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AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion


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I'm wondering, if an infernal enrapturess causes an enemy spellcaster to reroll into a double 1, can they choose not to take the miscast and instead just take the enrapturess's mortal wounds instead (as a roll can only trigger one ability), or does miscast get around this? 

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1 hour ago, Enoby said:

I'm wondering, if an infernal enrapturess causes an enemy spellcaster to reroll into a double 1, can they choose not to take the miscast and instead just take the enrapturess's mortal wounds instead (as a roll can only trigger one ability), or does miscast get around this? 

I think there's no conflict and here's why - 

The Infernal Enrapturess Discordant Disruption is 'triggered' by a successful casting roll.  One it has caused the reroll, any roll of double will then cause d3 mortal wounds (this isn't a new ability or trigger, its an effect of an ability you're currently under as you make the reroll).  Certainly, the same roll can't trigger discordant disruption and be a miscast, right?

If you reroll into double 1's, you suffer d3 mortal wounds for discordant because thats part of an effect you're already resolving, and you now 'trigger' a miscast.

Essentially, the timing should be different.

...this should likely be FAQed though, as I'm not super certain on this.

EDIT - There may also be an issue with my theory based on timing of when rerolls happen vs. triggers.

Edited by KrispyXIV
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6 minutes ago, KrispyXIV said:

I think there's no conflict and here's why - 

The Infernal Enrapturess Discordant Disruption is 'triggered' by a successful casting roll.  One it has caused the reroll, any roll of double will then cause d3 mortal wounds (this isn't a new ability or trigger, its an effect of an ability you're currently under as you make the reroll).  Certainly, the same roll can't trigger discordant disruption and be a miscast, right?

If you reroll into double 1's, you suffer d3 mortal wounds for discordant because thats part of an effect you're already resolving, and you now 'trigger' a miscast.

Essentially, the timing should be different.

...this should likely be FAQed though, as I'm not super certain on this.

The MW aspect is, however, triggered by the roll of an unmodified double. Which is also, "in addition", to the initial re-roll effect. Both triggered effects happen on the same roll, at the same time.

This could mean your opponent could pick the Disco effect on a multi-cast wizard to keep casting (as a miscast stops the wizard from casting more spells). Not a huge deal since the Enrapturess then gives you multiple chances of inflicting MWs if they keep casting.

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Tonight, my regular opponent told me he would not be going LRL and would be taking a new mystery army that apparently was not competitive at all. "Fantastic," I thought to myself, "I can try that slightly silly exalted chariot list out again". I even took Shalaxi for the hell of it. 

So I rock up, ready for a fun, frothy game against not LRL, only to find his brand new army was... basically Nagash. Yet another unkillable uber-caster that roflstomps all casting attempts into the ground. His supporting cast were Ossiarch Bone Reapers, who apparently are not competitive, but I'm not sure that matters when you have an 8-cast +3 caster with a 2+/4++ save who ignores 1 rend as standard (Petrifex something or other?) and has very nasty melee/shooting attacks in addition to all his magic. Oh, and also Shalaxi was one-shotted with Hand of Dust fired though an umbral spell portal, which I was powerless to stop due to our lack of casting prowess (I didn't take Glutos). 

Lesson learned a second time: don't ever think about leaving Glutos and Siggy at home, kids. Although had I had Glutos, he could just as easily have been Hand of Dusted too. 

Edited by LeonBox
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12 minutes ago, LeonBox said:

Tonight, my regular opponent told me he would not be going LRL and would be taking a new mystery army that apparently was not competitive at all. "Fantastic," I thought to myself, "I can try that slightly silly exalted chariot list out again". I even took Shalaxi for the hell of it. 

So I rock up, ready for a fun, frothy game against not LRL, only to find his brand new army was... basically Nagash. Yet another unkillable uber-caster that roflstomps all casting attempts into the ground. His supporting cast were Ossiarch Bone Reapers, who apparently are not competitive, but I'm not sure that matters when you have an 8-cast +3 caster with a 2+/4++ save who ignores 1 rend as standard (Petrifex something or other?) and has very nasty melee/shooting attacks in addition to all his magic. Oh, and also Shalaxi was one-shotted with Hand of Dust fired though an umbral spell portal, which I was powerless to stop due to our lack of casting prowess (I didn't take Glutos). 

Lesson learned a second time: don't ever think about leaving Glutos and Siggy at home, kids. Although had I had Glutos, he could just as easily have been Hand of Dusted too. 

Did you have Be'lakor?   Be'lakor is my planned countermeasure for these scenarios.  

If they foolishly go second, you can lock their lynchpin model out of their two most important turns of the game if they get the double.  

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Just now, KrispyXIV said:

Did you have Be'lakor?   Be'lakor is my planned countermeasure for these scenarios.  

If they foolishly go second, you can lock their lynchpin model out of their two most important turns of the game if they get the double.  

I did not, and I think he just made my purchase list. Getting tired of having absolutely no answer to the god models (I don't really want to buy/paint Archaon, frankly, but Be'lakor I think I can handle). 

