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AoS 2 - Orruk Warclans Discussion


Malakithe

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10 hours ago, Arkahn said:

Emerald swarm is only good with CoS imo, just D3 is not worth the price... 

@NikitaCrab132 if you want to run a rogue idol, brutish command trait on a megaboss is better than Ironfist because if you TP your 6 GGs in mighty destroyer, you will not be able to make a double move with your rogue idol anymore...

And breath of Gorkamorka is by far the best spell with a rogue idol, moving 20" twice + fly is just too good ! 

So, in this case I have to remove ironfist and take foot megaboss? 

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On 5/9/2020 at 8:07 AM, NikitaCrab132 said:

So, in this case I have to remove ironfist and take foot megaboss? 

It's the better idea imo or... you can keep your ironfist and to not rely on the weirdnob's HoG by squeezing it and keeping your GGs near your ardboyz as a counter attack

Edited by Arkahn
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18 hours ago, NikitaCrab132 said:

Hello, boyz! Is it worth to buy box of Savage boar boyz for big Waaaagh army? I little bit stacked and don't know how to expand my army

Definitely, they're really good value (both $$$ and points).

A 30-block of Savage Orruks with a Wardokk to double stack saves on them is really useful.  Great at fighting anything without an elite armour save, loads of bodies for pumping up the Waaagh, loads of wounds to get through.

30 Arrow Boys too, they have similar advantages.  Worse armour saves and lower overall output, but handy for chipping off a support hero or shooting off anything that fights when it dies.

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1 hour ago, PlasticCraic said:

Definitely, they're really good value (both $$$ and points).

A 30-block of Savage Orruks with a Wardokk to double stack saves on them is really useful.  Great at fighting anything without an elite armour save, loads of bodies for pumping up the Waaagh, loads of wounds to get through.

30 Arrow Boys too, they have similar advantages.  Worse armour saves and lower overall output, but handy for chipping off a support hero or shooting off anything that fights when it dies.

he is asking for boar ones, i would say that unless you like the model boar ones are not really that useful

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On 5/7/2020 at 11:21 PM, PlasticCraic said:

Well that's quite the rabbit hole right there!

Luckily @Nico has got your back:

https://aosshorts.com/nicolab-the-activation-wars-part-2/

In general, it comes down to which ability triggered most recently.  Spells like Warcry are fairly low down the pecking order in Activation Wars, because other things trigger in the charge or combat phase, which means they are more recent and therefore take precedence. 

But it's still useful against the many, many unit that have no real foothold in Activation Wars.

Cheers!

The original article can be found on AoS Shorts or in the NicoLab:

https://aosshorts.com/nicolab-sequencing-warhammer-age-of-sigmar/

The second chapter in the activation wars is here:

https://aosshorts.com/nicolab-the-activation-wars-part-2/

I knee-stabbed many Stonehorns to kick off*the Activation Wars back in October 2016 here:
 

*I didn’t know what I had started, but I’d do it again 😉.

Edited by Nico
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@NikitaCrab132 @PlasticCraic @Bululu

I've seen a fair number of lists that have a single minimum size squad of boar boys to satisfy battle-line requirements after they've got their big blobs sorted. I haven't really tested it because my boar boys are as-yet unbuilt, but I would think that with a difference of only 10 points at minimum size boar boys can do a lot more work for you than a too-small chaff squad of savage orruks. 

Maybe I'm wrong though. They do look nice, however.

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21 minutes ago, NauticalSoup said:

@NikitaCrab132 @PlasticCraic @Bululu

I've seen a fair number of lists that have a single minimum size squad of boar boys to satisfy battle-line requirements after they've got their big blobs sorted. I haven't really tested it because my boar boys are as-yet unbuilt, but I would think that with a difference of only 10 points at minimum size boar boys can do a lot more work for you than a too-small chaff squad of savage orruks. 

Maybe I'm wrong though. They do look nice, however.

I think their issue is that they find themselves in competition with Gore Gruntas, which are only a few points more, and amazing. 

They are definitely usable if you like them, but I think that's why they're squeezed out of my own lists currently. 

Minimum pigs are a decent mobile screen / speed bump, just about cheap enough to be throwaway.  One niche they do have is tying up shooting units / artillery.  Give them Breath of Gorkamorka, tag their unit in combat and let them soak up the Dakka.  Especially useful for things like OBR catapults and Helblasters, which then can't shoot at all.

