How have Gw price rises affected your purchasing habits?

[zilberfrid]

37 minutes ago, NauticalSoup said:

I don't understand the venture capitalist comment. They aren't venture capitalists, they're a publicly traded company whose sole accountability is to the shareholders - ie their bottom line. Perhaps you're using this term to mean something else?

I meant in the hyper capitalists. They don't seem to work short term profits over long term ones. Even though quite a few of their choices are baffling to us, their long term things do seem to work out, and they are not something like an Uber or Charter in how they treat their employees.

[NauticalSoup]

8 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

I meant in the hyper capitalists. They don't seem to work short term profits over long term ones. Even though quite a few of their choices are baffling to us, their long term things do seem to work out, and they are not something like an Uber or Charter in how they treat their employees.

Fair enough. For me as a Canadian however, since they prioritize their UK operations, I just don't really care. It's certainly not a point against them but it's not going to win them any kudos from me either. The only GW employees I've met here are the ones they laid off en masse during the Great Streamlining a few years back, so I can tell you it's certainly not all rainbows and unicorns for everyone within the GW envelope.

I care much more about how GW's practices impact my FLGS and my fellow consumers than I ever will about their workers in the UK.

[Ravinsild]

4 hours ago, zilberfrid said:

Sorry, I can't agree here. From what I can gather, they have made a choice to keep primary production in the UK when driving it offshore was the norm, their customer support currently seems quite good, and things like announcing this price adjustment is something the GW of a few years ago would not have done. And as far as I can see, they were quite good at putting the safety of their employees (and coincidentally, their customers) before the bottom line in the COVID thing.

There are a lot of things GW does I do not like, but I don't rank them among venture capitalists.

I say this not as a fan, but as someone who's leaving GW's offerings because I don't like their design direction, not because of their whole company deal.

You mean like joker face thicc skeletons and cow helmet elves and stuff? 

[CommissarRotke]

honestly i don't think i'll be purchasing anything outside of Warcry and Underworlds warbands from here on out... maybe some books when I see one that looks worth it. really annoying they're doing a price hike now when things already feel expensive.

[Thiagoma]

1 hour ago, Ravinsild said:

You mean like joker face thicc skeletons and cow helmet elves and stuff? 

That hurts. TK abd HE were my favorite armies. GW has it personal on me 🤣

[NauticalSoup]

@Thiagoma

I'm amazed you're still here. I'm still salty about Orcs & Goblins and a lot of them survived to this day.

[Greyshadow]

I think the timing is awkward. Your customers are doing it tough and the economy is shrinking. Not sure the price rise is a very good idea.

[zilberfrid]

3 hours ago, Ravinsild said:

You mean like joker face thicc skeletons and cow helmet elves and stuff? 

The factions I have no love for are Stormcast (except for Gryph hound/chargers and aether wings), Chaos Warriors, Khorne, Ironjaws, Dark elves, Phoenix temple, Fyreslayers (after the third model), Ossiarch (more about their whole design than the thickness and faces), Nurgle, the ghouls of FEC, Nagash and his mortachs, Half of Lumineth (basic inf and cav, as well as mage and cathaller are good) and Stormcast. Yes. I listed them twice. About some others I'm on the fence.

The direction is towards monopose, remocing the best bit about GW stuff, the bits.

I also don't like the overly monotheistic tone in AoS (meaning that everything is tied to a single god, not there only is one.

Most importantly though is their ever growing scale, making them incompatible with themselves (put a metal longbeard/trooper/thunderer next to an AoS dwarf...) as well as things on d&d scale.

I do like Goblins, Trolls, some Tzeench stuff and the Sphyranx where the scale doesn't matter as well as the Kharadron and Excelsior Warpriest (before his murder and reanimation as puppet of the god-emperor).

[Kirjava13]

15 hours ago, Kramer said:

On one hand they raise prices while on the other hand they report record profits.

This is the biggest deal to me. Coming at a time when record numbers of people are out of work, and against a backdrop of historic profits, the optics are extremely bad. Perhaps it makes economic sense: maybe it's inflation, maybe this was planned to cancel out a certain expected loss of revenue from X, Y or Z, I don't know. But millions of people suddenly have a LOT less money to spend, and "little plastic soldiers I paint and play dice games with" are going to be first on a lot of chopping blocks, doubly so if they know cost €10 more than before. I can only speak personally, but even though I've been making more money than previously, I've really cut back my purchases this year and limited it  to Long Boi the Big Cat. Partly this is because there's just nothing new I want, partly it's because increasingly I struggle to justify dropping half a hundred on a box of dudes and some paint. We'll see.

