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Oh man I forgot the best thing about the current 40k app- it is one of those amateur apps that the iPad version doesn’t even fit the screen. Can’t wait for that for AoS.  
 

Actually maybe I’m more amused that someone convinced GW to pay them to ‘work’ on an app that already existed and more than likely make it worse. It would be more funny if it didn’t negatively impact my enjoyment of the hobby but it’s still funny in an ironic way. 

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22 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

I can't see it taking away from independent streamers, if anything it gives them more to talk about with break downs of that weeks animation episode. 

I also don't agree with saying that giving £5 to warhammer+ will take away from a independent streamer. If you like that streamer and want to support them, you will. 

It's not about now. Wont be any initial changes for a while. But the nature of streaming *is* going to change. Just as with social media, hyper rich companies are not going to simply sit and watch independents earn off something they have a stake in.

AOS Analogy- WH+ is Necroquake. Wider monetization and monopolistic of streamed content will be the Soul Wars

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1 hour ago, Gothmaug said:

Looks like you'll be able to buy the exclusive minis, "for a few teef" probably after they get delivered to customers. SO at least a year out. 

 

The new ironjaw model is wonderful, but its just a megaboss resculpt. So no new warscroll. for a moment I was hoping for a unique named character, or a new warscroll to add some utility to the line. But hey, at this point all take anything new and shiny for ironjawz. Not sure if I want a digital subscription though. we'll see..

You can only get the minis for subscribing, Adam said the few teef part about if you want both minis, so you get one free and you buy the other (hinted as discounted) 

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Well, the price is better than I expected, but the content still seems a bit "meh". The white dwarf archive could be cool if there isn't too much of a delay to get new ones, and they eventually extend the back catalogue back further than 2020. (They'd never do the entire run of White dwarf though, as it would include far too much content for games they no longer support.)

There seem to be a lot of cartoons but... how to put this delicately? We have yet to have any real indication that they will be any good. If its kind of like Black Library quality then maybe it will be worth paying for, but a lot of the time a game company's idea of gripping television is a little too focused on marketing. Black Library is already a little hit and miss, in my opinion, and the long form stuff tends to be better than the short stories.

As for the hobby stuff and lore videos, I agree that the community already does this well enough, without having to pay for it.

I don't have a stake in electronic rules content since I prefer books.

On the whole I think it might be worth it if next year's model is one which I really want. If I want to buy that, and would be paying £25 for it already, then paying ~£25 more for the rest of the package would perhaps be fine, if the content has stood the test of time over the preceding year. For now though, its a no from me.

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Didn't watch the stream. Would you get the current WD issues they put out or its just old stuff?

I don't know much about the 40k app, but if you pay for it, do you get rules for all units, rules for the faction and such? Or you need to buy the book too?

Follow up question to that, if you don't pay for the app, but you buy the book, can you unlock it in the app still, or you must pay the subscription? 

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1 hour ago, Sleboda said:

I mean no offense to anyone in that situation with this take:

While inclusion is always appreciated, and looking out for others is a laudable societal trait, it makes very little business sense to choose a path that tries to accommodate what is assuredly a miniscule segment of your potential customer base at the expense of a course that would generate what that business believes to be significant income from the vast majority of the customer base.

We see this all the time in society, both in terms of business and just regular social interaction. Even in medicine.

Not to make this too much of a downer, but my grandfather, a decorated part of the Greatest Generation, a conservation officer, business owner, and all around loving, intelligent, and kind man died from an extremely rare brain disease. There is almost no research done into combatting this disease because it is so rare and resources are limited - resources that go into curing ailments that aflict many, many more people. It tore me up that he died from this ... but the medical community was and is right to not work on the disease that killed him.

To put it in more geek-centric terms, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

GW is right, and indeed has a legal responsibility to its shareholders, to focus on the majority with their plans rather than hamper those plans to accommodate just a few.

 

I mean... No offence but thats nonsense. Its a minimal amount of effort to produce epubs and the like given how the books are designed these days and then you save a whole load of logistics moving dead trees around only for some of them to sit around gathering dust forever.

They stopped making epubs for 40k, offering no viable alternative and people just went back to pirate PDFs instead, which were delayed for basically no time whatsoever by some guy with a scanner popping them up online. Its exactly like streaming and the like, if you offer a convenient legal option, even if it costs money, people will take it. If you make it awkward or too pricy, or just remove the option entirely (smoooooth work GW)  then people will pirate.

