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Gorgeous!!!

holding out for Squats :)

Edited by Dez

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I am immediately transported back to my childhood.  I used to run LoC and those monopose beastmen.  I scrimped and saved for ages to afford that tiny $50 LoC back then and it was the most incredible thing I had ever seen.

Now I get to run beastmen again and a LoC that makes me giddy all over again...for more than $50, but oh so worth it!

I love this hobby so much I often ponder what I would do in an alternate reality where it doesn't exist.

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1 minute ago, daedalus81 said:

I am immediately transported back to my childhood.  I used to run LoC and those monopose beastmen.  I scrimped and saved for ages to afford that tiny $50 LoC back then and it was the most incredible thing I had ever seen.

Now I get to run beastmen again and a LoC that makes me giddy all over again...for more than $50, but oh so worth it!

I love this hobby so much I often ponder what I would do in an alternate reality where it doesn't exist.

Same here.

Spoiler

I'd be rich

 

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I'd be poor between guitars, amps Magic and beer!

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Awesome to see another greater daemon. Still wish death would get some love.... or even give me another destruction battletome ;). But honestly im getting the DoT book just for the lore etc.

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Atia:

Quote

I've seen Kairos and I can tell you one thing guys and girls - HE IS SO AWESOME!

Also, that's not the last daemon you will see with this release ..

 

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It is an absolutely amazing and beautiful model. I'm very tempted by DoT, but I think I will hold out until the Duardin come out. I kind of fancy an army that really looks like an army if you know what I mean - uniforms, armour, grim stoic faces etc.

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9 minutes ago, Malin said:

So we wait for blue and brimstone horrors

I am so curious how this will turn out. Depending on the wording and costing of the splitting rule, if the cost of blues and brimstones is included in the cost of pink horrors, one could need 20 blue horrors and 20 brimstone horror bases to field 10 pink horrors, which is a lot of models (as well as money and painting) for a single small battleline unit.

On the other hand, if brimstone and blue horror units are costed, the splitting becomes hardly worth the trouble in matched play.

One thing I could imagine would be wounds taken by pink horrors being automatically transferable to nearby blue horror units (and wounds taken by blues to brimstones). I that case, players would only need a small amount of blues and brimstones for every pink unit, as very few of these would be on the table at any point.

Another possible system would be for splitting to only replenishing nearby units of blues and brimstones, which you buy and field like any old unit. Though that would make for some strange tactical interactions (if you kill of the different horror units one after another, you could prevent any splitting).

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31 minutes ago, Rogue Explorator said:

I am so curious how this will turn out. Depending on the wording and costing of the splitting rule, if the cost of blues and brimstones is included in the cost of pink horrors, one could need 20 blue horrors and 20 brimstone horror bases to field 10 pink horrors, which is a lot of models (as well as money and painting) for a single small battleline unit.

On the other hand, if brimstone and blue horror units are costed, the splitting becomes hardly worth the trouble in matched play.

One thing I could imagine would be wounds taken by pink horrors being automatically transferable to nearby blue horror units (and wounds taken by blues to brimstones). I that case, players would only need a small amount of blues and brimstones for every pink unit, as very few of these would be on the table at any point.

Another possible system would be for splitting to only replenishing nearby units of blues and brimstones, which you buy and field like any old unit. Though that would make for some strange tactical interactions (if you kill of the different horror units one after another, you could prevent any splitting).

I don't play a summoning army (yet) but are people really still so beat up about having to pony up points for generating new models and units? Like I see this all the time '<source of free models> is useless because I have to pay for it now>' and I don't get it. There are always upsides to this kind of thing, if there was no benefit at all it wouldn't see any use or wouldn't have a cost.

Just off the top of my head, a unit that splits from Pink > Blue > Brimstone (costed) is like having 3 units on an objective with the footprint of one. Pretty durable. Opponents need to hit them with just the right amount of damage too as anything over the wounds of the pink horrors say doesn't spill onto the new blue unit. Rather the blue models are setup once the damage is resolved (I think, never played these).

The main thing I can see that is valid is the hobby side you mentioned here, you need to buy and paint a lot of models to make this one unit. Ofc they could just sell 5 pink, 10 blue, 10 brimstone as one box?

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This new LoC looks great I could see myself getting one of these just to paint as a big project.  I can't wait to see the 360 degree photos. 

I really like the head, 3 tongues are all the better for licking you with! The sword, while looking awesome is maybe one thing I'd switch out to a casting arm, I'm sure there'll be a few options and bits to mix around with in the box. 

