The Rumour Thread

[Walrustaco]

I think if today was me in @Kurrilino's position like @Clan's Cynic said, then I, and all the other Ogor players, would have much more of a reason to be upset.

Gutbusters have been starved for a very long time. Slaves models have a place in multiple battletomes and through them have access to a lot of interesting and powerful allegiance abilities. You could go pure Slaves maggotkin, disciples of tzeentch, blades of khorne and hedonites too I think. 

Even for pure slaves, you got allegiance abilities in the generals handbook. You guys have multiple battalions, whereas Gutbusters had one, but for some reason it was taken away.

@Kurrilino, occupy yourself with something else in the mean time. Sell some of your vast army if needs be. But if Slaves to Darkness have to be last to get theirs, then that's only fair, because I deserve this. 

[Gaz Taylor]

+++ Mod Hat On +++

Can we please get back to discussing rumours and what was at the open day. I get some of you are a bit annoyed that some things weren’t shown but I’m sure GW have a plan. The folks at the studio read these forums and I’m sure are aware about some of the stuff you are asking for. Looking back at the releases for Death and Chaos, as well as the reveals yesterday, it will be worth the wait 😉

[alghero81]

One clarification about English language, I think the statement was that “All supported factions will receive a 2.0 battletome BY 2020” rather than “UNTIL”, the difference being that the latter may imply squatting in 2021...

Assuming KOs are covered in Cities of Sigmar, the only factions now without a 2.0 battletome would be:

Seraphon

Everchosen/StD/Creatures of Chaos

Tzeentch

There's another battletome for Chaos coming this year, so it’s really 50/50 chance, no?

Mawtribes battletome may technically come out next year but at this pace we will have all factions supported ready for 2.0 within the next 9 months... and then it will be new armies or niche armies expanded from existing soup battletomes.

The only 2.0 armies without the complete treatment endless spell/scenery are: Nurgle, LoN, Idoneth, DoK, Stormcast and Nighthaunt so we may see some smaller updates for them later on.

Regarding the Feast of Bones, from one side as someone already said there’s not much to eat from Skeletons so I would feel sorry for the Ogors. Zombies would give them more food despite being rotten... however the title tithe of bones seems to imply skeletons... but a duel box would not contain a mortarch or a super powerful being... on the other side any new death army would need more models as Deathrattle for now have only infantry, elite infantry, cavalry and a hero, and the others even less than this. A duel box may contain some of them but would be really boring as they are all available in the Start Collecting. I would bet on something new...

[DinoTitanedition]

1 hour ago, Gaz Taylor said:

everybody has a proper book now

And what is a proper book? Something that adjusts point values for competitive game requirements? To me the day one warscrolls were already "proper". Who actually has a problem with releases most of the time? Why is there mainly adjustments in paperworks and not in models? I somehow always get back to the same, mostly competitive,  causation.

 

EDIT: Just to make this clear, this emphasizes a factor of the upcoming releases - this is part of the rumours. I'm not trying to make this a discussion about the community, but the community does impact production and release strategy. It's very much connected.

Edited July 21, 2019 by DinoTitanedition

[alghero81]

And totally forgot, super excited by a new Centigor model? Whatever that is, it would be great to see BoC get some new models!

[Charleston]

Well, we do not know when StD will drop, but at least the signs are good that StD will get some love. A lot of hopes. mine too, were based on the Release of Gloomspite half year after Soul Wars, so I hoped that may be used to estimate a date. This was wrong. Than I hoped that Warcry will be a soft narrative turn into StD Book. Well, it somehow still is as it points the story back to the Allpeaks and Archaon gathering an army again, althrough we have to wait more.  But the signs are good that we will have at least a release with new models, something that now many factions get these times, which is nice. And with the current rules, any book will be a massive improvement. 

Back to topic:
I wonder if GW will go for shared units between factions. Wanderers could be an initial attempt to do so. We have Aelfish Wanderers-like Teasers for UW Season 3, whilst we have Wanderer Units confirmed in Cities of Sigmar. From business point of view, it could be a nice way to lure players to play more armies, just because they can reuse a lot of units they already own (main reason I will start Cities of Sigmar f.e.).

Also, why is noone hyped about the centaur? I mean, CENTAURS! That seems pretty new and rad

[Overread]

7 hours ago, Kurrilino said:

Yes there is a particular reason why.

I hear that the Battletome is coming since over 4 years. And despite you claim we know that one is coming, the actual truth is that we know ******.

