Kurrilino Posted June 12, 2021 Share Posted June 12, 2021 (edited) 10 hours ago, Perturbato said: 3 reinforced and you have your 20 chaos warriors Doublepost Edited June 12, 2021 by Kurrilino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enoby Posted June 12, 2021 Share Posted June 12, 2021 I posted it elsewhere but looks like a slight nerf for warriors and a points hike for Archaon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boar Posted June 12, 2021 Share Posted June 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Kurrilino said: It somehow reads as there are more rules than 2 max reinforcements involved. One rule is max for all army (4 for 2000pts), and second limit at unit level where battleline unit could be reinforced 2 times, and non-battleline only one time. There was rest of that particular page on teh internetz somewhere However what @Enoby just posted would mean that Chaos Warriors in particular will be available in sizes of 10/20/30. Which if true will still allow @drcraterto run his duded as he likes them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurrilino Posted June 13, 2021 Share Posted June 13, 2021 11 hours ago, Enoby said: I posted it elsewhere but looks like a slight nerf for warriors and a points hike for Archaon Jebus, Archaeon started out with 800 points and was sickening overpriced. Now he is 950 points. Also my beloved Chaos Warriors get more expensive. Why of why Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimrock Posted June 13, 2021 Share Posted June 13, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Kurrilino said: Jebus, Archaeon started out with 800 points and was sickening overpriced. Now he is 950 points. Also my beloved Chaos Warriors get more expensive. Why of why I don't believe Archaon was overpriced at all, but he's absolutely going to be a beast in the new rules. With the monster and hero buffs he can just wander around tossing buffs on himself like mad. Being able to give himself +1 to hit or save whenever he needs, using heroic recovery along with the khorne head for 2d3 heals, arcane bolt and smash to do 2d3 mortals before combat even starts... and that's all without needing a single other model to buff him and before he gets any bonuses from his mark. Plus the 3 missions we've seen all start with an 18" no mans land so he's pretty well guaranteed a turn one charge and the smaller board means he can reach out and touch people a lot easier. Honestly the only thing I see balancing him out at all is the fact that he takes up half of your army and only counts for 5 models on objectives. He's going to be ridiculously hard to kill for most armies and he's just going to smash anything he comes into contact with. At this point I'm actually worried about using him because he's so strong, it's just going to be an auto feels bad moment. Either your opponent has a counter to him and when they kill him you just lose half your army, or like most armies they won't stand a chance and he gets to run roughshod over them for 5 turns. Also for what it's worth, it sounds like pretty much everyone is getting a points hike. It's possible slaves will see a proportionately smaller increase than some other armies, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it. With the prevalence of reroll saves in the army All out Defense is going to be reallly good. Edited June 13, 2021 by Grimrock 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritofHokuto Posted June 13, 2021 Share Posted June 13, 2021 Just a thought, but the Khorne Daemon Prince CA together with the new Redeploy is going to potentially make getting the jump on us in melee pretty difficult. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 19 hours ago, SpiritofHokuto said: Just a thought, but the Khorne Daemon Prince CA together with the new Redeploy is going to potentially make getting the jump on us in melee pretty difficult. I like how khorne is the best wizard (priest are the best) and the best at fleeing or denying charge 😛 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus The Blue Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 On 6/13/2021 at 7:45 AM, Grimrock said: I don't believe Archaon was overpriced at all, but he's absolutely going to be a beast in the new rules. With the monster and hero buffs he can just wander around tossing buffs on himself like mad. Being able to give himself +1 to hit or save whenever he needs, using heroic recovery along with the khorne head for 2d3 heals, arcane bolt and smash to do 2d3 mortals before combat even starts... and that's all without needing a single other model to buff him and before he gets any bonuses from his mark. Plus the 3 missions we've seen all start with an 18" no mans land so he's pretty well guaranteed a turn one charge and the smaller board means he can reach out and touch people a lot easier. Honestly the only thing I see balancing him out at all is the fact that he takes up half of your army and only counts for 5 models on objectives. He's going to be ridiculously hard to kill for most armies and he's just going to smash anything he comes into contact with. At this point I'm actually worried about using him because he's so strong, it's just going to be an auto feels bad moment. Either your opponent has a counter to him and when they kill him you just lose half your army, or like most armies they won't stand a chance and he gets to run roughshod over them for 5 turns. Also for what it's worth, it sounds like pretty much everyone is getting a points hike. It's possible slaves will see a proportionately smaller increase than some other armies, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it. With the prevalence of reroll saves in the army All out Defense is going to be reallly good. Also, have you seen the new generic spells Flaming Weapons, +1 damage to all the casters attacks (and only 4+ to cast)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritofHokuto Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 3 hours ago, Magnus The Blue said: Also, have you seen the new generic spells Flaming Weapons, +1 damage to all the casters attacks (and only 4+ to cast)! Only available via an Enhancement that unique models can't have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrk Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 Thinking about the Warlord/Command battalions for Ravagers. Not sure if it'll be a solid take over the other options, but 1-2 free enhancements seems good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurrilino Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 13 hours ago, Perturbato said: I like how khorne is the best wizard (priest are the best) and the best at fleeing or denying charge 😛 Yes, this is why we combine them with Chaos Warriors who are the worst melee fighter in our range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasant Posted June 15, 2021 Share Posted June 15, 2021 Hi, I'm getting the idea of starting a 1k list for 3.0 consisting on chariots and Knights lead by a lord on karkadrak. What do you think? It could work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 15, 2021 Share Posted June 15, 2021 i love chaos chariot but they are very bad. You can play an idolator for a priest on a chariot if you don't wan't to be the most competitive ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rors Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 4 hours ago, Perturbato said: i love chaos chariot but they are very bad. You can play an idolator for a priest on a chariot if you don't wan't to be the most competitive ! II think they will be a lot better this edition. The move to smaller units and coherency rules are both buffs for chariots. They prefer to fight small units where their impact mortals are meaningful, there will be more of these in AoS 3. Coherency means single units can counter charge and only touch a single model in the back corner. Due to coherency, this will often mean only one model can fight back, making them significantly more powerful. This is a buff to all single units. For example, if you take two single units and charge them into a unit of 10 and only touch a single model in each corner, they won't be able to pile in to attack either. Chariots, like all single units, will get a huge benefit from this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 oh no ! you made me think my chaos chariots are good again !! i'll have to play them again now !! About the bloodstocker ability, does it increase the number of dice you launch for the post-charge mortal wounds ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeymajq Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 I'm actually doing a Cavalry Ravagers army, it probably won't be super good, but the meta seems to be shifting in its favour, with min units. Just think of chariots as missiles that can assist your knights. I'm thinking of adding maybe two units of furies to the list as screens, because knights and chariots both need to charge to be the most effective (at least with the lances). I'm running two Lords on daemonic mounts and a Manticore sorcerer lord. the Karkadrak seems good, and looks amazing. But I only have the older chaos knights so I don't want to mix in the new, much better looking models haha 😜 anyway, it's gonna be a low model count list, helped out somewhat by summoning in marauder horsemen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 Hey, after thinking of it, if the chariots are good again, and the prayers are good again .. i think i'll make an Idolator list with maybe two warshrines and mark all of this with nurgle ! I'll add the sorcerer lord on manticore, a chaos sorcerer and karkalord. The must would be that idolators traits that make warshrines leader give them the hero keyword too so they are able to do the mark of chaos thing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeymajq Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 (edited) I'm just mentioning this to uh, mention it. but if you take a unit of chariots... not wait hear me out! It's the only way to get a command model in there so you won't have to spend a CA from a Leader on them for buffs. So there's that, a teensy weenzy reason to take a unit of more than one chariot because you don't want to waste using a leader to give them a CA when you have good stuff around that needs it more. edit: also I woulnd't call the chariots good just better off than before. (pending pts changes) Edited June 16, 2021 by Mikeymajq Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritofHokuto Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 2 hours ago, Perturbato said: Hey, after thinking of it, if the chariots are good again, and the prayers are good again .. i think i'll make an Idolator list with maybe two warshrines and mark all of this with nurgle ! I'll add the sorcerer lord on manticore, a chaos sorcerer and karkalord. The must would be that idolators traits that make warshrines leader give them the hero keyword too so they are able to do the mark of chaos thing The thing is that the Idolators ability does make Warshrines (and all other Priests) Leaders but it doesn't confer the Hero keyword to them. So as it stands they can't use Heroic Actions. Will have to see if that gets FAQ'ed. But overall Idolators do seem to have some real legs now with the changes in 3.0. Priests are better, units are going to be smaller on average, and now there's a decent selection of universal artefacts to choose from. The loss of Ruinbringer Warband in Matched Play is unfortunate, but it's not back breaking. And you're still going to be able to satisfy quite a few of the core battalions with MSU Knights/Chariots and what have you. Although I will say that with the changes to +/-'s to hit being capped at 1, the stock of Nurgle's mark may go down a bit. But easy access to re-rolls with a few straight up bonuses to hit/wound/saves seems to be the sweet spot for buffing in 3.0. Khorne looks to be particularly tempting now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drib Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 (edited) Idolator Chaos Warshrines are, as mentioned above, no Heroes, BUT they are no longer Behemoth either. (Core Rules 25.5.1 Page 31) Sorry, that only seems to work when the role is changed by the "Notes" column .. Edited June 16, 2021 by Drib Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 15 hours ago, Perturbato said: About the bloodstocker ability, does it increase the number of dice you launch for the post-charge mortal wounds ? Bloodstoker add's 3" to the roll so yes it does increase the number of dice you roll for mortal wounds. Also the +3" for run and charge stacks so when you use the chariots run & charge ability its gets +6" from this guy. They are best buds for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rors Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Idolators do look really tempting this edition now actually. Iron gollems seems extra nice given a large unit can be teleported onto an objective then sit there with a rerollable 3+ save just using their own champions command without needing nurgle. I'll need to play around when I get home but I'm trying to work out what the best way to organize a defensive unit would be for minimum contact with anything that charges. I'm thinking maybe a star shape with large units might be possible to create shapes where it's impossible to pile in or fit many models. The more I think about how coherency the more I believe it's going to be something that seems simple but opens up extremely deep layers of strategy that can be unlocked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritofHokuto Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 (edited) Knights of the Empty Throne Varangaurd with Arcane Tome & Flaming Weapons seems like an interesting choice, especially as their points have been untouched. Edited June 17, 2021 by SpiritofHokuto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 30 minutes ago, SpiritofHokuto said: Knights of the Empty Throne Varangaurd with Arcane Tome & Flaming Weapons seems like an interesting choice, especially as their points have been untouched. Knights of the Empty Throne Allegiance ability says they can only have Command traits and artifacts from their own suballegiance list, so nothing out of the core rules for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orodhen Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Warriors going up in points kinda stings. Minimum squad size being upped to 10 is... interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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