prior to damage from the attacks themselves. The speed at which “Blades of Putrefaction”-buffed Centigors and/or Bestigors can move, combined with Warherd units’ own improved movement, results in a Pestilent Throng that can reliably charge a surprising amount of elite units on the first turn. Slaanesh Allegiance Thunderscorn gain arguably the most from Euphoric Killers, given innate amount of attacks available in a given space, with both Warherd and Bestigors also significantly benefiting from that armywide buff. A Dragon Ogor Shaggoth also has an innate healing option which, combined with its high wound count, can result in many Depravity Points becoming available over the course of a game. Additional benefits for a Depraved Drove in a Slaanesh allegiance army likely depend on the Host chosen at army creation. A Godseekers list amps up units’ already above average speed. A Pretenders list allows Gors to both re-roll 1s to Hit and have a melee 4+ save, making a 30 block unit of Gors a cost effective buy at 200 points each. Further, a Pretenders list can run a Doombull with both the “Hunter of Godbeasts” command trait and the “Sliverslash” artefact, resulting in a Hero that: (1) re-rolls charges against an opposing Hero Monster with an artefact (many armies have these), (2) attacks five times at 3+/3+/-2/4, re-rolling to Hit rolls, (3) inflicts additional mortal wounds on unmodified to Wound rolls of 6, and (4) rolls additional attacks from Bullgor Horns. An Invaders list might slightly edge out a Pretenders list as the most efficient option for a Depraved Drove. While its outright potential damage output might be somewhat less, the additional range for command ability like Inspiring Presence is very attractive for units with average Bravery. Also, the “Best of the Best” command trait complements the Depraved Drove benefit, especially for a Thunderscorn Hero. When fighting an opposing Hero that has an artefact, a Dragon Ogor Shaggoth general, armed with a Rune Blade or Dimensional Blade, will attack three times at 3+/3+/-3/3, re-rolling to Hit and to Wound, plus other melee attacks. That is a strong Hero killer. Closing Thoughts Beasts of Chaos is a fun range of units to play in and of themselves, before even considering which allegiance one finds most fun. At times, I have explored all five options; each has an appeal that might surprisingly compel my interest for a time before I move on to a different build. I recommend eventually trying them all, but for beginners, especially those without much experience with Beasts of Chaos units, I think starting with the Beasts of Chaos allegiance is the best bet. Learn the basics of what the Brayherd, Warherd, and Thunderscorn do well and what they do not do well. Get a sense for their capacity for speed relative to other armies, as well as how their respective innate buffs complement each unit. If there is an aspect to the Beasts of Chaos range that you discover you particularly enjoy (high Rend capability, high speed, etc.), then explore the Chaos God allegiance that most accentuates that facet. Have fun! I hope the above is helpful and look forward to the conversation. Happy wargaming! Edited January 19, 2020 by Fazhak 9 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naprapaten Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 I would argue the best combo for BoC as Phantasmagoria of fate battalion in Tzeentch allegiance is to run ungors for screens and pair that with skyfires/enlightened on discs with a great bray-shaman for that nasty 19" move. So with this you have cheap screens, hard punch, a bit of magic and also summoning to back it up. If you run a gaunt summoner and pick the host arcanum as your coven you summon 6 screamers and 10 pinks for free first turn. Thats 30 fate points worth of summoning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
begleysm Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 What about the Slaves to Darkness? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 9 minutes ago, begleysm said: What about the Slaves to Darkness? They are allies only. But you can take a Gaunt Summoner to spawn horrors, you can also take a DP or even Be'lakor, all 3 are great for different reasons. Personally i think Be'lakor is the best for BoC out of those 3 units. