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AoS 2 - Ogor Mawtribe Discussion


Ogor Mawtribes Poll  

491 members have voted

  1. 1. What tier do you feel Ogors are pre-battletome?

    • High-tier
      29
    • Mid-tier
      226
    • Low-tier
      236
  2. 2. What kind of army will you be running?

    • Entirely Gutbusters
      37
    • Mostly Gutbusters
      121
    • Mixed forces
      206
    • Mostly Beastclaw Raiders
      86
    • Entirely Beastclaw Raiders
      41


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2 minutes ago, Wickie De Viking said:

I also just made the move to the Mawtribes and ordered 2 Feast of Bones sets and a Beastclaw Raiders SC box. Somehow I don't like the Ironblaster so I'm looking for help in building a 1000 pt list with the rest of the units from these boxes

You can still assembly the Ironblaster as Scaplauncher. Together with 20 Gnoblars and the Battalion you can use it as a well screened objective holder for your own territory which can shoot down enemy hordes quite well from afar. It is a lot of fun from how the Warscroll looks.

With the mentioned Boxes you can freely decide on a Frostlord/Huskard or Tyrrant as Warlord. Depending on it I would recommend 12 Gluttons as first battleline and then either 4 Leadbelchers or 2+ Mournfangs. A Tyrrant is great either way to make the Gluttons immune to morale. Rest depends on what you like and what you are about to face.

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It's time to rule the world... Aaaaaaaaarghhhh.   

My New Handmade Butcher) 

Okay for the people wh o are apparently already disappointed brcause leadbelchers aren’t suddenly the snipers of the mortal realms when only looking at the warscroll... there is a whole tribe dedicate

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1 minute ago, GeneralZero said:

I like the ironblaster, a moving canon yeah!  But is it efficient? Playable? How to use it?  Will probably have 3 of it (if my feast of bones are  delivered)

The Ironblaster is like the Leadbelchers a meele unit with ranged attacks. As there is no penalty to moving and shooting you want to move right toward your enemy, shoot targets (maybe to even snipe something) before you finish them in meele. As we are allowed to shoot into meele, there is no point in wasting thoose sweet meele attacks. 3 Ironblasters will actually look amazing, do some neat damage on their own and work as an amazing distraction carnifex. Use them for pressure on a flank and to force your opponent to play the way you want it to :D

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@Wickie De Viking@GeneralZero Ironblaster might only really be vaguely playable in an Underguts list, with a Tyrant with the Gruesome Trophy Rack. The one that gives Gutbuster units wholly within 12” +1 to hit against hero and monster units.  It’s probably better to have more than one cannon to benefit more from the +1 shot command ability.

alternatively you can build scraplaunchers.

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@Walrustaco

 

Did you have modified your current list ? Including the option of Frostlord on Stonehorn/huskard ? 

 

I wanted to go for something like :

Frostlord on Stonehorn 

Butcher

Slaugtermaster

 

glutton x12

irongut x8

mournfang x4 (x8 ?)

+

Bataillon 

+ something like frost sabre for objectif

Edited by Zorki
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51 minutes ago, Zorki said:

@Walrustaco

 

Did you have modified your current list ? Including the option of Frostlord on Stonehorn/huskard ? 

 

I wanted to go for something like :

Frostlord on Stonehorn 

Butcher

Slaugtermaster

 

glutton x12

irongut x8

mournfang x4 (x8 ?)

+

Bataillon 

+ something like frost sabre for objectif

Not sure you could fit all of that under 2000 points

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1 hour ago, Kimbo said:

How do people think the mawtribe will fare competitivly?

I think they'll be mid or even bottom tier. Nothing really stands out as broken just all around solid, which will make them great fun to play but won't hold up against dedicated tourney lists which will have those some tools plus something broken on top.

Ironically I think the strongest tools will be yetis and Frost sabres. neither are particularly amazing but by themselves but they have the nearly gauranteed deepstrike+charge, the pile in from 6inches and the always strike first to make them hard to deal with in some armies. But only as a part, maybe supporting some ogors or mournefangs or something.

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I can see them being strong B tier.

I foresee at least one Thundertusk being a must-take -- forcing enemies who charge to fight last.  It'll be used to protect either frontlines from being charged, or protect the casters from deep strike charges.

I also think we'll have a strong list using the Thundertusk -1 to hit, the Firebelly -1 to hit aura, and an endless spell to provide additional -1 to be hit.  I think this could make us pretty tanky (considering we're already pretty tanky), and with the points drop and extra survivability to the stonehorn, we'll have a nice hammer to a stonehorn / Irongut anvil. 

