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8 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

WHU Rivals sounds as expected. I like the idea a lot but can't help notice that only Direchasm and Harrowdeep warbands are actually shown in the video. Doesn't necessarily rule out the idea that this could be a reprieve or a boost (or even a reissue!) for S1/2/3 warbands but does suggest this format won't break from the larger WHU model.

It's also a bit much to suggest that it'll be perfectly balanced just because all the decks are pre-made but that's the inevitable marketing copy. As a concept it's still a good call to introduce a format that doesn't rely quite so heavily on the FOMO churn of cards and pay-to-win aspect of deckbuilding.

I would love for gw to rerelease the older warband with a complete deck of cards. I missed out on some :(.

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7 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

WHU Rivals sounds as expected. I like the idea a lot but can't help notice that only Direchasm and Harrowdeep warbands are actually shown in the video. Doesn't necessarily rule out the idea that this could be a reprieve or a boost (or even a reissue!) for S1/2/3 warbands but does suggest this format won't break from the larger WHU model.

It's also a bit much to suggest that it'll be perfectly balanced just because all the decks are pre-made but that's the inevitable marketing copy. As a concept it's still a good call to introduce a format that doesn't rely quite so heavily on the FOMO churn of cards and pay-to-win aspect of deckbuilding.

I'm asking this as someone who has no idea how Underworlds works: What is actually changing with this release?

As far as I understand it, Underworlds usually moves in seasons, but I don't know what that means for backwards compatibility. Could you not play old warbands against new ones at all before? I thought old warbands were just incompatible with some of the newest cards.

I also noticed that some (most?) warbands are still available under their respective faction's store page (e.g., Zarbag's Gitz, Rippa's Snarlfangs and Mollog's Mob under Gloomspite Gitz). I think they are currently partially unplayable in Underworlds, but what are they missing? Character cards?

To be honest, Underworlds kinda continues to confuse me. If I was told "GW is doing a miniature/deck building hybrid game", I would have definitely expected it to take cues from MtG's Commander: The models are what you build your deck around, but you can run whatever cards you want. But apparently they decided to make it a rotating format instead?

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@Neil Arthur Hotep You kind of have it. There's a few different formats for WHU that only really matter for organised play but then as it's meant to be a game more heavily based around formal organised games in tournaments and such than AoS/40k, these are a bigger deal.

  • Championship - all warbands and faction-specific cards allowed, only universal cards from this season and the last season
  • Vanguard - only warbands and cards from current season
  • Relic - anything goes, all warbands/cards

What this means is that you can absolutely play old warbands for most organised games but you still need to get the latest starter kit to ensure that you have legal universal cards, hence encouraging this FOMO sort of buying behaviour.* Older warbands can still be competitive - Mollog's Mob was killing it before a recent update because of some interactions with S4 universal cards - but in practice most are getting a bit left behind in terms of power in the same way as older battletomes/codices in AoS/40k.

From a sales POV, you've hit on the issue. Warbands from S1 and S2 are only available without their cards. If you buy, say, Zarbag's Gits, you get the minis but you'd need to either buy the cards secondhand or print them yourself (which is doable but a pain and I'm not sure if it tournies have an issue with it). If you buy a S3 warband like e.g. Rippa's Snarlfangs, you do get cards but maybe half of those cards can't be used legally in two of the three organised play formats. Once these go out of stock, we may well see them reissued without the cards as with S1/S2 warbands, which brings us back to the same problem.

In a sense this new Rivals format is sort of orthogonal to the whole seasons/rotation thing, it's basically just sticking to pre-made decks. It does simplify things, which is good, but it's not clear how it'll work with these older warbands who don't have (legal) cards and it doesn't address the larger unfortunate side-effects that the card rotation brings. You could call these 'problems' but they're maybe just what happens when you have a game that is explicitly about keeping organised/competitive play fresh and with a business model based around buying new warbands frequently for new cards.

Speaking as someone who doesn't play at all competitively, Rivals is basically just a formalisation of how this game gets played with folks from a board game background; pre-made decks, who cares about rotation. Treated that way it's genuinely a fantastic game, possibly GW's best-written, if one that is lately straining against the limits of giving each warband a unique angle.

