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Rodiger

How have Gw price rises affected your purchasing habits?

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Well @Rodiger I think you’re doing the right thing. To me the hobby is becoming much more affordable now that I only buy stuff I intend to paint & play with immediately. I’m not buying anything for a discount, a bundle or because it’s new and shiny. I’m not filling my closet with nebulous future armies that will never see the light of day. Sure I’d probably buy more if it was more affordable, but passed that first impulse of « I want it », I’ve never looked back weeks later and thought « if only I’d bought that battlebox! ».

I don’t think what GW is doing is really out of the norm. I don’t think it’s particularly good either! This kind of releases prey on FOMO and « whales » ready to buy anything as soon as it’s released, be it from a scalper. I’m not a big fan of such consumerism; what i value in the hobby is creativity, DIY, friendship and community.

I just don’t want to waste too much energy in all this; I have no way to influence GW other than how I spend my money. So I don’t spend it when the price is too high, and I know that my happiness will never be really impacted because I couldn’t afford some toy soldiers.

I do hope they keep releasing some affordable stuff though. But to me the prices are a blessing in disguise, as they forced me to ask myself what I value in the hobby.

(that’s the end of my TED talk, thank you for coming)

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the new 2020 increase has stopped me from entering the hobby after just two boxes of Astartes. I can't afford it. I just spent £80 on 3 Aggressors, 10 Intercessors and 3 paints. I cannot afford it. I've been into the lore for years and I was starting to collect but I honestly cant afford it now and I'm going to have to stop. This is the third price increase in 3 years. 

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I usually would rush buy things I think I need that I really don t in the week before the price increase take effect but quarantine, loss in wages made me realize how much I still have new in box and my spendable income has shrunk to a point where I won t be spending on hobby for at least the next 6 months

I am also expecting gw to announce yearly increase around june, but I ve been surprised before when they did some unannounced increase as well. I get they don t have to tell us but in my mind they ve always have and I m glad they still are. Now if they pick and choose to announce some and not some others, it looks more like a marketing move to push sales without discounting. I guess it normally worked with me but this year it s different

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Posted (edited)
On 11/8/2019 at 7:44 PM, MitGas said:

Indeed, very valid points - the cost of the consoles and/or PC have to be taken into consideration as well. At least nowadays you won't need a new computer every 2-3 years. I can remember the times when a PC was hopelessly outdated after like 3 years because specs got better so fast. Now I only got a MacPro (the trashcan) and for my work stuff it's good enough despite being far from perfect. I do play games on a WIN partition with it and most stuff runs reasonably well but I plan to buy a ridiculous gaming PC soon. It should light up like a christmas tree! And well, when I think what that'll cost me, Warhammer is suddenly  a less expensive hobby.

 

Edit: Oh and good luck with your hdd!

The counterpoint is that from a playing perspective games dont really become redundant unless they have a server requirement. I can still play games I bought a decade ago, whereas a lot of armies people bought for GW systems dont have even half that shelf life if they're interested in the competitive side of the hobby. 

Edited by Nos

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3 hours ago, SanguineSon said:

the new 2020 increase has stopped me from entering the hobby after just two boxes of Astartes. I can't afford it. I just spent £80 on 3 Aggressors, 10 Intercessors and 3 paints. I cannot afford it. I've been into the lore for years and I was starting to collect but I honestly cant afford it now and I'm going to have to stop. This is the third price increase in 3 years. 

In 40k I try to avoid the regular infantry kits. For example, I just started a Chaos Space Marine army. The marines themselves are $60 for ten but I found a CSM start collecting box for $85 on amazon. (and it includes 10 CSM). 

You may want to check out the old "know no fear" box and newer "start collecting vanguard"  kit.  Also Aggressors, Reivers, and Redemptors can be found in the "easy to build" kits for a pretty significant discount.

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Posted (edited)

Forgot this was a thread but the last few GW price rises essentially pushed me out of AoS and 40k. They weren't the only thing but eventually I measured the increasing amount of effort I was putting into keeping costs down (ebay, second hand, proxies and conversions, creative use of specific units) for games I was feeling jaded about and it just wasn't worth it.

WHFB 8th ed. had already basically done that for a time but AoS pulled me back and then sort of pushed me out again. I still have no idea how folks that are all in on competitive play do it, it's just an insane amount of money to me.

Of course I'm still on the hook to a limited degree for Underworlds, Titanicus, and a bit of other skirmish gaming so it's not like GW's not still getting my money, just... a lot less.

Edited by sandlemad

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26 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

for games I was feeling jaded about and it just wasn't worth it.