[valenswift]

6 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

This is the biggest deal to me. Coming at a time when record numbers of people are out of work, and against a backdrop of historic profits, the optics are extremely bad. Perhaps it makes economic sense: maybe it's inflation, maybe this was planned to cancel out a certain expected loss of revenue from X, Y or Z, I don't know. But millions of people suddenly have a LOT less money to spend, and "little plastic soldiers I paint and play dice games with" are going to be first on a lot of chopping blocks, doubly so if they know cost €10 more than before. I can only speak personally, but even though I've been making more money than previously, I've really cut back my purchases this year and limited it  to Long Boi the Big Cat. Partly this is because there's just nothing new I want, partly it's because increasingly I struggle to justify dropping half a hundred on a box of dudes and some paint. We'll see.

To be fair these record profits have been rising over the last couple of years  and would be more to do with record numbers of people getting in to the hobby rather than the people who already played buying and paying more. When I started playing (mid 80's) I wouldn't have dared tell anyone outside of my friends who played about the hobby for fear of physical and painful reprisals. When I started again as an adult I would have a been a little embarrassed if any of my work colleague's knew I played with and painted little plastic figures. But now in 2020 I'm embarrassed for anyone who isn't enjoying Warhammer, D&D or board games in some way or other (although I would not beat them up for it 😉)

[Kirjava13]

Hey, don't get me wrong, I've taken girls into Warhammer shops on (almost) first dates after they've asked about my hobby! Tip: shoot for artistic ladies and they'll be much more likely not to give you an odd look and back away slowly 😅

[valenswift]

52 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

Hey, don't get me wrong, I've taken girls into Warhammer shops on (almost) first dates after they've asked about my hobby! Tip: shoot for artistic ladies and they'll be much more likely not to give you an odd look and back away slowly 😅

Hahaha you're much braver than me. I sold off a massive collection of Greenskins and Lizardmen after my divorce in fear I'd never meet anyone again if they saw my collection (Don't worry Warhammer was only one factor of the relationship breaking down 😉). Luckily i then met someone who is as big a geek as me who actively encourages me (to justify her own Lego habit). 

[Sleboda]

17 hours ago, NauticalSoup said:

So along the road from annoying pewters to all-plastic we have a highway strewn with wreckage, bitter fans, waves and waves of markups and plenty of jettisoned miniatures.

The anecdotes don't really get us anywhere though, basically it's just me venting because I've seen GW blade players again and again and again and there's always new players without the history to know someday they'll be in line to get offed for a buck. GW is a publicly-owned corporation, they are a 'make number go up business' and couldn't care less about anything that isn't their bottom line. GW doesn't care about you, and will squat your grandmother for a nickel. I play their game because I enjoy it and because, ultimately, they won so it's the only game in town. Doesn't mean they're forgiven though. There will always be room in the Dammaz Kron for more dastardly deeds by James Workshop.

Not a single cuss, but probably one of the ugliest posts I've seen here in years. 

[PC Veteran]

I know this is a hobby and GW can charge what ever it wants, but are they fair in how they charge us. If GW would let us all buy from the UK at UK prices. (GW for some reason blocked us from doing so). I think there would be a lot less complaining. These price adjustments effect many of us much more then others. Speaking form a US point of view, and as an example. The UK has a higher minimum wage than the US, and pays 24.00 for a box of Ironjawz Brutes. In the US they charge us 50.00 for the same box. Working at minimum wage. In the UK your looking at about 3hrs pay. In the US it over 6hrs pay, and the price doesn't reflect the exchange rate at all.  24 BP is currently just over 29 US. Many of us want to enjoy this hobby too, so telling us to not buy it feels like a slap in the face. When the product is available to some at such a lower cost, and we are not allowed to purchase it for the same. 

Sorry for the rant just wanted to put some stuff in prospective.

