AoS 2 - Ossiarch Bonereapers Discussion

[Pejzub]

58 minutes ago, Obeisance said:

Does Feast of Bones come with parts to build Harbingers with both weapon choices? I assume it's all the same sprues. 

Yes, both weapons. And it is the new color one, updated (I believe there was some error in the old one )

54 minutes ago, Scurvydog said:

I don't think I will ever use a battalion + Katakros, he generates 4 points just by himself and I think points are needed for support wizards and just bodies.

Its 5 for Katakros, 3 for being him, 1 for him being Leige, 1 for him being a Hero, and you actually roll for 6th. You have seen my list with Katakros and battalion, it is 8 guaranteed + 8 rolls. Watching yesterdays game of Tony on the stream where he was generated 9 + rolls I would say it was a little overkill as he never used all of them. However list which generates 4, as someone posted here before, is not enough by far.

Also you can play Morghasts in unites of 4, where the risk of them dying in one turn is pretty impossible in Petriflex. Which I suggest running them in with this battalion, its not an issue that you cant pay for rend with Coffin guy or that you do not get +1 save for him.

[XReN]

1 minute ago, Pejzub said:

Yes, both weapons. And it is the new color one, updated (I believe there was some error in the old one )

Its 5 for Katakros, 3 for being him, 1 for him being Leige, 1 for him being a Hero, and you actually roll for 6th. You have seen my list with Katakros and battalion, it is 8 guaranteed + 8 rolls. Watching yesterdays game of Tony on the stream where he was generated 9 + rolls I would say it was a little overkill as he never used all of them. However list which generates 4, as someone posted here before, is not enough by far.

Also you can play Morghasts in unites of 4, where the risk of them dying in one turn is pretty impossible in Petriflex. Which I suggest running them in with this battalion, its not an issue that you cant pay for rend with Coffin guy or that you do not get +1 save for him.

Any suggestions on how to push RD points generation to 5-6 a turn? I can't find situations where I'd want to bring 2-3 supporting wizards instead of bringing Arkhan the Black

[Pejzub]

 

25 minutes ago, XReN said:

Any suggestions on how to push RD points generation to 5-6 a turn? I can't find situations where I'd want to bring 2-3 supporting wizards instead of bringing Arkhan the Black

Well Arkhan is 1, you definitely want Liege-Kavalos, which is 2, then I suppose one wizard as a support and preferably a battalion.  This puts you at 5 guaranteed. Good with Arkhan is that you have the option to cast the spell for extra D3 RD in case you really need them. Then with 8 units, which seems to be kinda standart, you are to recieve 1 or 2 with the rolls. I would be comfortable with that amount for the round.

[XReN]

24 minutes ago, Pejzub said:

 

Well Arkhan is 1, you definitely want Liege-Kavalos, which is 2, then I suppose one wizard as a support and preferably a battalion.  This puts you at 5 guaranteed. Good with Arkhan is that you have the option to cast the spell for extra D3 RD in case you really need them. Then with 8 units, which seems to be kinda standart, you are to recieve 1 or 2 with the rolls. I would be comfortable with that amount for the round.

I guess such core would be good:

Arkhan - 360
Kavalos - 200

Shield-Corps - 120
Soulmason - 140
3x10 Mortek guard - 390

Nightmare Predator - 40

That's 1250 points, actually a lot of room to add bodies and fighty units

EDIT:

So, based on how I'm going to approach buying OBR I think I'll add 6 stalkers, 5 deathriders, boneshaper and +1 to hit obelisk spell to the roster above

Edited October 31, 2019 by XReN

[Nasnad]

34 minutes ago, XReN said:

Well Arkhan is 1, you definitely want Liege-Kavalos, which is 2, then I suppose one wizard as a support and preferably a battalion.  This puts you at 5 guaranteed. Good with Arkhan is that you have the option to cast the spell for extra D3 RD in case you really need them. Then with 8 units, which seems to be kinda standart, you are to recieve 1 or 2 with the rolls. I would be comfortable with that amount for the round.

