Graywater Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, kahadin said: @Graywater What do you arm your Varanguard with? I think Daemon weapons are good, but I'm not sure what people are using now. Daemon Weapons. Decent enough chance for mortals, especially if you get reroll hits and wounds off. Ensorcelled weapons are good on 6th circle varanguard in hosts of everchosen, but lose out to the daemon Weapons outside of that. Spears suffer from the typical Spear issue in that they're useless off the charge, and you don't actually charge much in Knights of the Empty Throne, just pile in instead, so you don't get the charge bonus. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archion89 Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) Silly question but I’m still new to this system and my googling didn’t bring up what I wanted. When you take smite the unbelievers for the idolator lord you get +2 attacks to each of his weapons. I’m assuming the whip and mounts are considered part of this too and not just the great blade? Effectively giving him +6 total across the three profiles (2 to geeatblade, whips and hooves)?Do I have this correct as it doesn’t say exclude anything such as Mount, etc. And in general, something that says give +1 attack to a unit includes all weapon profiles including Mount unless specifically mentioned? For example, an aspiring deathbringer gives +1 attack to the lord on Karkadrak, which really gives him +4 across the profile (1 to axe, sword, claws and tail)? Edited March 25, 2021 by Archion89 Clarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boar Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 3 minutes ago, Archion89 said: Silly question but I’m still new to this system and my googling didn’t bring up what I wanted. When you take smite the unbelievers for the idolator lord you get +2 attacks to each of his weapons. I’m assuming the whip and mounts are considered part of this too and not just the great blade? Effectively giving him +6 total across the three profiles? Do I have this correct as it doesn’t say exclude anything such as Mount, etc. And in general, something that says give +1 attack to a unit includes all weapon profiles including Mount unless specifically mentioned? For example, an aspiring deathbringer gives +1 attack to the lord on Karkadrak, which really gives him +4 across the profile? Command Traits do not (unless specified otherwise) affect mounts. Since chariot lists greatblade and whip as unit weapons, and hooves as mount weapons, you would get +2 attacks to first and second. Other buffs usually work as you described. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archion89 Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 @Boar thank you! I missed that last line in the core rules for command traits. Much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 Guys I have played sunday a game on tts. I have 2 rules questions : - when I summon with ravagers ability 10 marauders, can I give them nurgle mark? - in plaguetouch battalion, the slaves to darkness hero can benefit from the rules of the battalion? Or its only for 7 mortal nurlge units?:) As alweys thx a lot guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charleston Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 15 minutes ago, Tizianolol said: Guys I have played sunday a game on tts. I have 2 rules questions : - when I summon with ravagers ability 10 marauders, can I give them nurgle mark? - in plaguetouch battalion, the slaves to darkness hero can benefit from the rules of the battalion? Or its only for 7 mortal nurlge units?:) As alweys thx a lot guys! Yes, you are allowed to choose a Mark when you add the Models into your army by summoning. Plaguetouched consist of 1 STD MORTAL NURGLE HERO and 6 STD NURGLE MORTAL units. All of thoose 7 are affected by the battalions rule, but only them. Notice that among the 6 StD Mortal Nurgle Units you may also include heroes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 Ok thx , battletome said 7 mortal units plus hero. But I have understood!!:) thx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charleston Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 16 hours ago, Tizianolol said: Ok thx , battletome said 7 mortal units plus hero. But I have understood!!:) thx Oh, sorry, you are actually right! I tought it was the gods holy number including the hero. So it is 7 units and 8 units affected by the battalion 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Thx to tts im testing many list for a friendly tournament soon. The only thing that im sure to bring is plaguetouch battalion:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Same for me, i hésitante between ravager and idolators. Idolators with the aditionals prayers with garanteed succès but ravager to bring more minions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Guys yestorday i played against a guy on tts . That was his list Belakor Ch lord kardarak Sorc lord Sorc lord Chaos lord Demon prince nurgle 20 marauders 10 knights 5 ch warriors 9 untamed beast Warshrine Plaguetouch Tot 2000 I found that list pretty powerful, he put kardarak hero in cover with warshrine buff its 1+ rerollable saves with artifact that decrease rend by 1 . All of that on nurgle battalion. Is this legal ?:) he letterally cant die:( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Tizianolol said: Guys yestorday i played against a guy on tts . That was his list Belakor Ch lord kardarak Sorc lord Sorc lord Chaos