You can also stack saves on the Boarboys and turn them into a bit of a tarpit, in the same way you would with Savage Orruks.  Maybe you could have a wave 1 - wave 2 strategy where you ramp up the saves on some pigs and fling them away into the enemy, while the Orruks run onto Objectives.  Then next turn you put the saves on the Orruks.

I'd love to have a cheap unit or two in my army, it just gets squeezed out when push comes to shove.  They are useful, and if you like them you will be able to compete with them.  I just struggle to fit them into lists currently because Gore Gruntas.

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Yeah, that and also the fact that Big Waaagh is tight for points because you're squeezing in two sets of buffing Heroes.  Your Warchanter and your Weirdnob Shammy (plus maybe a Megaboss for BC) plus a couple of Bonespliterz wizards....I think you often end up with one more small Hero overall, which means no space for one throwaway chaff unit.  

Like I said though, they're not unusable.  You'll be able to make them work if you like them.  Quite good fun to paint and affordable too, plus they could be a bridge into running a Bonesplitterz army.  I did a whole article on the Bonesplitterz side of the book, which you might be interested in if you're tempted by them:

https://plasticcraic.blog/2019/10/26/battletome-orruk-warclans-bonesplitterz-review/

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Seen a lot of Waagh lists running 30 arrowboyz (in lists with mostly IJ units). How are these used? They seem pretty pathetic without buffs and proper synergy (30 boyz forces 15 saves with 0 rend, hardly impressive or cost effective shoo- i mean dakka), so I cant imagine their taken purely as shooting support.

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1 hour ago, umpac said:

Seen a lot of Waagh lists running 30 arrowboyz (in lists with mostly IJ units). How are these used? They seem pretty pathetic without buffs and proper synergy (30 boyz forces 15 saves with 0 rend, hardly impressive or cost effective shoo- i mean dakka), so I cant imagine their taken purely as shooting support.

Bodies, Bodies and wounds.

  • The amount of space you can cover with 30 models on 32mm is massive,
  • You have an extra 30 Orruks for the CA which is +3 waaagh points on the first turn. 
  • A lot of damage being done at the moment is either high rend or mortals, against that 60 wounds is better than 40 with a 4+.
  • You can sling 30 of them onto an objective for raw numbers you wouldn't otherwise have.
  • Often you can sit them on one objective and shoot onto others without moving off.

For 360 points they offer a lot of utility. My current list has generates 4waaagh points from warchanters, 4 from my 40 ardboys (15+15+5+5) + 3 from the 30 Arrowboys = 11+d6 for my general. It means I can Guarantee that I will hit 12 Waaagh Points on my turn 1.

 

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1 hour ago, Malakree said:

My current list has generates 4waaagh points from warchanters, 4 from my 40 ardboys (15+15+5+5) + 3 from the 30 Arrowboys = 11+d6 for my general. It means I can Guarantee that I will hit 12 Waaagh Points on my turn 1

Do you find it relatively easy to fit all of it within 18" of your General without compromising too much your set-up?  Haven't played with Big Waaagh yet and have been wondering whether trying to clump up leaves you exposed in other areas.

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Using a Mawkrusha, easily. I also have 4 heroes so I can have 4 models just outside.

For reference.

  • A Mawkrusha base is a fraction less than 6" (~5.905). Call it 6"
  • 18" from the base.
  • This gives us a bubble of 3"+18" radius = 21".
  • The total Diameter of the bubble is 42".
  • So we have a donut 42" wide with a 6" hole in order to fit all our units in.
  • The donut is ~6.1" short of of 2/3rds of the board.

On a traditional deployment you lose ~15" either end if you deploy the MK dead centre.  No such board has an objective less than 12" from the edge of the board, with an capture area of 6". So with correct placement you can drop the MK off centre, to get one unit onto one of the objectives. The second unit has 4 models out of the area on the otherside ~8" outside of that bubble thus ensuring you can run onto the objective turn 1.

For almost other deployments you are forced to cramp into that bubble by the deployment rules.

The only exception is Duality of death where the strategy is normally to take prio, tag one objective turn 1 and bum rush the other with your entire army. In that case I'd stack up, take first, burn d6 into hand of gork to try and teleport a unit of 5 onto the objective and flood the other objective anyway.

@Aelfric @Lanoss

Edited by Malakree
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9 hours ago, Malakree said:

Using a Mawkrusha, easily. I also have 4 heroes so I can have 4 models just outside.

For reference.

