The Rumour Thread

[edmc78]

2 hours ago, SilentSentinel said:

The LGS that i'll hopefully be ordering from did mention that they had been allocated some more boxes that are set to deliver in 4 months. Based on this it does seem like there's at least one more run of the box planned.

 

Same here, I've been provisionally allocated a pre-order 'for the autumn' so I wonder if there will be waves of releases or some made to order stuff? -Never mind, caught up on the other stuff. 

 

Edited June 18, 2021 by edmc78

[Clan's Cynic]

Seems like LFGS stock is all over the place. One store near me's getting over a hundred boxes, others don't even have enough to cover interest.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Clan's Cynic

[Clan's Cynic]

7 hours ago, PrimeElectrid said:

Can we take a moment to talk about how flipping weird it is for a multi-million pound company to give a product to their mates to live stream in full 2 days prior to preorder so that nobody has to actually buy the book.

 

Influencers are a thing just about every medium-to-large company utilises these days. Maybe we're just old and cynical, but it seems younger generations really love the whole "wow this Youtuber is so friendly and personal and he sent me a thank you for donating to his Patreon, I'm going to go buy the products he gets for free because he said they're amazing!" thing. Obviously indorsements from people is nothing new in advertising, but definitely a more 'personalable' angle with things like Twitch and YouTube that arise from people who began as being genuine fans in makeup brands, video games, wargames, etc that do wonders to convince people to Buy The Product. 

[Scurvydog]

Living outside the UK I will try to preorder any from the webshops here, but got just about 0 hope to actually get a box. Can hardly get an undercoat spray outside the UK these days, getting increasingly hard to be part of the hobby in the rest of the EU and seems GW has 0 interest in trying to address that based on this information. 

[Gailon]

6 hours ago, Sleboda said:

It's sort of a topic on it's own, but sadly, yes. Prizes at tournaments are, in my opinion, one of the absolute worst parts about this hobby.

It's bad enough that some folks use winning at these things as some sort of alpha dog creating, personality validating, ego inflating experience that lets them measure the size of their, um, you know, in public, but when you then also dangle vacations, cash, and/or hundreds (or thousands) of dollars worth of toys in the face of these "bruh, do you even lift, bruh" types, it gets so much worse.

Prizes bring out the Roid Rager in far too many hobbyists.

I guess it just shows the full scope of something like Age of Sigmar that so many people who play it can have such a wildly different experience than I do. Makes me very grateful for my local gaming group where we play and have fun. Imagine that. 

[DoctorPerils]

I'll admit I was really excited to start Age of Sigmar when the new Hedonites models were previewed. Bought the battlebox with a friend, as well as the endless spells and a KoS. But ever since the battletome came out, my excitement has waned. It's not so much the army "not being good", it's the "not getting laughed off the table" that has me dubious. Years of getting tabled at 40k have taught me to see fun as the most important value when playing these games, but the faction that had me most hyped now feels unmotivating.

As things stand, I think I'll be pausing my GW purchases for the foreseeable future - neither of my factions in 40k seem to on the list to get updates soon, Hedonites definitely won't until at least the general's handbook FAQ (if there is such a thing), and the other Age of Sigmar armies that could interest me (cities of sigmar, Kharadron overlords, Kurnothi, and Chaos Dwarves) either have uncertain futures or are only even hinted at by the developers. This is a real shame, as both AoS3.0 and 40k9.0 seem to have great core rules.

With regards to the supposedly "toxic" community here - I must admit I feel very welcome in this forum, with loads of great people sharing awesome inspirational pictures and substantive comments and criticisms. In the last few weeks, people have been posting their concerns and hopes for AoS3, and it seems that the reveals for the upcoming rules have hyper-charged the very same concerns and hopes. I can't say I view any of those as toxic or unwelcoming, when critiques are aimed at a company who are responsible for the products we spend a lot of money on, and when enthusiasm is aimed at those products and the people who do great things with those products. What off puts me is people in the community taking aim at other people in the community for the valid opinions they hold: this goes both ways, when some try to shame others for pausing their engagement with an expensive hobby because of what they view as sub-par products, and those others kicking back at the former because they don't like being told they might be acting a little entitled. Both of these sides are a bit right and a bit wrong at the same time: we aren't entitled to a 100% balanced game system (after all, that doesn't and can't exist, at least not when we also want our new shinies), but conversely GW aren't entitled to our money if they can't convince us it's worth spending it on their products.