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezgor Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Very interesting post. I am very fan of lists combined with my beasts, recently I created this list to give more usefulness to my beasts. Allegiance: Tzeentch - Change Coven: Guild of Summoners LEADERS Magister (100) - General - Command Trait : Prophet of the Ostensible The Blue Scribes (120) - Lore of Change : Arcane Transformation Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore (260) - Artefact : Brimstone Familiar - Lore of Fate : Shield of Fate Fatemaster (120) - Artefact : Secret Eater Doombull (100) Grashrak Fellhoof (140) UNITS 10 x Bestigors (120) 10 x Bestigors (120) 6 x Bullgors (280) - Great Axes 10 x Ungors (60) - Mauls & Half-Shields 10 x Ungors (60) - Mauls & Half-Shields 10 x Ungors (60) - Mauls & Half-Shields 1 x Cockatrice (100) - Allies BATTALIONS Phantasmagoria of Fate (200) ENDLESS SPELLS / TERRAIN / COMMAND POINTS Balewind Vortex (40) Burning Sigil of Tzeentch (40) Wildfire Taurus (80) TOTAL: 2000/2000 EXTRA COMMAND POINTS: 1 WOUNDS: 123 LEADERS: 6/6 BATTLELINES: 3 (3+) BEHEMOTHS: 1/4 ARTILLERY: 0/4 ARTEFACTS: 2/2 ALLIES: 100/400 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 Some notes for using Beasts in Khorne: -Bloodtithe can be used to let a unit fight in the hero phase (either player's), double hits on 6's and/or fight on death. When used at the right time on buffed Bullgors/Bestigors it can be devastating. - Bullgor hit rolls can be buffed with a slaughterpriest's Killing Frenzy prayer (+1 to hit) which goes off on 4+ with a reroll if the priest is within 8" of the khorne altar. Also it lasts until your next hero phase so great if you have to eat a double turn. With reroll 1's from the battalion this makes them pretty reliable hitters. Also great to put on Bestigors for 2+ to hit (reroll 1's) when fighting a unit of 10 or more models. -Can also buff their saves with slaughterpriest's Bronzed Flesh prayer (+1 to save), pretty handy on a 4 wound model, especially if they're in cover and/or you happened to give them shields (although obviously great axes are better). Again the effects lasts until your next hero phase. Also a great buff for Bestigors or Gors with Shields for a 3+ save (2+ in cover!!!). - Gors are actually good to take in Brass Despoilers as fast cheap screens that die and give you Blood Tithe Points. Or you have them follow wholly within 9" of the Bullgors/Bestigors to get the battalion rerolls in which case you can give the Gors shields to boost their save instead of dual hand weapons (as they already get reroll 1's to hit from the battalion). - The Goretide Slaughterhost lets you autorun 6" and charge with a unit of Bloodwarriors or Bloodreavers for a CP. Combines nicely with Gors and Bestigors run & charge for a surprisingly fast infantry army. A Khorne artifact called Talisman of Burning Blood gives +1 to run and charge for friendly khorne units wihtin 12" of the bearer when the roll is made (no restriction for mortals or daemons) for even more speed. - Wrathmongers were FAQ'ed to only buff melee attacks so they won't buff the Cygor's shooting attack (however the killing frenzy prayer would if you really want to hit that enemy wizard in the face with a giant rock... you know you do). Below is a list I've come up with taking advantage of the above (and somewhat limited to the models I own). Its only 2 drops although I've only taken 5 heroes. Unfortunately there are no 60 point khorne heroes so would have to drop 2 units to fit a 6th hero in, probably a chariot and either a unit of Gors or another chariot, although you can always summon a Bloodthirster 🙂; Allegiance: Khorne- Slaughterhost: The GoretideMortal Realm: GhyranLeadersDoombull of Khorne (100)- General- Trait: Hew the Foe (+1 DMG to all melee weapons)- Artefact: Ghyrstrike (+1 to hit & wound for one melee weapon)Bloodsecrator (120)- Artefact: Thronebreaker's Torc (Armour save ignores modifiers)Slaughterpriest (100)- Artefact: Talisman of Burning Blood (+1 to run & charge rolls for units within 12")- Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy (+1 to hit)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Bronzed Flesh (+1 to save)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Blood Sacrifice (D3 mortal wounds to a friendly unit with 8" for 1 Bloodtithe Point)Battleline10 x Blood Warriors (200)- Goreaxe & Gorefist- 1x Goreglaives10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Gors of Khorne (70)10 x Gors of Khorne (70)Units20 x Bestigors of Khorne (240)3 x Bullgors of Khorne (140)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)BattalionsBrass Despoilers (190)Gore Pilgrims (140)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Death1942 Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 2 hours ago, Agent of Chaos said: Allegiance: Khorne - Slaughterhost: The GoretideMortal Realm: GhyranLeadersDoombull of Khorne (100)- General- Trait: Hew the Foe (+1 DMG to all melee weapons)- Artefact: Ghyrstrike (+1 to hit & wound for one melee weapon)Bloodsecrator (120)- Artefact: Thronebreaker's Torc (Armour save ignores modifiers)Slaughterpriest (100)- Artefact: Talisman of Burning Blood (+1 to run & charge rolls for units within 12")- Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy (+1 to hit)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Bronzed Flesh (+1 to save)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Blood Sacrifice (D3 mortal wounds to a friendly unit with 8" for 1 Bloodtithe Point)Battleline10 x Blood Warriors (200)- Goreaxe & Gorefist- 1x Goreglaives10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Gors of Khorne (70)10 x Gors of Khorne (70)Units20 x Bestigors of Khorne (240)3 x Bullgors of Khorne (140)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)BattalionsBrass Despoilers (190)Gore Pilgrims (140)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 3 I really love the tactics you explained around Khorne, I am mighty tempted to collect an army similar to this. Personally I would drop all the chariots (maybe summon them in though) and aim for 2 blocks of 6 Bullgors with great axes. I think those backed up by a slaughterpriest and some gor for screening and reroll 1s buff would be super nasty to face. That way you end up with 3 massive threats on the board (with the Bestigor) and your opponent has to make some difficult choices on what to remove first. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 @Death1942 No worries! 🙂 Big blocks of Bullgors is definitely an option as you get even more benefits from all the buffs. Keep in mind you lose the Beast of Chaos summoning in Khorne allegiance (along with the herdstone and ambushing) so you cant summon chariots. However you can summon khorne daemons 😈😈😈 Alternatively you could run Brass Despoilers battalion in Beasts of Chaos allegiance with an allied bloodsecrator for extra attacks but then you cant get access to the slaughterpriest prayers for +1 to hit/save as they are locked to the khorne allegiance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 Something else to think about for Khorne now that Cygors are cheaper. The are Single modles and can sit behind other units to trigger the Batalion buff, they gain the benefits from the battalion as well, so if not shooting at a Wizards its 4+ rr1's, and for 1 turn its 4+, rr1's and rr wounds. Its a very good way to get a few easy -2 rend shots off, a couple unbinds, and aura maker for battalion. Not the most optimal pick, but if you want to play it, it helps. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 50 minutes ago, Agent of Chaos said: Alternatively you could run Brass Despoilers battalion in Beasts of Chaos allegiance with an allied bloodsecrator for extra attacks but then you cant get access to the slaughterpriest prayers for +1 to hit/save as they are locked to the khorne allegiance. Can you do that? I now battalions counts as the allegiance, but we don't have the ability to ally in khorne units in the army. no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 Oh yeah, whoops! Only slaves to darkness can be allies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 (edited) With OBR meta, it also might be better to play Pure BoC until they are changed (if they will be). BoC can have the most Rend in the entire game easily. Almost every unit starts out at -1 rend, with Bullgors and Doombulls -2 rend, a Gargant (AKA Giant) has lots of -1 and a -3 witha -2 rend attacks, a Chimera also has a -3 attack with lots of -1's, etc.. Herdstone for -1 save Shaggoth spell for a unit gets an additional -1 rend Shaman spell for a enemy unit gets -1 to saves a Shaggoth relic for additional -2 rend Allher relic for -1/-2/-3 rend (+1 rend for every 10 models in a unit( A few other relics that are -1 rend with other rules You could do Shaggoth -2 rend relic (or Allherdrelic) Doombull +2D relic Doombull Shaman Bray or on Disk (1 cast and re-roll casts once a game, also works well with Portal) Bray Shaman and or Named shaman (He also has a +1 to hit spell) Bullgor unit Bestigor units A giant and or Enlighten on Disks (price hike) or a Giant Finally lots of Ungors/chariots/ models to get in the way. You start with 3 Heroes, 2 at -2 rend, 1 at -3 (or more) 2 spells for more rend/lower saves, Bullgor unit for a -2 rend to start, then a few other units to fill out. Try to cast both spells each turn (1 is a short range, so Shaman on Disk will work better get i range turn 1 cast turn 2, or take Portal and now you have 2 casts with re-rolls). Over all you can get many units at high rend easily. a 5+/6+ re-rolling isnt very good, if you are lucky and get 2 spells off he is now -4 rend/5D, give him a couple attacks from CP (Gavespawn trait) he now has a potential of 25D and M-guard will have no saves, tho the Doombull will most likely miss 1 hit and 1 wound, so it'll be 15D, not bad for a 100pt character. The Giant is most likely the Strongest single low point unit in BoC, if you can get the 3 spells on it,a nd 2-3 CP from Spawns, you could be rr1's, +1 