The Rumour Thread

[SlyRebirth]

1 minute ago, KingBrodd said:

Sons of Behemat Merch come at me!!

Size XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXL only.

[Charleston]

6 hours ago, michu said:

That's just dismounted warrior from Chaos Chariot. No new miniatures. 

People keep telling this but it never made sense. Like, there is no mention of this guy beeing a LoC or the Kit to have an option to build one. I know people use the model for but it doesn´t fit gw´s style of releases. But yeah, until gw shows something than I guess the Chariot Dude is right.

[michu]

22 minutes ago, Charleston said:

People keep telling this but it never made sense. Like, there is no mention of this guy beeing a LoC or the Kit to have an option to build one. I know people use the model for but it doesn´t fit gw´s style of releases. But yeah, until gw shows something than I guess the Chariot Dude is right.

Do you have the book? What miniature is on warscroll's photo?

[HorticulusTGA]

45 minutes ago, Charleston said:

People keep telling this but it never made sense. Like, there is no mention of this guy beeing a LoC or the Kit to have an option to build one. I know people use the model for but it doesn´t fit gw´s style of releases. But yeah, until gw shows something than I guess the Chariot Dude is right.

It's because it was labelled as such in older editions of Warhammer, the Chariot was designed under WFB ruleset (and releases pattern design). 

Also Cape + Big Horns = High ranking commander in Warhammer (also : Big pauldrons and tall Hats). 

[ReyD1]

7 hours ago, Overread said:

GW rarely leaves a door shut on armies they develop - even Squats have several avenues to be re-introduced into 40K if GW chooses. 

Old World (which had 30 years of production) had multiple factions which appeared in the lore many times and were well fleshed out in the story setting. They never appeared and one, Araby, only appeared in Warmaster (the 6mm wargame). As always I'd caution people against getting over-excited at seeing niche armies like Kirnothi being raised into full armies; or at "lore" armies like Grotbag Scuttlers or Skaven Sky Pirates becoming fully fledged models and armies 

 

Sometimes those armies just hang around for ages - Exodites for 40K have been referenced many times but never had a single model made since the Rogue Traders days. 

By all means get enthusiastic and perhaps even consider conversions (most of the sky-priate alternate factions get into the skies by stealing KO airships so that's easy conversion fodder right there). But I would never bank on any of those forces becoming full armies.

 

Of course there's a few very certain hints. GW has all but said that the Shadow Aelves will appear; furthermore its clear that Soulblight (vampires) will get their own book for Death at some stage. Of course such certain facts can take a very long time to materialise. Sometimes taking so long they basically never come around. 

 

Eyes on the future is good, but keep yourself grounded in the present too and don't wait on hinted/lore/rumour armies. 

That's a pretty pessimistic statement right there 😕

In my humble opinion, I think comparing AoS to Fantasy/40K patterns is not that relevant :

1) Fantasy choices and management led to the destruction of the world. They were multiple reasons brought to the table such as : Commercial failure, copyright problems and a limited world to expand and build upon.  I think GW are not the same since Fantasy.  They know now that having an IP and adding a couple units (and dumb ones lol) each editions after YEARS of waiting, is just not exciting and interesting. It's just some kind of "more of the same" boring cycle. Yay we got flying chariot for High Elves after  6 years ... woohoo 😢.
With their new aggresive communication model AND this brand new world to build and expand, it's just a gift for them, to be able to add new factions after new factions without creating "lore" problems or stereotypes.
Building the hype through videos and throwing new models and concepts that sells SUPER well (I'm betting Lumineth will be a HUGE success). And I think they will continue to do the exact opposite of what Fantasy used to do. Generation evolves and the market too. With the actual generation staying "passive" = dead game.
Card games / Video games (even SINGLEPLAYER games) are trying to keep the playerbase active with regular updates. This fascination of trying to stay "fresh" is something really important these days and I think that adding brand new armies are part of that.

2) I think 40K and Fantasy had a deeper problem. GW needed to expand a universe with foundations built during the 80's with a completely different mentality and teams. I can understand why an "Araby" faction made of arabic soldiers fighting alongside Djinns on flying carpets with camel and elephants, or a chinese/japanese type of factions with samourais and ninjas, will not interest a lot of ppl and even the design team.
Fantasy had limits, and even if GW could have pushed some fantasy concepts and ignored "grounded" factions it would have been weird. My point is : Warhammer Fantasy (and by certain extend 40K) was built durint a completely different era and with the policy of keeping things canon it would have been complicated to push certain things as "new" without checking what was actually possible. I think AoS is a completely different beast, it's more of a "modern" game, and each hint can become easily a thing since the limits are not that well established in this world.


