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10 hours ago, Overread said:

I figure for Warhammer this retreat into a bit of childhood for many of them is not just a means to reflect their unchanging state over the millennia, but also a means by which they are kept in check from simply taking over everything because they can outlive any competition. In theory a very mature, very smart vampire has no need of armies - they can sneak, hide and worm their way into society and play the long game taking everything over from the shadows. Yet in practice we see them getting childishly and emotionally impulsive, withdrawn, cattish infighting etc... 

But, but good sir, in my mind  as one of 3 (well, 5 now) mortarchs, one of the  few creatures (?)  who is just less powerful than a god, master manipulator and the oldest spymaster in the mortal realms,  Neferata should just be like the "really smart vampire" that you described, not some arrogant  cartoonish bad girl who grant happiness  and superiority from tricking young boy and his ancestors...

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I think we are through all or almost all models for OBR and apart from catapult I see no range units? I'm pretty sure @Thomas Lyonstold a rumour they were supposed to be a ranged army. 

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So how about that new Ossiarch hero? https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/10/07/lords-of-the-ossiarch-bonereapers-revealedgw-homepage-post-2/

Good to see a generic fighty hero too, the Liege-Kavalos, I was getting concerned that there wouldn't be one. Looks cool too, it's very much the same silhouette as the Lord-Celestant on Dracoth but he's also got a pretty close pose to that of Volturnos. I like the continuity between Mannfred & Co.'s dread abyssals and the mount, looks slightly more pronounced than on the regular cavalrymen.

The special character version isn't bad - check out that Egyptian-style bone beard! - but the generic one wins out, I think.

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I like the mount of SC far more than the normal one, but think the face of generic one is better, looks more like a proper skull

Also their pose just looks like mirroring IDK Akelian Kings

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want to like them, I really do..the  concept is really cool but the models are just so cheesy in my eyes. Maybe after the drop and different paint jobs start popping up I may see them differently but doubtful. 

The four- armed walking throne character looks interesting so actually looking forward to see better pics but overall this fan was just disappointed with this new faction, more so with each new reveal. 😕😔

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24 minutes ago, Whitefang said:

Also their pose just looks like mirroring IDK Akelian Kings

Yeah that seems to be a bit of a problem with their mounted on horse-equivalent heroes, they all have very similar poses. But to be fair how many heroic poses on a horse can there be really? That said I wouldn't mind an action pose every now and then similar to what they did with the new Loonboss on Giant Squig.

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I think the thing about using the rather limited palette of commanding poses they use on the mounted leader types is that they don't look out of place whether they are placed is combat or not.

Use a more fighty pose and it looks awkward just deployed. Use a more at ease pose and it doesn't really don't look the part in melee.

Now, all in all, I don't think GW is too fussed if a pose doesn't really fit every situation. They go for a rather wild mix of combat action, at ease, doing something non-combat and pure posing with unit kits and less central heroes. But I think it's different for these kind of miniatures.

Along with some others, Aekelian Kings, Lord Celestants or now the Liege-Kavalos are intendet to be the go-to Generals of their factions and quite often the first centerpiece a player will get for a new army. That makes them quite important to the appeal of the faction as a whole. So those really need to look good in every marketing shot (so, placed in and out of combat), as well as drawing more attention from their owners.

It propably also really helps that they are also the poses people learn to expect to see in paintings and monuments of various generals, immediatly calling them out as army leaders to even casual onlookers.

Edited by Rogue Explorator
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Others have touched upon it, but I don't think I'd say the pose is simply copied from SC or other heroes. 

GW has chosen similar poses for for many of their mounted heroes for a reason, take a look at artistic depictions of historical figures (horses seem to rarely have all four hooves on the ground)

napoleon-on-st-bernhard.jpg.506cd0c82586b602039f937d320fb676.jpg

 

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2 hours ago, Shearl said:

Others have touched upon it, but I don't think I'd say the pose is simply copied from SC or other heroes. 

GW has chosen similar poses for for many of their mounted heroes for a reason, take a look at artistic depictions of historical figures (horses seem to rarely have all four hooves on the ground)

napoleon-on-st-bernhard.jpg.506cd0c82586b602039f937d320fb676.jpg

 

 

Never recognized where Archaons pose came from!

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2 hours ago, Shearl said:

Others have touched upon it, but I don't think I'd say the pose is simply copied from SC or other heroes. 

GW has chosen similar poses for for many of their mounted heroes for a reason, take a look at artistic depictions of historical figures (horses seem to rarely have all four hooves on the ground)

napoleon-on-st-bernhard.jpg.506cd0c82586b602039f937d320fb676.jpg

 

Some views maintain that a horse statue with one leg raised is associated with a rider who was injured but did not die in battle.