* which is common in lots of games but was largely not present in GW stuff until WHU. It's funny, one of the big things GW learned from watching games like FFG's X-Wing was the most irritating and consumer-unfriendly aspect of them, one of the only messy games industry practices they had historically not had front and centre.

Edited by sandlemad
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I think the rest of the year is just gonna be:

  • Harrowdeep
  • Maybe 1-2 warbands for Underworlds
  • The rest of the Stormcast
  • The rest of the Black Templars
  • Genestealers vs Custodes box from that leak
  • Battleforces
  • Christmas bundles
  • New paints and hobby tools
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28 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

...

In a sense this new Rivals format is sort of orthogonal to the whole seasons/rotation thing, it's basically just sticking to pre-made decks. It does simplify things, which is good, but it's not clear how it'll work with these older warbands who don't have (legal) cards and it doesn't address the larger unfortunate side-effects that the card rotation brings. You could call these 'problems' but they're maybe just what happens when you have a game that is explicitly about keeping organised/competitive play fresh and with a business model based around buying new warbands frequently for new cards.

Speaking as someone who doesn't play at all competitively, Rivals is basically just a formalisation of how this game gets played with folks from a board game background; pre-made decks, who cares about rotation. Treated that way it's genuinely a fantastic game, possibly GW's best-written, if one that is lately straining against the limits of giving each warband a unique angle.

by the sounds of it they are planning to release sets of premade legal decks which can be used with any warband, perhaps with different styles of play.  Ideally what id like is list of old cards to be made into those premade decks to get some use out of them. Underworlds kind of died amongst my mates as there was just too much card reading and faffing to make the games quick when you had so many cards to choose from.

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19 minutes ago, PJetski said:

I think the rest of the year is just gonna be:

  • Harrowdeep
  • Maybe 1-2 warbands for Underworlds
  • The rest of the Stormcast
  • The rest of the Black Templars
  • Genestealers vs Custodes box from that leak
  • Battleforces
  • Christmas bundles
  • New paints and hobby tools

Khorne Team and Killteam too

Edited by Nezzhil
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21 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

Personal Theory Time: Old World is just going to be a Blood Bowl expansion game!

Please don’t jinx it. I’m impatiently waiting for the Old World to drop. I took to AoS with openarms, the concept is great, the factions too (mostly, but I’m not gonna judge hardwork on my aesthetic or lore preference. Not least for the fact that Gods get to lead armies. But I have such a deep yearning to visit the Drakwald, Lustria, the Mountains Mourn. Etc.

 

Age of Sigmar has its place, and the more ways you can squeeze out more Warhammer Lore the better. Whether it’s a campaign  in Chamon or a full release of Kislev. The biggest disappointment for me has always been the closure of Warhammer Forge and not exploring more alternate Timeline scenarios like Tamurkhan (yes that broken record). 
 

 

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1 hour ago, Nezzhil said:

ok7DPxQu9sRdfvNO.jpg.c9cf28989190b1ffca79c461a7667367.jpg

 

Kreek ‘The Verminator’ Rustgouger

 

A new Blood Bowl Star Player

That handsome boy is making me want to play Skaven. Like someone else said, a Rat Ogor anvil character like old school Ghoritch.. But I shouldn't collect so many horde armies..

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33 minutes ago, Higolx said:

They showed us the rest of the black templars range: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/10/04/black-templars-reinforcements-are-on-the-way-with-these-amazingly-zealous-new-models/

Their new Castellan is my personal highlight BY FAR

GRRjoyOWbiMAhFj8.jpg

syQGLvsvWUXZh4it.jpg.df24b44c5c2fbf2b6c2b41b85140fd90.jpg

I personally love the Crusader's Helm piece. It looks like a mark II helm in plastic, and I love the mark II look.

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3 hours ago, Matrindur said:

They uploaded a video about Underworlds: Rivals but more than that apparently Harrowdeep will be released this month? We only have two more releases that will actually be in store in October so either this Sunday or next would have to be the announcement.

image.png.0bd7dbdb677cbf5c8450cd306fe02112.png

I honestly didnt expect it so soon!! We could very well be getting a Roadmap this month if that's the case.

2 hours ago, Nezzhil said:

ok7DPxQu9sRdfvNO.jpg.c9cf28989190b1ffca79c461a7667367.jpg

 

Kreek ‘The Verminator’ Rustgouger

 

A new Blood Bowl Star Player

@Ratboy genius @Skreech Verminking Well that's a good Rat Ogor proxy for AOS if I've ever seen one!! It looks incredible!! 