Where do you get the 5th from? .. 3 from heroes and 1 from battalion, but I don't think you just get one, as you do with command points? .. 

[XReN]

1 minute ago, Nasnad said:

Where do you get the 5th from? .. 3 from heroes and 1 from battalion, but I don't think you just get one, as you do with command points? .. 

First, you quoted wrong person

Second, @Pejzub mentioned taking at least 1 wizard in addition to kavalos and Arkhan. Which kinda makes sense to do

[Skelebags]

14 minutes ago, Nasnad said:

Where do you get the 5th from? .. 3 from heroes and 1 from battalion, but I don't think you just get one, as you do with command points? .. 

You get 1 for each hero, you also get 1 for each LIEGE(keyword), which is basically just the liege-kavalos, arch-kavalos, and katakros. So the Liege-Kavalos actually generates 2 RD points on his own.

[Nasnad]

18 minutes ago, XReN said:

First, you quoted wrong person

Sorry, this is apparently not so easy on a small phone😓

Edited October 31, 2019 by Nasnad

[Nasnad]

5 minutes ago, Skelebags said:

You get 1 for each hero, you also get 1 for each LIEGE(keyword), which is basically just the liege-kavalos, arch-kavalos, and katakros. So the Liege-Kavalos actually generates 2 RD points on his own.

I had missed that, thanks, an even better reason to to take a liege-kavalos. But kinda avoiding him in my 1000 list, as i wanted more small heroes to generate more RDP.

[Heijoshin]

3 minutes ago, Nasnad said:

I had missed that, thanks, an even better reason to to take a liege-kavalos. But kinda avoiding him in my 1000 list, as i wanted more small heroes to generate more RDP.

I see what you are saying, but as a balance between point costs and RDP generation, wouldn't it be better to take the LK in a 1k game? 

- LK: 200 points and 2RDP (can get a 3rd on a 6+)

or

- Two heroes (lowest is 120 - so 240) for 2 RDP (can get a 3rd and 4th on a 6+ each). 

Just my opinion, but an extra 40 points (at the very least)  for the potential to get one extra RDP each round isn't worth it. And that is just if you take two Soul Reapers as your heroes. 

[XReN]

5 minutes ago, Nasnad said:

I had missed that, thanks, an even better reason to to take a liege-kavalos. But kinda avoiding him in my 1000 list, as i wanted more small heroes to generate more RDP.

I honestly don't think it's viable to play without Kavalos, he is the cheapest of 3 models that can use our only auto-working and the strongest offensive buff in the book - a +1 attack. 

[Nasnad]

5 minutes ago, Heijoshin said:

I see what you are saying, but as a balance between point costs and RDP generation, wouldn't it be better to take the LK in a 1k game? 

- LK: 200 points and 2RDP (can get a 3rd on a 6+)

or

- Two heroes (lowest is 120 - so 240) for 2 RDP (can get a 3rd and 4th on a 6+ each). 

Just my opinion, but an extra 40 points (at the very least)  for the potential to get one extra RDP each round isn't worth it. And that is just if you take two Soul Reapers as your heroes. 

But you do get extra spells and resurrection from an extra caster. But i agree, now knowing that i get 2 from the LK, i might try to fit him in instead.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Nasnad

[PraetorDragoon]

Can't you give the Kavalos the Dark Acolyte trait so he can cast? 

[Heijoshin]

1 minute ago, Nasnad said:

But you do get extra spells and resurrection from an extra caster. But i agree, now knowing that i get 2 from the LK, i might try to fit him in instead.

Indeed, its just you specifically mentioned you wanted more heroes for more RDP, from that perspective it doesn't make as much sense. This is especially true if it's a 1k game. 

[Heijoshin]

1 minute ago, PraetorDragoon said:

Can't you give the Kavalos the Dark Acolyte trait so he can cast? 

