The Rumour Thread

[Baron Klatz]

Indeed a tiny one and certainly a reason we need more. In the descriptions of smaller God-beasts ranging from gigantic dragons to mystical elk-like creatures in Ghyran it gives a lot of room for more models of them (and hopefully a Destruction faction one day).

Just now, Whitefang said:

*it refers to “who created realmgates?”*

Ah, thank you for the quote. So there is a recent precedent even though there's other sources that show Realmgates are products of gods, wizards and duardin as well. (The rifts between realms sometimes occur naturally so sometimes it's just a case of making a concrete structure out of them)

The "Realmgates of all kinds" bit gives them elbow room to add Old Ones to the list.

That is a nice Seraphon shout-out though to how effective Slann were at manipulating them during the Age of Chaos. With what would take a cadre of mages to do a single Slann was enough to reroute a gate into a "death-gate" to slaughter unwary chaos forces using it.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[khadgar567]

On 1/17/2020 at 11:14 PM, Lanoss said:

Tyrion might not have ascended unto god-hood as Teclis did? Tyrion might be present on the battlefield as a representation of Teclis’ will?

another idea is the tyrion in picture is basicly eidolon of him summoned by the new army so he leads the boys as awesome powerful representation of elven power while his real squishy god body pulls morhati and drink on the worship the new army generates

 

[JackStreicher]

1 hour ago, Baron Klatz said:

The "Realmgates of all kinds" bit gives them elbow room to add Old Ones to the list.

I'd really love that. For me the old ones were what made lizardmen even more interesting back in the day

[Aelfric]

And, of course, the use of the word "Likely" at the beginning means that it can be considered only one of many possible explanations, which is one of the strengths of GW lore-writing.  I like the fact that there are often varying versions of the "truth" and that nothing is set in stone (not even Realmgates).

[Baron Klatz]

Indeed. It helps open up the narrative.

A Realmgate in your background can be anything from a gift from your diety to prosper your land with trade, an ancient relic of a lost race your people built around for safety, a construct made of magic rifts/hidden aelven ways/gnaw-holes that was forgotten after a war and can even be a local event of your city paying highly skilled duardin clans or the eldritch council to create one to open up travel for their expanding economy.

Lots of possibilities.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[Mikeymajq]

I personally hope they don't backtrack Seraphons lore too much. Them being crazy af space lizard wizards is exactly why I like them in aos

[Overread]

1 hour ago, Mikeymajq said:

I personally hope they don't backtrack Seraphons lore too much. Them being crazy af space lizard wizards is exactly why I like them in aos

I don't think they'll make the Slaan any weaker, but I get the impression that they will have Seraphon settle colonies and establish lands and peoples. So I can see them being a race of two parts. Those who are still upon the great Arks and are summoned into battle by the Slaan, but also those who are now native to the Mortal Realms. Who establish a people, culture and territories of their own.

I'd say that's the best of both worlds. It gives them both what they've had before, but also really opens up the lore and possibilities for them to adapt and evolve and advance as a race. There's a lot more story options when you've got a race as opposed to warriors who are temp-summoned only to do battle by great mages who mostly don't say very much. 

[JackStreicher]

52 minutes ago, Overread said:

I don't think they'll make the Slaan any weaker, but I get the impression that they will have Seraphon settle colonies and establish lands and peoples. So I can see them being a race of two parts. Those who are still upon the great Arks and are summoned into battle by the Slaan, but also those who are now native to the Mortal Realms. Who establish a people, culture and territories of their own.

I'd say that's the best of both worlds. It gives them both what they've had before, but also really opens up the lore and possibilities for them to adapt and evolve and advance as a race. There's a lot more story options when you've got a race as opposed to warriors who are temp-summoned only to do battle by great mages who mostly don't say very much. 

Sounds compelling...
This is absolutely made up and based on no story whatsoever:
to expand upn your idea: What if some Slann indeed discovered a rescue pod/ship of one of the Old Ones. Boarded it and freed/awakened one of their former gods? This god in turn draws a portion of the Slann back to his former plan of defeating chaos/forming the now-mortal-realms by some kind of great plan. However not all Slann believe in the old ones anymore since they've failed and abandoned the Saurus in the past. They're not hostile by any means but they follow their own plan while being allies to the old one.

The old one's faction starts settlements, terraforming and the building of more Slann world ships and spawning pools, creating more, new Saurus species to deal with the dangers of the mortal realms (remember: Lizardmen were made to fight the perils of the old world, the mortal realms however are vast and full of more powerful dangers).
Therefor you can still summon normal (old) Saurus to the field, but you get additional new Saurus-Reptile-Beings to add to your army.

😃

Edited January 19, 2020 by JackStreicher

[khadgar567]

Intrestingly some fluff and crunch update to seraphon works good way to update them to 2.0 with each  block of army using diffrent realm based astetic where hysh based ones get storm powers( kinda mimic sigmar style) while realm of beasts gets realy beefy berserkers as core unit. realm of fire can get good old flaming lizards and realm of metal can probably use some mechanic caste as their focus.