Just to be clear piracy bad, i would rather give GW money, but Paper codexes are awkward, take up space and have other problems, their current app model is awkward, not usable on PC's and missing over half the content.

On the topic of the day, the sub is pretty mediocre until it comes to the Assassin which is 80% of the reason to sub right there :D 

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1 hour ago, JustAsPlanned said:

Ok, the initial outrage has developed into a sort of... well, melancholy. It’s just really unimpressive. Everything except the animations you could get on YouTube for free, and arguably at a higher quality (ie, the lore show). And the insinuation that there’s no more ebooks is just a massive pain in the backside as well. I do stand by what I said about “what a market share does to a mfer” though. GW are slowly but surely getting too big for their boots. 

Anyway, back to rumours ig. About the Kruleboyz flyer, are y’all #TeamBatScorpionThing or #TeamGiantFethingEagle as that new leak from 4chan seemed to claim?

#Teambatscorpionthing!!

 

9 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Ladies and gentlemen, we got 'im.

E4lkZnxWYAMrJtV?format=jpg&name=mediumlatest.png

Mate this is bang on Grimgor!! Down to the broken toof!!

On the topic of the BR Brutal story I absolutely loved it. It also straight up states the Gordrakk VS Kragnos was a draw which I'm pleased by. Great story and we havent seen the last of Gordrakk for this Edition that's for sure!!

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1 hour ago, Sleboda said:

I mean no offense to anyone in that situation with this take:

While inclusion is always appreciated, and looking out for others is a laudable societal trait, it makes very little business sense to choose a path that tries to accommodate what is assuredly a miniscule segment of your potential customer base at the expense of a course that would generate what that business believes to be significant income from the vast majority of the customer base.

We see this all the time in society, both in terms of business and just regular social interaction. Even in medicine.

Not to make this too much of a downer, but my grandfather, a decorated part of the Greatest Generation, a conservation officer, business owner, and all around loving, intelligent, and kind man died from an extremely rare brain disease. There is almost no research done into combatting this disease because it is so rare and resources are limited - resources that go into curing ailments that aflict many, many more people. It tore me up that he died from this ... but the medical community was and is right to not work on the disease that killed him.

To put it in more geek-centric terms, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

GW is right, and indeed has a legal responsibility to its shareholders, to focus on the majority with their plans rather than hamper those plans to accommodate just a few.

 

Paper books use more resources then digital ever will, it's just an excuse to limit (badly) piracy. they can do both physical and digital, the books are designed on computers 🙄

You can not view any lore or pictures from the books in the App, all you get is the rules/data sheets unlocked. If the code gave you this no one would complain (except the part about trees and the books being sent half way around the world via the most polluting transport known to man) 

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1 hour ago, JustAsPlanned said:

I do stand by what I said about “what a market share does to a mfer” though. GW are slowly but surely getting too big for their boots.

Excuse me? Their boots are perfectly fine. Big enough to stomp on the consumer without breaking a sweat.

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2 hours ago, Sleboda said:

I mean no offense to anyone in that situation with this take:

While inclusion is always appreciated, and looking out for others is a laudable societal trait, it makes very little business sense to choose a path that tries to accommodate what is assuredly a miniscule segment of your potential customer base at the expense of a course that would generate what that business believes to be significant income from the vast majority of the customer base.

We see this all the time in society, both in terms of business and just regular social interaction. Even in medicine.

Not to make this too much of a downer, but my grandfather, a decorated part of the Greatest Generation, a conservation officer, business owner, and all around loving, intelligent, and kind man died from an extremely rare brain disease. There is almost no research done into combatting this disease because it is so rare and resources are limited - resources that go into curing ailments that aflict many, many more people. It tore me up that he died from this ... but the medical community was and is right to not work on the disease that killed him.

To put it in more geek-centric terms, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

GW is right, and indeed has a legal responsibility to its shareholders, to focus on the majority with their plans rather than hamper those plans to accommodate just a few.

 

I mean no offense to anyone in this situation, but do you perhaps work for GW or something? 

 

Asking because you consistently shill pretty hard for them, which is understandable if they pay you to do so.

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4 minutes ago, Deepkin said:

I mean no offense to anyone in this situation, but do you perhaps work for GW or something? 

