The Rumour Thread

[Neverchosen]

41 minutes ago, michu said:

Ok, first person who convert a Mega-Gargant to have Drill-fist  and sunglasses will win the internet.

"MY DRILL IS A DRILL THAT WILL PIERCE THE AZYR!!"

I feel Kamina's sword would be a little to long for a Mega-Gargant.

[michu]

3 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

I feel Kamina's sword would be a little to long for a Mega-Gargant.

But imagine crashing into Sigmar's place saying:

"WHO THE SHYISH YOU THINK I AM!?"

[Twisted Firaun]

1 hour ago, michu said:

But imagine crashing into Sigmar's place saying:

"WHO THE SHYISH YOU THINK I AM!?"

Well it is a well known fact that Gurren Lagann is one half of Gorkamorka(the other being Megas XLR), so who knows what the future holds for us?

[Grimrock]

6 hours ago, Kramer said:

Couple of additional thoughts to this from my end are:

- why the special edition battletome in the box? Makes the starting point so much more expensive. Maybe they just wanted to test it? 

- with the release of stormcast they also talked about the other ‘branches’ of their military. So I’m not that surprised there. Helps sell the faction if you know more stuff is coming. 

- as you say. I can’t see how Corona would have meant them splitting things up. The production time on the book would have prevented that. Kinda proof is that the gargants are in the ghb2020

 

I do think that the Lumineth are a price test on the market. They made an army theme that a lot of people could get behind, hyped it up like crazy, and then released with a premium box set to cash in on the hype. Then they released with extremely high prices that match daughters of khaine for the most expensive price per plastic kits in the range. I'm guessing GW is gauging if they can start increasing the prices for all future releases. Unfortunately for that reason I hope they flop. I don't think I can keep going with the game if it becomes standard to pay 70 dollars CAD for 10 small based models. 

As far as models go I agree they feel like they're being intentionally set up for future releases. It's really bizarre that they don't have even a single non character combat hero in what is supposed to be an extremely capable military. Again maybe they're doing their best to help mitigate all other negative factors to test and see if the price is tolerated by the market.

Edited September 23, 2020 by Grimrock

[willange]

4 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

Unfortunately for that reason I hope they flop. I don't think I can keep going with the game if it becomes standard to pay 70 dollars CAD for 10 small based models. 

Well it's the exact reason I haven't bought any since the premium box.  I probably will eventually but it's gonna have to be a slow burn at that price point.

[KingBrodd]

I wonder if theyll drop the Sons of Behemat article today? I'm really interested in seeing what this one will be about.

[Kramer]

25 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

I do think that the Lumineth are a price test on the market. T

No I meant the combination collectors battletome with a special start collecting. 
that they were testing that for future releases. 

but you’re probably right as well. But to a certain extent probably every release is monitored in that manner. 

Edited September 23, 2020 by Kramer

[JPjr]

38 minutes ago, Kramer said:

No I meant the combination collectors battletome with a special start collecting. 

I mean it's only 2 data points but the Sisters of Battle launch boxset  came with their ltd ed. codex too, so I'm guessing it could be the new format for when armies get a standalone launch set. 

 

[Sonnenspeer]

It's a smart way to prevent people from buying more than one. 

[Kramer]

21 minutes ago, Sonnenspeer said:

It's a smart way to prevent people from buying more than one. 

Or it’s a dumb way of selling less models on release

I saw so many second hand collectors edition on the dutch eBay those few weeks. I wonder how many more of those boxes would have been sold if it didn’t carry a €60 book inside. Our flgs’s have two or three left each. But that might just be local of course. 

[novakai]

well the Boxset (and generally release too) just came at a bad time  too since COVID and all, it unknown how much it affects people's wallets and willingness to buy a new model/ army during times of uncertainty but there probably was an impact to it. plus your not entirely sure if you can play games during these time either.

if where talking about the incompleteness of the LRL release and feeling that there was something more, i would guess they had to get the release out of the window at a deadline because 9th edition 40k was going to be release soon afterwards and they may not have been able to design all the units they wanted for that army on time

[Clan's Cynic]

2 hours ago, JPjr said:

I mean it's only 2 data points but the Sisters of Battle launch boxset  came with their ltd ed. codex too, so I'm guessing it could be the new format for when armies get a standalone launch set. 

 

It's not an entirely new concept to GW really They used to do similar  army boxes that generally featured one of each new character/unit as well as a limited edition sculpt (generally a standard bearer) and the codex/army book and was a way of getting your hands on some of the newer stuff potentially a few months in advance. I think the last one might have been Beasts of Chaos or Bretonnia? But don't quote me on that.

 

[Kramer]

29 minutes ago, novakai said:

well the Boxset (and generally release too) just came at a bad time  too since COVID and all, it unknown how much it affects people's wallets and willingness to buy a new model/ army during times of uncertainty but there probably was an impact to it. plus your not entirely sure if you can play games during these time either.

