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31 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

Why do people keep saying things GW has no faith in the book, they don't care about cos or it must be delayed?

GW have their release schedule in place for a long time. They have to for logistics sakes. Yes sometimes things go wrong like sylvaneth but otherwise I'm betting the CoS battletome is being released when it's supposed to.

 

Mostly because GW does not communicate about bad news, and they have not been communicating about it.

We don't even know whether the culling was the only one for CoS, and there are signs it may not be.

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People at the Nova event said he works like a Video Game boss where you are taking out his minions as he brackets and only face the big bad at the end.

 

Should be interesting as it probably means he's at his most useful as a support piece at full health and at his best as a beat stick when bracketed.

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3 minutes ago, Eldarain said:

People at the Nova event said he works like a Video Game boss where you are taking out his minions as he brackets and only face the big bad at the end.

 

Should be interesting as it probably means he's at his most useful as a support piece at full health and at his best as a beat stick when bracketed.

Oops I see that I didn’t clarify the Cities of Sigmar command squad that’s been rumored

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22 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

Mostly because GW does not communicate about bad news, and they have not been communicating about it.

We don't even know whether the culling was the only one for CoS, and there are signs it may not be.

But what bad news? Had the book not been shown at NOVA, no one would have known it was coming. It's because it wasn't released within a short time period of the preview, people get their tin foil hats on.

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52 minutes ago, Overread said:

Mostly because the removal of models happened with a big lag time before the release of the book. So currently those players most interested in the Cities book (esp any highelf players) have had toys taken away from them and nothing to let them use what remains. It means that they are left frustraited and not able to do much - they can't even spend money since they don't know exactly how the armies within the book will function nor what the stats are. It leaves them in a limbo.

Pretty much spot on though I'll add that the lack of community article to accompany the Cull and the Nova blunder are giving me the impression that its not something they care to push much.

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4 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

But what bad news? Had the book not been shown at NOVA, no one would have known it was coming. It's because it wasn't released within a short time period of the preview, people get their tin foil hats on.

It was previewed on the Open day on 7-20 on we haven't heard anything since then other than a significant purge of the Order factions that will make up Cities which leaves them in an even more unplayable state than they were before. GW reps flat out refused to discuss the battletome at Nova stating it's release was so soon it was pointless. Then GW proceeded to release stuff previewed at NOVA. 

I'm buried in a Gloomspite project at the moment so it isn't really the biggest deal to me but the roll out is bizarre and frustrating. At this point it would make far more sense for the NOVA and Sigmar Open Day previews to have been swapped. 

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17 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

But what bad news? Had the book not been shown at NOVA, no one would have known it was coming. It's because it wasn't released within a short time period of the preview, people get their tin foil hats on.

They stated at Nova the book was coming so soon, it was useless to talk about it. But stuff they did talk about is out earlier. Not to mention that GW often really likes to talk about stuff if it's close.

So my guess is a second round of culling, because that's something they don't want to talk about (and might become obvious if they spoke about the book), and suddenly you can't find whole factions anymore.

Edited by zilberfrid
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35 minutes ago, Mandzak-Miniatures said:

Oops I see that I didn’t clarify the Cities of Sigmar command squad that’s been rumored

Oh. I hadn't seen that rumor. Sound interesting. Be cool if it allowed the cities to field a ton of cheap heroes. I'm hoping an MSU approach can work with the new book. CCG combo boosted Hordes is getting old.

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15 minutes ago, Eldarain said:

A second round of culls after the backlash would explain the quiet and lack of Nova coverage for sure.

Yes. I wonder what they'll cut next. Phoenix Temple would get rid of the rest of the the high elves, but my bet is on a few of the following: drakespawn knights, remaining chariot, black ark fleetmaster, black ark corsairs, asassin, battlewizards, flagellants, luminark/hurricanum, outriders/pistoleers, 

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I have theory that the Ossiarch leak was orchestrated to feed us juicy AoS news, knowing the CoS and Orruk books were still a little ways out.

Firstly, I find it odd that someone who doesn't directly work for GW would already have the Ossiarch battletome this early (with an October release). If CoS and Orruks are indeed next in line, wouldn't the leaks have been from those books? If they're a couple weeks away I could see some retailers/media having access to them already. After all, everyone knows how anticipated these two battletomes are, especially Cities.

Secondly, why would a rogue leaker only post blurry, unreadable half pages? If you're going to leak information, you do it, you're not coy about it. It's almost like a small GW preview isn't it? Glimpses of interesting things, but not near all of it and not near in the clarity we'd want. Take a look at the Sylvaneth fiasco. When that book was leaked, EVERYTHING was put out there. That's how you know for certain it wasn't by corporate influence.