 

TL;DR: I love you all, and we're all here for our shared love of this hobby: let's shake hands and get along 🤗😙

PS: if you want us to sing Kumbaya together, that's fine by me

[PrimeElectrid]

9 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Influencers are a thing just about every medium-to-large company utilises these days. Maybe we're just old and cynical, but it seems younger generations really love the whole "wow this Youtuber is so friendly and personal and he sent me a thank you for donating to his Patreon, I'm going to go buy the products he gets for free because he said they're amazing!" thing. Obviously indorsements from people is nothing new in advertising, but definitely a more 'personalable' angle with things like Twitch and YouTube that arise from people who began as being genuine fans in makeup brands, video games, wargames, etc that do wonders to convince people to Buy The Product. 

I understand that influencers are part of the presale hype now, but this move counterintuitively lost sales because it just gave the book away.

[PJetski]

1 minute ago, PrimeElectrid said:

I understand that influencers are part of the presale hype now, but this move counterintuitively lost sales because it just gave the book away.

It lost some sales, but gains others

I'm certain that it's more of the latter than the former

[Sleboda]

3 minutes ago, Gailon said:

I guess it just shows the full scope of something like Age of Sigmar that so many people who play it can have such a wildly different experience than I do. Makes me very grateful for my local gaming group where we play and have fun. Imagine that. 

I hear what you're saying, but I think it's important to note that even these people in talking about are still "playing to have fun."

Fun is built into games. It's more about what makes an activity fun for a given player.

[AccendantEvincar]

1 hour ago, Golub87 said:

I understand, if I complain about legitimate issues today, that makes you look silly for all the abuse from GW you have accepted and came to expect over the years, right?

I dont think that is his point at all, you have every right as a consumer to complain. However it isnt always helpfull to yourself, i think hes trying to indicate this by saying to take a moment to step back etc.

As a long time player of games workshops products (started with 2nd ed 40k then i think it was 4th or 5th ed fantasy, the starter box was lizardmen and brettonia) i know full well the experience of edition changes messing with your army etc. I own a fair bit of the legion of azghor for example. Ive reacted accordingly to GWs buisness practices by buying from 3rd parties etc.

Over the last few years ive massively cut down my spending, i own a 2k (not any more) DOK army that i slowly bought over nearly two years.  I still have my old vampire count army and looking to update it a bit now the SBGL are a thing. Which im genuinly excited about, got images of a grim dark bloodborne inspire vamp army rolling around my head

This hobby is an investment its that simple and its up to you as a individual whether to be happy about that investment. Does it feel like a kick in the balls when a new edition messes with your army? Hell yeah it does but what he was alluding to i think is that when youve been in this a while you kind of expect it. Its the same with most games though, a new ed messes with the meta, a new patch when i used to play league would nerf my main etc. 

While i dont post on here often amongst my friends im.more than happy to criticise and praise GW where i see it is fit. Theres lots they do that i dont like but the thing is i LOVE the worlds that GW has created and the models around it, will admit i preferred the old world but AOS has really grown on me. My apologies for the ramble but my point is you either stick with it and enjoy the ride or you dont, either way is fine really, if the time you spend on anything isnt worth it then dont do.it

[Enoby]

11 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Influencers are a thing just about every medium-to-large company utilises these days. Maybe we're just old and cynical, but it seems younger generations really love the whole "wow this Youtuber is so friendly and personal and he sent me a thank you for donating to his Patreon, I'm going to go buy the products he gets for free because he said they're amazing!" thing. Obviously indorsements from people is nothing new in advertising, but definitely a more 'personalable' angle with things like Twitch and YouTube that arise from people who began as being genuine fans in makeup brands, video games, wargames, etc that do wonders to convince people to Buy The Product. 

Just as a little aside to add on to what you said for anyone interested, a lot of companies use influencers because the customers see themselves as more similar to these influencers and so trust them more

So if they see someone from GW say "ooh, these look good" most people think "well yeah, of course you'd say that", but if a more personal personality says "ooh, these look good" people are more likely to believe it's their personal opinion (even if they're being paid for it). 

Also, people tend to develop parasocial relationships with internet celebrities - kind of like one way friendship. Usually, the best way to convince someone to buy something is to have their friend tell them. 

Hope people found this a little interesting

[KingBrodd]

3 hours ago, Ogregut said:

Some more plastic ogor characters would be great, I'll actually paint the pile of big guys I've got in a box. Having so many finecast characters really put me off. 

To many armies, not enough time!! 

I'm hoping for 2 things character wise for Mawtribes in 3.0. 

8 new plastic Maneaters, each representing a different Realm.

Globb Glittermaw and Frost King Braggoth Vardruk getting models.

3 hours ago, Black_Templar_Lad said:

So what you're sayin is,  a new Firebelly is coming? 