lord Demon prince nurgle 20 marauders 10 knights 5 ch warriors 9 untamed beast Warshrine Plaguetouch Tot 2000 I found that list pretty powerful, he put kardarak hero in cover with warshrine buff its 1+ rerollable saves with artifact that decrease rend by 1 . All of that on nurgle battalion. Is this legal ?:) he letterally cant die:( It's legal, but remember that a natural 1 (after any rerolls) always fails. What was the gametype? He only has the unit of marauders and the Knights that can do any real damage, and the marauders die to a stiff breeze in return. Outside of a hero centric mission, this list is going to suffer. Edited March 30, 2021 by Graywater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 he told me he copyed the list , its similar to a tourny list played month ago. anyway do you think we need 40 marauder to be competitve? i play StD too, im looking for a competive plaguetouch battalion to play ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Tizianolol said: he told me he copyed the list , its similar to a tourny list played month ago. anyway do you think we need 40 marauder to be competitve? i play StD too, im looking for a competive plaguetouch battalion to play ! Do we need 40? No. But they are arguably our best unit, and I've really noticed a lack of options if I don't have a unit of 20 in a list. I've won 3 tournaments so far this year with slaves to darkness. All 3 had plaguetouched, but they've been different lists. I've done a marauder and knight based despoilers list (only one with more than 20 marauders), a pure Knights despoilers, and the Dave kerr 6 varanguard Knights of the Empty Throne list. Have another tournament in 2 weeks that im trying to nail down another new list for, but I'm sure it'll have Plaguetouched. We definitely have tools in slaves, but it takes a bit more effort, precision, and practice to make it work because on average, our warscrolls and abilities aren't on par with other top tier armies. Edited March 30, 2021 by Graywater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 i found only plaguetouch competitive tbh. can u post your despoiler and knight list ?^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Tizianolol said: i found only plaguetouch competitive tbh. can u post your despoiler and knight list ?^^ I had 2 despoilers lists with Knights, but since you were asking about not having 40 marauders, I'll show you the other one. Allegiance: Slaves to Darkness- Damned Legion: DespoilersLeadersChaos Lord on Karkadrak (230)- Artefact: Armour of Tortured Souls- Mark of Chaos: NurgleChaos Sorcerer Lord (110)- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle- Spell: Mask of DarknessSlaves to Darkness Daemon Prince (210)- General- Axe- Command Trait: Paragon of Ruin- Artefact: Diabolic Mantle- Mark of Chaos: NurgleChaos Sorcerer Lord (110)- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle- Spell: Mask of DarknessBattleline10 x Chaos Knights (320)- Ensorcelled Weapons- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle10 x Chaos Knights (320)- Ensorcelled Weapons- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle5 x Chaos Knights (160)- Ensorcelled Weapons- Mark of Chaos: Nurgle20 x Chaos Marauders (160)- Axes & Shields- Mark of Chaos: NurgleBehemothsChaos Warshrine (170)- Mark of Chaos: NurgleBattalionsPlaguetouched Warband (180)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 134 Edited March 30, 2021 by Graywater 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 thx a lot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer72 Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 On 3/28/2021 at 4:31 PM, Charleston said: Yes, you are allowed to choose a Mark when you add the Models into your army by summoning. Plaguetouched consist of 1 STD MORTAL NURGLE HERO and 6 STD NURGLE MORTAL units. All of thoose 7 are affected by the battalions rule, but only them. Notice that among the 6 StD Mortal Nurgle Units you may also include heroes. Hello, I 've got a further question for 2. Must all the units in the battalion have the mark of Chaos keyword, i.e. max I take a formoid crusher or a mindstealer sphiranx into the battalion? thx for your answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 minute ago, Homer72 said: Hello, I 've got a further question for 2. Must all the units in the battalion have the mark of Chaos keyword, i.e. max I take a formoid crusher or a mindstealer sphiranx into the battalion? thx for your answers. No. They cannot go into the battalion without having the appropriate mark. Since the fomoroid and sphiranx cannot have a mark, they cannot be a part of the battalion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archion89 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Hey guys, over the course of an average game, how many mortal wounds would you get from the Ruinbringer Warband and Plaguetouched Warband? Assume it’s a list that would effectively take advantage of both i.e. with knights, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 minute ago, Archion89 said: Hey guys, over the course of an average game, how many mortal wounds would you get from the Ruinbringer Warband and Plaguetouched Warband? Assume it’s a list that would effectively take advantage of both i.e. with knights, etc. Plaguetouched is impossible to estimate because it entirely relies on what your opponent is doing. On the one hand, it's incredible against plague monks/wych elves with 20+ models attacking with 3 attacks each. On the other hand, you will get next