A horse with all four feet on the ground is said to represent a rider that was neither killed nor injured in battle but who died away from the battlefield of something unrelated to war or battle.

A horse with both the legs in air is said to represent a rider who died in the battlefield, during a war.

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14 minutes ago, Souleater said:

What's a horse standing on three tacticool rocks represent? 

Roboute Guilliman. 

Edited by Austin
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2 hours ago, Shearl said:

Others have touched upon it, but I don't think I'd say the pose is simply copied from SC or other heroes. 

GW has chosen similar poses for for many of their mounted heroes for a reason, take a look at artistic depictions of historical figures (horses seem to rarely have all four hooves on the ground)

napoleon-on-st-bernhard.jpg.506cd0c82586b602039f937d320fb676.jpg

 

Knight of shroud on steed !

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41 minutes ago, pseudonyme said:

Knight of shroud on steed !

It's the Freeguild General on horse. He died in the vanguard of the Great Culling of august 2019.

Two legs in the air is correct, the mold is probably worn out, considering the flash on my newest General on Horse, so he went down fighting.

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8 hours ago, Dirtnaps said:

Yeah that seems to be a bit of a problem with their mounted on horse-equivalent heroes, they all have very similar poses. But to be fair how many heroic poses on a horse can there be really? That said I wouldn't mind an action pose every now and then similar to what they did with the new Loonboss on Giant Squig.

Standing on the mount, leaning forward extremely like there charging, running besides the mount, already lancing a enemy, hanging on the side of the mount while slashing a weapon, actively shouting orders, while drawing a weapon, mount pouncing while the hero hangs on for dear life, mount cuddling the rider*, etc. I honestly think their more  options than foot heroes as you can play with the interaction between mount and rider. 

*imagine kurghos khul’s hellhound licking the face of mister khul when his doggie jumps up to slobber his face 😂

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1 hour ago, zilberfrid said:

Some views maintain that a horse statue with one leg raised is associated with a rider who was injured but did not die in battle.

A horse with all four feet on the ground is said to represent a rider that was neither killed nor injured in battle but who died away from the battlefield of something unrelated to war or battle.

A horse with both the legs in air is said to represent a rider who died in the battlefield, during a war.

Ill try to find the source but I’m pretty sure this has been disproved. Something about one statue maker that did do this and people shouting ‘see it’s true’ when it accidentally matches. and kind of ignored when it doesn’t. 

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8 minutes ago, Kramer said:

Ill try to find the source but I’m pretty sure this has been disproved. Something about one statue maker that did do this and people shouting ‘see it’s true’ when it accidentally matches. and kind of ignored when it doesn’t. 

Yeah, it is not a universal truth at all, but since it was believed for a time, there is correlation for some statues after the fact.

My statement was deliberately non-authoritive for that reason.

I choose to take this representation when I can, because it helps create a narrative.

Edited by zilberfrid
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@zilberfrid You forgot something: "three legs in the air indicates that the rider got lost on the way to the battle; and four legs in the air means that the sculptor was very, very clever. Five legs in the air means that there's probably at least one other horse standing behind the horse you're looking at; and the rider lying on the ground with his horse lying on top of him with all four legs in the air means that the rider was either a very incompetent horseman or owned a very bad-tempered horse.”

Good old Discworld.

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*pokes the site* it lives again! 

It would be neat if GW would watch some of the trick/stunt horse riding teams that go around and get some inspiration from them. Granted its the kind of riding that might not be all to effective in actual battle; but for lithe and light characters like aelves you could easily see them standing on the backs of two horses, perfectly in control and balanced without reins. Or with a modified saddle so that they could not just swing into the side and lash out with a sword but go around under and up the other side of hte horse (not sure if that would actually translate well as a model though). 

 

Otherwise your standard "heroic" pose as defined by classical art works. Also don't forget that many motions can appear rather odd if you freeze them mid-motion. Take jumping, if you photograph a horse with its hind legs on the ground when jumping it almost looks like its more standing and leaning on an invisible bar with its front legs; rather than leaping. You need it timed just after the legs leave the ground to give that sense of actual motion (which in a model means you've got to sculpt it with grass and dirt flying up to the hooves as it takes off to give it a contact point). 

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What this model hits home, more than the basic cavalry, is how bloomin' big the mounts ("Regular Abyssals?") are. Their shape and structure doesn't quite match up with any living animal - even putting aside the bone structure that could never be anything natural, look at those rear shins - and the heads and legs clearly come variously from rhinos, dracoths, griffins, giant warthogs, etc. These are seriously big constructs, larger than juggernauts. Fitting for stormcast-sized warriors.

