Tempest Eye Discussion

[Raffonerd]

27 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

I have a few questions: 

• What will the Evocators be doing?
• What types of battlemages are you using and what spells do they have?
• How will you protect the battlemages?
• What artifact is which hero using?
• What command trait does the general have?
• Why take company as battleline?

Everything for first first turn charge. You run and charge here.

[zilberfrid]

15 minutes ago, Raffonerd said:

Everything for first first turn charge. You run and charge here.

That... is not an answer to any of the questions.

I ask those for a reason:

• Evocators can only cast their own spell, and that has no targets but themselves
• The Knight Heraldor has very few targets as well, just himself and the evocators
• Ambers may be best, but I'm not sure. Get Aura of Glory on at least one of them. Protect them as well.
• In artifacts, you may want the Zephirite banner?
• Do you want the Aetherguard captain command ability, or Swift as the Wind?
• For battleline, if you are going for maximum charge capacity, try Pistoleers instead of the company. They are battleline for Tempest's Eye.

Get one of the Amber wizards to boost the speed of the Phoenix guard in the first turn, and they'll be allright

I would not buy a command point, boosting one of the battlemages to a Knight Incantor isn't a bad idea if you have no plans to protect them.

[Raffonerd]

Yes, for the stormcast part.

Bmage are hysh and Ghur. Artifact run and charge on fire phoenix for let it walk also. Company for sit and hold objectives.

[FPC]

I've been thinking about how I'd run Dwarves in Tempest Eye and threw together this list below.  I have some thoughts of changes/options but I think this could be fun, if not super competitive.

Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar
- City: Tempest's Eye

Leaders
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Strike of Eagles 
- Mortal Realm: Hysh
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Eagles - Aura of Glory
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
Runelord (90)
- City Role: General's Adjutant
Warden King (110)
- General
- Trait: Hawk-eyed 
- Artefact: Zephyrite Banner 

Battleline
30 x Ironbreakers
20 x Longbeards
- Ancestral Weapons & Shields
- City Role: Honoured Retinue
20 x Irondrakes
20 x Irondrakes
20 x Hammerers

Units
2 x Gyrocopters 

Total: 1950 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
 

So the plan here is to basically run everything turn one, create a nice wall with the Ironbreakers and Longbeards (who are grudging reroll 1s to wound) and the remainder of the army spreads out to be the counter attack.  I can give one unit of Irondrakes run and shoot, or possibly the Gyros if there's a juicy target and they're within 12" of a character.  The Ironbreaker screen stands to have 4 attacks each with the Warden King CA and Aura of Glory.  Depending on opponent, I could also make them -1 rend, but that will probably be better served on a unit of Irondrakes.  

Some things I'm considering:

-Drop 10 Irondrakes and do 1x30 (better for Runelord buff) and also drop the Gyros --> Add 30 Shadow Warriors (awesome for Hawk Eyed general, 3+/3+ on their bows).  This breaks my Dwarf theme but I love the look and rules of SWs.

-Change the artefact.  Not sure what I'd go with, Possibly Patrician's Helm to make sure my screen stays around.

Thoughts?

[Ruvich]

anyone seeing toys from the Kharadron Overlords, like Ironclads/Gunhaulers in a CoS army? As of right now, I am not very sure if I want to use one of those in a possible CoS army of mine..but damn, the ironclad is so beautiful. x.x

[Televiper11]

Playing in a 1K tourney soon and this is my first pass at a list:

Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar
- City: Tempest's Eye
Warden King (110)
- General
- Trait: Hawk-eyed
- Artefact: Seerstone Amulet
Runelord (90)
- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)
10 x Hammerers (140)
- City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models)
20 x Freeguild Handgunners (200)
Steam Tank (200)
Steam Tank (200)
Extra Command Point (50)
Total: 990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 64
 

Edit: If I can get my Freeguild General painted in time, I might drop a Steam Tank to take him and a unit of FG Guard.

Edit 2: Am also considering giving the Runelord Thermalrider Cloak to keep him near units that need his prayer buff.

Edited October 8, 2019 by Televiper11

[stratigo]

3 hours ago, Frowny said:

I have no experience but looking at it, grundstoks are far more mobile giving full strength even moving and likely much more independent with their awesome retreat ability. Irondrakes have noticeably more damage per point if stationary and are easier to buff (160 pt chemist vs 90pt runelord or batteline longbeards.) 

I think bigger picture grundstoks will be better if you are already taking a chemist for something else (big arkonaut company, endriggers) to give a 2nd buff Target but worse if you just want something killy in your main line behind some ironbreakers.