[Baron Klatz]

Just now, Overread said:

I don't think they'll make the Slaan any weaker, but I get the impression that they will have Seraphon settle colonies and establish lands and peoples. So I can see them being a race of two parts. Those who are still upon the great Arks and are summoned into battle by the Slaan, but also those who are now native to the Mortal Realms. Who establish a people, culture and territories of their own

Yeah, they explained that back in 2017 with the city builder that since they are evolving memories(mention from their battletome) some Seraphon can "go native" which is how they can be in players cities.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ageofsigmar/comments/8qn0qa/i_dont_think_the_seraphon_spawning_pools_are_a/

So while the old ones  might be a throw-away line for narrative they'll still build on this to allow more sub-factions and justify their presence with a party in the AoS rpg along with the main core of their lore still being "star daemons" in constellation armadas as that let's them be anywhere in the lore and a active force in the story.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[trolemon]

Hey look, no Seraphon warcry cards. Could this means theres new models on the way, or that they dont know what to do with them as a faction?

[Clan's Cynic]

What do the War Cry designers have against Fyreslayers? You'd think mostly-naked-axe-wielders-with-loincloths would be a shoe-in for such a game.

[madmac]

12 minutes ago, trolemon said:

Hey look, no Seraphon warcry cards. Could this means theres new models on the way, or that they dont know what to do with them as a faction?

As much as I want new Saurus models, this appears just to be them splitting up the releases.

They're also only releasing one of the three new monsters, three reboxed factions, and about half of the other factions confirmed in Tome of Champions that do have models.

Interesting note though, no more Sisters of Battle this week, with only like half their range out yet.

I think we're in for two to three weeks of boxed set releases as they gradually roll through the Warcry updates along with the Ogor Warband for underworlds, ect. Probably resuming SoB in February.

Also didn't notice at first that they are expanding the rules for the non-chaos warbands a bit by chucking in new models. Really annoying if you already have the models and just want the rules.

Edited January 19, 2020 by madmac

[JPjr]

@trolemon & @Clan's Cynic both Fyreslayers and Seraphon have campaigns in the Warcry Tome of Champions, so I assume they'll release their cards in a second wave with the cat and ogroids.

[Whitefang]

I just want to point out in the fiction where spawn pool was mentioned, the Slann of that temple was actually dying and hence lost its consciousness.

As a result it took no part in the spawning process so the responsibility falls to a skink priest, who just simply pushed a button to start the spawning pool.

That doesn't look like a "summon" or "remember" process to me.

But surely in the new battletome designers will find a way to explain this. Seraphon can still be order daemons (I believe they will keep that) and star construct, but in a bit different form.

However in the new battletome there will likely to be much much more new fluff, considering their 1st book actuall had little regarding the fluff. I won't complain that for many books in 1.0 had that problem, not mention Seraphon is the first to get book. (or second? after SCE?) I think the greatest one will be the re-introduction of old ones.

[zilberfrid]

44 minutes ago, Baron Klatz said:

the city builder

The city builder is an odd thing, as it is utterly incompatible with Cities. It's weird that just a few months before the release of Cities, the direction pointed so far from what it became.

I would not place too much trust in what it will reflect in the rules.

[ageofpaddsmar]

3 minutes ago, Whitefang said:

I just want to point out in the fiction where spawn pool was mentioned, the Slann of that temple was actually dying and hence lost its consciousness.

As a result it took no part in the spawning process so the responsibility falls to a skink priest, who just simply pushed a button to start the spawning pool.

That doesn't look like a "summon" or "remember" process to me.

But surely in the new battletome designers will find a way to explain this. Seraphon can still be order daemons (I believe they will keep that) and star construct, but in a bit different form.

However in the new battletome there will likely to be much much more new fluff, considering their 1st book actuall had little regarding the fluff. I won't complain that for many books in 1.0 had that problem, not mention Seraphon is the first to get book. (or second? after SCE?) I think the greatest one will be the re-introduction of old ones.

So Feb release then? 

[Baron Klatz]

Oh yeah, it was just narrative lore building.

Just now, Whitefang said:

I think the greatest one will be the re-introduction of old ones.

I'm not too convinced on the Old Ones yet. 5 years and only one mention doesn't really give them the impact they once had as the Gods so easily trump them and are they main forces that shape th realms, like at best it could be the pantheon that had them make a few gates before they and the mortal races did it themselves. We'll see though.

As for the dying Slann story it's already told in the Seraphon battletome that the memories evolve. A second-in-command Starpriest would have centuries to solidify and take over.

Edit: Oh haha, I mistook what you meant. You meant the spawning process wasn't them being remembered in. That needs some official explaining but I took it just that they were developing just like they replicated the star temples into armadas compared to when they took off from the World-that-was. Having an entire realm of life magic likely sped up that progress for pool research.