Edited May 24, 2020 by PC Veteran

[NauticalSoup]

1 hour ago, Sleboda said:

Not a single cuss, but probably one of the ugliest posts I've seen here in years. 

I laughed when I read this. You don't think they can take it? Is GW a person whose feelings I'm gonna hurt by stating I find their business practices to be among the more wretched in the industry?

Ah no I gotcha - the crack about WHFB dwarf grudges, a little too on the nose, eh? Or squatting grandmothers. VERY serious stuff. Enough to make a GW shareholder's ears bleed.

For real though - I get that TGA used to be a bit of a hug-box but come on, that was pretty tame as far as "I don't like GW" rants go. You get worse than that on Dakka Dakka on like every page even if it wasn't the subject of the thread.

 

[Sleboda]

1 hour ago, NauticalSoup said:

You don't think they can take it? Is GW a person whose feelings I'm gonna hurt by stating I find their business practices to be among the more wretched in the industry?

In that one bit you reinforce the ugliness, while also misrepresenting my opinion. Bravo.

Edited May 24, 2020 by Sleboda

[Gaz Taylor]

+++ Mod Hat On +++
 

We’ve been relaxed in this thread as some people need to say what they are feeling and have been fairly constructive about it. However, we seem to be edging towards that dark place and can I ask you all to not go there.

With what is going on in the world, we want TGA to be a place you can come and connect with each other and enjoy talking about Age of Sigmar. So I’m going to ask you all now to keep it civil and constructive. 
 

Also consider this a warning, as if any of you start venturing away from the values we follow here, warning points will be issued which can lead to bans.

[Moldek]

2 hours ago, PC Veteran said:

I know this is a hobby and GW can charge what ever it wants, but are they fair in how they charge us. If GW would let us all buy from the UK at UK prices. (GW for some reason blocked us from doing so). I think there would be a lot less complaining. These price adjustments effect many of us much more then others. Speaking form a US point of view, and as an example. The UK has a higher minimum wage than the US, and pays 24.00 for a box of Ironjawz Brutes. In the US they charge us 50.00 for the same box. Working at minimum wage. In the UK your looking at about 3hrs pay. In the US it over 5hrs pay, and the price doesn't reflect the exchange rate at all.  24 BP is currently just over 29 US. Many of us want to enjoy this hobby too, so telling us to not buy it feels like a slap in the face. When the product is available to some at such a lower cost, and we are not allowed to purchase it for the same. 

Sorry for the rant just wanted to put some stuff in prospective.

I mean considering the company is based in england and has a very solid foothold there it shouldn’t come as a surprise. Most of their manufacturing is done in the UK. They are not charging more just for the lolz but because they have shipping costs, market development and so on.

In the end I’ll say that yes I get annoyed by the price increases. Yes I feel that sometimes they’re pushing it a bit. So I’m not buying what seems too expensive to me. But for comparable quality they seem relatively on par with the rest of the market.

[NauticalSoup]

Sorry if my comments rustled anyone. My opinions are mine, and my negative experiences with GW shouldn't reflect on your passions or their worth.

😘  

Edit: but on topic my FLGS is taking orders again just in time so I ended up making a big order to flush out my dwarves so this hike DID motivate me to buy models!

Edited May 24, 2020 by NauticalSoup

[PlasticCraic]

On 5/23/2020 at 10:31 PM, Ravinsild said:

Also I get their brushes cuz it’s just like why not. They’re kind of disposable. 
 

Have you tried high-quality, non-GW brushes?  

I've saved a fortune since I switched to Winsor & Newton.

I was constantly churning through GW brushes because they lose their point so quickly.  I started buying W&N one brush at a time, and I've never looked back.  

They are expensive up front, and of course anything will wear out eventually.  But I'd never go back to Citadel "throwaways" after using these. 

The quality is supreme and it works out so, so much cheaper over time.  I think if most people even just bought a Size 1 to get started, they'd be converted.

[Saxon]

In Australia we already pay about 30% more than the rest of the world for the same product (thanks government).

I honestly haven't purchased anything brand new from  GW in about 18 months (other than my recent trip to the UK) due to costs. Honestly, i'm going to start collecting Bolt Action before i start another AOS army.

Edited May 25, 2020 by Saxon

[PlasticCraic]

1 hour ago, Saxon said:

In Australia we already pay about 30% more than the rest of the world for the same product (thanks government).