to nothing if fighting a KO force that doesn't want to be in melee and has very few melee attacks once you do engage them. Ruinbringer is easier. Assuming a minimum battalion of a karkadrak and 4 units, if every unit charges once in the game, you will succeed in 5 of your 6 2+s for mortal wounds, leaving you with an average output of 10 damage. Math says that, outside of the karkadrak, it is slightly less than 2 mortal wounds per unit per charge (accounting for needing the 2+ to do the wounds in the first place). You get increasing value for every subsequent charge, but for every unit you have that gets a second charge opportunity, you're likely going to have a unit that never gets the chance to do their mortals because they've been charged or shot and destroyed. So id say ~10 is what you should expect and any more is a blessing. Ruinbringer is a lower but more consistent, while plaguetouched is a lot more flexible and has the potential to spike way higher against horde melee armies. Plaguetouched is also nice because it allows for a wider array of units and can bring your list down to a one drop without sacrificing units you really do want (looking at you sorceror lord and warshrine). Ruinbringer is better in the sense that you can place where those mortals go, like targeting down a character by charging with multiple units into it, but plaguetouched will get more mortal wounds from that one unit of 40 models attacking into it and splashing wounds back than ruinbringer will produce all game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archion89 Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Graywater said: Plaguetouched is impossible to estimate because it entirely relies on what your opponent is doing. On the one hand, it's incredible against plague monks/wych elves with 20+ models attacking with 3 attacks each. On the other hand, you will get next to nothing if fighting a KO force that doesn't want to be in melee and has very few melee attacks once you do engage them. Ruinbringer is easier. Assuming a minimum battalion of a karkadrak and 4 units, if every unit charges once in the game, you will succeed in 5 of your 6 2+s for mortal wounds, leaving you with an average output of 10 damage. Math says that, outside of the karkadrak, it is slightly less than 2 mortal wounds per unit per charge (accounting for needing the 2+ to do the wounds in the first place). You get increasing value for every subsequent charge, but for every unit you have that gets a second charge opportunity, you're likely going to have a unit that never gets the chance to do their mortals because they've been charged or shot and destroyed. So id say ~10 is what you should expect and any more is a blessing. Ruinbringer is a lower but more consistent, while plaguetouched is a lot more flexible and has the potential to spike way higher against horde melee armies. Plaguetouched is also nice because it allows for a wider array of units and can bring your list down to a one drop without sacrificing units you really do want (looking at you sorceror lord and warshrine). Ruinbringer is better in the sense that you can place where those mortals go, like targeting down a character by charging with multiple units into it, but plaguetouched will get more mortal wounds from that one unit of 40 models attacking into it and splashing wounds back than ruinbringer will produce all game. @Graywater this is great and the type of information I was looking for. My goal is to make an offensive/consistent list and the Plaguetouched is definitely more swingy from what you’ve said. I wanted a Ruinbringer Warband but this typically shoots my list (pg113) into about 7-8 drops which is pretty high. Perhaps for an offensive punch I’ll look at a blood marked Warband with 4 heroes in it to hopefully capitalize on the additional attacks. Have you had any experience with using that one? Thanks. Edited March 31, 2021 by Archion89 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 26 minutes ago, Archion89 said: @Graywater this is great and the type of information I was looking for. My goal is to make an offensive/consistent list and the Plaguetouched is definitely more swingy from what you’ve said. I wanted a Ruinbringer Warband but this typically shoots my list (pg113) into about 7-8 drops which is pretty high. Perhaps for an offensive punch I’ll look at a blood marked Warband with 4 heroes in it to hopefully capitalize on the additional attacks. Have you had any experience with using that one? Thanks. I haven't tried bloodmarked, but I have a list I do want to try with it at some point. Biggest piece is 3x3 hero varanguard in Knights of the Empty Throne so they can create a sort of cascading +1 attack chain. Add in a chaos lord on foot/use the varanguard once per game ability for a second pile in to really take advantage of the extra attack buffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Guys about our auras and nurgle mark , our general aura gives -1 to hit vs shoot and 6s to wound 1 additional damage, other nurgle heroes only 6s to wound additional damage right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywater Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 38 minutes ago, Tizianolol said: Guys about our auras and nurgle mark , our general aura gives -1 to hit vs shoot and 6s to wound 1 additional damage, other nurgle heroes only 6s to wound additional damage right? Correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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