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25 minutes ago, LeonBox said:

I did not, and I think he just made my purchase list. Getting tired of having absolutely no answer to the god models (I don't really want to buy/paint Archaon, frankly, but Be'lakor I think I can handle). 

I’m going to buy him right f’n now! Wooooo

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15 hours ago, LeonBox said:

Tonight, my regular opponent told me he would not be going LRL and would be taking a new mystery army that apparently was not competitive at all. "Fantastic," I thought to myself, "I can try that slightly silly exalted chariot list out again". I even took Shalaxi for the hell of it. 

So I rock up, ready for a fun, frothy game against not LRL, only to find his brand new army was... basically Nagash. Yet another unkillable uber-caster that roflstomps all casting attempts into the ground. His supporting cast were Ossiarch Bone Reapers, who apparently are not competitive, but I'm not sure that matters when you have an 8-cast +3 caster with a 2+/4++ save who ignores 1 rend as standard (Petrifex something or other?) and has very nasty melee/shooting attacks in addition to all his magic. Oh, and also Shalaxi was one-shotted with Hand of Dust fired though an umbral spell portal, which I was powerless to stop due to our lack of casting prowess (I didn't take Glutos). 

Lesson learned a second time: don't ever think about leaving Glutos and Siggy at home, kids. Although had I had Glutos, he could just as easily have been Hand of Dusted too. 

Be'lekor is probably the best counter to god models we have access to (besides just bringing Archaon ourselves). He kind of has the same function as Glutos, being a control piece, with pros and cons. Be'lekor is better at dealing with god models for a turn, is cheaper, and is also quicker. He's very good double turn protection too, which is nice. 

Glutos on the other hand has weaker control of god models, especially ones that can dispell, but likely a greater effect on the game outside of Dark Master as he is much tankier, provides some battleshock buffs for the army, does similar damage (when considering keywords), provides a -1 to hit bubble, and his spell can be used multiple times in a game. 

Overall, Be'lekor is better against god models and Glutos is better against more 'well balanced' lists that don't rely on a single unit. In this meta, Be'lekor is probably better, but this may change in future GHBs.

A word of caution though is that I think Be'lekor is an ally rather than coalition as he lacks the Slaanesh keyword. While that's fine at the moment, there's a chance he may increase in points over 400 if he's used a lot. 

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I'm always a little surprised at how much love Be'lakor gets, he always struck me as a pretty generic evil demon guy design-wise, with none of the flair of his god-aligned fellows, but fair play if people like his style I suppose!  I'd have to convert/find a more Slaaneshi alternative if I was going to run him in a list I think.

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46 minutes ago, Lucentia said:

I'm always a little surprised at how much love Be'lakor gets, he always struck me as a pretty generic evil demon guy design-wise, with none of the flair of his god-aligned fellows, but fair play if people like his style I suppose!  I'd have to convert/find a more Slaaneshi alternative if I was going to run him in a list I think.

Haha, yeah I have no love for him lore wise - same with Archaon and Abaddon tbh, they both come across as very generic. I don't hate them or anything, they're just super vanilla in a faction that has the potential of some really creative characters. 

Also, it was revealed a while ago but I didn't see any mention on it here, how do people feel about the defeat of the twins being retconned from Witch Hunters to Morathi in the CRB?

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I don't hate Archaon, at least he's got his whole little rebelling against the whims of the chaos gods angle which can be kinda fun.

I haven't read Kragnos, only summaries, so I wasn't sure if I that was a retcon or misinformation on my part.  Morathi makes a lot more sense as the one responsible for defeating the twins, both in terms of narrative themes and general importance, shame it doesn't happen that way in the actual book!

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22 minutes ago, Sorrow said:

@Enoby

How does Morathi take down the Twins?

 

It's unfortunately pretty vague, but here's the excerpt: 

20210722_142022.jpg.fbf4d129731973176f993ef90feaf523.jpg

Basically just "Morathi fought them and they flew off", which is totally different to BR Kragnos.

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It's Morathi.  She did it with her beauty, wit, and raw unadulterated awesomeness.  They left in awe and terror of how great she was.   So sayeth the history books, published in Har Kuron, as approved by Morathi-Khaine, Goddess. 

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The fascinating thing about that is that they must have changed it before they even got any fan feedback. Seems to suggest some internal indecision.

 

Also that, combined with the lore on Dexcessa’s GW web store page, calling Morathi their figurative mother, seems kind of neat

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7 minutes ago, Selpharia said:

The fascinating thing about that is that they must have changed it before they even got any fan feedback. Seems to suggest some internal indecision.

 

Also that, combined with the lore on Dexcessa’s GW web store page, calling Morathi their figurative mother, seems kind of neat

Yeah, they're essentially the children of Slaanesh and Morathi. It makes a lot more sense in that context for Morathi to defeat them as compared to the Witch Hunters. 

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1 hour ago, Nagashfan said:

Got my Belakor, think I’m gonna stick a shield on him from the keeper/shalaxi kit

This was Vince Venturella's Be'lakor :) A pretty great conversion if it helps provide inspiration

Screenshot_20210722-210343_Instagram.jpg

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