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Malakithe

AoS 2 - Orruk Warclans Discussion

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6 hours ago, JoshPP said:

Hello guyz, I used to run Ironjawz in my town,

 

so, we have received "a new battletome" for the updated orruks.

 

so far, I have tried 3 games with my colleagues and feels like it has become a lot weaker than before and can't win a single game.

(against Deepkin, Chaos Dwarf, Stormcast Eternals)

 

My question is do you guyz think Ironjawz, on its own, is competitive in a matched play games?

 

or I should really think about buying some new models to form a Big Waaaagh?

 

---

 

Here is my list.

 

Ironjawz / Ironsunz

Hero

Megaboss (460) - General / Sunzblessed Armour/Right Fist of Dakkbad / Mean'un

Warchanter - Killa beat

Warchanter - Get em beat

Weirdnob Shaman - Shamanic Skullcape / Big Hand of Gork

 

Battlelines

3 Gore Gruntas

3 Gore Gruntas

10 Ardboyz

10 Ardboyz

10 Brutes

 

Battalion

Ironfist

 

Extra Command Points (50)

Total 1960 pts

 

Thanks

The new IJ, BS and Big Waaggh are all competitively viable. They have all already shown up and done well in tournaments. I think if Slaneesh didn't exist they could all win tournaments and the results are already showing they are strong. All the armies  rely on buffs and smart movement/charges. IJ's specifically need to get the most of their allegiance abilties to maximize their usefullness. Maybe try combining the gore grunts into a 6 man unit. That way it's easier to utilize your Warchanters. 6 man, buffed up GorGrunta units are super scary. 

Edited by Warbossironteef

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So having had a look at the faq for our battletome, it seems like if Greenskins will be usable in great whaaag army.

although that might just be for a short period of time.

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5 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

So having had a look at the faq for our battletome, it seems like if Greenskins will be usable in great whaaag army.

although that might just be for a short period of time.

Till at least GBH2020 so next july. Depending on how much of an Impact they have on the army GW might leave them in the game just move them over to "Additional Armies" Destruction.

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I think Big Waagh has amazing potential to be a powerful casting army. Below is my initial list. The idea is  that your Weirdnob and Wurrgog are both getting to +3 or +4 to cast and doing ranged Mortal Wounds while you also reliably buff your army. You can reliably cast Wrath of Gork/Green puke and extend the range with BWV. The Savage Orruks can be buffed to absorb alpha strikes and to gum up the board. The ardboys, while slow, are there to grind things out and to come back. The Idol can be buffed to +2, +5, (another +6 with Waagh Points) and then move 20 with fly, dmg 3 and smash face. I think this list or a variant of it has some legit legs. 

The casting power of this army is no joke and it has the staying power with the bodies and recycling Ardboys. The final piece  buffs your casters but also is your hammer. I'd love to put this on the table because theory crafting it seems to be very interesting. 

LEADERS
Wurrgog Prophet (160) –Boneybitz,  Brutal Beast Spirits/Gorkamorka’s Warcry
Maniak Weirdnob (120) – Breath of Gorkamorka
Orruk Warchanter (110)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (110) – Burtin with Power, Shamanic Skullcape – Wrath of Gork & Hand of Gork 
Wardokk (80) – Kunnin Beast Spirits

UNITS
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
30 x Savage Orruks (300) 
-Stikkas

BEHEMOTHS
Rogue Idol (400)

BATTALIONS
Ardfist (120)

ENDLESS SPELLS 
Balewind Vortex (40)
 

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@Warbossironteef I like your list, only concern would be speed as it really infantry heavy but maybe you're good  with just breath

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Hi Guys. 

One simple question, in a Big Waaagh! army, how the Waaagh points work? 

When for example I have 12 points, do I need to spend them going to 0 to use the abilities or is automatical and the points last? 

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32 minutes ago, DestructionFranz said:

Hi Guys. 

One simple question, in a Big Waaagh! army, how the Waaagh points work? 