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Lets not forget that a lot of GW's general mounted models are quite small in comparison to the riders. Horses and mounts were often kept smaller to make them cheaper to cast and practical to field on the table. You see the same if you compare things like the artwork of seeker riders to the actual model. In the artwork they are quite chunky mounts, in the model they have some of that but not as much. 

You can see the same if you compare things like the Raging Heroes mounted models to GW ones. 

 

Part of it is a style and GW was very in line with the standard 20-30 years ago for mounted models. I think that with plastics and such we could and should, in theory, have horses closer to the size of demigryphs and such - large draft horses designed to hold the weight of an armoured rider and to thunder forward etc... Indeed it would be neat to see them alongside other horses, smaller ones, used by a flanking archery unit - emulating the smaller mongolian ponies and their archer riders etc...

 

Of course alongside that GW has also branched out into more heroic poses and less of that "Parade Ground" posing too. 

 

 

 

In other interesting observations look at where the bit of the bridle is. It's right at the back of the mouth near the jawbone, whilst in reality a bit sits far further forward and would be between the mounts fore and rear teeth. Of course for the hero mount the mount has a huge mouth of sharp teeth and no natural gap between the fore and rear teeth. It's another sign that these creatures are not simply a skeleton brought to life. 

And yet the fact that its got even just a bit and reins suggests that these mounts are not totally "docile". That they have a life and mind of their own and are wild creatures. It makes the Bonereapers quite interesting and will be neat to see how they perform in the lore itself. Whilst they are clearly a heavily constructed army in soul and body, it also seems that they have quite a lot of potential independent thinking potential. That coupled to their multiple souls could make them quite a curious race to interact with. It also raises the possiblity that they will be a "people" not just a machine construct. Which introduces the potential for Bonereaper settlements. Perhaps even a Matrix like aspect to them - machines built by a great creator who are then gifted with the ability to create themselves. Mayhap they might start making sons and daughters not just warriors. What if a Reaper is made who wants to be poet not a warrior?! 

Edited by Overread

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20 minutes ago, Overread said:

What if a Reaper is made who wants to be poet not a warrior?! 

😳

Are we getting Felix as a Bonereaper and not as a Stormcast as initially hinted at/assumed by Gotrek?! 😜

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Interesting take aways from the article from a lore perspective is that they are called Warrior Monarchs and also the mission of the "purification of Shyish".

Obviously there can be no monarchs without kingdoms, this might of course mean they were monarchs in life now generals in death, but that is not made entirely clear. This is more interesting with the mission of the purification of Shyish, if Nagash is creating kingdoms entirely for the dead.

I really do hope this will create something interesting with the Soulblight vampires, as I can't see them being too happy about giving up all their living thralls. Sitting in kingdoms of nothing but the dead is bad for business for those who feed on the living. 

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8 minutes ago, Double Misfire said:

😳

Are we getting Felix as a Bonereaper and not as a Stormcast as initially hinted at/assumed by Gotrek?! 😜

Hey far as I know Gotrek has not yet confirmed it. He greatly suspects Felix would be a Stormcast because of his noble life defending the lands of men from the taint of chaos, however I'm not sure if he is a stormcast (though I've not yet made it as far as the End Times stories about them so I don't know what happens to Felix in them - yet). Felix could well have fallen through a crack and wound up a Reaper! 

Imagine poor Gotrek - travelling not just with an aelf who, for all intents and purposes, is a DARK ELF to Gotrek, but then having to wander with the product of a necromancers madness in a Skeletal construct Felix! He only just tolerated Ulrika in the old tales and was half way to slicing her in half

 

@Scurvydog it might not be a purging of all life, but possibly more a purging of non-death-peoples. Ergo that the living are not hated, don't forget the Reapers talk of a Tithe, they clearly realise that if they destroy all living things then their bone supply will eventually run out. Taking a Tithe suggests that they will treat living settlements like farms, taking their tithe and reaping a harvest from them. 

Purification would likely take the concept of cleaning the lands of Stormcast, of the living who don't follow Nagash. Cleaning out Orruk infestation; Chaos taint; pesky Stormcast and human settlements who stand against or who just don't want to pay the Tithe. 

 

 

Calling them Monarchs I think ties into their slight mongolian influence. The idea that the hoards of the Reapers are made up of united "Clans" of reapers brought under one ruler. Lets not forget whilst this is a "new" army, the story speaks of how Nagash was building them for aeons and that the new leader is only now taking command of the full force under him. So the Monarchs might well compete for his attention and reward; or might even plot against each other. They might even have old rivalries and such. 

Edited by Overread
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