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Damn that Skaven star player is a amazing, just wish star players werent so under utilised in game :/ 
That Tomb king team is a bit suboptimal annoyingly having played a few leagues with them, you really want 4 mummies to distract opponents while your blitzers (IE the only competent players you have) clean up ;)

Having a type of underworlds not reliant on pay to win deckbuilding ****** might actually see some play in our group, its a fun game without that element! 

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1 hour ago, sandlemad said:

@Neil Arthur Hotep You kind of have it. There's a few different formats for WHU that only really matter for organised play but then as it's meant to be a game more heavily based around formal organised games in tournaments and such than AoS/40k, these are a bigger deal.

  • Championship - all warbands and faction-specific cards allowed, only universal cards from this season and the last season
  • Vanguard - only warbands and cards from current season
  • Relic - anything goes, all warbands/cards

What this means is that you can absolutely play old warbands for most organised games but you still need to get the latest starter kit to ensure that you have legal universal cards, hence encouraging this FOMO sort of buying behaviour.* Older warbands can still be competitive - Mollog's Mob was killing it before a recent update because of some interactions with S4 universal cards - but in practice most are getting a bit left behind in terms of power in the same way as older battletomes/codices in AoS/40k.

From a sales POV, you've hit on the issue. Warbands from S1 and S2 are only available without their cards. If you buy, say, Zarbag's Gits, you get the minis but you'd need to either buy the cards secondhand or print them yourself (which is doable but a pain and I'm not sure if it tournies have an issue with it). If you buy a S3 warband like e.g. Rippa's Snarlfangs, you do get cards but maybe half of those cards can't be used legally in two of the three organised play formats. Once these go out of stock, we may well see them reissued without the cards as with S1/S2 warbands, which brings us back to the same problem.

In a sense this new Rivals format is sort of orthogonal to the whole seasons/rotation thing, it's basically just sticking to pre-made decks. It does simplify things, which is good, but it's not clear how it'll work with these older warbands who don't have (legal) cards and it doesn't address the larger unfortunate side-effects that the card rotation brings. You could call these 'problems' but they're maybe just what happens when you have a game that is explicitly about keeping organised/competitive play fresh and with a business model based around buying new warbands frequently for new cards.

Speaking as someone who doesn't play at all competitively, Rivals is basically just a formalisation of how this game gets played with folks from a board game background; pre-made decks, who cares about rotation. Treated that way it's genuinely a fantastic game, possibly GW's best-written, if one that is lately straining against the limits of giving each warband a unique angle.

* which is common in lots of games but was largely not present in GW stuff until WHU. It's funny, one of the big things GW learned from watching games like FFG's X-Wing was the most irritating and consumer-unfriendly aspect of them, one of the only messy games industry practices they had historically not had front and centre.

Thanks - its convinced me to pick it up

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hey ! Its a little bit dated (comes out of the article on dawnbringer crusades), but do we now what are those ?

2js9.jpeg


obviously not dracoth rider, or vanguard palladors… but looks like stormcast on gryph charger

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12 minutes ago, Gaz Taylor said:

I second that. Never seen them painted like that so not sure if just out of somebodies collection or sneaky look at a cities update?

That’s the Hammerhal paint scheme, nothing new, sorry pals

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27 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

Are we likely to get the Lord-Commanders for the other Stormhosts and do we have any info on any of them? I feel like narratively and in terms of Sculpt they would be easier to implement than the Primarchs in 40k.

Please no. We do not need stormcast getting the space marine treatment of needing individual sculpts and supplements for every storm host. 

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4 hours ago, The Red King said:

Please no. We do not need stormcast getting the space marine treatment of needing individual sculpts and supplements for every storm host. 

I would hate to see a Space Marine treatment, but Lord Commander Bastian Carthalos is such a fantastic model. I was hoping for more like him but filling different roles. But I guess I hadn't considered that it would bleed over into the weird subdivisions based on colour schemes. I also wish every named character had an unnamed equivalent ruleswise for people who want to develop their own lore 😕

The sad part is there is probably more than enough named characters already but they made them all boring Hammers of Sigmar already.

Edited by Neverchosen
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