Honestly I think that this comes down to it for many. From those who are current fans the price rises tend to only push out when they've either already been stepping out the door part way already or their work/life situation changes so that they can no longer justify the costs. 

 

That said you are very right, GW right now has several much cheaper games to get into. Underworld. Killteam, Warcry, AT, AN, Bloodbowl, WarhammerQuest, Necromunda. Each one can offer a much cheaper avenue to getting GW models and hobby gaming whilst being far less pressure on the wallet. If not in start up costs, then at least in long term army building costs and upkeep costs to keep up. Heck whilst games ilke AT might be really expensive in some ways (warlords are not cheap); the use of magnets and such can mean that you only need one or two and you're "done". 

 

I think its healthy to at times step back from the hobby and ask if you are enjoying it. If not then it doesn't have to be something from GW or you that is wrong its just a missmatch and its time to experiment outside of the box. Heck I've stepped away myself more than once, never a big fanfare just changes in life and situations and my interests. If anything I find that when I return I return more energised and excited than before. The refreshment of something different is great and who knows, perhaps you find something new and stick with it or you take it as a "holiday" and end up returning an edition or two later to glorious fun times. 

 

 

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There was a period of several years where I left Warhammer for other games, and while the price increases were not the sole factor, they definitely played a part.  The same is true of my return--edition rules changes made me interested in checking it out again, but having more money made it something I could justify.

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I do plan to get a bit of Kharadron sooner now, as these are the things I still want from AoS. And the Ork Gretchin, to have a few Arkanaut-style Goblins.

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On 10/29/2019 at 10:17 AM, amysrevenge said:

My personal life circumstances vastly outweigh the prices when it comes to my buying habits.  I've gone from lower paying job to extended unemployment to higher paying job to catastrophic water damage in my house - all of those dictated what money I could spend on my painty-men; from little to none to lots to none again.  Whether a unit box was $35 or $50 or $70 has always been a distant secondary factor.

I wanted to go back and see what I put in this thread last time it came up.

Yup, still true.

 

(I think GW analyzes a large variety of factors when setting or changing prices, including hard figures like materials, overhead, labour, transport, storage and other costs, as well as soft figures such as anticipating customer behaviours and attitudes when faced with various price options, and other factors such as maximum factory outputs and pandemic-related shipping difficulties, and then maximizes anticipated profit based on all of those factors.  Or, rather, I'd be appalled if they didn't consider all of those things and act accordingly.)

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I don't have a lot of money to spend on any hobby. But I've been into AoS for about 4.5 years now and I don't spend too much on it. This is because I've managed to build up enough paints etc. and models waiting to be built/painted that I don't feel I need to get anything new. When I do it tends to just be one box. 

Now, I'm not really a competitive player and, before this pandemic, I was only playing about 2 games a month. I see my hobby as more working on projects with the aim to build up an army/collection of built and painted models. I have around 2500 points of Sylvaneth. It took me 3 years to get 2000 points together! Show the speed at which my hobby goes. I'm now looking at building a Living City army.

This year all I have spent hobby-wise is on a few paints/paint additives. We're nearly half way through the year and I have probably spent less than £30.

Last year I spent more as I bought the new Sylvaneth battletome, their endless spells, the Warscroll cards and  one of the new Wyldwood boxes. Add in a few paints here and there and that is all I bought myself. I was lucky in that my partner bought me some boxes of miniatures for birthday and Christmas - apparently being into AoS makes me easier to buy presents for according to her and other family members.

This is ending up longer than I meant it to! To get to a point... the price increases don't mean much to me as I've got projects I'm working on and I'll add to them one box at a time. I've always tended to do this but have still ended up with a backlog! This is mainly through the odd additional purchase when I've had a bit of spare money or purposefully saving up for something (like when I knew the new Sylvaneth stuff was coming). 

To add to this point - when I got (back) into Warhammer, I didn't have anymore money for it than I do now. I used to go out and see bands at least once a week - this would cost between £10-30 a week. I stopped doing this as much and the money I saved went into AoS. I also sold some things on eBay to fund my first Sylvaneth Start Collecting box. I bought this and the battletome. I couldn't believe that the general rules of the game were free and even that the Warscrolls were free too. Nowadays the access to the points are free via Warscroll Builder. I used to buy one paint per week (I'd already bought a starter paint set a couple of years earlier). I quickly built up a decent selection of colours.

Yes, it sucks that prices are going up. But, at least for me, it won't change anything. Nor would it have made it much different to get into it if I was starting out again.

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Posted (edited)

I am eBaying Second Hand models. The only thing I buy new from time to time is the GHB or the X-Mas Battleforces. I earn pretty well yet most prices are just rude and I am not willing to pay 50€ for something that cost 25€ a few years ago - this greed puts me off.