I'm not confronting our opinions just giving mines and why I disagree that "everything seems not that much possible because of the past.."
AoS created a different era for the universe and GW, and so far we have pretty much, one or more new factions each year.
And even if some ppl would find that silly, I hope they keep doing that.

Adding fresh things regularly, adapting their teased/hinted factions and fleshed them out to become real thing ! I don't mind if in 10 years we end up with 40 new armies who cares as long as the game is successful and is hype 😄

We have 4 (!!)  Grand Alliances and some of them are really lacking content compare to other stuff. GW seems ready and apt of adding whatever is asked/requested by the community (hell I want to see some kind of Vampire Coast in that game one day), so I have faith that we might see every rumors one day

Edited June 1, 2020 by ReyD1

[Overread]

True, but ultimately GW made the Mortal Realms to allow them to basically do anything in the setting - including add factions at whim. Some of them will be hints at full armies to come; some will be cross-over armies (eg skaven stealing KO airships) to encourage conversions; some will just be a faction with a realm focus; others will just be something an author created for a story. etc...

 

There are a lot of factions that will never see the light of day; there are some that are not planned to see the light of day, but might one day. In the end GW can only produce a finite number of armies, especially if we as fans want to see existing armies get new models and updated models. We can't get that if GW just keeps adding more and more and more armies. Eventually there's a limit point - beyond which imagination and conversion skills are the only way to create some ideas. 

 

 

It's a realistic view based on GW's 30 odd years of operation so its not out of the question. I already admit there's several strongly hinted at lore armies that are very likely to get forces of their own and would be surprising to shocking if they don't. For example I'd be very surprised if Soulbight/Vampires didn't get their own force or a major reworking of Legions of Nagash to push them to the top. I'd be surprised based on teh vampire legacy from Old World and how strongly GW pushes them in the lore. But who knows they could be like Nippon, Cathay, Araby, Exocidets, Demiurg, Zoats and others that have appeared in lore many times that never got a whole army to themselves. Or perhaps in 10 or 20 years they do (eg Genestealer cults got their own army). 

 

 

Ultimately my point is not to sit on the fence and wait forever nor to put too much stock into lore and rumour and hope. By all means hope for new things  - heck I'm hoping to see the new Malarion Shadow Aelves - but I'm not "expecting" them in the sense that I know they are a guaranteed army to appear; nor do I know when - it might be this year; it might be in 5 years or 10 years time. 

[Neverchosen]

To add to @Overread's point even if things get released it does not always mean it will be a fully fledged army. For example: Grotbag Scuttlers may get a full release, they may get a unit in Underworlds or Warcry,  they may get a subfaction in a future update for Gloomspite Gitz, or they might be part of a new army with classic Gitmob grots. There is also a chance that they will get a few rules in an issue of White Dwarf and cool conversion lesson on Warhammer community. 

Speculation is a really fun part of the hobby but it is not reliable.

[KingBrodd]

I personally feel incredibly lucky to get my dream army. And as @Overread states it can take years. Mine took 2 Decades and a World to be destroyed to become reality.

[ReyD1]

@Overread I agree with your realistic points but just hope that this golden age of exciting and new things in AoS will still last for a few years more until it reach that "limit" and end like Fantasy (7th/8th edition) doing mostly the same over and over again

[KingBrodd]

3 minutes ago, ReyD1 said:

@Overread I agree with your realistic points but just hope that this golden age of exciting and new things in AoS will still last for a few years more until it reach that "limit" and end like Fantasy (7th/8th edition) doing mostly the same over and over again

I also hope for more fantastical things to come for years with AOS and I believe they will. The Mortal Realms is so amazing in that it can go anywhere and isnt restricted to the confines of its setting as the Old World was. 

I could honestly see GW adding entirely new Realms or making some Sub-Realms larger focal points. Whose to say there isnt a Realm of Ice or entirely covered in Water?

[Overread]

I foresee GW ending the phase of adding new armies "fairly" soon. AoS still has a lot of small factions and factions with lots of old sculpts. There's a lot to rework on what is already out. Plus its important to remember that many people only collect a few armies or even one army. So if GW focuses too much on adding new ones; all those one/two army fans get disgruntled and bored. They are less likely to invest in new armies if their original army is never getting updates. 