 

I 100% would have bought a €60-80 start collecting box to paint those models. They are gorgeous. Now 3 months later the excitement about them have seriously settled down. The box was too expensive for the amount of plastic in there for me. 

But yeah, it wasn't ideal in any sense. I just wonder how far behind the unit boxes were planned in  the initial schedule. 

[alghero81]

4 hours ago, Kramer said:

Or it’s a dumb way of selling less models on release

I saw so many second hand collectors edition on the dutch eBay those few weeks. I wonder how many more of those boxes would have been sold if it didn’t carry a €60 book inside. Our flgs’s have two or three left each. But that might just be local of course. 

Nope, UK as well. Been trying to get rid of mine to buy a normal one but there’s no one buying either...

[Marius au]

Was interested in the Lummineth, but the sticker shock was significant.  Once I started costing out my planned list, worked out it was simply too much to justify with a couple of other armies already.  I do agree the release is really odd, the size and lack of dual kits is just strange.  I think most people were surprised that there wasn't some sort of Vanari commander/leader character.

[LuminethMage]

4 hours ago, Kramer said:

I 100% would have bought a €60-80 start collecting box to paint those models. They are gorgeous. Now 3 months later the excitement about them have seriously settled down. The box was too expensive for the amount of plastic in there for me. 

But yeah, it wasn't ideal in any sense. I just wonder how far behind the unit boxes were planned in  the initial schedule. 

Yeah, with no box exclusive models (which is fine by me, but probably doesn't help increasing sales), a named character, low model count and the "special BT" in it, even if you are a Lumineth fan, you probably didn't need the box or at most one. And before people knew how expensive the range would be, the box looked even more expensive. 

I mean I bought 3 of those, but there probably aren't many people who think it's worth buying more than one. You could see many posts about people wanting to wait for the general release - and the special BT was mentioned multiple times as a negative, which inflated pricing. 

Where I live it sold out locally, but as you say it doesn't mean anything. I still see pictures of people buying it now though, together with their other models. So in the end they might sell a decent to really good amount of those. 

As mentioned before by many here, the whole release was a bit strange. Not only because of all the Covid 19 issues, but also the advertising for example. They did a lot, but nothing really special like for the OBR or Gitz for example. By far the best content they made for the Lumineth was the "pointy aelves" video which didn't have them in it. But almost nothing was done to make the more controversial parts like the Alarith look cool - in fact they did the opposite. And if you constantly imply that - this is just the beginning! Not all! Only a bit of it! More stuff coming! some people will say - okay then I wait until I have seen everything. Especially as they provided not much for a big part of the former HE community (no Tyrion, no heavy cavalry, no flyers, no dragons etc.).

I think more people will get interested once they see the army on the field. The models really look impressive in units, it's a big difference (of course that's subjective). 

 

[Neverchosen]

I feel like most new AOS specific factions have some obvious ways to grow and expand but Lumineth feel very much like a video game with planned DLC.

Fyreslayers and Flesh Eaters feel like good points of comparison as they both have Fantasy legacies and are small in terms of unique boxsets for the army. But despite having numerous ideas as to how both armies could be expanded in fascinating ways, I feel like we received a cohesive vision of an army on a limited scale. Lumineth has a number of outliers in the range that make an army that emphasizes unity feel rather incoherent. Teclis, the unnamed hero mages, and the Mountain Spirits feel oddly incongruous with the martial force of Aelves. I just feel there is something missing in the transition but I expect to see it when Tyrion arrives with more units. It is strange I really like the army and would be interested in playing them but I am waiting for the next wave of models to decide if I want animistic mountain spirits or cool aelf pikemen. I think that Lumieth are great but I am still waiting for that model or theme to make me love them.

But I think that is the cool thing about being on the ground level of a developing system. We are making snap judgements on armies that may be something completely different in an editions time. Maybe Lumineth aren't your thing currently, but maybe when Tyrion arrives he will bring cool gryphon knights or angelic aelves with spears of light or any other possible outgrowth of the army that makes them more interesting to a hobbyist or gamer. I love the aesthetic of Chaos Undivided but I am less fond of Marauders but I am still happy they exist and have seen fantastic armies themed around them.

Edited September 24, 2020 by Neverchosen

[JackStreicher]

14 hours ago, Grimrock said:

70 dollars CAD for 10 small based models. 

 

Which was why WHF died. And around in circles we go...

 

@Kramer I am living in one of the biggest German cities and our GW still  has 2 of 3 boxes left.

Edit: The same goes for another big city in which my brother lives 🤷🏼‍♂️
 

Edited September 24, 2020 by JackStreicher

[zilberfrid]

43 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

Which was why WHF died. And around in circles we go...

 

@Kramer I am living in one of the biggest German cities and our GW still  has 2 of 3 boxes left.

I'm not sure I agree.

WHFB died for many reasons.

Lack of support for many factions (everything has a current AoS BT except FW stuff).

Cost and pagecount of rules required to at least play a little (extra books will muddle it more and more, but you can start with free warscrolls and free core rules).