After Magnus with his and now with all these feathers poor Duncan is going to be tickled silly by the end of Tzzanuary, showing us all how to paint them!

Edited by cb_rex

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58 minutes ago, cb_rex said:

 

I really like the head, 3 tongues are all the better for licking you with! 

LoC or Keeper? ?

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4 hours ago, Turragor said:

I don't play a summoning army (yet) but are people really still so beat up about having to pony up points for generating new models and units? Like I see this all the time '<source of free models> is useless because I have to pay for it now>' and I don't get it. There are always upsides to this kind of thing, if there was no benefit at all it wouldn't see any use or wouldn't have a cost.

Just off the top of my head, a unit that splits from Pink > Blue > Brimstone (costed) is like having 3 units on an objective with the footprint of one. Pretty durable. Opponents need to hit them with just the right amount of damage too as anything over the wounds of the pink horrors say doesn't spill onto the new blue unit. Rather the blue models are setup once the damage is resolved (I think, never played these).

The main thing I can see that is valid is the hobby side you mentioned here, you need to buy and paint a lot of models to make this one unit. Ofc they could just sell 5 pink, 10 blue, 10 brimstone as one box?

Speaking for myself personally, I am not beat up about the reserve point rules at all. In fact, I would call myself over all, a fan of the ruling. I think that, apart from many summons being far to likely to fail, the advantages of summoning are well worth any hassle possibly caused.

I think, however, that the reserve point rules in the specific case of horrors splitting, are more trouble than is worth.

First of, blue and brimstone horrors do not come in neat unit sized packages, but dribble in with the attrition of the parent unit. So to start of, we need blue horrors to be prized as pair and brimstones to be prized by base, otherwhise players are overpaying for every split. If they are appropiately prized as stated, then accounting through a game becomes far more in game book keeping than is common to a wargame, particularly such an over all fast and fluid system as AoS. This becomes worse if pink horrors retain the generic demon icon rule of "popping back" lost models, as in that case, depending on the wording, I could end up splitting more models than the original pink horror units size.

Second, the points a Tzeentch player would have to reserve for splitting horror differ from points reserved for summoning units in the important point of entirely depending on the opponents actions to come into play. Simply put, so long as my opponent doesn't attack my horrors, I am not getting my points into play, very much unlike summoning, where as the summoning player I get to influence when I want to use my points. In addition, I only get my points worth of miniatures, when I lose a roughly equivalent miniature.

These factors combine to make a unit of horrors splitting far more alike to a unit of Death battleline, like Sceletons or Crypt Ghouls, regaining numbers through heroes abilities or their standarts, than to any summons, that reserve points where designed for. Those units do not pay for their regained numbers, yet share the lasting quality you so correctly called out as the strong point of splitting horrors.

 

P.s.

Consider this wonkiness of point costed blue and brimstone horrors:

If blue and brimstone horror are costed, I could just add a unit of pink horrors to my army list. In that case, I'd have to pay for any splits.

However, if I select a unit of pink, blue and brimstone horrors each and have all three in melee, but still nearby, all three units are bound to suffer casualties, as the opponent is bound to have models in combat that can only attack one of the units. Now, as by the current rules, split of blues and brimstones are added to nearby units, I get my split of horrors for free or have to pay for them, depending entirely on the timing of my opponents attacks! If my opponent attacks the pink horrors first, all splits would bring the nearby blues above original numbers, making me pay. But if, for any reason, the blues are attacked first, they take casualties that are then replenished by slain pink horrors, making the split of blues free.

Horrors are meant to represent the madness of Tzeentch, but I hope they aren't meant to inflict it uppon the players.

Edited by Rogue Explorator
added concrete play example
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Atia:
I've seen Kairos and I can tell you one thing guys and girls - HE IS SO AWESOME!
Also, that's not the last daemon you will see with this release ..
 


I'll just leave this here from the front page...

ee64cac957cafd8a62ac18b9689c50fc.png

Wouldn't that be cool!
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58 minutes ago, Rogue Explorator said:

Speaking for myself personally, I am not beat up about the reserve point rules at all. In fact, I would call myself over all, a fan of the ruling. I think that, apart from many summons being far to likely to fail, the advantages of summoning are well worth any hassle possibly caused.

I think, however, that the reserve point rules in the specific case of horrors splitting, are more trouble than is worth.