 

Asking because you consistently shill pretty hard for them, which is understandable if they pay you to do so.

Okay I’m just gonna ask if anyone has heard anything about Kruleboyz or Chorfs since before we spiraled into this debate about the preview. Anything? Anything at all?

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8 minutes ago, Deepkin said:

I mean no offense to anyone in this situation, but do you perhaps work for GW or something? 

 

Asking because you consistently shill pretty hard for them, which is understandable if they pay you to do so.

 

Quote

"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

Quote

GW is right, and indeed has a legal responsibility to its shareholders, to focus on the majority with their plans rather than hamper those plans to accommodate just a few.

The weirdest way in which I have seen this saying used, yet. Just wow.

This is almost always used to describe a situation were at a societal level we choose the greater good, not to defend corporations putting first their "very few and select" shareholders over the "few" (majority?) of the consumers.

 

 

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4 hours ago, JustAsPlanned said:

Ok, the initial outrage has developed into a sort of... well, melancholy. It’s just really unimpressive. Everything except the animations you could get on YouTube for free, and arguably at a higher quality (ie, the lore show). And the insinuation that there’s no more ebooks is just a massive pain in the backside as well. I do stand by what I said about “what a market share does to a mfer” though. GW are slowly but surely getting too big for their boots. 

Anyway, back to rumours ig. About the Kruleboyz flyer, are y’all #TeamBatScorpionThing or #TeamGiantFethingEagle as that new leak from 4chan seemed to claim?

the thing is, even through patreons becoming a normalcy i'd still rather be giving money directly to the content creators, because they're the ones who have helped this hobby grow exponentially since the internet really took off. GW mentioned including lore in WH+ which feels like they'll end up DMCA'ing people like Doug (2+ Tough) who love getting people into the story & narrative gaming. I would almost rather GW make WH+ *only* the animations, books, back-catalog, and companion apps.

edit: i don't think DMCA was the right term thanks to @prosecutor but you get the idea

Edited by CommissarRotke
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3 hours ago, frostyeel said:

I'm a big fan of Louise's painting style so cautiously optimistic for the masterclass. The idea of Warhammer+ seemed real dumb to me when it was first announced, but now seeing the full scope of what's included it seems like a reasonable deal for anyone who is actually going to use a good portion of what is included. But no epubs for AoS 3 battletomes is a bummer.

I love Louise which is why I sincerely hope the Masterclass *isn't* her revealing her secrets. Looking at the picture she tweeted, I dont think it will be- more 'Eavy Metal studio than 'Eavy Metal Army Painter. 

GW has basically commercialised and copyrighted Duncan Rhodes painting philosophy and not given him anything like the remuneration and respect he deserves.

*No body* has done more for GW in the past decade to get hobbyists into the hobby and keep them within the GW fold, or to sell GW's frankly rubbish and vastly overpriced hobby supplies.

Louise is very much in that same mould of delightful, sincere,  eager and just all round good person, a superb ambassador for all that's good in the hobby, and it would be a travesty if they did the same with her talent.

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2 minutes ago, Nos said:

I love Louise which is why I sincerely hope the Masterclass *isn't* her revealing her secrets. Looking at the picture she tweeted, I dont think it will be- more 'Eavy Metal studio than 'Eavy Metal Army Painter. 

GW has basically commercialised and copyrighted Duncan Rhodes painting philosophy and not given him anything like the remuneration and respect he deserves.

*No body* has done more for GW in the past decade to get hobbyists into the hobby and keep them within the GW fold, or to sell GW's frankly rubbish and vastly overpriced hobby supplies.

Louise is very much in that same mould of delightful, sincere,  eager and just all round good person, a superb ambassador for all that's good in the hobby, and it would be a travesty if they did the same with her talent.

Judging by nearly every tutorial on WarhammerTV now being Battle Ready(tm) rather than their previous videos going in-depth on every stage, I imagine they'll just be bringing back the 'old style' tutorials from Duncan's days and hiding them behind the paywall.

"Let them eat Nick drowning a model in Contrast."
- some GW marketing exec.