When for example I have 12 points, do I need to spend them going to 0 to use the abilities or is automatical and the points 

You gain each passive bonus for free and have them for as long as you have that many points or more. There are two abilities you can reach as well, the one that let's a wizard lose D3/D6 Waaagh points for +1/2 to cast and the Waaaagh ability itself at 24 points.  That one you roll a dice and on a 1 you lose all your Waaagh points, 2-5 half, 6 none.

Edited by ShaneHobbes

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1 hour ago, ShaneHobbes said:

You gain each passive bonus for free and have them for as long as you have that many points or more. There are two abilities you can reach as well, the one that let's a wizard lose D3/D6 Waaagh points for +1/2 to cast and the Waaaagh ability itself at 24 points.  That one you roll a dice and on a 1 you lose all your Waaagh points, 2-5 half, 6 none.

The +1 or +2 to cast is just for that turn or for the whole game? 

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6 hours ago, DestructionFranz said:

The +1 or +2 to cast is just for that turn or for the whole game? 

For one spell cast. If you can cast multiple spells and want the bonus casting for every spell youll have to use the ability for each spell cast. 

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I'm surprised more of the tourney list's I've seen don't include the Orruk warboss for Big Waagh.  Having access to a Waagh from turn 1 and being able to double Waagh later on seems super strong, and having a reroll 1's to wound bubble is never a bad thing either for a fairly cheap price.  Is the concern that he's going to get faq'd out once faq comes?  Because he's addable in the app, so doesn't seem like it was an oversight.

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I'm honestly more surprised we're not seeing more Great Waaagh lists in general.  I feel like all the competitive Orruk discussion got instantly consolidated when Leo (very deservedly, btw) won his event with Iron Jawz, with people quickly forgetting that a week prior a very inexperienced AoS player was only one misplay away from routing Slaneesh as well with The Great Waaagh.  I can't wait to see what some casting-heavy, endless-spell rocking Orruks do to the meta.  😉

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2 hours ago, tripchimeras said:

I'm surprised more of the tourney list's I've seen don't include the Orruk warboss for Big Waagh.  Having access to a Waagh from turn 1 and being able to double Waagh later on seems super strong, and having a reroll 1's to wound bubble is never a bad thing either for a fairly cheap price.  Is the concern that he's going to get faq'd out once faq comes?  Because he's addable in the app, so doesn't seem like it was an oversight.

Well, if we keep him, our battletome is really scary. Keeping the waaagh bomb with all the other buff we got... 

I don't want to be the new slaanesh.

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38 minutes ago, Neomaxim said:

I'm honestly more surprised we're not seeing more Great Waaagh lists in general.  I feel like all the competitive Orruk discussion got instantly consolidated when Leo (very deservedly, btw) won his event with Iron Jawz, with people quickly forgetting that a week prior a very inexperienced AoS player was only one misplay away from routing Slaneesh as well with The Great Waaagh.  I can't wait to see what some casting-heavy, endless-spell rocking Orruks do to the meta.  😉

Yeah that's a good point too.  I'm a little surprised how little I have seen the combined faction as well in the tourney standings since the book release.  I don't think I am going to use any bonesplitter units at all and I'm still considering going that way instead of Ironjawz.  Some of those allegiance abilities are great, but those forced Command traits and artifacts for the factions are almost all bad.  Obviously Ironsunz is strong regardless, but there are so many opportunities in the ironjawz Command traits and artifacts list that I don't want to lose out on, especially since its pretty easy to get a couple mighty destroyer's per turn in Big Waagh!  Feel like if you want to go magic heavy or use a Maw Crusha it's the clear way to go, not to mention the double waagh potential the orruk warboss presents.  The CA/artifact loss on general is definitely less of a deal on a normal megaboss, but still Big Waagh seems just as valid to me as Ironjawz proper.

Edited by tripchimeras

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2 hours ago, Neomaxim said:

I'm honestly more surprised we're not seeing more Great Waaagh lists in general.  I feel like all the competitive Orruk discussion got instantly consolidated when Leo (very deservedly, btw) won his event with Iron Jawz, with people quickly forgetting that a week prior a very inexperienced AoS player was only one misplay away from routing Slaneesh as well with The Great Waaagh.  I can't wait to see what some casting-heavy, endless-spell rocking Orruks do to the meta.