And i am extremely pissed that the main bad guys even have a single book or remotely useful stuff while everyone else is now on their 2nd edition.

 

The thing is a LOT of AoS armies never even saw a Battletome release in any form. 

AoS has been a terrible mess of a release until 2.0 launched because its focus and company management both changed dramatically. At launch GW wasn't even going to give you a battletome ever. They then panic released the Generals Handbook and some early Battletomes because sales were not what they should have been and complaints were very vocal about the issues. 

But it wasn't until 2.0 that the game really became a game. The battletomes for 1.0 rules wise were just warscrolls; no abilities gear etc.... Just the warscrolls gathered together off the webstore. So really you didn't miss much by not having a 1.0 battletome. 

So I measure things from the 2.0 launch and what I see is a fast release rate of Battletomes exactly the same as GW has done for the latest 40K release. Last year was a big focus on 40K whilst this year is a big focus on AoS. You can see this in the release patterns; last year we had loads of Codex releases to the point where 40K was almost done by Christmas; this year its the same for AoS. Loads of Battletomes and a very likely chance that by Christmas all armies will be equipped with a 2.0 Battletome or if not then in January/February. 

Slaves to Darkness are a big range in a solid part of the games lore and product development. They are NOT going to be removed en-mass and if they were it would be a massive shock. Slaves weren't even fragmented at the launch of AoS so they've remained a solid choice and chaos is the big enemy of the realms. So its only a matter of time until the 2.0 Tome comes. 

 

Under launch no one was getting Tomes

Under 1.0 Tomes were just warscrolls - nice to have but not really changing the game. You had the same rules if you went and printed off the warscrolls from the GW store. These were nice but they were only holding things over. 

Under 2.0 things are totally different. Tomes are complete complex armies with lore, art, warscrolls, spells, battalions, gear, etc...

 

So yes unless GW does a very unpredictable totally insane move a Slaves to Darkness Tome will appear this year or at the very worst early into next year. My only surprise is that it wasn't announced yesterday to coincide with Warcry, however Destruction has only had 1 Battletome until now, its been in sore need of attention whilst the Aelves, Dwarves and humans have been a very messy situation for GW and the game for a long while. Slaves are not in a mess, they are not in as "urgent" a need as the other two blocks so I can see justification for putting those other choices first. 

 

 

And yes its super insane that its taken this many years to get AoS into this position and it shouldn't have happened and yes GW messed up. They messed up so hard they had to do a full change around and change CEOs and a vast part of their old culture. It's why AoS has persisted in a very messy state for too long; but this year is going to change that. Already we are now just getting over the half way point in supporting the game and as time goes on it should clean up even more. Honestly Slaves are in a safe place; dwarves are pretty safe; aelves are in the most chance of losing things right now along with humans - lots of legacy kits and lots of cross over if they are now in a combined arms force (esp since they put all 3 blocks together). 

[Yokai]

2 hours ago, Turragor said:

People, this thread is one of the most entertaining urls on the net because it is like asking a group of 4 year olds to guess who will win the eurovision song contest. 

It's gold! Rejoice! But don't be too sad or it spoils the atmosphere

Agreed! This thread is a trainwreck of unmanaged expectations. It is quite entertaining, but I have given up on the rumours long ago.

Edited July 21, 2019 by Yokai

[Lernaean]

I agree with @Overread, I don’t believe StD are in some kind of trouble. I just think it took GW a very long time for such a high profile army, and I too am surprised it wasn’t shown yesterday along with Warcry.

[EccentricCircle]

I reckon that the Feast of Bones and Tithe of Bones must be related in some way. Otherwise it would be an odd choice from a marketing prespective, to give them two names which would so easily be confused, and are not that distinct. Conversely, if they both tie into the same narrative arc then it makes sense to give them theme naming.

I've very excited for the Cities of Sigmar, since it will unite a vast amount of my random little Order armies into a single faction. My Free City shall rise again!

[Overread]

Free Cities is going to be such an interesting Tome to see how it all works! There are so many possibilities that I really hope its the next tome because darn it just knowing it exists begs more questions than answers at this stage. Plus I agree it will clean up SOOOO many things on the GW store page and the AoS line. In one fell swoop GW makes the game immediately more accessible to newbies (even if some classic army collectors will turn in their graves at the prospect of aelves and dwarves not just having to work together but having to trust each other!)