Anyway, the Spire Tyrants are looking cool. Love the race diversity. I hope Freeguild gets that one day.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[Whitefang]

27 minutes ago, Baron Klatz said:

Gods so easily trump them, like at best it could be the pantheon that had them make a few gates before they and the mortal races did it themselves.

I think you make a mistake

THE OLD ONES is different from the Cthulhu-like old ones which are bested by Sigmar and his friends.

Besides, there is a very heavy mentioning of The Old Ones in the tome of champions, while in the first seraphon battletome there is zero

Just like what they add into the second Fyreslayer and Syvalneth battletome (other dwarven gods & Kurnoth/Kurnous), The Old Ones will likely be the extra stuff for Serahon this time.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Whitefang

[HorticulusTGA]

36 minutes ago, trolemon said:

Hey look, no Seraphon warcry cards. Could this means theres new models on the way, or that they dont know what to do with them as a faction?

There is no Nurgle, Slaanesh, etc. cards either.

But Seraphon ARE in the Tome Of Champions 2019, so they'll have cards, but in the next wave. 

[Baron Klatz]

Just now, Whitefang said:

I think you make a mistake

THE OLD ONES is different from the Cthulhu-like old ones which are bested by Sigmar and his frien

No no, I fully meant the Old Ones from the World-that-was. Universe hoping space scientists still don't compare to actual gods.

However your Tome of Champions evidence does support they'll get mentions again at least in the new Seraphon tome while still balancing out their place as star daemons as by the charged by the heavens fluff.

It'll be an interesting lore expansion Indeed.

Just now, HorticulusTGA said:

There is no Nurgle, Slaanesh, etc. cards either.

But Seraphon ARE in the Tome Of Champions 2019, so they'll have cards, but in the next wave. 

Makes me wonder if that's why they could speak in a fast release so some new Seraphon models can go with it? Probably wishful thinking though.

Good to see Ossiarchs coming so soon. The campaign book would be odd without them.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[Whitefang]

But it's really funny if you think about what The Old Ones did

Firstly they came to a planet, did some creating job and finally messed up, fled into the space without their servants

Years later this world finally blew up, kind of  The Old Ones' fault

Eight new worlds formed and these guys came agains, built something up, ignored their poor servants, and ran into the space thie time before Chaos had a chance to say "Surprise!"

Really wonder if they had a handshake with Sigmar to say "Nice to meet you and Bye Bye! Be a good responsible boy this time Siggy!" 

Or were they just sneaking out with worrying of waking  sleeping little Sigmar up？

I won't be surprised if the true name of The Old Ones is "GW"

Edited January 19, 2020 by Whitefang

[Baron Klatz]

Haha, that is the interesting part of it.  Where they fit between the original god-beasts who were the primordial rulers of the Mortal Realms that kept the numerous mortal races in their place and then Sigmar and  his pantheon's coming.

With how powerful the God-beasts were (Sigmar having to do hit-and-run tactics on a few even) it's possible they were chased out before Sigmar arrived. That leaves some room for their failed attempts to make civilization which angered the God-beasts.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Baron Klatz

[HorticulusTGA]

... And I am more with @Whitefang for the Seraphon "debate" :

Between Malign Portents (Dying Star) and Warcry (Tome Of Champion 2019) - and the general tone or "feel" of AOS since Malign Portents, more detailed and grounded - it seems to me that the Seraphon will be what they always should have been : 

Creatures of flesh and (cold) blood, infused with Azyr might, and wielding the magical technology of the Old Ones (like Space Ships, seen since the End Times and their first Battletome). Recently Phil Kelly also said on Twitch that there are battles between Seraphon Space Ships and Tzeentch Silver Towers in the Aetheric Void. 

Also, as much as I like Josh Reynolds' writings about the new Cities, and his world-building of mid-early AOS, I think he takes some freedom with two aspects of his takes on AOS' lore,  his "cosmic" views of the early Mortal Realms and the nature of the (non-Chaos) gods. Those have a bit evolved since AOS2 ("cosmic horror" or godbeasts or big monsters, cf. Forbidden Power or the Beasts Of Chaos Battletome, etc.). For example in a recent WD article, Kelly makes the difference between Elemental and Ascended gods, an important distinction IMO, which is kinda absent from Reynold's work, but work fine for almost all GW settings.  So I don't think it's safe to base ones view of the cosmic part of AOS world-building only on him. TLDR in those matter - and Seraphon - I'm inclined to follow Kelly (from the Studio) over Reynolds (from BL)  

[Whitefang]

However I doubt designers will abandon the concept of "Order Daemon", considering in orther 2.0 battletomes they decided to more or less keep some unique features to the faction. But what's the solution? Will there be a mixture? Or "Order Daemon" but in magic infused flesh? No idea.

We shall see in the new tome