Firebellys for 3.0!!

[Sunshine]

How long after the indomitus preorder date did Games Workshop announce a made to order run?

[Sleboda]

1 hour ago, Jagged Red Lines said:

Meanwhile there are more than enough copies to give to every social media personality to write glowing reviews of. Sick of it tbh. The whole thing feels scummy.

I won't debate the scumminess here (I tend to lean toward "not scummy"), one point -

Even if they handed out 1000 review copies (probably closer to 250 I'd guess), that's a deep in the water. It would not remove the scarcity issue.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Sleboda
Typo

[Clan's Cynic]

14 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

I won't debate the scumminess here (I tend to learn toward "not scummy"), one point -

Even if they handed out 1000 review copies (probably closer to 250 I'd guess), that's a deep in the water. It would not remove the scarcity issue.

The copies given out to influencers will definitely be a drop in the ocean, but there's the psychological impact to consider when you go on YouTube and every single channel tangentially related to wargaming's unboxing, paint and/or playing with Dominion's contents. Cursed City was especially bad for this when it became apparent that, no, you weren't getting your grubby mitts on it even whilst most influencers still had a good week or two's worth of content left about it. 

[sorokyl]

1 hour ago, Jagged Red Lines said:

Yeah, was hoping to get at least one box from them. Not enough copies on the initial run. GW creating artificial scarity again.

Meanwhile there are more than enough copies to give to every social media personality to write glowing reviews of. Sick of it tbh. The whole thing feels scummy.

Why do you think its artificial scarcity? Do you think GW has fun warehousing their hundreds of SKUs in warehouses around the world? I expect that they are getting them out as fast as possible, considering their plastic production has been bottlenecked for years and they are having to export in the middle of a global pandemic AND Brexit. Why does it seem like they made two runs? Who knows. These things have huge lead times. Maybe they realized their original order was not big enough. Maybe they had to swap production to something else. They're not doing it to ****** you off I promise. 

And no, the 50 review copies they sent out are not the reason you aren't getting one. That's called very effective advertising cost. They didn't say "We think we'll sell 10,000 of these. so we'll make 10,000. Oh lets give away 50 of those".  it's "Let's make 10,050 because this is way cheaper than google ads..."

[Feii]

3 hours ago, whispersofblood said:

lol look bro/sis if you want to mourn that's fine but don't pretend like you are acting rationally and debating or discussing. If you are just emoting online, perhaps flag your posts. Or do what I learned to do on Facebook, type it all out and don't hit post.

IF you want to play AoS3 then join the discussion, if you just want to moan about the misfortune of being a HoS player(A faction I myself play; I own 2 plastic KoS and 2 Soulfeasters.) then perhaps there are better ways to do that, which don't expose you to normal, and rational criticism to a hyperbolic position. Like just sit it out a minute and think about something else for a bit, I'm certain you will be happier afterwards.

I've been through Three edition changes in WHFB, five in 40k before finally giving up, and now 3 in AoS. Let me tell you for those of us who have been around you aren't saying anything someone didn't say going from 6th to 7th edition, to 8th edition, to AoS2. Every edition certain types of armies are invalidated, for instance my Chaos Army with 3 core(batteline) units of knights going from 7th to 8th were no longer core, and the required points for core went from units to % of the army. A massive invalidating change, but I wanted to play the game and I got on with it. If we are being cool, it (being able to use another factions batteline) was an interesting historical and practical aspect that let the god armies fill their batteline with generic Chaos units, but these factions all have their own versions of those units and probably should be relying on them going forward. It is unfortunate that your specific army got lost in the shuffle a bit, but have you considered playing S2D Slaanesh followers? That is one of the natural advantages to playing a Chaos Faction the core faction is always somewhat available.

I don't understand how can you be missing the point so much and be so egoistical about it. 

[SentinelGuy]

1 hour ago, Scurvydog said:

Living outside the UK I will try to preorder any from the webshops here, but got just about 0 hope to actually get a box. Can hardly get an undercoat spray outside the UK these days, getting increasingly hard to be part of the hobby in the rest of the EU and seems GW has 0 interest in trying to address that based on this information. 

This could be due to Brexit rather than GW. 

[AngryPanda]

I’m just gonna leave this meme here to summarize my overall feelings towards the HoS point increases, both from yesterday and carrying into today. This is gonna be the last comment on the HoS point increase I’ll make here because I agree that this forum is for rumors and not this type of discussion.
 

Regarding the nuke that HoS (an already crippled battletome) got to their points, it is the political equivalent of dropping a hydrogen bomb on a developing country, and having the UN say “let’s just wait and see what GW will do next, I’m sure it will get better.” 
 