[Rogue Explorator]

14 minutes ago, Carnelian said:

I hate to derail again but I'm so confused how the STD guy is complaining... Didn't Games Workshop just release 8 new warscrolls for Slaves to Darkness along with around 50 new models for the Slaves to Darkness range? Most of which are outstanding? 

Well, all of these miniatures where made for a seperate game and the warscrolls are only written to make these miniatures playable at all. But playable does not mean practicable to use. Chaos players would propably be better of using the warcry warbands as marauders than they are with using those warscrolls.

Bottom line, warscrolls and datasheets released for miniatures made for stuff like Warcry, Warhammer Quest or Underworlds just never measure up to the rules written for maingame releases. Just as the miniatures themselves just never fit in as well with the main force. Because both where produced for a completely different purpose.

I think it is unfair to ignore this and tell those waiting they should be glad they got so many miniatures and warscrolls when they can't use these remotely as they could use what comes with a full update.

 

Not to forget that not just undivided mortal players are affected by the weakness of the Slaves line and silence on their future. Apart from Khorne, monogod Chaos players are hardly spoiled for choices when it comes to mortal units outside of Slaves.

And this is something GW has actually been outright misleading, if not even disingenuous , about. Remember when Hedonites released and there was serious disappointment that it was all daemons for a faction that has only one mortal unit?

There where multiple instances of the Warhammer Community account telling those disappointed to look to Warcry for that. Well, none of the new models can be used in marked allegiance. Unless there is something major coming completely out of the left field, all monogod players got for mortals was some kits to convert into better looking but also very expensive marauders. Or some weak and awkward warscrolls to pointlessly ally in.

 

I just didn't have the expectation to be disappointed. I'm also very eager to get my hands on Warcry on its own merit. But I can absolutely see why a lot of other fans of Chaos Mortals are quite frustrated with GW right now.

Yes in theory they got a lot, but in practise they got nothing they could use. And this despite GW marketing telling them again and again that they have every reason to get excited.

[Paul Buckler]

Honestly restart the rumour thread, condense know releases, and delete the whining as its posted.  May be heavy handed but 100% needed.  The nonsense posted by people here is mind boggling!

[Kramer]

6 minutes ago, Paul Buckler said:

Honestly restart the rumour thread, condense know releases, and delete the whining as its posted.  May be heavy handed but 100% needed.  The nonsense posted by people here is mind boggling!

Please post rumours in the rumour thread and feedback in the feedback section... 

you don’t see me posted cluttering the feedback threat by posting rumours there 😒

 

 

 

😉

Edited July 21, 2019 by Kramer

[JPjr]

Honestly now the dust has settled if I was a StD/Everchosen/Darkoath player I’d be quietly, counter-intuitively perhaps, happy.

July, & lot of August will be all about Warcry. Which like it or not is bringing out a load of models you’ll be able to use, even if right now they’re not particularly optimal £€$ wise. We also have at least 2 more warbands to come, one of whom would seem to be a more elite choice.

August/September - probably the release of the two BTs we’ve seen, with possibly terrain & spells for both.

PLUS the new Underworlds boxset with what looks like BoC vs. what is possibly new variation of wood elves. Plus going by the usual schema there will be 2 more warbands out before Xmas (of which of course 1 could easily be for you).

Sept/October - at some point looks like we’ll get a versus box with the new Ogor king in, around then we’ll also probably get the Mawtribes BT with maybe spells/prayers/terrain and maybe an extra small release of models.

Oct/Nov - Most likely another battletome which increasingly looks like it will be for this new Death faction. Most likely an expansion of Deathrattle, possibly some new skeletons of some kind but sounds like definitely one kind of Mortarch level model.

Nov/Dec - some big box game for the Xmas market plus the battleforce sets.

PLUS we’re going to have one major release this autumn for sure with Sisters of Battle for 40k which will suck up a lot of space.

if a Chaos undivided tome had been announced then honestly you’d most likely be looking at the spells, terrain, new hero model at most route. Much more likely then you’ll get more of a Gloomspite treatment in the early new year slot with a much bigger new range of models. 