I think it was simplier to leverage new Ironjawz ability in the short term. Big waagh army are more contrôle army, and there is much more option.  I think they will grow in popularity, and end up having more success than pure ironjawz in the long term.

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On 11/6/2019 at 7:09 PM, Backbreaker said:

Well, if we keep him, our battletome is really scary. Keeping the waaagh bomb with all the other buff we got... 

I don't want to be the new slaanesh.

The boss was changed in the Errata so it's once per turn and not spammable (so no bomb). Still surprising we don't see him in competitive lists. 

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I tested a Big Waaagh vs. IJ list this Sunday, using this:

Quote

Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
Mortal Realm: Hysh
Orruk Megaboss (150)
- General
- Trait: Brutish Cunning
- Artefact: Metalrippa's Klaw
Orruk Warboss (140)
- Great Waaagh Banner
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Artefact: Aetherquartz Brooch
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Killa Beat
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Pig-iron Choppas
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- 2x Gore Choppas
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
Ironfist (160)
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 1920 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 146

 

Some parts of the list are just thrown in there (e,g, the 5x brutes) since I let him use some of my models, but the list still functioned like I intended. I have a couple of initial impressions:

1. The bannerboss is useful, imo. It's hard to calculate his effectiveness since he's a force multiplier, but once you have 20 Waaagh pts and +1 to wound, it gets a little ridiculous. With a WC buff and the bannerboss's Waaagh, a 7-ardboy unit was able to pile into his ardboyz and easily wipe a full squad of 10. 

2. Ardboyz are great, especially in a Big Waaagh. Ardboyz scale well with all of the buffs available to them, have the highest bravery in the army, +3 to charge, and additional 6++ saves, making them the tankiest, too.

3. A 6-man unit of GGs might be a little overkill. I did the big unit here since it's what I used in my IJ games, but I'm not convinced that they wouldn't be better off as two 3-man units. Again, with the +1 to hit, +1 to wound, and +1 damage, even a 3-man unit of GGs starts to do some really good damage. The 6-man unit does offer more protection for the IF boss, though.

4. Brutish Cunning and Ironfist were invaluable for me. It's hard for me to imagine taking CAs on the footboss that aren't Brutish Cunning. MD is good, and we all know that.

5. I missed the weirdnob. I tried playing without it, but it would have been incredibly useful to throw 10 2/2/-1/2 ardboyz with Hand of Gork. If your opponent doesn't block all of your teleports, nowhere is safe.

 

If I were to make changes to my list, it might look something more like this:

Quote

Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
Mortal Realm: Hysh
Orruk Megaboss (150)
- General
- Trait: Brutish Cunning
- Artefact: Metalrippa's Klaw
Orruk Warboss (140)
- Great Waaagh Banner
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (110)
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Artefact: Aetherquartz Brooch
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Killa Beat
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (160)
- Pig-iron Choppas
15 x Orruk Ardboys (270)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 2x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
15 x Orruk Ardboys (270)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 2x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
Ironfist (160)
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 152

Yeah, I think ardboyz are just that good. Move the two 15-man units up the board, hold objectives with the 10-man units, and Hand of Gork the 10-man units as needed. Keep everything else safely behind the ardboy blobs.

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Ardboyz def seem to be the mainstay unit across most non bonesplitter builds (as they should be), and free mighty destroyer casts just seem so strong.  I

One thing I wonder about is if it makes sense to take Maw Crusha in an ironjawz list at all.  Is the Maw Crusha worth its points with the Ironsunz requirements for example?  Certainly -1 rend isn't nothing, but when comparing to +3 rend on your attacks, +3 damage, 4+ mortal ward, or ethereal gauntlet it doesn't seem very good.   Alternatively Even if I am taking only Ironjawz models I think Big Waagh! is probably a stronger ability set then generic Ironjawz without a tribe which would be the only way to take Maw Crusha with its full ability compliment in Ironjawz... 

