Jump to content

Warhammer - The Old World


Gareth 🍄
 Share

Recommended Posts

11 hours ago, Public Universal Duardin said:

Reiterating myself from Rumour Thread...

 

Have you noticed the different fonts used on the different noble houses? Some are definitely Empire, but my thoughts that it showed cultural heritage doesn't make sense - Gastonne, despite Bretonnian coat of arms name has the 'Empire' font, while Aquilena differs and has a much more 'Bretonnian' font. Different fonts include Uvetovsk (Kislev?) ,
Ortegeta (Estalia?) , Pontenne (???) and Harkon (Vampire Counts). Rest seem to be Empire/Bretonnian, with focus on the former. Subfactions? Your Dudes? Hints of factions to come?

Edit: As you can see, we know for certain one font is associated with an existing faction. Considering the 'empire' font looks like Fraktur, a font associated with Germany, we have thar locked down. Ortegeta evokes 16th century manuscripts, and the star and moon on the coat of arms /could/ reference the religious diversity of Spain before the reconquista and inquisitions. Uvetovsk's imagery and name are obvious references to Kislev. Harkon's coat of arms features a grail where two blood drop falls - alongside menacing aura and red/black colour scheme its a clear reference to VC. Pontenne uses Bretonnian fonts. This leaves Tordorno, whose fleur-de-lis evokes Bretonnian heraldry but name sounds more Italian - as the font is unique from Bretonnian font Tilea is the best guess.Polish_20211007_212442938.jpg.7a18340df4a5420166905454d97faba0.jpg

Great job!!!

I'm still looking around the map to see if I missed something, for the fifth time!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

With that little Tomb Kings icon on the bottom of the most recent map, I wonder what shape a potential Tomb Kings re-release might take.

Tomb Kings only have the following plastic kits:

  • Sphinx kit (War Sphinx/Necrosphinx)
  • Snake kit (Sepulchral Stalkers/Necropolis Knights)
  • Tomb Guard
  • Chariots
  • Horsemen

And that's it. The Tomb Kings skeleton warriors and archers were not a real kit, just an upgrade sprue for a now two generations out-of-date Vampire Counts skeleton kit.

If we expand to finecast units, the following are also available:

  • Prince Apophas
  • Liche Priest
  • Necrotect
  • Tomb Prince/King
  • Ushabti (Bows/Great Weapons)
  • Casket of Souls

That leaves the following units missing:

  • Settra
  • Khalida
  • Basic Skeletons
  • Carrion
  • Tomb Swarms
  • Screaming Skull Catapults
  • Tomb Scorpion
  • Bone Giant

I kinda think including Tomb Kings as a playable army would necessitate an update. There is just too much Finecast and metal here. And to be honest, half of the plastic kits don't even look good (basically anything with a horse in it).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

With that little Tomb Kings icon on the bottom of the most recent map, I wonder what shape a potential Tomb Kings re-release might take.

Tomb Kings only have the following plastic kits:

  • Sphinx kit (War Sphinx/Necrosphinx)
  • Snake kit (Sepulchral Stalkers/Necropolis Knights)
  • Tomb Guard
  • Chariots
  • Horsemen

And that's it. The Tomb Kings skeleton warriors and archers were not a real kit, just an upgrade sprue for a now two generations out-of-date Vampire Counts skeleton kit.

If we expand to finecast units, the following are also available:

  • Prince Apophas
  • Liche Priest
  • Necrotect
  • Tomb Prince/King
  • Ushabti (Bows/Great Weapons)
  • Casket of Souls

That leaves the following units missing:

  • Settra
  • Khalida
  • Basic Skeletons
  • Carrion
  • Tomb Swarms
  • Screaming Skull Catapults
  • Tomb Scorpion
  • Bone Giant

I kinda think including Tomb Kings as a playable army would necessitate an update. There is just too much Finecast and metal here. And to be honest, half of the plastic kits don't even look good (basically anything with a horse in it).

All the listed metal models ultimately got converted to finecast with the exception of tomb swarms. Those are the versions I have, and when they did a made for order of Settra and Khalida it was resin. I'd love them to make new models in any medium though.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, EccentricCircle said:

All the listed metal models ultimately got converted to finecast with the exception of tomb swarms. Those are the versions I have, and when they did a made for order of Settra and Khalida it was resin. I'd love them to make new models in any medium though.

