The Rumour Thread

[Captain Marius]

What a great day for aos news!

Im reallly impressed by the new rules for the Great Unclean One and Nurgle heralds, and all the other Maggotkin stuff revealed on the War of Sigmar review. Major change to how summoning works for Nurgle, which i expect will be reflected by a similar change for Death summoning.

I did not expect them to revisit the whole Death range, let alone with 4 different themed allegiances based on Nagash and the 3 mortarchs - this has made me excited enough to crack back on with my never ending skellie rebasing project in preparation!

I expect Nurgle, Custodes and Thousand Sons to take up tje release slots for the next six weeks, maybe with the Necromunda Orlocks and the next Shadespire warband in there too - so17th feb i expect will be the proper start of malign portents with the book and the Nagash battletome.

Also, whoever thought of letting Thousand Sons use the mutalith vortex beast is a genius - i love it when kits can be used across multiple factions or even systems!

[Jamopower]

I really wish that Nagash/Mortarchs are not compulsory for running those factions as I'm not a big fan of special characters. Especially as I usually play quite small skirmishes. 

[bsharitt]

39 minutes ago, Jamopower said:

I really wish that Nagash/Mortarchs are not compulsory for running those factions as I'm not a big fan of special characters. Especially as I usually play quite small skirmishes. 

I doubt they'll be compulsory in every list, just that each allegiance will be themed around one and they'll probably synergize well with their underlings.

[Mr. White]

So, the noble Flesh Eater Courts should not be in the Legions of Nagash, correct?

I hope not. Part of their appeal for me is their rogue-like nature within the Death grand alliance.

[Amradiel]

35 minutes ago, Mr. White said:

So, the noble Flesh Eater Courts should not be in the Legions of Nagash, correct?

I hope not. Part of their appeal for me is their rogue-like nature within the Death grand alliance.

They are still their own faction

[Majorkill18]

Chances are it may only be Mannfred's prerogative to field them. An outcast leading rogues is poetic.

[Kaleb Daark]

How about tomb kings coming back in another form?

setra was ressirected by the chaos gods at the end of end times.. technically he’s owned by them now and of course he hates nagash.

 

now theres a story arc that was left open that’ll never happen.

[smucreo]

4 hours ago, Carnelian said:

Neferata wants to have a word....

Oh, yeah haha I guess the Queen of Vampires outranks Mannfred.

[swarmofseals]

3 hours ago, bsharitt said:

I think we're in for some changes to warscrolls, at least some tweaks. There've been some for Nurgle, so I'd assume death would get some, especially to work with new allegiances and abilities.

Yeah, I sure hope so. In the past they have only changed warscrolls when a new kit was released (if I recall correctly) with the one exception of the Grundstok Thunderers "fix" in the GHB. This would be the first time (I think) that they might change warscrolls without a new kit accompanying the change.

[swarmofseals]

3 hours ago, Jamopower said:

I really wish that Nagash/Mortarchs are not compulsory for running those factions as I'm not a big fan of special characters. Especially as I usually play quite small skirmishes. 

I suspect that they won't be. This is speculation to some degree, but up until now GW has generally kept special characters as relatively niche. Even the ones that see a good deal of competitive play (like Kairos) are far from mandatory and typically get taken in addition to a generic warscroll of the same type (IE: Kairos + LoC) as opposed to instead.

[AthlorianStoners]

“Battletome: Legions of Nagash is designed  to make sure that Death players have just as many options as their counterparts. Inside, you’ll find the warscrolls for every single Death model (so far…) alongside four new Allegiances within Death – the Grand Host of Nagash, Legion of Shadows, Legion of Sacrament and Legion of Blood. You’ll also find rules for the Soulblight vampires, if you’re looking to field one of Death’s most elite armies. If you would rather have an army formed from multiple facets of Nagash’s legions, there are also rules for those who pledge themselves more generally to the powers of Death.”

 

So it sounds like the 6 alliegances are: 

- Generic Death Army

- Grand Host of Nagash 

- Legion Of Blood

- Legion Of Night

- Legion Of Sacrament 

- Soulblight 

 

That’s interesting and pretty cool, I assume the legions will have access to different units then.

 

[Rogue Explorator]

So, I have just read the Death article in the new WD. Most of it reads like it was written for Vampire Counts with some slight "oh yeah, right, this is AoS" amendments. I found that strange, since, to me, so far the portrayal of Death in AoS has been far more diverse, interesting and nuanced, so I hope this is no permanent return to "the old ways".

 

3 hours ago, Mr. White said:

So, the noble Flesh Eater Courts should not be in the Legions of Nagash, correct?

I hope not. Part of their appeal for me is their rogue-like nature within the Death grand alliance.

Well they are over all the most likely Undead to go rogue.