I agree that we should wait for the FAQ, but this the last time we should wait before taking action. If there are changes, then we can end it here. Yet if there aren’t, then this is the kind of blunt disconnect from the community needs to be addressed; it’s just wrong and unfair to people who’ve spent hours painting their armies and being loyal customers only to be treated so poorly. We put numerous hours and hundreds of dollars into this hobby, you would think that GW would have the decency to be a bit more open about the changes they make? 
 

Take a look at what we did over on the HoS side of TGA. Since February, we kept saying “let’s wait.” We waited for our battletome to be released, only to be disappointed. We waited for the FAQ, which didn’t address any of the problems the book had. We waited for the GHB, which was a massive nerf to an already crippled faction, and now we are being asked to wait for the next FAQ. When is the waiting going to end? People who say we’re angry about the hobby and need to chill aren’t seeing the entirety of the picture here: we came together as a community and developed a survey that was submitted and confirmed to have been read. The vast majority of the community, in terms of player base and influential figures, agreed the book sucked. Yet, it feels like they took what we said and tossed us aside as if we are nothing. 

We’re not asking to be Uber-powerful; we’re just asking for some basic standards to be established. A point drop would of sufficed, people would have been happy if we had just stayed the same, or even gotten a very small increase in the new edition. Instead, HoS was the third most increased faction in the game. It’s wrong what they did, and if there aren’t changes in the faq we gotta do something to at least get some answers. 

[boyadventurer]

33 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

How long after the indomitus preorder date did Games Workshop announce a made to order run?

The post came out on the 13th, so two days after pre-order day.

Also on the day of the Indomitus release (the 25th), they did a big post showing the SM/Necron codexes, the tank/monolith, and the teaser for some of the other models that have come out since. Then after that we got info on all the smaller "starter sets" that contained portions of the Indomitus models. So we can probably expect something similar.

[edmc78]

53 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

How long after the indomitus preorder date did Games Workshop announce a made to order run?

about a day or so

[Golub87]

14 minutes ago, SentinelGuy said:

This could be due to Brexit rather than GW. 

I have to agree here. Transportation has been a nightmare in the past 18 months and UK is especially hard hit nowadays.

[Gailon]

5 minutes ago, AngryPanda said:

I’m just gonna leave this meme here to summarize my overall feelings towards the HoS point increases, both from yesterday and carrying into today. This is gonna be the last comment on the HoS point increase I’ll make here because I agree that this forum is for rumors and not this type of discussion.
 

Regarding the nuke that HoS (an already crippled battletome) got to their points, it is the political equivalent of dropping a hydrogen bomb on a developing country, and having the UN say “let’s just wait and see what GW will do next, I’m sure it will get better.” 
 

I agree that we should wait for the FAQ, but this the last time we should wait before taking action. If there are changes, then we can end it here. Yet if there aren’t, then this is the kind of blunt disconnect from the community needs to be addressed; it’s just wrong and unfair to people who’ve spent hours painting their armies and being loyal customers only to be treated so poorly. We put numerous hours and hundreds of dollars into this hobby, you would think that GW would have the decency to be a bit more open about the changes they make? 
 

Take a look at what we did over on the HoS side of TGA. Since February, we kept saying “let’s wait.” We waited for our battletome to be released, only to be disappointed. We waited for the FAQ, which didn’t address any of the problems the book had. We waited for the GHB, which was a massive nerf to an already crippled faction, and now we are being asked to wait for the next FAQ. When is the waiting going to end? People who say we’re angry about the hobby and need to chill aren’t seeing the entirety of the picture here: we came together as a community and developed a survey that was submitted and confirmed to have been read. The vast majority of the community, in terms of player base and influential figures, agreed the book sucked. Yet, it feels like they took what we said and tossed us aside as if we are nothing. 

We’re not asking to be Uber-powerful; we’re just asking for some basic standards to be established. A point drop would of sufficed, people would have been happy if we had just stayed the same, or even gotten a very small increase in the new edition. Instead, HoS was the third most increased faction in the game. It’s wrong what they did, and if there aren’t changes in the faq we gotta do something to at least get some answers. 

Frankly, it's perceptions in the community like this that make me understand GW's aloof lack of responsiveness to the community. Because there are so many people and so many competing interests, and so many people that are going to engage in pure hyperbole that it's not worth it. If you feel like there is no pleasing people, then just make your product and close your ears. 