Thanks, it's surprisingly hard to find info on what models are available in what material. But I suppose that makes things a bit better. Even though GW seems to be trying to eliminate finecast from their AoS range, I think it's way more likely that they will bring back old kits in resin rather than metal. They are still using resin for a number of models right now, after all.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Thanks, it's surprisingly hard to find info on what models are available in what material. But I suppose that makes things a bit better. Even though GW seems to be trying to eliminate finecast from their AoS range, I think it's way more likely that they will bring back old kits in resin rather than metal. They are still using resin for a number of models right now, after all.

Yeah, I think that is most likely. That said they actually still sell a surprisingly large amount of metal models, mostly for Lord of the Rings (and Skaven). I could see them going the LotR route actually, for that game the gradually rotat e the models which are on sale, keeping the core stuff in production and then rereleasing niche factions like dunland and the ruffians to go with the relevant campaign books.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Subscriber

I love all the background building, especially the border princes, but it does have me wondering what the actual rules and miniatures would be to cover all the different forces?

They could do some form of generic army list following the 30k model with the generic Space Marine Legion or Imperialis Militia & Cults army lists from the HH series. With special rites of war or provenance rules that adjust the style of play.  It's a very cool system that allows for all sorts of cool themed armies based on a single basic list. This depends on if they can follow the FW model of releasing rules without needing to have models. 

For human models I'm guessing there could be basic plastic infantry kit, which they could then sell upgrade kits of arms/heads that change the look.

There is still so much unknown about how it will work, but it is certainly exciting to think about the possibilities. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the old dogs of war encapsulate what border princes should be. Renegades, misfits, adventurers all banding together for gold and to build a new home and the Wild West.

I would like the option to have allied units from other armies build around a core that might be contingent on the particular state being represented. For example, a Breton renegade can have a core of bretonnian units, then the Mercenaries rounding it up. 
 

I have to admit I really liked regiments of renown, though it d be cool if you could build our own via point upgrades.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, SunStorm said:

They could do some form of generic army list following the 30k model with the generic Space Marine Legion or Imperialis Militia & Cults army lists from the HH series. With special rites of war or provenance rules that adjust the style of play.  It's a very cool system that allows for all sorts of cool themed armies based on a single basic list. This depends on if they can follow the FW model of releasing rules without needing to have models. 

I'm a huge fan of their red anb black books! I think it works awesome for Horus Heresy. One basic update means an update for 90% of the whole game, and a simple switch from 1 to 2 wounds or +1 WS o BS means A LOT when everyone is on the same ground.

But I'm not sure that Fantasy needs to follow the same pattern, I think the diversity is one of it's main features.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So with the recent lore explosion with Andy Hall, CA just released a new roundtable article regarding Cathay for Total Warhammer 3:

Cathay Roundtable

Now I'm shaking with hype already at the references by Andy to Ind, Tiger Warriors, the Monkey King, Monkey Warriors, Blood Nagas of Khuresh and even Nippon, but its also nice to see CA write this themselves. 

With their stance that this game is going to get supported for YEARS, I truly believe that. I really think we'll eventually see so many more factions not really seen before, particularly visually. 

Now obviously total warhammer is not directly connected to The Old World, it could point to hints that we will also see more of these factions head to the table top. The one that stands out to me is Nippon. 

Tinfoil hat time:

Both Andy and CA, referenced Nippon as an 'eastern human nation' alongside Dark Elves and the Jade Sea. Its pretty certain that this is Nippon, but the clear notion to not regard it as such, suggests that they are currently re-establishing the name at least. 

Now, if Nippon wasn't going to be included on the map or even in game, there'd be no reason to even rename it right? I do think they'll be designing Nippon for Total Warhammer 3 just like Cathay, and I bet this would also mean a release for The Old World, and boy does that make me hyped. I really need some Warhammer Samurai in my life. 

What do you all think, do you reckon we'll see more 'un-established' factions come to The Old World? 

 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Black_Templar_Lad said:

So with the recent lore explosion with Andy Hall, CA just released a new roundtable article regarding Cathay for Total Warhammer 3:

Cathay Roundtable

Now I'm shaking with hype already at the references by Andy to Ind, Tiger Warriors, the Monkey King, Monkey Warriors, Blood Nagas of Khuresh and even Nippon, but its also nice to see CA write this themselves. 