Well, actually I got the impression Nighthaunt are in fact even wilder than FEC, but most of the really troublesome ones are propably locked up safely in the Underworlds.

However, the battletome makes mention that numerous Flesheater Kings are still enthralled by Nagash, often worshipping him as part of their delusion. So it would actually go against established lore if there where no FEC among the Legions of Nagash. That does not mean that many other of the Kings are not still as far away from Nagash as possible if not even actively opposed to him (still from far away if they have any sort of sense left). Its not like the FEC hold regular conference to agree on their common agenda.

 

It is propably very few Undead who can resist when their god calls them to service. Though there is propably a sizable number who would deny it if some lowly Souldblight tries to do it in his name.

[Envyus]

This was a comment on facebook from the Age of Sigmar guys about the Ghouls and how they would relate to the Nagash book.

"The Flesh Eater courts have a complicated relationship with the Lord of Death, and while they do fight alongside other Death warriors, they aren't part of Nagash's shambling undying legion"

 

Anyway I really like this. Squishing factions into more thematic ones makes a lot more sense. I hope this is just a start for things to come and we get Skaven, High Elves and Free Peoples books that does the same thing,

[bsharitt]

1 hour ago, Rogue Explorator said:

Well, actually I got the impression Nighthaunt are in fact even wilder than FEC, but most of the really troublesome ones are propably locked up safely in the Underworlds.

Just curious, where'd that impression come from? Books or battetomes?

[BrownDog]

'NighthauntTM' maybe this is a tease for things to come?

[Turgol]

Iam 99% sure it will be:

-Nagash allegiance

-Sacrament, Night and Blood allegiances

-Soulblight

-Deathrattle

This leaves almost all factions (exceptions being deadwalkers and monsters) covered and explains why Deathrattle was left out of GH 2017. And implies new releases will be 100% new.

 

[Inqy]

1 hour ago, Envyus said:

This was a comment on facebook from the Age of Sigmar guys about the Ghouls and how they would relate to the Nagash book.

"The Flesh Eater courts have a complicated relationship with the Lord of Death, and while they do fight alongside other Death warriors, they aren't part of Nagash's shambling undying legion"

 

Anyway I really like this. Squishing factions into more thematic ones makes a lot more sense. I hope this is just a start for things to come and we get Skaven, High Elves and Free Peoples books that does the same thing,

A bit of a shame, but I can't say it comes as a shock. FEC's have less need of an overhaul and already have a battletome so if something had to be cut for wordcount it figures it would be their Warscrolls. (I mean, I'd have liked new command abilities for the Abhorrants and some way to protect courtiers from ranged sniping but eh, can't have everything.)

I do hope it'll be possible to include them in some of the new factions though. Don't see why Mannfred wouldn't have ghouls in his army.

[bsharitt]

1 hour ago, BrownDog said:

'NighthauntTM' maybe this is a tease for things to come?

I don't get what the tease would be here. We already knew he was Nighthaunt.

On another note, I can't help but notice that the box is Malign Portents specific. This is of course not the first time GW has released models for a specific even of originally only in a particular set and I know there's probably no reason to worry, but have there been event in the past where GW released new specific models for the event, and after it was over they never went into general circulation?

[Tailessine]

I expect a Nighthaunt battletome in a few months based on clues so far; they also have mostly modern kits and only really need a couple of warscroll changes e.g. malignant to Nighthaunt. A new battleline would be nice, or they may try to use existing kits like they did with FEC and beastclaw. I imagine spirit hosts are only a monobuild (but could be painted seperately?) but could hexwraiths/blacknights  be melded to made a different unit ? Even cairn wraiths as a unit, possibly using a specific face, would work....

[Sleboda]

7 hours ago, Rogue Explorator said:

So, I have just read the Death article in the new WD. Most of it reads like it was written for Vampire Counts with some slight "oh yeah, right, this is AoS" amendments. I found that strange, since, to me, so far the portrayal of Death in AoS has been far more diverse, interesting and nuanced, so I hope this is no permanent return to "the old ways".

I am very concerned that after all this time GW has had to work on Death, all we are going to get is "spooooooky ghosts and vampires" again.

[Jamopower]

5 hours ago, Turgol said:

Iam 99% sure it will be:

-Nagash allegiance

-Sacrament, Night and Blood allegiances

-Soulblight

-Deathrattle

This leaves almost all factions (exceptions being deadwalkers and monsters) covered and explains why Deathrattle was left out of GH 2017. And implies new releases will be 100% new.

 

My guess is that deathrattle won't be its own allegiance per se, but the deathrattle troops will feature heavily in the alleginces of the Mortachs and especially Nagash. 

[Envyus]

5 hours ago, Turgol said:

Iam 99% sure it will be:

-Nagash allegiance

-Sacrament, Night and Blood allegiances

-Soulblight

-Deathrattle

This leaves almost all factions (exceptions being deadwalkers and monsters) covered and explains why Deathrattle was left out of GH 2017. And implies new releases will be 100% new.