 

If there's 20 armies (there's already more) that's 20 new/update models GW has to release to keep "everyone" happy. That's perhaps double or more a full "new" army being added. 

 

Of course ending new armies doesn't mean things stop; it just means that things shift in direction. changing toward Gloomspit Gitz style updates for Seraphon and Skaven; fleshing out Flesheaters with double the number of kits they have now etc...

[123lac]

1 hour ago, KingBrodd said:

I personally feel incredibly lucky to get my dream army. And as @Overread states it can take years. Mine took 2 Decades and a World to be destroyed to become reality.

Have you always liked giants in fantasy settings?

I can't really think of many books/games/movies where there were fleshed out giant factions, except a very old PC game called Warlords (storm giants faction).

[Sttufe]

3 minutes ago, 123lac said:

Have you always liked giants in fantasy settings?

I can't really think of many books/games/movies where there were fleshed out giant factions, except a very old PC game called Warlords (storm giants faction).

I mean, he is King Brodd.

[ReyD1]

1 hour ago, Overread said:

I foresee GW ending the phase of adding new armies "fairly" soon. AoS still has a lot of small factions and factions with lots of old sculpts. There's a lot to rework on what is already out. Plus its important to remember that many people only collect a few armies or even one army. So if GW focuses too much on adding new ones; all those one/two army fans get disgruntled and bored. They are less likely to invest in new armies if their original army is never getting updates. 

 

If there's 20 armies (there's already more) that's 20 new/update models GW has to release to keep "everyone" happy. That's perhaps double or more a full "new" army being added. 

 

Of course ending new armies doesn't mean things stop; it just means that things shift in direction. changing toward Gloomspit Gitz style updates for Seraphon and Skaven; fleshing out Flesheaters with double the number of kits they have now etc...

I still think they can do both and hopefully will not end that soon. It would be interesting to know if updating a faction is worth more than adding a brand new army financially speaking.
Cause new armies would bring new players (a friend of mine will start AoS because of Lumineth).

But I agree, as a Death player I would love to have a huge expansion for Fleash Eater and Nighthaunt.

[Sttufe]

1 hour ago, ReyD1 said:

I still think they can do both and hopefully will not end that soon. It would be interesting to know if updating a faction is worth more than adding a brand new army financially speaking.
Cause new armies would bring new players (a friend of mine will start AoS because of Lumineth).

But I agree, as a Death player I would love to have a huge expansion for Fleash Eater and Nighthaunt.

Stating what been said before, chaos is doing good except for slaanesh, but order has a lot of too small factions

it is becoming a little bloated in terms of resources so we do need to stop adding and just get the current factions up to a bigger size. Probably I would say add a lot more destruction armies if they are adding more.

[LuminethMage]

Here's the problem, my attitude to adding new armies vs. expanding on current ones. 

Before the Lumineth are out: "GW has to add new armies. Many people are looking for something like the new High Elves, and Idenoth are just not doing it for many of us."

After the Lumineth are out: "Enough is enough, we have so many small armies now, it's time to flash them out, my Lumineth only have X valid warscrolls, hardly enough for a good army! And so much interesting things to still add there! Tyrion! New elemental factions! Phoenixes!" 

So, I don't think they'll stop adding new armies. Especially because with this setting they could come up with some really fantastic, out of the box stuff. But I guess, the speed will go down, and more expansions of old armies are coming. But they also can do that via other means like Warcry etc. Will be interesting to see. 

It's always difficult because we don't know how much they make with new armies vs old ones, how many people regularly change to another shiny new army when in comparison to shiny new models for an existing army. 

[Mandzak-Miniatures]

4 hours ago, 123lac said:

Have you always liked giants in fantasy settings?

I can't really think of many books/games/movies where there were fleshed out giant factions, except a very old PC game called Warlords (storm giants faction).

Everquest has several. In velious you built up faction with dwarves dragons or the giants. Each was either a city to raid or do massive quests with 

[KingBrodd]

6 hours ago, 123lac said:

Have you always liked giants in fantasy settings?

I can't really think of many books/games/movies where there were fleshed out giant factions, except a very old PC game called Warlords (storm giants faction).

I've always loved Giants. I've always loved "Humanoid" monsters. Giants, Ogors, Vampires, Zombies. But especially Giants and seeing as I personally havent come across much of them in my personal hobbies it's made the itch for them even greater!!

5 hours ago, Sttufe said:

I mean, he is King Brodd.