Edited by Clan's Cynic
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10 minutes ago, CommissarRotke said:

the thing is, even through patreons becoming a normalcy i'd still rather be giving money directly to the content creators, because they're the ones who have helped this hobby grow exponentially since the internet really took off. GW mentioned including lore in WH+ which feels like they'll end up DMCA'ing people like Doug (2+ Tough) who love getting people into the story & narrative gaming. I would almost rather GW make WH+ *only* the animations, books, back-catalog, and companion apps.

Depending on what state Doug is in, that could be extremely profitable for Doug. There are surprisingly strong anti-SLAPP protections in some places and I would strongly advise anyone to pay attention to those before DCMA'ing someone in the modern day. What Doug is doing is almost certainly fair use under any plausible interpretation of the law, and in certain jurisdictions, that means GW will be writing Doug a pretty fat check for doing this.

Be aware of your rights and don't take this laying down.

On the W+ front: I won't be getting it because GW's digital products have sucked, other than PDFs. But if they cut PDFs for AoS books, that's both insane from an environmental perspective (and people should get on them about this and refer them to some of the local UK organizations that oppose this kind of thing as they literally will organize protests outside GW's HQ and what not) and shareholder perspective. This is recreating the anti-Napster movement that ultimately crippled and massively damaged the music industry. Boomer logic and then some from GW. You don't have to get into the clash of shareholder vs. public interests when a specific action is genuinely dumb from both perspectives. I'm just surprised 80 year old people who think the computer machine will lead to the death of humanity are still running GW in 2021.

Edited by Reinholt
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2 minutes ago, Reinholt said:

Depending on what state Doug is in, that could be extremely profitable for Doug. There are surprisingly strong anti-SLAPP protections in some places and I would strongly advise anyone to pay attention to those before DCMA'ing someone in the modern day. What Doug is doing is almost certainly fair use under any plausible interpretation of the law, and in certain jurisdictions, that means GW will be writing Doug a pretty fat check for doing this.

Be aware of your rights and don't take this laying down.

On the W+ front: I won't be getting it because GW's digital products have sucked, other than PDFs. But if they cut PDFs for AoS books, that's both insane from an environmental perspective (and people should get on them about this and refer them to some of the local UK organizations that oppose this kind of thing as they literally will organize protests outside GW's HQ and what not) and shareholder perspective. This is recreating the anti-Napster movement that ultimately crippled and massively damaged the music industry. Boomer logic and then some from GW.

While this is true, in a cease and desist situation from someone like GW irrespective of legality, a lot of content creators are not going to be able to afford the initial fees or the attrirional cost of getting to a win

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3 minutes ago, Nos said:

While this is true, in a cease and desist situation from someone like GW irrespective of legality, a lot of content creators are not going to be able to afford the initial fees or the attrirional cost of getting to a win

This is what a properly crafted anti-SLAPP law covers, and there are multiple states with them. A lot of attorneys take these kinds of cases on contingency because you get fees when you win if it's clear fair use. I get the sense most people get a DCMA and don't even explore their options because it's much easier to punch back in a lot of places than expected. Some states less than others. You'd be foolish not to at least consult with a lawyer and it's usually free to have the first discussion (and if it's not, you're into something really messy and shouldn't be on a message board but rather loading your munitions into your private jet etc. kind of things).

This is not legal advice blah blah blah.

Edit: RuneBrush is right and to get this back on track, I'll stop here.

Edited by Reinholt
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1 hour ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Ladies and gentlemen, we got 'im.

E4lkZnxWYAMrJtV?format=jpg&name=mediumlatest.png

That's an amazing spot although it certainly reinforces to me that Ironjawz armour is just super dumb, really bad design. Poor guy is drowning in there. I've always felt it deep down despite loving orcs, always reacted badly to Ironjawz, shadespire gangs etc. 

Most contemporary sculpts which are riffs on an old range- Vamps as an example, or indeed Kruleboyz- really highlight the advantages of modern approach to mini sculpting.

But Grimgor honestly is far better proportioned for me than his new incarnation who just looks gawdy and bloated, like a regular orruk in drag.

 

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1 minute ago, Televiper11 said:

If by next edition, GW puts everything except minis & paints behind the paywall, I might be out of the hobby as I’m not in this for screens. If it becomes rules on App, lore on +, WD digital-only, I’m outta here.

I don't imagine they'll ever stop selling their $40+ books that go obsolete every 1-4 years, at least as long as they can find trees to cut down. Even then, I think they might try to press paper from rags and pensioners.

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