to hit/wounds, +3atks, +2 rend (most likely fail a couple of those) But thats 4 attacks 3+/3+ re-rolls for -5 6D, yes 6D not 1D6 but flat 6 damage, and that is not counting the 4 -3 for D3 damage attacks for the 3D6+3 -3 for 1D attacks. But its alot of spells and he could fail his charge (he can't charge if you roll doubles). Very high risk/High reward. Edited January 20, 2020 by Maddpainting Spelling, I'm bad at english Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Mandelson Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 (edited) The rend buffing artefact that escalates rend with every 10 models is the Allherd relic and caps at -3 rend (sadly). Another benefit of BoC allegiance is the 4 Unalligned battalions, one for each of the Breyherd, Warherd and Thunderscorn and one for Breyherd and Warherd mix. Although they mostly aren't great (with one exception) and not really competitive (again except one), they can be fun if you build a list around them or play skillfully with them can be beneficial. Breyherd only: Gives +1 to charges when arriving from Breyherd ambush. It has a large number of unit requirements which makes pricey but only needing 8+ charges from ambushing Bestigors, which you have them can come in turn 2 from Darkwalkers and reduce that charge to 6+ with cogs can make it an interesting surprise to your opponents. Warherd only: Gives 6" pile-in moves, note this does NOT give you 6" combat range just the pile-in move. With new Warherd discounts this becomes a bit better, especially when taking larger squads of Bulls getting more of them into attack range. Thunderscorn only: Gives extra chance to heal Thunderscorn units and deal out mortal wounds to units within 3" (may be getting this wrong as I have never used it so have nothing really to say about it). Mixherd: Gives Unmodified 6s to hit counts as 2 hits when wholly within enemy territory. This one is actually pretty useful. Got benefit (a worse version of Slaanesh AA but this one also works for shooting and you still have all the BoC AAs) and can easily contain most (or even all) of your army for a low drop list due to it's various unit choices. Only downsides to this Battalion is that Bestigor and Bullgor take up the same slot and it's only 1-3 of them which I feel limiting, only 1 Gorgon/Cygor slot and No Centigor /Tzaangor (any kind). They may not be the best Battalions but they can only be taken in a BoC Allegiance and they can be useful if applied well. Also, I'm new to the forums and the tournament scene. So, Hi to all you fellow BoC players. PS. Just for reference, the Darkwalkers artifact is basically useless: Pick a terrain feature within 1" of the Bearer, on a 2+ for each enemy unit within 1" of said terrain feature deal d3 MW. One use only, use at the Start of your Hero Phase. Edited January 20, 2020 by Alan Mandelson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 (edited) Oh yeah its allherd, i got my artefacts mixed up, will edit that. And i was saying rend, but sometimes i am referring to the spells/herdstones abilities "-1 to their saves" so it does stack with that. Edited January 20, 2020 by Maddpainting Spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Mandelson Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 I got what you meant (Have personally had a Doombull attack with -5 to my opponents saves) it's just that the artifact states that the rend of the weapon cannot get upgraded better then -3 rend and thought I should make sure the info is precise for the unenlightened to the ways of the beastmen, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddpainting Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 It was a bit confusing b.c i lump it all up as potentials negatives to their saves b.c there is many combinations you can do, sorry for the confusion. 1 artefact is max -3, then you have another artefact that gives -2 always, and then you have the spells and herdstone, 1 spell gives -1 rend, another spell gives -1 saves, and the herdstone gives -1 saves. 2 -2 saves options and 1 -1 rend option is pretty good, Tho 1 of them is tied to the Shaggoth. A Doombull and Shaggoth and always b -3 no matter what if you wanted -3 rend without spells/herdstone, the Doombull is better with 5D from Gavespawn as giving him an additional -1+ rend is easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Krungharr Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 On 1/19/2020 at 6:03 PM, Agent of Chaos said: Some notes for using Beasts in Khorne: -Bloodtithe can be used to let a unit fight in the hero phase (either player's), double hits on 6's and/or fight on death. When used at the right time on buffed Bullgors/Bestigors it can be devastating. - Bullgor hit rolls can be buffed with a slaughterpriest's Killing Frenzy prayer (+1 to hit) which goes off on 4+ with a reroll if the priest is within 8" of the khorne altar. Also it lasts until your next hero phase so great if you have to eat a double turn. With reroll 1's from the battalion this makes them pretty reliable hitters. Also great to put on Bestigors for 2+ to hit (reroll 1's) when fighting a unit of 10 or more models. -Can also buff their saves with slaughterpriest's Bronzed Flesh prayer (+1 to save), pretty handy on a 4 wound model, especially if they're in cover and/or you happened to give them shields (although obviously great axes are better). Again the effects lasts until your next hero phase. Also a great buff for Bestigors or Gors with Shields for a 3+ save (2+ in cover!!!). - Gors are actually good to take in Brass Despoilers as fast cheap screens that die and give you Blood Tithe Points. Or you have them follow wholly within 9" of the Bullgors/Bestigors to get the battalion rerolls in which case you can give the Gors shields to boost their save instead of dual hand weapons (as they already get reroll 1's to hit from the battalion). - The Goretide Slaughterhost lets you autorun 6" and charge with a unit of Bloodwarriors or Bloodreavers for a CP. Combines nicely with Gors and Bestigors run & charge for a surprisingly fast infantry army. A Khorne artifact called Talisman of Burning Blood gives +1 to run and charge for friendly khorne units wihtin 12" of the bearer when the roll is made (no restriction for mortals or daemons) for even more speed. - Wrathmongers were FAQ'ed to only buff melee attacks so they won't buff the Cygor's shooting attack (however the killing frenzy prayer would if you really want to hit that enemy wizard in the face with a giant rock... you know you do). Below is a list I've come up with taking advantage of the above (and somewhat limited to the models I own). Its only 2 drops although I've only taken 5 heroes. Unfortunately there are no 60 point khorne heroes so would have to drop 2 units to fit a 6th hero in, probably a chariot and either a unit of Gors or another chariot, although you can always summon a Bloodthirster 🙂; Allegiance: Khorne- Slaughterhost: The GoretideMortal Realm: GhyranLeadersDoombull of Khorne (100)- General- Trait: Hew the Foe (+1 DMG to all melee weapons)- Artefact: Ghyrstrike (+1 to hit & wound for one melee weapon)Bloodsecrator (120)- Artefact: Thronebreaker's Torc (Armour save ignores modifiers)Slaughterpriest (100)- Artefact: Talisman of Burning Blood (+1 to run & charge rolls for units within 12")- Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy (+1 to hit)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Bronzed Flesh (+1 to save)Slaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Blood Sacrifice (D3 mortal wounds to a friendly unit with 8" for 1 Bloodtithe Point)Battleline10 x Blood Warriors (200)- Goreaxe & Gorefist- 1x Goreglaives10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Gors of Khorne (70)10 x Gors of Khorne (70)Units20 x Bestigors of Khorne (240)3 x Bullgors of Khorne (140)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)1 x Tuskgor Chariots of Khorne (60)BattalionsBrass Despoilers (190)Gore Pilgrims (140)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 3 I think you need at least three units from Gors/bestigors/bullgors for a Brass despoilers. So two chariots could become 10 bestigors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 @Lord Krungharr you are correct however my list has Bestigors, Bullgors and 2 x 10 Gors so meets the requirements 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Krungharr Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Oops! Missed the Gors in the Gor Pilgrims Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phynxes Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) Hey guys, sorry if it has been answered already, but I´m going to play a Depraved Drove battallion with my Slaanesh Demons, and I´m facing some insecureness about the use of magic lore for my Great Bray-Shaman. As far as I interpret the FAQ and designer commentary, the BOC gain both allegiances (BOC and Slaanesh), so in my understanding, the shaman uses a spell from the lore of twisted wilds, sicne ther HOS battletome has only lores for daemons and mortals. I wrote my list with battlescribe and didn´t get any failures, but Azyr didn´t let me choose a spell for the shaman (But we all know how well Azyr works sometimes...). So, it seems, I don´t know what´s the right way, and since GW just did an update on BOC and HOS, there will be some time until the next. Thanks in advance P.s. That´s my list so far:++ **Pitched Battle** 2,000 (Chaos - Slaanesh) [2,000pts] +++ Leader +Bladebringer on Exalted Seeker Chariot: 1. Lash of Slaanesh, 1. Strength of Godhood, 3.True Child of