With their stance that this game is going to get supported for YEARS, I truly believe that. I really think we'll eventually see so many more factions not really seen before, particularly visually. 

Now obviously total warhammer is not directly connected to The Old World, it could point to hints that we will also see more of these factions head to the table top. The one that stands out to me is Nippon. 

Tinfoil hat time:

Both Andy and CA, referenced Nippon as an 'eastern human nation' alongside Dark Elves and the Jade Sea. Its pretty certain that this is Nippon, but the clear notion to not regard it as such, suggests that they are currently re-establishing the name at least. 

Now, if Nippon wasn't going to be included on the map or even in game, there'd be no reason to even rename it right? I do think they'll be designing Nippon for Total Warhammer 3 just like Cathay, and I bet this would also mean a release for The Old World, and boy does that make me hyped. I really need some Warhammer Samurai in my life. 

What do you all think, do you reckon we'll see more 'un-established' factions come to The Old World? 

 

Maybe for Old World they'll finally release the Nippon guide they promised was under development since 3rd edition :Pimage.png.e2430c340a2eac51a7a648a994852b40.png

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well as long as people keep paying enough theyll keep developing :D

NGL it certainly feels like they have more ideas for Ind there, Nippon was always just a flanderised Japan from memory but i cant help but feel with invincible dragon Emperors next door things would be different?

At least with Cathay they have shown their designs arent beholden to the slightly awful in retrospect 80s concepts! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Black_Templar_Lad said:

So with the recent lore explosion with Andy Hall, CA just released a new roundtable article regarding Cathay for Total Warhammer 3:

Cathay Roundtable

Now I'm shaking with hype already at the references by Andy to Ind, Tiger Warriors, the Monkey King, Monkey Warriors, Blood Nagas of Khuresh and even Nippon, but its also nice to see CA write this themselves. 

With their stance that this game is going to get supported for YEARS, I truly believe that. I really think we'll eventually see so many more factions not really seen before, particularly visually. 

Now obviously total warhammer is not directly connected to The Old World, it could point to hints that we will also see more of these factions head to the table top. The one that stands out to me is Nippon. 

Tinfoil hat time:

Both Andy and CA, referenced Nippon as an 'eastern human nation' alongside Dark Elves and the Jade Sea. Its pretty certain that this is Nippon, but the clear notion to not regard it as such, suggests that they are currently re-establishing the name at least. 

Now, if Nippon wasn't going to be included on the map or even in game, there'd be no reason to even rename it right? I do think they'll be designing Nippon for Total Warhammer 3 just like Cathay, and I bet this would also mean a release for The Old World, and boy does that make me hyped. I really need some Warhammer Samurai in my life. 

What do you all think, do you reckon we'll see more 'un-established' factions come to The Old World? 

 

I think as far as "unestablished" factions go, we'll get some view of Ind and Khuresh, and perhaps a rework of Nippon under a name that's slightly less blatant than one of the formal/poetic names of Japan. 

The lore drop for Cathay was simply amazing. We were introduced to not one, not two, but four legendary lords for Cathay beyond best dragon (Zhao Ming) and slightly nicer Azula. I say four because I am including the Monkey King, who appears to not be chaos aligned at all, which might make him the only Beastman ever to be nominally good. My favorite part had to be the growing cults to Tzeentch and Slaanesh (the Cult of Painted Skin, tell me that isn't a slaaneshi cult name) in Cathay, as it showcases the vast variety of chaos and the faiths that grow around it, something that 40k can't properly grasp yet.

As always I hope that we get an expansion of Tomb Kings and make Araby into a full faction. I link these two together because they are quite literally next to each other on the map. Tomb Kings are still missing Prince Apophas' treacherous self, and it would be a good way to showcase whatever new models the boils and ghouls over at GW have cooked up for them when The Old World finally drops. Araby on the other hand, could be a great way to showcase Arabian culture and art without the usual "terrorist" crowd popping up. 

I don't know much about either of the Real World mythologies of India or the South Asian countries that Khuresh is based off of, so I'll leave my opinions out of it.

Edited by Loyal Son of Khemri
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

Well as long as people keep paying enough theyll keep developing :D

NGL it certainly feels like they have more ideas for Ind there, Nippon was always just a flanderised Japan from memory but i cant help but feel with invincible dragon Emperors next door things would be different?