I am all in on taking a Maw Crusha in my Orruk army, and I don't foresee myself at least initially delving into the Bonesplitterz range.  So does Big Waagh! just automatically make the most sense, or is it still worth while with the lesser artifacts of one of the clans?  My feeling is I'm sure its not bad in any circumstance, but just thinking  fully optimizing your list competitively it feels like a generic Megaboss is probably stronger in a mono ironjawz list, and the Maw Crusha is at its best in Big Waagh maybe?  I could be putting too much significance on the command traits and artifacts, but if I am plopping a quarter of my points on a single model, it feels like you want to make it either the killiest killer possible or the tankiest tank, and Ironjawz seems to disincentivize that with the tribes.

Edited by tripchimeras

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I've a medium local event in 2 weeks, and i'm looking to bring a list like this: 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
Mortal Realm: Shyish
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- General
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
- Trait: Brutish Cunning
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Killa Beat
Wurrgog Prophet (160)
- Artefact: Mork's Boney Bitz
- Lore of the Savage Beast: Gorkamorka's War Cry
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Pig-iron Choppas
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
10 x Savage Orruk Morboys (120)
Ironfist (160)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 144
 

At first I was looking to play ironjawz, but with the rise off the bonereaper and potentially cities, I really wanted to use the Wurgog (and have access to some casting bonus). 

Smash and bash is ok, but i'm not sure it have that big of an impact exept in some situation (like agains slaneesh, but Gorkamorka warcry can do a similar job). However brutish cunning and Ironfist make sure i've 2 reliable source of Mighty destroyer. 

The goal is really to take it slow in turn 1, then start commiting units in turn 2 with 6++ and (hopefully) +1/+1 in effect. It's a first draft, my units choice may change as i've lot's of choice from IJ and BS.

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25 minutes ago, broche said:

I've a medium local event in 2 weeks, and i'm looking to bring a list like this: 

  Hide contents

Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
Mortal Realm: Shyish
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- General
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
- Trait: Brutish Cunning
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Killa Beat
Wurrgog Prophet (160)
- Artefact: Mork's Boney Bitz
- Lore of the Savage Beast: Gorkamorka's War Cry
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Pig-iron Choppas
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
10 x Savage Orruk Morboys (120)
Ironfist (160)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 144
 

At first I was looking to play ironjawz, but with the rise off the bonereaper and potentially cities, I really wanted to use the Wurgog (and have access to some casting bonus). 

Smash and bash is ok, but i'm not sure it have that big of an impact exept in some situation (like agains slaneesh, but Gorkamorka warcry can do a similar job). However brutish cunning and Ironfist make sure i've 2 reliable source of Mighty destroyer. 

The goal is really to take it slow in turn 1, then start commiting units in turn 2 with 6++ and (hopefully) +1/+1 in effect. It's a first draft, my units choice may change as i've lot's of choice from IJ and BS.

I like your list apart from that I'd use Weird un instead of fast un. 

Than I don't understand so much the 10 Savage Orruks. I would change them with some Ardboyz. 

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I've a tournament this weekend as well.

 Suggestions are welcome. 

This is my list:

Maw Krusha ( Ironclad, Ignax Scale, Weird Un) 460

Warchanter 110

Warchanter 110

Weirdnob Shaman  110

Fungoid Cave Shaman 90

6 Goregruntas 320

5 Brutes 140

10 Ardboyz

10 Ardboyz

Ironfist 160

Mork's Mighty Mushroom 90

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, DestructionFranz said:

I like your list apart from that I'd use Weird un instead of fast un. 

Than I don't understand so much the 10 Savage Orruks. I would change them with some Ardboyz. 

Weird'un would be totally justifiable as well, really depend on your play style/meta. Personnally I really like the fact that fast'un allow a first turn jump over a screen.

The morboys are only 12 pts per model, and have a decent attack profile. Ardboys come at 18 pts per model. I plan to use them as either a cheap screen or objective holder. 

I'm also considering swapping a WC for a Weirnob + hand of gork , but that would hurt my Waaagh point building ,so dunno

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Big Waaagh review is live on the Blog:

https://plasticcraic.blog/2019/11/11/battletome-orruk-warclans-big-waaagh-review/

It's the main army I've been playing since the book dropped, I just can't put it down because it's so much fun.  Love it.

(Link updated to take you straight there, thanks for pointing that out!)

Edited by PlasticCraic
Link updated to take you straight to the relevant article
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