Multiple year imbalances (there's an attempt at balancing twice per year).

Awkward lore to get into (we have to face that the map was too much an earth map, with all its implications. Mortal Realms are different).

Lack of gryph hounds (they are cute).

Too many models/too high a cost required to enter (Underworld -> Warcry -> Meeting Engagements -> 2k points make it easier to get into)

Now, I don't like price increases, but that wasn't the only, and probably not even defining reason WHFB failed.

[EMMachine]

4 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

I'm not sure I agree.

WHFB died for many reasons.

Lack of support for many factions (everything has a current AoS BT except FW stuff).

Cost and pagecount of rules required to at least play a little (extra books will muddle it more and more, but you can start with free warscrolls and free core rules).

Multiple year imbalances (there's an attempt at balancing twice per year).

Awkward lore to get into (we have to face that the map was too much an earth map, with all its implications. Mortal Realms are different).

Lack of gryph hounds (they are cute).

Too many models/too high a cost required to enter (Underworld -> Warcry -> Meeting Engagements -> 2k points make it easier to get into)

Now, I don't like price increases, but that wasn't the only, and probably not even defining reason WHFB failed.

• I think we can add, that quite often units of 30-40 Models were needed that the unit has use, where in AoS you can have these units but 10-20 man units can work as well.
• WHFB wasn't really made for small games. Most of the time Armies of 1750-2500 Points were build from the beginning because 1000 Points were played rarely.
• And looking at the world, the lore was quite stagnant for maybe 15 years, with undoing the results of the 6. Edition Storm of Chaos and shoehorning units into the same intime years that were lore in older editions as well without explanations + the new units were a better fitting for AoS as for WHFB.

I know I could have spent more time with WHFB Lore, but I really like ne AoS lore with all the creative potential.

 

 

[Beastmaster]

I don’t necessarily think that price increases keep people from getting their first army, because you need it to play. But for me, it’s definitely an important factor in the decision to start a second or third army, which is not really needed, and much more of a luxury buy.
Your choice, GW. 

Edited September 24, 2020 by Beastmaster

[Kramer]

4 minutes ago, Beastmaster said:

I don’t necessarily think that price increases keep people from getting their first army. But for me, it’s definitely an important factor in the decision to start a second or third army. Your choice, GW. 

Ooh that’s interesting! I feel the high entry price keeps some of my friends from collecting an own army.

while friends that are in deep, will always start that second, third, fourth army.

for myself I’m starting to become much more selective in what new thing I buy into as I have plenty of armies to add to and stuff to paint. So the price of the big box of pointy elves really kept me from getting a few to paint. And now the excitement is pretty much gone. 

[Beastmaster]

Ok, I may be a bit of a special case, since I started with Ogors, which can be built as one of the cheapest armies in the game, and compare from there.

For comparison, I recently calculated the Euro/point ratio for different common units. With Ogors it’s about 8. Idoneth are somewhere between 3 and 4. The Lumineth battleline is under 3.

I know many buyers won’t calculate the ratio. But as far as I’ve heard, most start with setting a first points goal before they start collecting. And it does make a huge difference if I get to, say, 1000 p with 130 € or with 350 €. I would do the first, MAYBE the second, but definitely not both.

If this goes on I’m sure there will be a point where sales will go down for new kits, because more people decide they’re just not worth it, or at least only buy what’s absolutely necessary for playing at all. Maybe we are already at that point.

And, as can be seen in all those pile of shame discussions, a lot of GW sales depends on people not only buying what is absolutely needed... 😎

Edited September 24, 2020 by Beastmaster

[pixieproxy]

24 minutes ago, Beastmaster said:

Ok, I may be a bit of a special case, since I started with Ogors, which can be built as one of the cheapest armies in the game, and compare from there.

For comparison, I recently calculated the Euro/point ratio for different common units. With Ogors it’s about 8. Idoneth are somewhere between 3 and 4. The Lumineth battleline is under 3.

I know many buyers won’t calculate the ratio. But as far as I’ve heard, most start with setting a first points goal before they start collecting. And it does make a huge difference if I get to, say, 1000 p with 130 € or with 350 €. I would do the first, MAYBE the second, but definitely not both.

If this goes on I’m sure there will be a point where sales will go down for new kits, because more people decide they’re just not worth it, or at least only buy what’s absolutely necessary for playing at all. Maybe we are already at that point.

And, as can be seen in all those pile of shame discussions, a lot of GW sales depends on people not only buying what is absolutely needed... 😎

This is in part why I've started, and then not continued a DoK army. The ridiculousness of the ratio is just something else. Maybe the Khainite Shadowstalkers will alleviate some of it but given the other warcry bands... not exactly hopeful? I even like painting skin so it's not the size of the units that's the issue let me tell you x.x

[KingBrodd]

Bundo Whalebiter rules on Facebook!! Not only does it seem our named Gargants are going to have unique abilities but it's our first real look at the Megas in scale with everything and they are monstrous!! Also loving the colour scheme of Bundo!!