I think we'll have some nice shooting with catapults and butcher spells.  Able to take charges with grots or ogors. So strong B tier.  I don't see anything broken enough to compete with Slaanesh, or FEC.  I think we'll lose 4/10 to things like Idoneth Deepkin, Sylvaneth or Fyreslayers, and lose on objectives to things like DoT.   I think we'll have a pretty even matchup against lists like Nurgle, Beasts of Chaos, or maybe even some Death lists.

 

Still VERY early to tell.  Just my predictions of where we'll fit in the meta.

Edited by ryanguy88
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I'm not sure on Tier yet but I'm thinking in the 40 to 50% win rate area. Frost Lord on Stonehorn with Etheral Amulet is going to be something that some armies just can't deal with, especially with him being worth 10 models for objective capping now. So that might push us up. That said, it depends on a realm artifact (so not always available) and other armies can do it about as well as we can.

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1 hour ago, Forrix said:

 That said, it depends on a realm artifact (so not always available) and other armies can do it about as well as we can.

What do you mean ? It is always available when you make your list, you just need to choose a realm where you come from. It something different than the realm where you make the fight.

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36 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

What do you mean ? It is always available when you make your list, you just need to choose a realm where you come from. It something different than the realm where you make the fight.

As in tournaments or events may not always allow realm artifacts.

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Hey all, I have a conversion question. I want to use the 2 hand weapons from my Mournfang kit combined with foot ogor bodies from the glutton kit (that i dont have yet) to convert 4 ironguts. However the arm bits that go with the 2 handed weapons in the mournfang kit are needed to build the one handed mournfang models, so my question is has anyone done this conversion or knows if there are arms in the standard ogor kit that are compatible with the 2 handed mournfang weapons? Like, are the same arms that will connect properly with those 2 hand weapons in both kits? If not, i'll have to save the mournfang kit arms for the conversion and just use one hand weapon arms from the ogor kit on the mournfang.

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3 minutes ago, ccconner777 said:

Hey all, I have a conversion question. I want to use the 2 hand weapons from my Mournfang kit combined with foot ogor bodies from the glutton kit (that i dont have yet) to convert 4 ironguts. However the arm bits that go with the 2 handed weapons in the mournfang kit are needed to build the one handed mournfang models, so my question is has anyone done this conversion or knows if there are arms in the standard ogor kit that are compatible with the 2 handed mournfang weapons? Like, are the same arms that will connect properly with those 2 hand weapons in both kits? If not, i'll have to save the mournfang kit arms for the conversion and just use one hand weapon arms from the ogor kit on the mournfang.

The arms of the 2 kits are interchangeable,  your idea should work 

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58 minutes ago, Jmason said:

The arms of the 2 kits are interchangeable,  your idea should work 

That's not his problem, the arms from the glutton kit are not made to align a 2 handed weapon and the angle will be different making impossible to glue the weapon. To wait is the best solution.

Edited by Painkiller95
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Did math stuff to try to figure out whether Gluttons should have the new Ironfists or the new dual-wield.  Sorry if this has been posted before.
Change to Ironfists:  Reflect mortal wound on natural '6' save roll.

Change to dual-wield: Natural '6' to hit creates 2 hits.  Make a wound and save for each.

TLDR:  At groups of 3, probably Ironfists.  At groups of 6+, probably dual-wield.  If you expect better saves, ironfists become more worth it, but probably not enough so.  

Dual-Wielding first:
A model has 3 attacks, it'll pop off and get an extra wound roll every other activation. 2/3 will deal 2 damage. So, statistically, an extra 1.3 damage per model every two activations.  So .65 extra damage per combat per model. 

  3 Ogor bois would mean (3*.65)= 1.95 damage per combat.  6 Ogors would be 3.9 damage per combat,  12 would be 7.8 damage per combat.  

This doesn't factor enemy's save characteristic -- which hurts as we have no rend. Also, this will deteriorate based off how many are actually in combat, and gluttons only have 1" range and sit on 1.5" bases.  In order to keep up, ironfists would have to deal equivalent mortal wounds back.  At 3 gluttons, dealing an equivalent 2 mortal wounds in combat would mean they'd have to perform saves against 12 attacks. For breakpoints:

  3 Ogors = 12 saves rolls.  6 would be 24. 12 would be 47. 

I think you can roughly estimate that for every +1 save the enemy has (6+ being 1), 1/6 of saves need to be performed. 
e.g.:


6+ save on enemy = 

     3 ogors = 1.625 damage per combat;  6 ogors = 3.25 ; 12 ogors = 6.5

     3 ogors = 9.75 saves need to be rolled; 6 ogors = 19.5;  12 ogors = 39.

