Can I have plague rats in my Everchosen army?

[Slaves]

So as I understand it I can choose different chaos factions to form an alliance army.  So can I have plague rats in my Everchosen army?  I seem to remember half reading somewhere that pestilens units could only work with other plague units...?  But I can't remember where I read it, and may have misread it as I was looking for something else and not really paying much attention.

[Skreech Verminking]

7 minutes ago, Slaves said:

So as I understand it I can choose different chaos factions to form an alliance army.  So can I have plague rats in my Everchosen army?  I seem to remember half reading somewhere that pestilens units could only work with other plague units...?  But I can't remember where I read it, and may have misread it as I was looking for something else and not really paying much attention.

If your going the everchosen way, you’ll be able to take pestilence units as allies, since Everchosen take allies from any chaos faction.

although this is only if your going with Everchosen as your army

You could also go with the generic chaos allegiance which is right now anyways the only allegiance your able to take with Everchosen and just play mixed chaos

 

Edited May 23, 2019 by Skreech Verminking

[XReN]

52 minutes ago, Slaves said:

 

ok, so don't know about AOS enough to tell if you're disagreeing with each other or both saying I can do it but with a grand alliance...?

They are both saying you can have as many skaven and everchosen models if you build a GA: Chaos list, as there are no restrictions on what you can take if it has CHAOS keyword.

What Skreech also says is that you can build an Everchosen Allegiance list and take up to 200/400/500 points of skaven allies - depending on point size of the game using Allies system

[AverageBoss]

2 hours ago, Slaves said:

 

ok, so don't know about AOS enough to tell if you're disagreeing with each other or both saying I can do it but with a grand alliance...?

They did post conflicting information. The correct answer is:
A Skaven army CANNOT include Everchosen allies, as they are not a listed ally.
An Everchosen army CAN include Skaven allies as they can ally ANY CHAOS units.
A Grand Alliance army has no restrictions, and can utilize every single model with the Chaos keyword at once, even compendium units.

[AverageBoss]

7 hours ago, Overread said:

Skaven have a battletome and within it are the allied factions they can draw from which is basically only other skaven and Nurgle (through a skaven pestilens clan army). 

So you can't form a Skaven army with Everchosen nor an Everchosen army with Skaven. However what you can do is form a Grand Alliance Chaos army which can draw units from any force in the Chaos Grand Alliance. The Grand Alliance has its own book and abilities, however they were some of the first published for AoS and are very out of date now, which is why you don't see too many Grand Alliance armies. 

You are correct that Skaven cannot take Everchosen allies, but Everchosen CAN take Skaven allies.

[Overread]

1 minute ago, AverageBoss said:

You are correct that Skaven cannot take Everchosen allies, but Everchosen CAN take Skaven allies.

Ouch that's just darn confusing! 

That said it makes me wonder if/when GW address Everchosen we will see a change to reflect how the Skaven Battletome currently stands. It's a thought to keep in mind because there's a very strong chance that the Tome iwll be updated within the next year or so. 

[AverageBoss]

1 minute ago, Overread said:

Ouch that's just darn confusing! 

That said it makes me wonder if/when GW address Everchosen we will see a change to reflect how the Skaven Battletome currently stands. It's a thought to keep in mind because there's a very strong chance that the Tome iwll be updated within the next year or so. 

True, but its not the only case of this. Ogors and Ironjawz for example can call on various Gloomspite units as allies. But the Ogors and Ironjawz can't be used as allies for Gloomspite.

Both instances are probably fluff related. What Ogor or Ironjaw would be caught dead taking orders from a Goblin?

Likewise, I am pretty sure Archaon has no respect for the Skaven and considers the GHR a pretender.

[Overread]

1 minute ago, AverageBoss said:

True, but its not the only case of this. Ogors and Ironjawz for example can call on various Gloomspite units as allies. But the Ogors and Ironjawz can't be used as allies for Gloomspite.

Both instances are probably fluff related. What Ogor or Ironjaw would be caught dead taking orders from a Goblin?

Likewise, I am pretty sure Archaon has no respect for the Skaven and considers the GHR a pretender.

Aye, and in destruction again its the new tome vs old tomes issue again as Ironjawz and Beastclaw Raiders are old tomes.

Still until the new books come we can't be certain. 

[AverageBoss]

2 minutes ago, Overread said:

Aye, and in destruction again its the new tome vs old tomes issue again as Ironjawz and Beastclaw Raiders are old tomes.

Still until the new books come we can't be certain. 

Another good point. But its been this way with all the Goblin factions Ogors and Ironjawz since allies were introduced (you can check both the 2017 and 2018 GHBs). I don't think that one is going to change. Everchosen might though.