The initial Warcry warbands will have been out for some time by then too so I’d expect them to get reboxed in AoS packaging, without cards etc and be cheaper. Or they’ll do sone kind of ‘Cultists of Chaos’ boxset so you can pick them up even cheaper.

of course annoying if you’re a kind of ‘I have 500 million points of chaos warriors and I won’t play anything else’ kind of person but every single thing I’ve read and understood since I got back into this hobby is that that isn’t the kind of person GW is focused on now. I suspect their kind of ideal player is someone with several different armies on the go from random warbands to 500-1000 pt forces to 1 or more bigger setups.

with so so so so many factions, even after the wave of consolidations, if all your eggs are in one basket you’re probably always going to be waiting and frustrated. They’re giving us lots of different ways to play to dip our toes into new & different factions. Of course that makes financial sense for them but I’d say it’s a much better, & healthier, way to engage with the hobby from our side.

anyway just my random musings on the matter. I’m looking forward to building up a little Darkoath/StD force myself so this gets me much more excited about the possibility of a bigger release with lots of new amazing models.

Edited July 21, 2019 by JPjr

[Beliman]

48 minutes ago, DinoTitanedition said:

And what is a proper book? Something that adjusts point values for competitive game requirements? To me the day one warscrolls were already "proper". Who actually has a problem with releases most of the time? Why is there mainly adjustments in paperworks and not in models? I somehow always get back to the same, mostly competitive,  causation.

I believe that it will change from one person to other. 

IMO, in a game with 20 supported armies/bands/warbands/etc..., every book should have the same number (or close enough) of features. From their own expanding lore, to tools to play (from abilities, to artefacts, etc). I don't mind if one book has 3 more battalions and the other more artefacts/models. The problem starts  when one of this books doens't have the whole package and others are fully "supported".
Of course, the setting and  main rules should go hand to hand too (it doesn't count If my book has the whole package but was written 20 years ago for a diferent edition...).

[Gaz Taylor]

1 hour ago, DinoTitanedition said:

And what is a proper book? Something that adjusts point values for competitive game requirements? To me the day one warscrolls were already "proper". Who actually has a problem with releases most of the time? Why is there mainly adjustments in paperworks and not in models? I somehow always get back to the same, mostly competitive,  causation.

 

EDIT: Just to make this clear, this emphasizes a factor of the upcoming releases - this is part of the rumours. I'm not trying to make this a discussion about the community, but the community does impact production and release strategy. It's very much connected.

Hi, I mean a Battletome rather than a couple of pages in the Generals Handbook. For me it’s great as they can focus upon new stuff and everybody has a fleshed out background for their models. This won’t please everybody but it’s a good spot to be in 😉

On another note, did anybody go to the open day? Did anybody get chance to chat with the people in the studio?

[Gecktron]

So, we just got a number of reveals but they are all missing something. 

Maybe GW is holding back stuff for Gencon and Nova? 

-Warclans and Free Cities need spells and faction terrain. 

-better pictures of the miniatures shown in the Beastgrave teaser

-part 2 of the Tithe video...

 

So maybe we get more stuff soon?

[Infeston]

Just one thing. Everyone now expects a new Ogor tome. I mean it is heavily hinted at, especially with "The Mawtribes". But right now GW hasn't confirmed any Ogor tome coming. It would be great if they put all Ogors in one faction.

But as someone said before, I fear that GW retcons Beastclaw Raiders and makes them generic Ogors again. This would be bad, because BCR have such a good lore.

I don't know which Ogors are finecast at the moment and which are not, but I believe that everything Finecast could be squatted from the Ogors.

The video does show several Ogor units. Are some of them in the video finecast? Or are they all plastic? I bought most of my "Gutbuster Ogors" in 6th Edition in Warhammer Fantasy, so I don't really know which models are finecast and plastic anymore. 

I guess the Bulls and Ironblasters will stay. But which models are finecast or metal at the moment and might be squatted later? Does anyone know?

Edited July 21, 2019 by Infeston

[Overread]

If Ogors lost finecast/metal from their range they'd lose most of their range. Almost every single model that isn't a large war engine or a team of 5 or so units (ergo troops) is metal/finecast. Ergo all the characterful ogors that make the faction popular. 

[Walrustaco]

6 minutes ago, Infeston said:

Just one thing. Everyone now expects a new Ogor tome. I mean it is heavily hinted at, especially with "The Mawtribes". But right now GW hasn't confirmed any Ogor tome coming. It would be great if they put all Ogors in one faction.

But as someone said before, I fear that GW retcons Beastclaw Raiders and makes them generic Ogors again. This would be bad, because BCR have such a good lore.

I don't know which Ogors are finecast at the moment and which are not, but I believe that everything Finecast could be squatted from the Ogors.

The video does show several Ogor units. Are some of them in the video finecast? Or are they all plastic? I bought most of my "Gutbuster Ogors" in 6th Edition in Warhammer Fantasy, so I don't really know which models are finecast and plastic anymore. 