Thirdly, we have to all understand...the whole China debacle almost certainly pushed their timetables back and scrambled the release structure. Sure, we received news of CoS and Orruks early for how long it's taken for them to come out; but maybe that was the only option. They knew they wouldn't be able to fit in all of this AoS stuff with the release of Warcry after everything shifted, so they did what they could to give us SOMETHING---even if it was only knowledge of the books' existence. Does that mean everything is cool and was handled correctly? No, they definitely could have handled the squatpocalypse better. But sometimes we have to give them a break with this stuff. Whether it's the stuff you want or not, they're releasing content on all fronts like a perpetual motion engine. We'll get to where we want to be, just remember to have patience.

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It's sounding like the only things being run in CoS if a second culling occurs is a bunch of humans, stormcasts, and the token duardin or aelf. This book isn't looking good at all. I'd rather them just cut all the lines than release this embarrassment. 

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5 hours ago, Mutton said:

Firstly, I find it odd that someone who doesn't directly work for GW would already have the Ossiarch battletome this early (with an October release). If CoS and Orruks are indeed next in line, wouldn't the leaks have been from those books? If they're a couple weeks away I could see some retailers/media having access to them already. After all, everyone knows how anticipated these two battletomes are, especially Cities.

GW send out review copies of Battletomes and products to reviewers in advance of the actual release date, but get those reviewers to sign an NDA so nothing gets revealed until the official release date.  Sadly this results in some reviewers leaking information themselves or not being quite as protective about the review products as they should be.  Now that's not to say that GW hasn't done it's own leaks in the past or won't in the future, however at the present time I don't think they actually need to.

The actual release date isn't set in stone either so that GW can try to achieve some kind of balance between releases and any production issues (I'm imagining it's a bit of a juggling act with so many systems and releases), which could result in there being quite a time between the review copy being sent out and the final release date.

One interesting note is that not everybody within GW actually has access to (or knowledge of) all releases within the company.  Certainly I've spoken to staff who genuinely haven't known that a product was coming out until it appeared on the WarCom website.

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52 minutes ago, RuneBrush said:

One interesting note is that not everybody within GW actually has access to (or knowledge of) all releases within the company.  Certainly I've spoken to staff who genuinely haven't known that a product was coming out until it appeared on the WarCom website.

This is something I really hope changes in GW. I'd really like to see more of their departments working together toward a unified goal rather than working together and coming up with mistakes along the way. There's loads of hints that they still don't work together like how Destruction got two packs of cards for Orruks for Warcry when the army is going to be made into a single battletome. Clearly no one told the warcry team about that important change. 

There's loads of other little hiccups like that which spoils things for the customer and also makes GW seem inept. They either need way more inter-departmental communication or someone hired on who has the sole job of floating between teams to pass on required information on changes where they might impact another teams development - with a clear hierarchy established of who overrides who and potential for interdepartmental debate on key issues. Ergo a chance to get their house in order.

 

Sure this "might" increase leak risks but honestly its dealing with the core of the company which is honestly where you are expected to get the least number of leaks because most of those staff should be the most invested into the company and their jobs. Argue whatever you like but a steady work job from GW is likely a very desirable position for many of the types of work they hire for - mostly because its such a specialist market. 

Most of hte leaks we see are when the info gets spread about - review copies, shipments of stock, outside input etc.... Ergo people who are willing to take a bit of a risk because there's no chance of getting caught (distribution stock going out) or because if they lost the exclusive it doesn't really hurt them too much (Bloggers and such - as for many its a hobby/side job or supporting material for stores so they get advanced copies anyway for distribution). 

I think the days when GW HQ people leaked stuff is gone because now GW has outreach through their massive marketing department. There's no need to risk your job to sneak info about new Sisters of Battle or that the game isn't being abandoned etc... because GW itself is putting that info out there. Barring vocal number who decry that GW will close doors tomorrow (most of which are either just venting frustration or who are not actually GW customers any more but are still active members of fan forums); the majority of fans are very upbeat about GW in general at present (certain segments of the AoS fanbase exempt of course as they still don't have a Tome or any clear idea what is going to happen - and the Old World fanbase who have not moved on are also, understandably, still salty about it)

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I’m far from being negative and 2019 has been a great year for AoS as a game overall: 7 battletomes so far and 3 more announced plus 1 or 2 expected before the end of the year.

However from the miniatures standpoint it has been a bit lacklustre: started great with many new Grots, just one hero, terrain and spells for Skaven, FEC and Sylvaneth, not even the hero for Khorne and Fyreslayers, few models for Slaanesh and now Gotrek for all Order alliances (however how many lists will actually include him in competitive play?).