First of, blue and brimstone horrors do not come in neat unit sized packages, but dribble in with the attrition of the parent unit. So to start of, we need blue horrors to be prized as pair and brimstones to be prized by base, otherwhise players are overpaying for every split. If they are appropiately prized as stated, then accounting through a game becomes far more in game book keeping than is common to a wargame, particularly such an over all fast and fluid system as AoS. This becomes worse if pink horrors retain the generic demon icon rule of "popping back" lost models, as in that case, depending on the wording, I could end up splitting more models than the original pink horror units size.

Second, the points a Tzeentch player would have to reserve for splitting horror differ from points reserved for summoning units in the important point of entirely depending on the opponents actions to come into play. Simply put, so long as my opponent doesn't attack my horrors, I am not getting my points into play, very much unlike summoning, where as the summoning player I get to influence when I want to use my points. In addition, I only get my points worth of miniatures, when I lose a roughly equivalent miniature.

These factors combine to make a unit of horrors splitting far more alike to a unit of Death battleline, like Sceletons or Crypt Ghouls, regaining numbers through heroes abilities or their standarts, than to any summons, that reserve points where designed for. Those units do not pay for their regained numbers, yet share the lasting quality you so correctly called out as the strong point of splitting horrors.

 

P.s.

Consider this wonkiness of point costed blue and brimstone horrors:

If blue and brimstone horror are costed, I could just add a unit of pink horrors to my army list. In that case, I'd have to pay for any splits.

However, if I select a unit of pink, blue and brimstone horrors each and have all three in melee, but still nearby, all three units are bound to suffer casualties, as the opponent is bound to have models in combat that can only attack one of the units. Now, as by the current rules, split of blues and brimstones are added to nearby units, I get my split of horrors for free or have to pay for them, depending entirely on the timing of my opponents attacks! If my opponent attacks the pink horrors first, all splits would bring the nearby blues above original numbers, making me pay. But if, for any reason, the blues are attacked first, they take casualties that are then replenished by slain pink horrors, making the split of blues free.

Horrors are meant to represent the madness of Tzeentch, but I hope they aren't meant to inflict it uppon the players.

I see what you mean better now!

I'd add more thoughts about possible solutions or interesting ways of making it work out fairly but I don't wanna derail the rumour thread more :)

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22 hours ago, daedalus81 said:

I am immediately transported back to my childhood.  I used to run LoC and those monopose beastmen.  I scrimped and saved for ages to afford that tiny $50 LoC back then and it was the most incredible thing I had ever seen.

Now I get to run beastmen again and a LoC that makes me giddy all over again...for more than $50, but oh so worth it!

I love this hobby so much I often ponder what I would do in an alternate reality where it doesn't exist.

Apologies for the continued off topic but I have to say that I actually can't imagine a reality like that.

On-topic @Shane has posted up what Lady Atia has said re. more daemons. My gut feeling is that we will get Blue Horrors and Brimstone Horrors (maybe in one box?). Secretly though I am also hoping for something completely unexpected like disc riding Horrors, or a new large infantry.

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21 hours ago, Vasshpit said:

Well, looks like I'll be starting my first chaos army.... good job, GWs!

Oh wow amazing model. 

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There are still some Arcanite Heroes to be released: magoster IIRC and one other

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2 hours ago, Malin said:

There are still some Arcanite Heroes to be released: magoster IIRC and one other

The Magister is confirmed to be the old Tzeentch Sorcerer (the chickenfeet one) with a new name by an illustration caption in WD.

The other one (Fateweaver?) really sounds like the old finecast Lord on Disk.

I really hope we get more heroes through the year though, I get envious looking at the veriety available to Bloodbound and Stormcast.

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Stay focused on current projects, I do not need this now, stay focused on current projects, I don not need this now, stay focused on current projects, I don not need this now, stay focused on current projects, I don not need this now, stay focused on current projects, I don not need this now...

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I've already started list building at work, and my wife is away for all of Tzaanguary...I am under no illusion that I will be able to resist this release...

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So, are we expecting the 2nd global sellout of models (for fantasy) from an army with this tzeentch release. 

From the sounds of it, the sheer amount of players who have asked for a "proper" tzeentch army over the years, those who have wanted an excuse to start chaos and those who love beautiful models. 

I belive we will 

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Whoa, that LoC is craaaaazy nice! Chaos has already had more fantastic models released for AoS than anyone else, but this is just on another level entirely.

What am I saying, I don't even play Chaos... xD

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