Just as a note, they dropped the khemist back to 140 points

[Ironblaze]

3 hours ago, Ruvich said:

anyone seeing toys from the Kharadron Overlords, like Ironclads/Gunhaulers in a CoS army? As of right now, I am not very sure if I want to use one of those in a possible CoS army of mine..but damn, the ironclad is so beautiful. x.x

I played two games (at 1500 pts) over the weekend as Tempest Eye and included a Frigate and Arkanaut Company in it. They proved rather useful for setting up a nice firebase while the Freeguild Guard, Handgunners, and Steam Tanks were walking up the field to the enemy. If you have enough other units to squeeze in three KO units at a 2k point list, I could see a serious use for an Ironclad, Grundstock Thunderers (ideally all with the standard rifle, of course) and an Aether-khemist to send off to capture/hold an objective on their own.

[Ruvich]

5 minutes ago, Ironblaze said:

I played two games (at 1500 pts) over the weekend as Tempest Eye and included a Frigate and Arkanaut Company in it. They proved rather useful for setting up a nice firebase while the Freeguild Guard, Handgunners, and Steam Tanks were walking up the field to the enemy. If you have enough other units to squeeze in three KO units at a 2k point list, I could see a serious use for an Ironclad, Grundstock Thunderers (ideally all with the standard rifle, of course) and an Aether-khemist to send off to capture/hold an objective on their own.

Thank you so much for the reply! I was thinking About it as well, if I might use the KO's as an Independent tool in a bigger army. More replies like that are appreciated from, people who want to share their experience.

[zilberfrid]

18 hours ago, Raffonerd said:

Yes, for the stormcast part.

Bmage are hysh and Ghur. Artifact run and charge on fire phoenix for let it walk also. Company for sit and hold objectives.

I don't know what you mean. Please put a bit more effort in it so we can help you.

Edited October 9, 2019 by zilberfrid

[mikethefish]

19 hours ago, Ruvich said:

anyone seeing toys from the Kharadron Overlords, like Ironclads/Gunhaulers in a CoS army? As of right now, I am not very sure if I want to use one of those in a possible CoS army of mine..but damn, the ironclad is so beautiful. x.x

I've actually mostly given up on trying to fit KO into Tempest's Eye - mostly because of the 1-4 unit restriction.  I find it very frustrating, at least with ships.

I find I want three KO units in my army - one unit (of some sort), a ship, and a Khemist to buff them.  Unfortunately this requires that I bring 9 other units in the army, which I have found a bit hard to work into my lists.  I suppose I could pad the army MSU-style (with minimum Pistoliers or something), but I just cannot find a list that looks good.

I suppose I could go with only 2 units (a Khemist and either rifle Thunderers, or Riggers, depending on my army concept), but...meh...

So lately, my generated lists have just been doing a Free Guild core, supplemented by whatever other odds and ends I want to include into the list.

[mikethefish]

Question: 

With no native benefits to spellcasting (barring stuff like the Hurricanum, etc), how hard are all of you leaning into spellcasters and Endless Spells?

[dekay]

2 minutes ago, mikethefish said:

I find I want three KO units in my army - one unit (of some sort), a ship, and a Khemist to buff them.  Unfortunately this requires that I bring 9 other units in the army, which I have found a bit hard to work into my lists.  I suppose I could pad the army MSU-style (with minimum Pistoliers or something), but I just cannot find a list that looks good.

Pistoliers, outriders [with added bonus of being battleline and base for the battalion], shadow warriors, scourgerunners, cheap support characters, it's quite easy to get to really high unit count. I found that I have the opposite problem, with very high number of drops. Taking battalion mitigates it somewhat.

Just now, mikethefish said:

With no native benefits to spellcasting (barring stuff like the Hurricanum, etc), how hard are all of you leaning into spellcasters and Endless Spells?

Sorceress gets +2 to cast, it's pretty solid. plus out of our 3 city spells, only aura of glory runs at real risk of being in unbinding range. As for endless spells - better not to build a strategy based solely on them, but +2 casts them kinda reliably...

[Keilerei]

I am not an Order player myself, I am asking for a friend of mine who is a DWARF player since fantasy. He is more like a narrative player, who likes to join us in smallish tournaments so matched rules are important as well. 

The Cities rules especially for Tempest Eye allows to have 1/4 units of Kharadron Overlords taking the factions abilities without counting against the allies limitations. But if you want more KO units into your tempest eye, can you just ally them in, without taking the alliegiance. So are you able to take 1/4th KO with Tempest Eye Rules and in addition 200-400 KO as allies (without benefits of TE)?

e g. :
TE - Warden King (1/4)
TE - Ironbreakers (2/4)
TE - Ironbreakers (3/4)
TE - Arkonaut Company (4/4)
KO - Endrinriggers (allies)

Not a native english speaker, or rule lawyer, so help is very much appreciated.