Isn't that a trait from Legions of Sacrament though? 

[Nasnad]

2 minutes ago, Heijoshin said:

Isn't that a trait from Legions of Sacrament though? 

There is a similar trait in the book

4 minutes ago, PraetorDragoon said:

Can't you give the Kavalos the Dark Acolyte trait so he can cast? 

Only if you don't use a legion, as you have to take the legion specific trait

[XReN]

8 minutes ago, PraetorDragoon said:

Can't you give the Kavalos the Dark Acolyte trait so he can cast? 

It's debatable whether you should go vanilla instead of Petrifex even at 1k format. Extra rend pretty much equals +1 to hit you can get from artefact, army-wide +1 to save rolls is better than 1 spell any day of the week and on top of that your Kavalos becomes a chunky boi that would be rather hard to kill. And that's all not considering the ability to bring battalion

Edited October 31, 2019 by XReN

[Nasnad]

A quick 1000 point lists:

Petrifix legion

Soul mason - 140

Bone shaper - 130

20 Mortek guards with swords - 260

20 Mortek guards with swords - 260

3 stalkers/1harvester - 200

Might change the soul mason for a soul-reaper, to fit in the screamer endless spell

 

Edit: another quick list:

Petrifix legion

Liege-kavalos - 200

bone-shaper - 130

20x mortek guard with swords

5 deathriders

5 deathriders

an endless spell

 

Edited October 31, 2019 by Nasnad

[Sception]

13 minutes ago, Nasnad said:

A quick 1000 point lists:

Petrifix legion

Soul mason - 140

Bone shaper - 130

20 Mortek guards with swords - 260

20 Mortek guards with swords - 260

3 stalkers/1harvester - 200

Might change the soul mason for a soul-reaper, to fit in the screamer endless spell

 

Looks alright, but I'd take a liege kavalos instead of the stalkers/harvester.  A fantastic attack buff, plus two discipline points a turn to spend on it or other abilities that make the army work, is a big deal, and make at least one liege near mandatory unless you're running an off beat gimmick list.

[Koujow]

3 hours ago, XReN said:

Any suggestions on how to push RD points generation to 5-6 a turn? I can't find situations where I'd want to bring 2-3 supporting wizards instead of bringing Arkhan the Black

Can I play devil's advocate and make a case for taking a couple support wizards instead of Arkhan? Arkhan does beat out all three lords in terms of spell casting ability and even taking up to three for roughly the same points won't equal the field. Also, he is better in combat. But I think Arkhan has few potential flaws: the 2-3 heroes will generate more RD consistantly (Arkhan 1 + 17% chance of 2nd + 1d3 if spell is used compared to three casters getting 3 RD + three 17% chances) In addition, the army is already elite and any extra bodies will always help. A couple extra support characters can help cap objectives. Finally, Arkhan is a target. People will see Arkhan and focus on him. Support characters can get lost in the fray.  And they can be given artifacts, so that is cool. 

Arkhan is pretty BA though. 

[Arcian]

1 hour ago, Sception said:

Looks alright, but I'd take a liege kavalos instead of the stalkers/harvester.  A fantastic attack buff, plus two discipline points a turn to spend on it or other abilities that make the army work, is a big deal, and make at least one liege near mandatory unless you're running an off beat gimmick list.

Basically end up just relying on the boneshaper to regen units then?

[Gwendar]

3 hours ago, XReN said:

I guess such core would be good:

Arkhan - 360
Kavalos - 200

Shield-Corps - 120
Soulmason - 140
3x10 Mortek guard - 390

Nightmare Predator - 40

That's 1250 points, actually a lot of room to add bodies and fighty units

EDIT:

So, based on how I'm going to approach buying OBR I think I'll add 6 stalkers, 5 deathriders, boneshaper and +1 to hit obelisk spell to the roster above

I've been considering something similar, but I really feel you would need at least 1x20\30 of Mortek. I haven't decided if the Crawler has been worth it though... it can be quite a threat to some of the armies I play having that kind of range and killing power on support heroes (even with the normal 3 shots) would be quite beneficial.