Standard Australian import tariffs are 5% - I'm not aware of gaming miniatures attracting a special, higher tariff, but if anyone has a source I'm open to being proved wrong.  This 5% (?) tariff is only one of many factors in the pricing.  There's freight, local wages and probably higher margins for GW in there too.  

Bearing in mind that VAT represents 17.5% of sticker prices in the UK, yet GST is only 10% in Australia, I don't think it's fair or accurate to pin higher prices on  gouging by the Australian government.

[Saxon]

2 minutes ago, PlasticCraic said:

Standard Australian import tariffs are 5% - I'm not aware of gaming miniatures attracting a special, higher tariff, but if anyone has a source I'm open to being proved wrong.  This 5% (?) tariff is only one of many factors in the pricing.  There's freight, local wages and probably higher margins for GW in there too.  

Bearing in mind that VAT represents 17.5% of sticker prices in the UK, yet GST is only 10% in Australia, I don't think it's fair or accurate to pin higher prices on  gouging by the Australian government.

I may be incorrect on the tarriffs. I was under the impression that it was considered a luxury item and thus taxed differently but i can't find anything. 

We have high rents, absurdly high minimum wages in comparison to other countries. If you want to talk about rents, i could chew your ear off about how absurd our government (at all 3 levels) are when it comes to affordability of bricks and mortar. 

Realistically though, in the UK you pay 25 pounds sterling for a box of Drayds which is $46 AUD. We pay $70 for the same box which is almost a third higher. If you want to talk about shipping, Canada pays an equivalent of $56 AUD for a box of Dryads which is 20% cheaper than us. No matter which way you look at it, any price rise hurts us badly when we already pay more for the same thing. 

Local gaming pages on Facebook have reacted extremely negatively to the price rise which has been magnified by the current Covid crisis. 

[PlasticCraic]

Yep I certainly wouldn't disagree that we are paying over the odds one way or another!  I just wouldn't put it all at the door of the government (on this occasion).

I had a quick look at the last thing I bought, which was a Beastclaw Raiders Start Collecting.  That's GBP 55 in the UK, which is GBP 46.81 of sales revenue + VAT.

Add 5% on for tariffs (again I could be wrong), plus 10% GST, at the current Exchange Rate of 1.86 and that gives you a sticker price of AUD 100.56

Current price is AUD 150, which is a markup of 49.2%.  There's a few things chipping into that (freight, exchange rate uncertainty, higher wages etc), as well as the tariff which we've already built in.  But whatever way you slice it up, that's quite a bit of fat.

It would be quite interesting to do a "Burgernomics" analysis: how many hours does a GW retail sales assistant need to work, to buy one SC out of their wages?  I'd guess the equation then looks a lot tighter than the actual price at the actual exchange rate would suggest, and is probably a fairer comparison.

But bringing it back to the original premise: the experience in Australia suggests that as much as we might not like it as consumers, in practice, when push comes to shove people will continue to find the money even at prices significantly above those currently seen in the UK.

Edit: or maybe not, when I did a very sketchy local wage comparison (see below) I'm not sure that we're actually paying that much over the odds relative to what a lot of people earn. 

Maybe we are actually paying broadly in line with the UK in terms of local market conditions, so Australian prices don't really demonstrate that people in other countries can and will pay that much more in nominal terms.

Edited May 25, 2020 by PlasticCraic

[PlasticCraic]

I don't know what GW pays its retail staff, but looking at minimum wages as a benchmark is quite illuminating.  

So looking at the UK Minimum Wage, it's currently GBP 8.21 per hour for adults.

That's 6.7 hours of minimum wage work to cover the sticker price of a Start Collecting BCR.

In Australia, the level 1 retail award is $21.41 (more at weekends, more at higher levels). 

That's 7.0 hours of minimum wage work to cover the sticker price of a Start Collecting BCR.

When you look at it like that, the pricing seems pretty well-adapted to local conditions.  Not everyone earns minimum wage, and GW may well pay above that, but I think it gives a good feel for the wages that selling prices need to cover for local warehousing and retail staff, what your average person can actually afford, and so on. 

Given that there are real extra costs to cover (e.g. freight + import tariff) I don't actually think the pricing structure looks that far out of whack?