[dekay]

2 minutes ago, Keilerei said:

TE - Warden King (1/4)
TE - Ironbreakers (2/4)
TE - Ironbreakers (3/4)
TE - Arkonaut Company (4/4)
KO - Endrinriggers (allies)

Sadly, Tempest's Eye can't take Kharadron allies. You're limited to 1/4 units.

[Keilerei]

1 minute ago, dekay said:

Sadly, Tempest's Eye can't take Kharadron allies. You're limited to 1/4 units.

Sad... might've been a way to fit all his old dwarf stuff together with his steampunk lads. But thanks for clarification. I guess he still can ally a few Dispossed into his KO then.

[Televiper11]

Thoughts on taking a huge blog of, say, 30 Freeguild Crossbowmen? Add a Hawk-Eyed Freeguild General who wants them to Hold The Line and things could be nasty. I also have 20 Handgunners that could apply to as well.

[stratigo]

6 minutes ago, Televiper11 said:

Thoughts on taking a huge blog of, say, 30 Freeguild Crossbowmen? Add a Hawk-Eyed Freeguild General who wants them to Hold The Line and things could be nasty. I also have 20 Handgunners that could apply to as well.

You don't need hawk eyed if you are intending to use the Command ability.

[dekay]

1 hour ago, Televiper11 said:

Thoughts on taking a huge blog of, say, 30 Freeguild Crossbowmen? Add a Hawk-Eyed Freeguild General who wants them to Hold The Line and things could be nasty. I also have 20 Handgunners that could apply to as well.

Hawk eyed is better used with other units. on something mobile running around the field. For crossbowmen you'll get better mileage from Hold the Line!, no need to use up trait slot for them.

But in general - multiple shooting blobs holding the line are a scary prospect for anything in range.

[FPC]

Yea I like Irondrakes + Hawk Eyed a lot. 30 is a bit pricey, but you’re looking at 60 shots if they stand still, at 3+/2+/-1/1.  Against a 4+ save with nothing special like rerolls, you will be averaging just about 22 wounds.  Are there things that’ll put out more than that for 400 pts? Sure. But that’s still pretty solid.

[Rahatlin]

14 minutes ago, FPC said:

Yea I like Irondrakes + Hawk Eyed a lot. 30 is a bit pricey, but you’re looking at 60 shots if they stand still, at 3+/2+/-1/1.  Against a 4+ save with nothing special like rerolls, you will be averaging just about 22 wounds.  Are there things that’ll put out more than that for 400 pts? Sure. But that’s still pretty solid.

30 SoTW put out 60 with NP buffing them (CP) and Hawk Eyed they got 2+/2+ profile. No rend but extra 1 MW on each 6 wound roll. Additionally they shoot on beign charged (3") which means 90 shots minimum. Considering they also have 18"range its harder for enemy to charge you in 1 turn.

You can also put single line of chaff in front of them triggering overwatch from behind chaff

[FPC]

Sure that’s my point. Sisters with those buffs are going to average around 20 wounds on a 4+ sv unit, plus probably an additional ~6 mw. I’m not counting the additional 30 from overwatch bc there’s no guarantee they get charged and if so that they’ll all still be alive.  They also have 1 less save. I didn’t factor into my math the free Grudgehammer you’re sure to take, not to mention you could also have -1 further rend from a Runelord. Sisters are 30 more points.  I’d say pretty inconsequential differences. 

[Rahatlin]

1 minute ago, FPC said:

Sure that’s my point. Sisters with those buffs are going to average around 20 wounds on a 4+ sv unit, plus probably an additional ~6 mw. I’m not counting the additional 30 from overwatch bc there’s no guarantee they get charged and if so that they’ll all still be alive.  They also have 1 less save. I didn’t factor into my math the free Grudgehammer you’re sure to take, not to mention you could also have -1 further rend from a Runelord. Sisters are 30 more points.  I’d say pretty inconsequential differences. 

Yea i was sure they have 30units discount aswell but checked book and they dont 😕

Shots come before attacks and if he walk instead of charge means you have 1 more turn of shooting.

But yea - they are 80 pts more for 30 so 😕

 

[FPC]

8 minutes ago, Rahatlin said:

Yea i was sure they have 30units discount aswell but checked book and they dont 😕

Shots come before attacks and if he walk instead of charge means you have 1 more turn of shooting.

But yea - they are 80 pts more for 30 so 😕

 

Nah just 30 more points, 480 to 450. Either way the big takeaway is...either unit is scary!

Edited October 9, 2019 by FPC

[Rivener]

You can also grumble irondrakes to let them reroll wound rolls of 1.