  • A Mawkrusha base is a fraction less than 6" (~5.905). Call it 6"
  • 18" from the base.
  • This gives us a bubble of 3"+18" radius = 21".
  • The total Diameter of the bubble is 42".
  • So we have a donut 42" wide with a 6" hole in order to fit all our units in.
  • The donut is ~6.1" short of of 2/3rds of the board.

On a traditional deployment you lose ~15" either end if you deploy the MK dead centre.  No such board has an objective less than 12" from the edge of the board, with an capture area of 6". So with correct placement you can drop the MK off centre, to get one unit onto one of the objectives. The second unit has 4 models out of the area on the otherside ~8" outside of that bubble thus ensuring you can run onto the objective turn 1.

For almost other deployments you are forced to cramp into that bubble by the deployment rules.

The only exception is Duality of death where the strategy is normally to take prio, tag one objective turn 1 and bum rush the other with your entire army. In that case I'd stack up, take first, burn d6 into hand of gork to try and teleport a unit of 5 onto the objective and flood the other objective anyway.

@Aelfric @Lanoss

Thanks for the feedback.  I haven't got a Mawcrusha yet (been saving it for last), but is next on the list after I've painted the 10 Brutes that arrived ths morning.  1000 - 1500 pts is the norm in my local store, but hoping to get some 2000 pt games in when things are more open.  

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6 hours ago, Aelfric said:

Thanks for the feedback.  I haven't got a Mawcrusha yet (been saving it for last), but is next on the list after I've painted the 10 Brutes that arrived ths morning.  1000 - 1500 pts is the norm in my local store, but hoping to get some 2000 pt games in when things are more open.  

Interesting. In my experience small points games are pretty unpopular in Sigmar thanks to the way close combat is structured. At 1k you can't bake in sufficient screening so the guy who gets off the first good charge will probably just win.

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1 hour ago, NauticalSoup said:

Interesting. In my experience small points games are pretty unpopular in Sigmar thanks to the way close combat is structured. At 1k you can't bake in sufficient screening so the guy who gets off the first good charge will probably just win.

I'd like to get bigger games in (I have the models), but there are not so many AOS players in my area compared to 40k so I get what I can.  My sister's partner is building up a couple of armies, so once travel is back on I'm hoping for more 2000 pt games.  Having a Mawcrusha for smaller games didn't make much sense, which led to building other units first.  It's taken a while as I've had to start Ironjaws from scratch and leave all my Greenskins for another day - They're all old metal and far too small to be Ardboyz and too armoured to be Bonesplittaz.  (Also, Cities and Troggoths have taken up time).  

Maybe in time people will build up larger armies - esp given the current circumstances.

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Reflections on Seraphon

So on Saturday I played in the Tabletop Simulator 1-Day event using Big Waaagh and came away with 2 Majors Wins (Vs Cabbage Big Waaagh & Legion of Chaos Ascendant) & a Minor Win (Vs Slann & Kroak Sotek). List below if interested:

Spoiler
Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (110)
- General
- Command Trait: Bursting with Power
- Artefact: Shamanic Skullcape
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork
- Lore of the Weird: Wrath of Gork
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Artefact: Mirrored Cuirass
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Wardokk (80)
- Artefact: Luminary Rod
- Lore of the Savage Beast: Gorkamorka's War Cry
15 x Orruk Ardboys (270)
- 3x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
15 x Orruk Ardboys (270)
- 3x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
15 x Orruk Ardboys (270)
- 3x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Jagged Gore-hackas
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)
- 1x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
Ardfist (120)
Ironfist (160)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 163

All the games were absolute belters , but I'd like to focus in on the Seraphon game simply because it was against an army that from my own personal experience we lose far more often than we win due to the Slanns domination of the magic phase and endless skink screens stopping us from getting to grips without getting shot off. It was also the culmination of learning from the many beatings I'd taken from them.

Allow me to explain:

In the run up to this event I'd played the new Seraphon around 10 times and been hammered in all but 2 of them - either being shot off the board from behind skink screens of smashed to bits by Saurus shield walls. Rather than rage at Seraphon, I wanted to try and think of some creative strategies for handling the lizardmen and there were some key lessons & important reminders during these games that I took away and wanted to share in case anyone else found it useful.

Caveat: These by no means put us on an even playing field, but at least may give some alternative approaches.

Kill those priests early!

Don't both trying to kill the Slanns who sit at the back behind their screens and saurus buddies - it's the skink characters you want to go for if you have any type of ranged threat as their buffs are so good at making units better.