If GW truly „adjusted“ prices they‘d reduce the price of old products while keeping a higher price for newer kits. Naming this adjustment is scratching on deception. (They don‘t need to increase anything they just do it for the greed).

Edited by JackStreicher
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I think that the price increase for an already pricey hobby is very much limiting what I will purchase. I was thinking of starting a 40k army, but now I think that I will stick with my small Slaves to Darkness and Idoneth armies. I can say that with more decent pricing I would be more armies deep into the hobby and spend more money on GW's products.

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Because I think it is very relevant to this discussion:

Is it against TGA forum rules to discuss recasting?

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So I don't mean to defend GW's prices, but I hate that several guys are suggesting that they will be quitting the hobby altogether after this incoming price hike. It hurts my soul. :( But I want to point out that there are ways to be successful in this hobby on a modest budget. I know because I am working on my 14th fully painted army in the last 5 years and I'm poor AF.

This hobby can be insanely punishing for impulse buyers. I have found that meticulously planning out armies and then purchasing the desired units as a part of box sets, during sales, or off the second market significantly helps mitigate the cost. The most efficient way to get models you want is to trade your own unwanted models for them. 

Also, GW miniatures, especially decently painted ones, actually hold their value pretty well. Compare that to hobbies such as MTG or video games, which depreciate to near zero value.

TLDR; Don't give up the hobby. Stick it out! 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Well, when restarting 40k and making my first steps into AoS I´ve bought quite a bunch of stuff at GW. From time to times I ordered some units together with friends from UK shops as theese were the cheapest ones around, but yet it was rare as "support the lgs" seemed important back then.

Well, the manager changed some times, while in the past we could easily have some evenings with later closing times to finish some games, these days were past. In the same time there was a price increase if I recall correctly. Afterwards I´ve bought almost exclusively online for the 20-25% discount, picking up some colors and codices/battletomes at another lgs in our town.

Then, after the last price increase, I actually turned much more into used market and trading models. We created our own local monthly playgroup which has around 20 players which come to paint, play and hangout. As we are not tied to a store, second market is flourishing, which allowed me to get more stuff than ever for less money than before. I also became quite averted from buying battletomes and campaign books as thoose overpriced books loose value so fast that it really hurts, althrough it seems more a 40k issue to me.

The current price hike actually made me think again. I have currently too many armies (Necrons and Marines with Knight Support in 40k, Beastclaws, Slaves to Darkness, Khorne and Flesh Eaters in AoS, in addition also Savage Orruks for Warcry and Nids for Killteam) so I really feel overwhelmed by my projects and can´t focus on playing one army and feel like loosing often to the fact that I simply never took the time to learn a single faction well. Therefore I am really concidering to sell some armies off, especially as Khorne and Slaves seem quite similar on the battlefield. Following an minimalist approach, I would really prefer to focus on less factions. Also, I actually only did 3 games with my Nids Killteam, none with my Orruks in Warcry and therefore concider just to get rid of them and to accept that I am not that kind of player for specialist games.

Edit: Also, I recently got to use the 3D printer of a friend for some terrain features and concider to print some terrain and maybe Lord of War Proxies for 40k. In general, putting money aside for a 3d printer became so much more desireble than buying a gw kit because the long term payoff is so much higher. Currently trying to learn how to make propper sculpts in blender

Edited by Charleston
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23 minutes ago, NauticalSoup said:

Because I think it is very relevant to this discussion:

Is it against TGA forum rules to discuss recasting?

Yes it is. Please don’t 

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20 minutes ago, NauticalSoup said:

Because I think it is very relevant to this discussion:

Is it against TGA forum rules to discuss recasting?

Yes. Up to and including a full ban. Recasting is not something we permit discussion of here.
Proxies, making your own models etc... that's all legal and fine, though we generally don't have much encouragement of such discussion or engagement of such discussion. However making recasts is illegal and immoral and overall only harms the hand that feeds. If you like the game and want it to survive then in the end you've got to put your money into the pot to keep GW around. If you steal from the hand that feeds then one day that hand will close and will feed no more - sure "one person won't matter" but that attitude can fast breed a very toxic attitude. 

So short answer again - NO RECASTING

9 minutes ago, Landohammer said:

So I don't mean to defend GW's prices, but I hate that several guys are suggesting that they will be quitting the hobby altogether after this incoming price hike. It hurts my soul. :( 

TLDR; Don't give up the hobby. Stick it out! 