Slaanesh, GeneralInfernal Enrapturess+ Battleline +Daemonettes: 2x 10 Daemonettes, Banner Bearer(s), Hornblower(s), Icon Bearer(s)Daemonettes]: 2x 10 Daemonettes, Banner Bearer(s), Hornblower(s), Icon Bearer(s)+ Other +Fiends: 3 FiendsSeekers: 5 Seekers, Heartseeker, Hornblower, Standard BearerSeekers: 5 Seekers, Heartseeker, Hornblower, Seeker Icon Bearer+ Battalion +Battalion: Depraved Drove [750pts]: Depraved Drove . Bestigors: 10 Bestigors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Ghorgon . Gors: 10 Gors, 2 Gor Blades, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Gors: 10 Gors, 2 Gor Blades, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Great Bray-shaman: 6. Titanic Fury . Ungor Raiders: 10 Ungor Raiders+ Allegiance +Allegiance . Slaanesh: Pretenders HostAllegiance: Allegiance: Chaos+ Game Options +Game Type: 2000 Points - Battlehost++ Total: [2,000pts] ++ Here are some relevant quotes from the FAQ & Errata: Quote Page 85 – Marked by the Decadent FiendChange to:‘Units from this battalion gain the Slaanesh keyword. In addition, this warscroll battalion is part of the Slaanesh faction and the Beasts of Chaos faction.’ https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/5335ef41.pdf Quote Q: Can a Hero from a Beasts of Chaos warscroll battalion that is part of a Chaos army that owes its allegiance to a Chaos God be given any spells/artefacts/etc. from that army’s set of allegiance abilities?A: Yes, as long as no other restrictions apply. https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/age_of_sigmar_beasts_of_chaos_designers_commentary_en.pdf Edited February 5, 2020 by Phynxes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sauriv Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 6 hours ago, Phynxes said: Hey guys, sorry if it has been answered already, but I´m going to play a Depraved Drove battallion with my Slaanesh Demons, and I´m facing some insecureness about the use of magic lore for my Great Bray-Shaman. As far as I interpret the FAQ and designer commentary, the BOC gain both allegiances (BOC and Slaanesh), so in my understanding, the shaman uses a spell from the lore of twisted wilds, sicne ther HOS battletome has only lores for daemons and mortals. I wrote my list with battlescribe and didn´t get any failures, but Azyr didn´t let me choose a spell for the shaman (But we all know how well Azyr works sometimes...). So, it seems, I don´t know what´s the right way, and since GW just did an update on BOC and HOS, there will be some time until the next. Thanks in advance P.s. That´s my list so far:++ **Pitched Battle** 2,000 (Chaos - Slaanesh) [2,000pts] +++ Leader +Bladebringer on Exalted Seeker Chariot: 1. Lash of Slaanesh, 1. Strength of Godhood, 3.True Child of Slaanesh, GeneralInfernal Enrapturess+ Battleline +Daemonettes: 2x 10 Daemonettes, Banner Bearer(s), Hornblower(s), Icon Bearer(s)Daemonettes]: 2x 10 Daemonettes, Banner Bearer(s), Hornblower(s), Icon Bearer(s)+ Other +Fiends: 3 FiendsSeekers: 5 Seekers, Heartseeker, Hornblower, Standard BearerSeekers: 5 Seekers, Heartseeker, Hornblower, Seeker Icon Bearer+ Battalion +Battalion: Depraved Drove [750pts]: Depraved Drove . Bestigors: 10 Bestigors, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Ghorgon . Gors: 10 Gors, 2 Gor Blades, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Gors: 10 Gors, 2 Gor Blades, Banner bearers, Brayhorns . Great Bray-shaman: 6. Titanic Fury . Ungor Raiders: 10 Ungor Raiders+ Allegiance +Allegiance . Slaanesh: Pretenders HostAllegiance: Allegiance: Chaos+ Game Options +Game Type: 2000 Points - Battlehost++ Total: [2,000pts] ++ Here are some relevant quotes from the FAQ & Errata: https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/5335ef41.pdf https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/age_of_sigmar_beasts_of_chaos_designers_commentary_en.pdf I'm sorry to inform you that you can't use any spells or artifacts from the BoC book if you play Slaanesh. The commentary regarding this that you posted talks about using spells and artifacts from the chaos god book on your BoC heroes. Because spells from HoS require the caster to either have mortal or deamon keyword makes a bray-shaman unable to gain any additional spell. The fist quote just say that the battalion is shared so both BoC and HoS can use it when you play those alligiances but the books are not connected otherwise. When playing under an alligiance you can only use stuff from that particular book, with the exception for some battalions like in this case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Death1942 Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 You can take the beasts spells on the shaman, the other spell lores I am not completely sure about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.