I guess the Bulls and Ironblasters will stay. But which models are finecast or metal at the moment and might be squatted later? Does anyone know?

Everything in the video is plastic. Other armies like skaven kept their finecast stuff, most notably their heroes.

Unless GW plan on making plastic butchers or maneaters, perhaps both from the same kit, then I don't see why they wouldn't just keep the current finecast ogor models.

[Dirtnaps]

15 minutes ago, Infeston said:

Just one thing. Everyone now expects a new Ogor tome. I mean it is heavily hinted at, especially with "The Mawtribes". But right now GW hasn't confirmed any Ogor tome coming. It would be great if they put all Ogors in one faction.

But as someone said before, I fear that GW retcons Beastclaw Raiders and makes them generic Ogors again. This would be bad, because BCR have such a good lore.

I don't know which Ogors are finecast at the moment and which are not, but I believe that everything Finecast could be squatted from the Ogors.

The video does show several Ogor units. Are some of them in the video finecast? Or are they all plastic? I bought most of my "Gutbuster Ogors" in 6th Edition in Warhammer Fantasy, so I don't really know which models are finecast and plastic anymore. 

I guess the Bulls and Ironblasters will stay. But which models are finecast or metal at the moment and might be squatted later? Does anyone know?

Ah ya beat me to it.

None of the Ogors in the video are finecast, everything is plastic. I really do think this is the Carrion Empire/Looncurse for Gutbusters/Maw Tribes and whatever the other faction is, so a tome is probably not too far off. If the second army in the box is the new death faction I would be very surprised and it would mean this box would be the best way to get into the faction, pretty sure it won't be though and instead it'll be like Legions of Nagash Deathrattle or something.

Edited July 21, 2019 by Dirtnaps

[madmac]

3 minutes ago, Infeston said:

Just one thing. Everyone now expects a new Ogor tome. I mean it is heavily hinted at, especially with "The Mawtribes". But right now GW hasn't confirmed any Ogor tome coming. It would be great if they put all Ogors in one faction.

But as someone said before, I fear that GW retcons Beastclaw Raiders and makes them generic Ogors again. This would be bad, because BCR have such a good lore.

I don't know which Ogors are finecast at the moment and which are not, but I believe that everything Finecast could be squatted from the Ogors.

The video does show several Ogor units. Are some of them in the video finecast? Or are they all plastic? I bought most of my "Gutbuster Ogors" in 6th Edition in Warhammer Fantasy, so I don't really know which models are finecast and plastic anymore. 

I guess the Bulls and Ironblasters will stay. But which models are finecast or metal at the moment and might be squatted later? Does anyone know?

The only models shown in the video, other than the new Tyrant, are Ogors, (Bulls) Leadbelchers, and Ironblasters. All plastic kits, probably the contents of the vs box, and all certainly going to stay.

In terms of finecast, Ogors have a lot, but it's almost entirely hero options.

Tyrant, Butcher, Butcher with Cauldron, Maneaters, Firebelly, Hunter, Frost Sabers, Gorgor, Yhetti, are all finecast models.

I don't particularly expect any of the finecast models to go away except the ones replaced with plastic kits, so fingers crossed we get more than just the amazing Tyrant model.

[AthlorianStoners]

Best case scenario for Ogors is they get the Gloomspite treatment, combine them into one book but then expand each with new kits. Plastic Butcher, Hunter, Yhetees and Frost Sabre’s, then expand Firebellies and Maneaters with more units. 

Thats best case and probably unlikely, but one can dream. 

[Infeston]

15 minutes ago, madmac said:

I don't particularly expect any of the finecast models to go away except the ones replaced with plastic kits, so fingers crossed we get more than just the amazing Tyrant model.

Jeah. This is what I am hoping for. I guess if they release a new Tyrant they will propably also release Ogor endless spells. Maybe like Gloomspite Gitz, different themed spells depending on which Ogor tribe. Maybe a Maw spell for Gutbusters tribes and icy/frost-themed spells for Beastlaw Raiders.

And maybe, because the only wizards which Ogors have are Finecast, we will also get a new wizard. Maybe a new and cool Butcher. But this is just wishful thinking. But I think it would be great if we get a new Butcher model.

Edit: I guess they could also get the Khorne/Fireslayers treatment and get some kind of endless spells which aren't really endless spells.

Edited July 21, 2019 by Infeston