5+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 1.3.   6 ogors = 2.6.   12 ogors = 5.2

    3 ogors = 7.8 saves; 6 ogors = 15.6;  12 ogors = 30.2.

4+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 0.975.   6 ogors = 1.95.   12 ogors = 3.9

    3 ogors = 5.85 saves; 6 ogors = 11.7;  12 ogors = 23.4.

3+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 0.65.   6 ogors = 1.3.   12 ogors = 2.6

    3 ogors = 3.9 saves; 6 ogors = 7.8;  12 ogors = 15.6.

Of course, if your unit dies faster, Ironfists need to perform less to keep up.  If their unit dies faster and you have less save rolls to make,  dual-wielding will shoot ahead. (And isn't it better to assume that you get the charge and deal massive damage first?) Seems like Ironfists are best on MSU chaff walls.  

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What do you guys think of Firebellies? I think for 120, it might be worth taking them just for their amazing lore. Every single one of their spells is awesome, the best probably being the -1 to hit aura wholly within 12".

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11 minutes ago, Mutton said:

What do you guys think of Firebellies? I think for 120, it might be worth taking them just for their amazing lore. Every single one of their spells is awesome, the best probably being the -1 to hit aura wholly within 12".

@Mutton    I strongly agree.   I think that getting the firebelly close to the mawpot will be essential though. CV 8 doesn't have good odds.  Getting that +1 to cast means there'd be a 58% chance of the cast being successful, IIRC.  But being able to sit a Thundertusk nearby to make any charging enemies fight last means that the two of them will be a nice, hard to deal with combo.

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8 hours ago, Kimbo said:

How do people think the mawtribe will fare competitivly? 

At least mid-tier? 

Is it better to go for a mixed army or what faction seems like it got most love? 

Mid-tier. I don't think they are trash. I don't think any build in the book can touch Slaanesh, but I think Slaanesh needs an FAQ. When writing lists I would focus on what you may want if you play an army like say DoK, Fryreslayers,  Skaven, FeC, Clans, etc. If you have a list your comfortable vs those tomes with I think you'll be in a good position.


I'd build around a unit of 12 gluttons. Maybe Large units of leadblechers in Underguts.
I'm going to start my lists with 2xFL on Stonehorn and 12x1 gluttons. Aim is for it to be fun and playable. It will get crushed in a poor match up.

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3 hours ago, ryanguy88 said:

Did math stuff to try to figure out whether Gluttons should have the new Ironfists or the new dual-wield.  Sorry if this has been posted before.
Change to Ironfists:  Reflect mortal wound on natural '6' save roll.

Change to dual-wield: Natural '6' to hit creates 2 hits.  Make a wound and save for each.

TLDR:  At groups of 3, probably Ironfists.  At groups of 6+, probably dual-wield.  If you expect better saves, ironfists become more worth it, but probably not enough so.  

Dual-Wielding first:
A model has 3 attacks, it'll pop off and get an extra wound roll every other activation. 2/3 will deal 2 damage. So, statistically, an extra 1.3 damage per model every two activations.  So .65 extra damage per combat per model. 

  3 Ogor bois would mean (3*.65)= 1.95 damage per combat.  6 Ogors would be 3.9 damage per combat,  12 would be 7.8 damage per combat.  

This doesn't factor enemy's save characteristic -- which hurts as we have no rend. Also, this will deteriorate based off how many are actually in combat, and gluttons only have 1" range and sit on 1.5" bases.  In order to keep up, ironfists would have to deal equivalent mortal wounds back.  At 3 gluttons, dealing an equivalent 2 mortal wounds in combat would mean they'd have to perform saves against 12 attacks. For breakpoints:

  3 Ogors = 12 saves rolls.  6 would be 24. 12 would be 47. 

I think you can roughly estimate that for every +1 save the enemy has (6+ being 1), 1/6 of saves need to be performed. 
e.g.:


6+ save on enemy = 

     3 ogors = 1.625 damage per combat;  6 ogors = 3.25 ; 12 ogors = 6.5

     3 ogors = 9.75 saves need to be rolled; 6 ogors = 19.5;  12 ogors = 39.