Edited May 23, 2019 by AverageBoss

[Slaves]

22 hours ago, Overread said:

So you can't form a Skaven army with Everchosen nor an Everchosen army with Skaven. However what you can do is form a Grand Alliance Chaos army which can draw units from any force in the Chaos Grand Alliance. The Grand Alliance has its own book and abilities, however they were some of the first published for AoS and are very out of date now, which is why you don't see too many Grand Alliance armies. 

 

22 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

If your going the everchosen way, you’ll be able to take pestilence units as allies, since Everchosen take allies from any chaos faction.

although this is only if your going with Everchosen as your army

You could also go with the generic chaos allegiance which is right now anyways the only allegiance your able to take with Everchosen and just play mixed chaos

 

ok, so don't know about AOS enough to tell if you're disagreeing with each other or both saying I can do it but with a grand alliance...?

[Slaves]

4 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

A Grand Alliance army has no restrictions, and can utilize every single model with the Chaos keyword at once, even compendium units.

OK, to be clear, can I use a Grand Alliance army in a "regular" game of AOS, or is it some special variant with different rules?

[Overread]

4 hours ago, Slaves said:

 

ok, so don't know about AOS enough to tell if you're disagreeing with each other or both saying I can do it but with a grand alliance...?

You can either:

a) Use an Everchosen Army with Skaven allies (skaven would be limited to 1/4 of points and unit count as per allies rules)

b) Use a Grand Alliance Chaos army with both forces how you want.

 

 

Baring in mind the Everchosen faction currently has no up to date 2.0 Battletome of its own and thus the ability for them to take Skaven allies might be changed when their book is released (which is likely to be sometime within the next 6-12 months). 
Further noting that the Grand Alliance books are very old and not as "powerful" as regular up to date armies. 

 

Note I'm unsure where the current rules for Everchosen are to be found 

[EMMachine]

2 minutes ago, Overread said:

a) Use an Everchosen Army with Skaven allies (skaven would be limited to 1/4 of points and unit count as per allies rules)

Actually it's 1/4 in case of units and 1/5 in case of points if you play one of the three standardsize games

 

3 minutes ago, Overread said:

Baring in mind the Everchosen faction currently has no up to date 2.0 Battletome of its own and thus the ability for them to take Skaven allies might be changed when their book is released (which is likely to be sometime within the next 6-12 months). 
Further noting that the Grand Alliance books are very old and not as "powerful" as regular up to date armies. 

 

Note I'm unsure where the current rules for Everchosen are to be found 

Everchosen is one of the worst Allegiances at the moment. It only has 3 units uses the same allegiance Abilities as there grand alliance und since 2.0 even the units in Everchosen battalions are allies (just not using the 1/4 rule). So you can't even fill your battleline with marauders or chaos warriors (this was possible in 1.0 after models in battaltion counted as part of the Allegiance of the battalion).

[AverageBoss]

1 hour ago, Slaves said:

OK, to be clear, can I use a Grand Alliance army in a "regular" game of AOS, or is it some special variant with different rules?

Yes, Grand Alliances are perfectly legal in all forms of AoS. Unlike other allegiances found in the GHB and Battletomes; the GA rules, artifacts, and abilities are located in the main rule book.

[Slaves]

19 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

Yes, Grand Alliances are perfectly legal in all forms of AoS. Unlike other allegiances found in the GHB and Battletomes; the GA rules, artifacts, and abilities are located in the main rule book.

So I couldn't use say an everchosen battalion or everchosen battletraits if I'm using a grand alliance?  Those sorts of thing would only be valid for "pure" armies?

[SolomonHelsing]

6 minutes ago, Slaves said:

So I couldn't use say an everchosen battalion or everchosen battletraits if I'm using a grand alliance?  Those sorts of thing would only be valid for "pure" armies?

You can use battalions because there is a part in an FAQ somewhere that says Battalions are said to belong to the Grand Alliance for that army allegiance as well. But yes you couldn't use allegiance specific items like battletraits and artefacts in a Grand Alliance Chaos army, only the Grand Alliance chaos ones. 

[Slaves]

11 minutes ago, SolomonHelsing said:

You can use battalions because there is a part in an FAQ somewhere that says Battalions are said to belong to the Grand Alliance for that army allegiance as well. But yes you couldn't use allegiance specific items like battletraits and artefacts in a Grand Alliance Chaos army, only the Grand Alliance chaos ones. 

ok, cool, thanks everyone, it's all starting to make sense now!  Definitely adding plague monks to my army, they're awesome...

[Overread]

Skaven have a battletome and within it are the allied factions they can draw from which is basically only other skaven and Nurgle (through a skaven pestilens clan army). 

So you can't form a Skaven army with Everchosen nor an Everchosen army with Skaven. However what you can do is form a Grand Alliance Chaos army which can draw units from any force in the Chaos Grand Alliance. The Grand Alliance has its own book and abilities, however they were some of the first published for AoS and are very out of date now, which is why you don't see too many Grand Alliance armies.