For what its worth its my observation that more people give up on GW, but its only ever a "straw that breaks the camels back" situation. Ergo they already had several issues and a price hike just forces them to confront and rethink and finally make the choice. New rules editions do the same thing; new battletomes even sometimes a new big model can make people stop and go "what am I doing". etc... 

Many don't give up on wargaming, they shift to other games. Either using models as proxies in warhammer games or going to other systems. I've said before/elsewhre, that I've taken breaks from my 40K armies and often as not when I've returned I've engaged far more in the hobby than before. My most recent return included AoS in a big way and also reading BL novels, something that I've greatly enjoyed and yet never interacted with before. 

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Posted (edited)

@Gaz Taylor @Overread

Loud and clear.

Kind of a shame though, seems hard to discuss this without that, given it's yet another market pressure.

Carry on.

Edit: I can't help it, I need to point out that reply was literally discussing said banned subject in a very direct capacity. Or moralizing I guess, because I'm not allowed to reply.

Edited by NauticalSoup
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Posted (edited)

Everyone who is in the hobby right now is still involved after the last time there was a price rise and it was the last straw for someone and they left the hobby (or talked big about leaving and then didn't).

Every price rise is declared as the point at which the hobby can't continue as it is out of reach for the common hobbyist.  And then a year later, the current pricing is sustainable for the common hobbyist, but the next price rise puts it out of reach.  Until the next price rise, which is *really* the one that puts it out of reach for the common hobbyist.  And then then next one, where we *really mean it this time*.  And then you get to 1998....

 

Anytime you find yourself thinking "I wish it was as affordable now as it was back in {insert date here]", you can search through the records and find people at that time upset about how unaffordable it was .  It's literally the most predictable thing in the hobby.

Edited by amysrevenge
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Posted (edited)

I've gone to 3rd Party companies (Scibor, Lost Kingdoms, etc..) and I'm getting a 3D printer. I now just buy on Amazon or Ebay or like FLGS but on the internet?  Like miniaturemarket, or alpha omega hobby or gamenerdz, etc. I am looking forward to some .stl's especially the counts as Kroxigors from Lost Kingdom Miniatures. 

Edited by Ravinsild

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We aren't quite to the point where 3D printing will seriously cut into the marketability of detailed plastic minis, but it's definitely within sight. One of the reasons you buy products from big companies like GW is that the economy of scale factor usually makes it a lot cheaper. Problem is when the only game in town because also the most expensive option you start looking for any alternative. 

Seems like with every month we get more and better looking 3D print sculpts, and 3D printers continue to get better and cheaper, so I envision one day within a few short years that'll be the go-to option for alternatively sourced miniatures.

Looking forward to it. The only shame is that it will probably start killing off small 3rd party operations (that aren't able to leverage the tech for whatever reason) before it forces GW to adjust their business practices.

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I spend maybe 4-5k on war games a year? Maybe half GW? Don’t really look at prices. Try to get my best, but I accept a full army is going to end up costing $600-$1000

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I find myself often thinking about something I heard, I think from Vince Venturella : people overestimate what they can do in one year and underestimate what they can do in three.

This kind of thinking really applies to the hobby. My latest return to it was around one and a half year ago, and most of my projects are still unfinished. It used to cause me a lot of frustration but now I give it time and try to take it one step at a time rather than restarting.
It also means than rather than getting excited and biting off more than I can chew, I think « I don’t really need this new model, I’ll get it when I’ve finished painting this and that... if I still want it ». This helps really reduce the spending.

That said, I’m in it mostly for the skirmish and hobby. Playing larger games and especially tournaments seems to require a rather large investment upfront, in time as well as money. If I ever did that I would definitely contemplate buying secondhand for the bulk of the army.

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2 hours ago, Overread said:

Yes. Up to and including a full ban. Recasting is not something we permit discussion of here.
Proxies, making your own models etc... that's all legal and fine, though we generally don't have much encouragement of such discussion or engagement of such discussion. However making recasts is illegal and immoral and overall only harms the hand that feeds. If you like the game and want it to survive then in the end you've got to put your money into the pot to keep GW around. If you steal from the hand that feeds then one day that hand will close and will feed no more - sure "one person won't matter" but that attitude can fast breed a very toxic attitude. 

So short answer again - NO RECASTING

 

Most people I know who have invested in recasts have also invested hundreds to thousands in GW products and continue to buy new GW plastics every year; they may just want an incredibly overpriced item(s) that may be of the same or better quality from Forgeworld in a recast. Many individuals who put a ton of money into their little plastic toys from GW also supplement some of it with recasts but whatever you say :P.  Do you have a grading system of how immoral it is? Like is it equivalent to downloading movies off the internet bad or charging $100 for a loaf of bread immoral?

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