To this we can add the 4/6 warbands released this year for Underworlds of which extremely rarely any of those are found on the tabletop as warbands (mostly for alternative sculpts) and 6 warbands for Warcry. Warcry has the same issue as Underworlds, warbands with potentially limited use on competitive play but with the addition that they don’t have a battletome yet to make them viable.

And now a new army in a moment that probably deserved more attention to what is going to survive in the game and news of only one new miniature for the existing armies (the new Ogor). 

If we add the risk that the tomes today look like more than placeholders with a limited validity, this year could have been just a transition year much less entertaining than last year for example. I hope I’m wrong and they will surprise next year, but I would not be interested in a game where I have to change army every 2 years because models are retired, books despoiled of their units, etc...

On the other hand if these placeholders will be expanded with the next books coming out, then that would be a much brighter future.

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To be fair the leak part could be solved with better planning in advance. Would be much simpler to have a high level plan of the year/6 months and then you dive in detail only for the next 3 months or so. This way many things will be solved and the customer base would be less on edge, of course with the usual disclaimer plans can change at any time, etc efc

I’ve also suggested this in the community survey.

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45 minutes ago, alghero81 said:

I’m far from being negative and 2019 has been a great year for AoS as a game overall: 7 battletomes so far and 3 more announced plus 1 or 2 expected before the end of the year.

However from the miniatures standpoint it has been a bit lacklustre: started great with many new Grots, just one hero, terrain and spells for Skaven, FEC and Sylvaneth, not even the hero for Khorne and Fyreslayers, few models for Slaanesh and now Gotrek for all Order alliances (however how many lists will actually include him in competitive play?).

To this we can add the 4/6 warbands released this year for Underworlds of which extremely rarely any of those are found on the tabletop as warbands (mostly for alternative sculpts) and 6 warbands for Warcry. Warcry has the same issue as Underworlds, warbands with potentially limited use on competitive play but with the addition that they don’t have a battletome yet to make them viable.

And now a new army in a moment that probably deserved more attention to what is going to survive in the game and news of only one new miniature for the existing armies (the new Ogor). 

If we add the risk that the tomes today look like more than placeholders with a limited validity, this year could have been just a transition year much less entertaining than last year for example. I hope I’m wrong and they will surprise next year, but I would not be interested in a game where I have to change army every 2 years because models are retired, books despoiled of their units, etc...

On the other hand if these placeholders will be expanded with the next books coming out, then that would be a much brighter future.

Khorne got 2 heroes (Skulltaker and generic Herald). 

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I don't think GW is going to use 2.0 battletomes as placeholders. The placeholders were the 1.0 Tomes and the 1.5. Those were placeholders - heck the 1.0 were purely just the warscrolls in a book and nothing else. It would be marketing suicide to treat the 2.0 Tomes as a placeholder for armies. 

 

The only reason we've not had more models is because GW has hit their limit for production. They can't produce more yet a lot of the Old World armies were left quite under supported for a long while. There's a lot of factions with finecast, heck metal floating around. There's a lot of old first generation plastic sculpts (old zombies). Meanwhile someof the fragmented armies that have been solidified as full armies (Flesheaters, Fyreslayers) are simply very small forces still with a limited roster. 

You can bet that GW will steadily shift like they are with 40K this year; into a period of more normal releases. Where we see armies get additions of new models, replacements for old and some removals here and there; but always coinciding with additions. This shift into 2.0 is the last big clean up of AoS; the sweeping away of the mess and the firming of armies that will remain for the life of AoS. 

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1 hour ago, Still-young said:

Khorne got 2 heroes (Skulltaker and generic Herald). 

I think what he meant was, no new heroes, as these were essentially replacements of resin models, with updated warscrolls.

I am all up for replacing resin with plastic whenever the opportunity arises, ofcourse, but the new Khorne Battletome was also a good opportunity to release a new multipart kit for a might lord of Khorne (who is not Khorgos Khul) or a khorgorath (which is a large monopose static model and really shows when you use multiples of them on the table) that has been talked about for ages.

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6 minutes ago, Infernalslayer said:

I think what he meant was, no new heroes, as these were essentially replacements of resin models, with updated warscrolls.

I am all up for replacing resin with plastic whenever the opportunity arises, ofcourse, but the new Khorne Battletome was also a good opportunity to release a new multipart kit for a might lord of Khorne (who is not Khorgos Khul) or a khorgorath (which is a large monopose static model and really shows when you use multiples of them on the table) that has been talked about for ages.

I don’t think that’s what they meant, they’re just talking about number of models released. 

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