At least with Cathay they have shown their designs arent beholden to the slightly awful in retrospect 80s concepts! 

I think if CA redevelops Nippon, we might see a more chaos tolerant nation. Remember the old lore for clan Eshin was that they learned their techniques from a Nippon school, so either the rats were being sneaky punks, or chaos dealings are more in the open over there. I would like them to mix the Ainu culture (bear worship is an amazing concept for a religion, sue me, and those tattoos!) into the more stereotypical samurai deal, alongside some pirate culture as well.

  • Like 1
  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Loyal Son of Khemri said:

https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-warhammer-3-tzeentch-campaign-mechanics/
What’s everyone’s opinion on  the Tzeentch and Chaos mechanics we’ve seen today?

EVERYTHING IS GOING ACCORDING TO PLAN!

On a slightly more serious note I do like how CA is trying to make every faction feel more unique on the campaign map as well as in the battles. I hope they continue to do this for all the new factions as well as the old ones. I mean beastmen used to get the short end of the stick but with their update now they are perfect for what beastmen should be.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One thing I've been thinking about recently is what if there are african themed Human nations in the Southlands.

I'm not talking about stuff like Zulu and Southern tribes but rather the more advanced civilisations like the Mali, Benin, Nubian and Ethiopian kingdoms (like Aksum and Abyssinia). They could be divided into the western and eastern kingdoms. The Western Kingdoms could be influenced by the Mali empire due to their proximity to Araby. The Eastern Kingdoms could be located south of Lahmia closer to the jungles and Sea of Dread. They could be influenced by Nubia and Ethiopia.  

Also I'm not suggesting these should be full fledged factions but rather as a part of the Dogs of war as unique units, some examples could be:

Southland Elite Longbowmen: based on nubian archers who used longbows with poisoned tipped arrows and fought as mercenaries in many armies.

Shotel Warriors: Sickle shaped swords with armour piercing properties

Cold one warriors: Frenzied fear causing warriors who prove themselves by venturing into the jungles to slay a cold one, skin it and wear it's pelt. Pretty well armoured as the cold one's pelt provides good protection (5+ save like heavy armour).

Elephants: shared with Araby

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes to African inspired factions, but from a place of pride and respect; we all know what went wrong the first time.

Also, please allow for some cross compatibility with AoS. There are multiple Minos that could have a home in both systems. 
 

Related, approach basing more like KoW and less like greedy Scrooges. Enough of cramming a million figures without space to sell more minis: 1 to 1 is a terrible representation, units should feel like a dynamic abstraction regiments. If this is a battles game, take that seriously and don’t try to monetize that aspect to the point of what we saw in 8th edition.

I said this is related to AoS cross compatibility because a known problem is ranking AoS figures with dynamic poses.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Noserenda said:

Savage Orcs and Terrible racist caricatures

But you repeat yourself, unfortunately...😕

Regardless, I think it's an unfortunate side effect of WHFB's focus on the old world. Loads of unique detail there but then everything else is extremely broad strokes or an afterthought with a grab-bag of other factions stuffed in. It's something which the TW maps actually make even more obvious, honestly.

Cathay does seem to be an example of CA/GW moving beyond that but I'd be very surprised if they did the same for anywhere else.

Edited by sandlemad
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Noserenda said:

As written, the Southlands is a three way battlefield between Lizardmen, Savage Orcs and Terrible racist caricatures  with the Odd rogue Tomb king unfortunately :(

How is anything I wrote Racist? I don't think you know much about these kingdoms and their military history.

Historical Nubian archers did use poison on their arrows. They also used Longbows nearly a thousand years before the Welsh. There are many historical accounts of their accuracy and potency.

Shotel is an actual sword and the shape was likely employed to get around an opponent's guard and weak points in the armour to pierce vital organs. 

pretty sure nobody cried racist when the Disciples of Apedemak were in the Kush faction of Total war Rome 2 (Kushite kingdom of the southern Nile not the hindu Kush). I just replaced lions with dinosaurs (Africa has a few cryptids that resemble dinosaurs).

Nubians used War elephants, Probably used them the same way Carthage did but probably got phased out. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, Greybeard86 said:

Also, please allow for some cross compatibility with AoS. There are multiple Minos that could have a home in both systems. 

Depends on how they let us use Old world minis

I'm personally hoping that the rumoured Dawnbringer Crusades brings back some of the Squatted Empire units. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...