ElectricPaladin Posted May 28, 2019 Share Posted May 28, 2019 With the new push towards updating buffs with the "wholly within" language, do the calculations change around taking large units of models with larger bases? Case in point: I had a game the other day where I ran 30 dryads and an arch-revenant. I found that it was nearly impossible to buff the dryads unless I set everything up perfectly. When you consider terrain - and the fact that Sylvaneth in particular play to terrain - perfect is hard to achieve. How have you been dealing with this change? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel saxcloud Posted May 30, 2019 Share Posted May 30, 2019 Well can't remember Now but if the range " wholly within" just need to include a small bit of the Bases of the farthest models, you just need a bit of math... Or IF ot is a command ability, few kournoth hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMMachine Posted May 30, 2019 Share Posted May 30, 2019 27 minutes ago, Daniel saxcloud said: Well can't remember Now but if the range " wholly within" just need to include a small bit of the Bases of the farthest models, you just need a bit of math... Or IF ot is a command ability, few kournoth hunter "Unit wholly within" means, every model has to be completly within range, not only a small bit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted May 30, 2019 Author Share Posted May 30, 2019 Additionally, the entire unit must be in the range of the hero or the hunters. If the unit is half in range of a hero and half in range of some hunters, it doesn't work. The hunters don't extend the general's aura, they give you an alternative point to measure from - you still have to measure from one or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 On 5/28/2019 at 10:15 PM, ElectricPaladin said: With the new push towards updating buffs with the "wholly within" language, do the calculations change around taking large units of models with larger bases? Case in point: I had a game the other day where I ran 30 dryads and an arch-revenant. I found that it was nearly impossible to buff the dryads unless I set everything up perfectly. When you consider terrain - and the fact that Sylvaneth in particular play to terrain - perfect is hard to achieve. How have you been dealing with this change? Practice and pre-measuring. If you can get into your head what a legal ‘wholly within’ deployment / formation looks like you’ll do it more often and you’ll remember more often. Everyone forgets this kind of stuff though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riff_Raff_Rascal Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 Its an interesting question as I've had mixed results. Ultimately, you'll find that the same synergies you've had before a rules change or with even new heroes/units everything is still possible. I've discovered that this new push actually promotes and rewards tactical players because you are forced to make a very concise choice with these support heroes: Do you put them in position to capture a point? To charge in? To cast magic at a target? Or buff the unit? Its very difficult to do even 2 things in that list. For your situation, decide what you want your arch-revenant's role is, not just in your army list but during each turn. This will dictate a great deal of things. For his command ability I totally understand, top of combat abilities are tough to use without pre-planing well in advance. Heres my suggestion for a sylvaneth army: take advantage of your kurnoth hunter's "envoy of the everqueen" ability because now you're measuring wholly within the unit, and not just a model for your arch-revenants command ability. That unit broadcasts a buffing area far greater than the dinky thing your general is on. I'll agree with @5kaven5lave on the practicing part especialy if you run blocks of 30-40 models you want to target. I have had plenty of practice playing skaven trying to get an identical ability to work but I don't want to bombard you with too much info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel saxcloud Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 That s exactly the point. If a unit has to be wholly within were it is specified what it means for single models? Because if I have some. Model on the 12" from closest points of the bases they are within the 12" range ( basic rules ) and so it qualify for me for the "unit wholly within" . For the Kurnoth thing, of course is easier to be 12" from a unit of 3-6 members, instead from a single model. And I can keep the booster character elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMMachine Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Daniel saxcloud said: That s exactly the point. If a unit has to be wholly within were it is specified what it means for single models? Because if I have some. Model on the 12" from closest points of the bases they are within the 12" range ( basic rules ) and so it qualify for me for the "unit wholly within" . For the Kurnoth thing, of course is easier to be 12" from a unit of 3-6 members, instead from a single model. And I can keep the booster character elsewhere. The definition of "wholly within" is in the rulebook FAQ on warhammer community. Sadly GW forgot the specification in the corerule as it looks like (besides twice it is mentioned to use. Quote Q: Sometimes a rule will specify that a model or unit needs to be ‘wholly within’ a certain distance. What exactly does ‘wholly within’ mean? A: A model is wholly within a certain distance if every part of its base is within the stated distance. A unit is wholly within a certain distance if every part of the bases of all of the models in the unit is within the stated distance. For example, a model would be wholly within 12" of the edge of the battlefield as long as every part of its base was 12" or less from the edge, while a unit would be wholly within 12" of the edge of the battlefield as long as every part of every base of the models from the unit were 12" or less from the edge. @ElectricPaladin I think I would simply play smaller units if I want to get wholly within buffs from. Edited May 31, 2019 by EMMachine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel saxcloud Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 Ok so that is settled. Then, more kurnoth hunter s! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted May 31, 2019 Share Posted May 31, 2019 Surely the definition of ‘wholly within’ is beyond any kind of debate or need for clarification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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