5+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 1.3.   6 ogors = 2.6.   12 ogors = 5.2

    3 ogors = 7.8 saves; 6 ogors = 15.6;  12 ogors = 30.2.

4+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 0.975.   6 ogors = 1.95.   12 ogors = 3.9

    3 ogors = 5.85 saves; 6 ogors = 11.7;  12 ogors = 23.4.

3+ save on enemy =

     3 ogors = 0.65.   6 ogors = 1.3.   12 ogors = 2.6

    3 ogors = 3.9 saves; 6 ogors = 7.8;  12 ogors = 15.6.

Of course, if your unit dies faster, Ironfists need to perform less to keep up.  If their unit dies faster and you have less save rolls to make,  dual-wielding will shoot ahead. (And isn't it better to assume that you get the charge and deal massive damage first?) Seems like Ironfists are best on MSU chaff walls.  

The problems are the mortal wounds. I would choose the dual wield because in this game the attack is the best defence. So if you kill faster you enemy you will receive less mortal wounds. 

The high speed of the Igor army can be useful to kill as fast as you can the opponent. Or maybe I just hope that. 🙂

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23 minutes ago, svnvaldez said:

Mid-tier. I don't think they are trash. I don't think any build in the book can touch Slaanesh, but I think Slaanesh needs an FAQ. When writing lists I would focus on what you may want if you play an army like say DoK, Fryreslayers,  Skaven, FeC, Clans, etc. If you have a list your comfortable vs those tomes with I think you'll be in a good position.


I'd build around a unit of 12 gluttons. Maybe Large units of leadblechers in Underguts.
I'm going to start my lists with 2xFL on Stonehorn and 12x1 gluttons. Aim is for it to be fun and playable. It will get crushed in a poor match up.

God, I hope they gut slaanesh. 

Anyways, I'm really wondering how good Leadbelchers are compared to gluttons. In terms of points, 6 gluttons go for the same price as 6 leadbelchers. 

Let's compare their respective toolkits:

Leadbelchers have 2 attacks to Gluttons' 3.

Leadbelchers have -1 rend, Gluttons have none, which is one of their biggest downsides.

Leadbelchers have a shooting attack - with rend. Gluttons can get exploding sixes or bounce back MWs. Also banners and bellowers.

I love Leadbelchers. In case that wasn't clear, and with their new price and the buffs available to them via Underguts, I'm liking them even more.

 

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Which of these stupid lists do you prefer? They're both similar, but for a single difference:

list 1

underguts

Tyrant 160, Gruesome Trophy Rack, UG wl trait

Firebelly 120, Keg, Billowing Ash

10 Leadbelchers 400

10 Leadbelchers 400

3 Ironblasters 360

4 Ironguts 220

40 Gnoblars 200

Tyrant's Gutguard 120

1980/2000

 

list 2

underguts 

Tyrant 160, Gruesome Trophy Rack, UG wl trait

Firebelly 120, Keg, Billowing Ash

10 Leadbelchers 400

10 Leadbelchers 400

3 Ironblasters 360

4 Ironguts 220

4 Ironguts 220

Tyrant's Gutguard 120

2000/2000

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Maybe I’m crazy....but has anyone thought about running a huge unit of 8 Mournfang? I know it’s a lot more than the same wounds worth of Gluttons, but with the right buffs I think it could be worth it. This would probably hinge on getting the Huskard +1 to wound prayer going tho. Not exceptionally reliable. Thoughts? 

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9 minutes ago, FPC said:

Maybe I’m crazy....but has anyone thought about running a huge unit of 8 Mournfang? I know it’s a lot more than the same wounds worth of Gluttons, but with the right buffs I think it could be worth it. This would probably hinge on getting the Huskard +1 to wound prayer going tho. Not exceptionally reliable. Thoughts? 

I am really interested in running them in the Eurlbad battalion for the juicy exploding 6s additional mortal wounds. A pack of 6 and a pack of 4, with the Butcher to buff them with the +1 attack for more juicy 6s.  

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5 minutes ago, TheWilddog said:

I am really interested in running them in the Eurlbad battalion for the juicy exploding 6s additional mortal wounds. A pack of 6 and a pack of 4, with the Butcher to buff them with the +1 attack for more juicy 6s.  

Yea I was thinking Butcher for +1 attack too. With a 4+ they should be pretty tough to shift. My concern is their offensive output drops off after the charge. A Thundertusk nearby with the trait that makes enemies fight last could be nice.

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