At the same time though... having the 6 Stalkers as a hammer and a Deathrider unit for mobility is absolutely needed and you start running out of points quickly. I dunno, perhaps I'm just putting too much value on the Crawler (hopefully so, then I don't have to buy one and worry about how I'm going to transport it + the terrain in the same case...).

[Lightbox]

So using a bit of the explosive recycling list on Warhammer community as inspiration I'm looking at my own Crematorium list

So presenting the lightbox initial draft of Mister Arkhan's Wild Ride:

Arkhan - 360

Liege Kavalos - 200 - General

Bone shaper - 130

 

20x Mortek Guard (Swords) - 260 - BL

20x Mortek Guard (Swords) - 260 - BL

10x Mortek Guard (Swords) - 130 - BL

 

3x Necropolis Stalkers - 200

 

Gothizzar Harvester - 200

Mortek Crawler - 200

 

Emerald lifeswarm - 50

 

Points: 1990/2000

So my ideas were arkhan and the bone shaper provide some nice resurrection though the shaper does have that nasty 6" range limit which could be hard to work around but he should be able to keep up with the guard. Arkhan also obviously provides some nice spellcasting and unbinding. The emerald lifeswarm also adds to the theme of recycling my guard for splosions and just generally war of attritioning my enemies out though it can be a bit double edged due to enemy being able to use it too but I should still be outressurecting them with all my healing put together.

The guard I put in units of 20 partly to save points for other fun things (I don't want a pure guard list) and whilst I could have 1 unit of 30 and 2 units of 10 instead I don't like the idea of putting all my eggs in one unit basket (though I'm open to suggestions of why it might be a better idea.

The Kavalos has his command ability for the nice +1 attack and he's not bad in combat (if a bit expensive) but he does add some useful mobility to the force too.

The stalkers are a bit of a unit I can let run off and do their own thing as they won't need all the resurrection support though only 3 of them could be a bit too few but they are also gorgeous models I want to use.

The Gothizzar gives some more resurrection potential and a smashy monster (though the 3" range could be a pain but he does at least allow for recycling from enemy units too). The crawler is another really cool model and provides the list some ranged support and hopefully the potential to shoot some backline targets if my guard struggle pushing through lines.

I think the list provides some decent numbers whilst also having a few different options of punchy units and even if exploding doesn't do too much having the recycling to give me more staying power could be pretty nice.

 

I'm very much open to (and looking for) C&C on this list and what might work better for crematorium in general. 

[Scurvydog]

My first 1k all purpose list will be like this:

Petrifex elite:

Liege Kavalos - general 

Boneshaper

20 x Mortek Guards

5 x Kavalos Deathriders

3 x Stalkers

Shrieker endless spell

The idea is for the shaper to mainly maintain the shriker and then advance with the army to backup heal as needed. even with -1 to cat with the shrieker up, he might get a spell of once in a while, here I am thinking keeping it simple with the spell giving 1d3 discipline points (people seem to forget this exists when discussing point generation).

Bonus is this will also look pretty cool to play with and against, with a bit of everything and visually interesting.

A variation of this could be to skip the endless spell and get a mason instead for more casts and dispells, and possibly morghasts instead of stalkers for more mobility, or a harvester for more support and a bit less damage than stalkers.

This is made with meeting engagements in mind, so having relatively fast units can be very important, for example if a rearguards shows up at the end of turn 2, it needs to be fast to have an impact, so kavalos and stalkers/morghasts in spearhead and rearguard can be useful.

[Sception]

31 minutes ago, Arcian said:

Basically end up just relying on the boneshaper to regen units then?

At 1000 points, in a mortek guard heavy petrifex list, that should be plenty.  If you were running Crematorians or some other really off kilter list with morr specialized needs things might be different.