Hydrogen bomb? That's the equivalent? You typed that out and feel like that's the best analogy to this situation? Let's see if we can think of some better analogies: 

It's like being a Sylvaneth player and being bottom tier for ages and then not getting points fixes. Maybe it's like being a Beast of Chaos player and then having a game released in the realm of beasts and it not being clear that any of it will do anything for your faction. Maybe it's like being a Seraphon player and having one of the oldest AoS 2.0 model ranges in the entire game, then getting a new book that doesn't update a single model. 

I don't like the "but GW has always treated people like trash" argument. But I don't think that's what's happening. This is more just that in a game this complicated and large there are always basement tier armies and units. That's a given. Isn't that a given in any competitive game with a shifting meta? There are heroes that are unusable in LoL or in DotA, 

It is definitely tough in Warhammer, where models are expensive and time consuming. You can't just switch armies. But the complaints are all about competitive power level. This is where I just don't see eye to eye with the severity of the complaints. (having a weak army is a bummer for sure, but HoS players here are acting, well, like this is a hydrogen bomb). If you have a weak army, then try to play against weak armies. There are a lot of them, there always are. Someone has a collection of spider riders they barely get to play with. 

Frankly, that's the same situation for powerful armies. Maybe some people like smashing their opponents to bits, but people with very strong armies also need to seek out specific opponents with strong armies to have a good game. 

If the concern is with high level competitive play, that you want to take an army to a tournament and win, then it is difficult for me to believe that that type of player (where that is their primary enjoyment from the game) is stuck with only a HoS army as their option. 

I think GW thought HoS would be better in 3.0 than it looks like it will be. There are arguments for this (summoning is more powerful now, depravity points could be more numerous). In my opinion, they were wrong. Just like how Wizards is frequently wrong about the strength of magic cards, or any other company that makes any other complex game with a shifting power balance. 

[Golub87]

1 minute ago, Gailon said:

Frankly, it's perceptions in the community like this that make me understand GW's aloof lack of responsiveness to the community. Because there are so many people and so many competing interests, and so many people that are going to engage in pure hyperbole that it's not worth it. If you feel like there is no pleasing people, then just make your product and close your ears. 

Hydrogen bomb? That's the equivalent? You typed that out and feel like that's the best analogy to this situation? Let's see if we can think of some better analogies: 

It's like being a Sylvaneth player and being bottom tier for ages and then not getting points fixes. Maybe it's like being a Beast of Chaos player and then having a game released in the realm of beasts and it not being clear that any of it will do anything for your faction. Maybe it's like being a Seraphon player and having one of the oldest AoS 2.0 model ranges in the entire game, then getting a new book that doesn't update a single model. 

I don't like the "but GW has always treated people like trash" argument. But I don't think that's what's happening. This is more just that in a game this complicated and large there are always basement tier armies and units. That's a given. Isn't that a given in any competitive game with a shifting meta? There are heroes that are unusable in LoL or in DotA, 

It is definitely tough in Warhammer, where models are expensive and time consuming. You can't just switch armies. But the complaints are all about competitive power level. This is where I just don't see eye to eye with the severity of the complaints. (having a weak army is a bummer for sure, but HoS players here are acting, well, like this is a hydrogen bomb). If you have a weak army, then try to play against weak armies. There are a lot of them, there always are. Someone has a collection of spider riders they barely get to play with. 

Frankly, that's the same situation for powerful armies. Maybe some people like smashing their opponents to bits, but people with very strong armies also need to seek out specific opponents with strong armies to have a good game. 

If the concern is with high level competitive play, that you want to take an army to a tournament and win, then it is difficult for me to believe that that type of player (where that is their primary enjoyment from the game) is stuck with only a HoS army as their option. 

I think GW thought HoS would be better in 3.0 than it looks like it will be. There are arguments for this (summoning is more powerful now, depravity points could be more numerous). In my opinion, they were wrong. Just like how Wizards is frequently wrong about the strength of magic cards, or any other company that makes any other complex game with a shifting power balance. 

So the uppity Slaanesh players should accept that they need to sit at the back of the bus with Sylvaneth and BoC and Spider Riders and just accept their lot in life?

[Aturox]

17 minutes ago, Golub87 said:

So the uppity Slaanesh players should accept that they need to sit at the back of the bus with Sylvaneth and BoC and Spider Riders and just accept their lot in life?

Tbh its more fitting for the aos 3 rules discussion instead of complaining about point updates in the rumor thread? There is literally no connection to this thread.

You can be upset and have every right to be but why should everybody else be upset aswell?

There is literally no merit to it but getting mad yourself.. I come here for some juicy rumors but i see only salt

Edited June 18, 2021 by Aturox