Example: In this particular event I ran a Weird Nob general with Bursting With Power allowing him to take the obvious Hand of Gork but also Wrath of Gork (normally used to discourage teleporting heroes and small units). The Weird Nob was deployed front and centre and rather than run a block of Ardboys or Pigs up the field with Mighty Destroyers, you can do this on the Shaman (he's also allowed to run!) to bring him in range of Skink Characters who generally are deployed further forward to extend Slann casting and buff Salamanders/40 model blocks. With Shamanic Skullcap and +2 to cast by giving up D6 waaagh points (and with the Slanns only on their natural +1 to unbind at this stage) I was able to do 8 mortal wounds to the priest meaning the skinks/salamanders were no longer doing the mortals on 6s. When the movement phase came around the Weird Nob just ran back to the relative safety of his own lines :)

A Different Use for Waaagh! Points

Against magic heavy skink /salamander builds we don't need to be hitting/wounding on 2s so trying to maintain 20 Waaaagh points isn't a priority here. Instead, try blowing your Waaagh points on Casts + Unbinds. This will at least mean you stand a decent chance of getting a teleport off or unbinding a Comets Call to keep your Warchanters/Weird Nob alive a little longer. A cheap way to get a wizard with a potential extra +1 unbind is with a Wardokk doing a Weirddokk dance.

Zog'Em! (Otherwise known as Mad As Hell)

I'll be the first to put my hand up and admit that I often forget about the Zog'Em rule. But with damage coming at you in both the magic and shooting phase, this could give your army some serious extra movement each turn. This is huge against seraphon who are themselves rapid. 

In the list I took at the weekend I gave the weirdnob Bursting with Power which gives him both a second spell and an additional cast. The main use for this additional cast is to use Green Puke before teleporting (normally you can use Green Puke with Brutal power but this will come at the end of the phase, after you have teleported). Now you can puke away into your own unit, teleport them and give them an extra D6" move. This can be huge for that important charge you want to make.

Oops, did I shoot my own unit? Possibly my new favourite item is the Luminary Rod. For those unaware of what it does here is the wording:

Once per battle, pick a point within 9" of the bearer that is visible to them and draw an imaginary straight line 1mm wide between that point and the closet part of the bearer. Each unit other than the bearer that has models passed across by this line suffers D3 mortal wounds.

Now the key thing here is that it does not specific when the item is used...so you can technically use it in any phase of either player's turn. For me, there are two key roles here which I'll share below:

1) This item can effectively act as another Green Puke which can be used in another phase to fire through your own unit and move forward. Using a unit of Ardboys as an example:  (Mighty Destroyers + average of 2D6" From Green Puke then later Luminary Rod + Move  + Average Charge Roll)  4"+7"+4"+10" = an average threat range of 25" without a teleport in sight! Also, if you roll poorly for the Green Puke roll in the hero phase you don't then need to blow the luminary rod later in the turn.

2) By far my favourite use of this item though is against teleporting units, and against Seraphon in particular - Salamanders. Most teleport rules say you need to land more than 9" away from the enemy which is great for us as this is exactly what we need in order for Zog'Em to kick in. So, picture this. The Salamanders (or other nasty unit) lands...you immediatly shoot the luminary rod through your own unit and can move them D6" in any direction. You now have a 66.7% chance of rolling a 3+ which is what you need to not only get out of shooting range of the salamanders but also any potential charge as they need to be within 12" to do this too! If you get the following turn you can then show them how hard Orruks hit when not getting shot up! 😈

Anyway - this may have come as no news to anyone but hopefully someone might find it useful.

Keep on Waaaghing!

Edited by VonSmall
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@VonSmall very good report and nice trick with the Rod ! 

I totaly agree with you about the way to use our waaagh points, one of their few weaknesses are how they are fragile, so a big unit buffed is able to down any of them in 1 or 2 phases, even in 3+/3+. 

About your list, after this tournament will you change anything ?

Edited by Arkahn
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@VonSmall awesome article mate.  I've long been a fan of the Rod for the same reasons you outline, but running your Weirdnob up into spell range with Mighty D is a new one!  Well it is for me anyway, that's fantastic.  Love your thinking.

Very interesting perspective on the Waaagh points too, it's easy to get tunnel vision and lock ourselves into +1 to Hit, +1 to Wound.  But I think you are absolutely correct that we shouldn't be afraid to spend it on clutch casts and unbinds in this matchup.  We won't struggle to splatter Skinks.

Any tweaks you'd make for next time?

Keep it up, you are doing Mork's work!

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