 

We already know what the Allegiances are. 
Nagash, Mortarchs, Soulblight and Death.

 

Skeletons and Ghosts don't need their own battletomes. I assume Deathrattle's will be standard units in all Mortarch and Nagash armies, while Nighthaunt will be synergize best by the Sacrament or Night allegiance. 

It's far better for Allegiances to focus on more thematic things like Nagash or the Mortarchs. Rather then Army of Skeletons, Army of Ghosts. 

[Turgol]

3 hours ago, Envyus said:

We already know what the Allegiances are. 
Nagash, Mortarchs, Soulblight and Death.

 

Skeletons and Ghosts don't need their own battletomes. I assume Deathrattle's will be standard units in all Mortarch and Nagash armies, while Nighthaunt will be synergize best by the Sacrament or Night allegiance. 

It's far better for Allegiances to focus on more thematic things like Nagash or the Mortarchs. Rather then Army of Skeletons, Army of Ghosts. 

The article talks about 6 new allegiances being covered and then reveals 5. Death is covered in GH 2017. So unless you give a source, I call that “knowledge” of  Death being the 6th allegiance wrong. 

[Still-young]

1 hour ago, Turgol said:

The article talks about 6 new allegiances being covered and then reveals 5. Death is covered in GH 2017. So unless you give a source, I call that “knowledge” of  Death being the 6th allegiance wrong. 

‘Inside, you’ll find the warscrolls for every single Death model (so far…) alongside four new Allegiances within Death – the Grand Host of Nagash, Legion of Shadows, Legion of Sacrament and Legion of Blood. You’ll also find rules for the Soulblight vampires, if you’re looking to field one of Death’s most elite armies. If you would rather have an army formed from multiple facets of Nagash’s legions, there are also rules for those who pledge themselves more generally to the powers of Death.’

So, Nagash, Shadows, Sacrament, Blood, Soulblight and Death. 

[Rogue Explorator]

11 hours ago, bsharitt said:

Just curious, where'd that impression come from? Books or battetomes?

It is mostly an overall impression I get from the bits and pieces of lore we get here and there.

But I have got my GA:Death book on hand, it has some lines about how they are ghosts who managed to flee the Underworlds that even the Undead fear (I can not quote literally, since I only have a german copy to work of). There where some much more meaningfull bits of lore of this sort, but they are spread wide across multiple battletomes and other sources. I also remember GWs answer to complaints about the inability of Nighthaunt allying in a Mortis Engine being that the Nighthaunt on the Mortis Engine are bound by Nekromancy, which is something free Nighthaunt despise and they would rather tear Deathmages appart for it and never willingly work with them.

All in all, Nighthaunt have up to this been portrayed as escapees that just want to mess with the living and do not take kindly to being ordered around.

5 hours ago, Envyus said:

We already know what the Allegiances are. 
Nagash, Mortarchs, Soulblight and Death.

 

Skeletons and Ghosts don't need their own battletomes. I assume Deathrattle's will be standard units in all Mortarch and Nagash armies, while Nighthaunt will be synergize best by the Sacrament or Night allegiance. 

It's far better for Allegiances to focus on more thematic things like Nagash or the Mortarchs. Rather then Army of Skeletons, Army of Ghosts. 

The lore so far has portrayed both Deathrattle and Nighthaunt as forces that exist on their own when there is no greater power of Death to command them. They are a far call from their will-less puppet forebears from the World-that-Was Vampire Count armies

The Deathrattle are no longer the likes of the random Joe Shmoes hastily ressurected to form units for some Vampire or Necromancer and only animated bound to their will, but are often more like Tomb Kings, entire Kingdoms and cultures dating back to the Age of Myth of the dead reanimated in their own right, going through the motions of their previous lifes., directed by their Lords who still have an intact mind and personality. Yes, regular skeletons hastily raised to serve some master would not need their own battletome. But undying remnants of a lost age, wielding weapons not seen since the time of myth, acompanied by warbeasts long extinct would be a different matter.

Meanwhile, the Nighthaunt are the denizens of the Underworlds, which to me seem like a very important part of the cosmology. One that could be very well explored much more through a battletome. And the Nighthaunts we have seen so far are just the escapees. If the various Underworlds where to be opened, there are pretty much unlimited possibilities of what ghosts could surge into the Realms.

 

Both have the background and the possibility for expansion an army with its own battletome requires. It would be a pity if GW went back on their word and turned them back into being just the tools of Nekromancers and Vampires. Particularly for me, as I have no interest in either of those.

However, with some of the latest lore, it seems this is exactly where GW is heading, particularly for Deathrattle. The high hopes I had for the future of Deathrattle are certainly sinking by the day currently.