Thank you kind sir.

[123lac]

2 hours ago, Mandzak-Miniatures said:

Everquest has several. In velious you built up faction with dwarves dragons or the giants. Each was either a city to raid or do massive quests with 

I've actually started playing Everquest on P99 on and off over the last year, but I'm not up  to Velious content yet.

[Scurvydog]

New armies are always fun to see, but each new army will also mean longer and longer between updates of exisiting armies. It would also be a disservice to the world building to not expand on many of the current factions, as there is plenty of untapped potentiel everywhere.

What I'd like to see, even if I do not play all these factions, is expanded rosters and named heroes and stories built around this as well, to really flesh out the world and warfare options.

Such as a larger roster for Flesh eaters, fyreslayers and ironjawz, updated Seraphon models and generel expansion of rules across the board. Psychic Awakening is probably a format we can expect, with 1-3 models/kits for the various factions, some new rules to play with and story expansions, I would not mind to see that format copied.

[KingBrodd]

24 minutes ago, Scurvydog said:

New armies are always fun to see, but each new army will also mean longer and longer between updates of exisiting armies. It would also be a disservice to the world building to not expand on many of the current factions, as there is plenty of untapped potentiel everywhere.

What I'd like to see, even if I do not play all these factions, is expanded rosters and named heroes and stories built around this as well, to really flesh out the world and warfare options.

Such as a larger roster for Flesh eaters, fyreslayers and ironjawz, updated Seraphon models and generel expansion of rules across the board. Psychic Awakening is probably a format we can expect, with 1-3 models/kits for the various factions, some new rules to play with and story expansions, I would not mind to see that format copied.

I only hope that if they do a PA for AOS there isnt as many books because I cant justify spending all that money for lore. And I love lore.

But I agree that Fyreslayers, FEC and Ironjawz definitely need more units and Seraphon and Skaven are in dire need of updated models.

[Oak7603]

I'm sure that you all mean to mention Beasts of Chaos too when you talk about Armies needing updates... 🤣🤣😉

[OkayestDM]

With the release of 40k 9th they're updating and expanding the necron line of models, and it's quite plausible that they'll be doing this with each of their factions. Expanded ranges create incentive to purchase new codexes, all of which is money in pocket for them.

While 40k and AoS don't exactly mirror one another in release methods and practices, businesses tend to use what works.

I imagine they'll start fleshing out factions once we hit AoS 3. The current edition has been used to establish the factions and bring them all more or less up to date. They've also taken the opportunity to expand upon GAs that had limited options. 

A lot of the excitement for factions this edition was that they were all finally getting their Battletome updated (and by all accounts, this has been pretty unprecedented for GW). A great way to duplicate that level of excitement and give people a valid reason to purchase a new Battletome would be to give them some shiny new models to go with it.

This is all my head-logic, so take it with a grain of salt, but at the very least it seems like a pretty plausible plan.

[madmac]

Yeah, my first instinct was to say 40k, but it's got a crude gear heavy look that would work for AoS's more advanced tech factions.

[Landohammer]

12 hours ago, Overread said:

I foresee GW ending the phase of adding new armies "fairly" soon. AoS still has a lot of small factions and factions with lots of old sculpts. There's a lot to rework on what is already out. Plus its important to remember that many people only collect a few armies or even one army. So if GW focuses too much on adding new ones; all those one/two army fans get disgruntled and bored. They are less likely to invest in new armies if their original army is never getting updates. 

 

If there's 20 armies (there's already more) that's 20 new/update models GW has to release to keep "everyone" happy. That's perhaps double or more a full "new" army being added. 

 

Of course ending new armies doesn't mean things stop; it just means that things shift in direction. changing toward Gloomspit Gitz style updates for Seraphon and Skaven; fleshing out Flesheaters with double the number of kits they have now etc...

I wish this were the case but it doesn't appear that GW is really into expanding lines, or at least not in the way that we remember it from 8th edition. Back in those days you could expect at least 10+ new units with a refresh. 

Consider the recent refreshes of older armies. Most notably Tzeentch, Sylvaneth, and Ogors. They got a new codex, a new character, a new terrain piece (not tzeentch tho) and endless spells. 

In a game system where MANY codexes survive with 11-15 units, there isn't much incentive to add more units when you can just release a brand new army. 

From a business perspective: (In my opinion) The majority of "refreshed army" sales are probably by players who already play the faction. While a new army has the potential to to sell to older players as an additional army while also potentially enticing newer players.