AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[KrispyXIV]

2 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

Well,
I have a small HoS Collection and would like to field them with my Slaves to Darkness.
Is there a legitimate way to build an army without being tabled against even the worst lists?

Here's what I own:

2x Fiends
1x Syll'esske
1x Keeper of Secrets
1x Slickblade Seekers
1x Slaanesh Terrain

I intend to proxy my chaos Warriors as Twinsouls (5 Models) or Myrmidesh (25 Models)
Apart from that I have pretty much everything the Slaves Range has to offer except the Mutalith ans its Khorne counterpart and Chariots 

The big issue I see with what you have is a lack of sustainable summon models.  In a good game, I'm hoping for at least 2 but maybe 3 good summons, meaning an exalted chariot or 20-30 daemonettes and SOMETIMES a Keeper where its CA helps.  

I don't have a horrible time playing Hedonites, but it IS an extremely demanding army to play/collect. 

[ibel]

17 hours ago, JackStreicher said:

Well,
I have a small HoS Collection and would like to field them with my Slaves to Darkness.
Is there a legitimate way to build an army without being tabled against even the worst lists?

Hi,

so let me Say it is actually not easy to Play with Hedonits and are not Tabled, better speak: U Always Start with a Handicap of 3-450 Points in a 2k Game. With the Modell List u owen i defintl say u Need a Lord of Pain to make Painbringer and Twinsouls Batteline. Than i would give this List to u:

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Godseekers Host
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Syll'Esske, the Vengeful Allegiance (210)*
- Lore of Slaanesh: Born of Damnation
Infernal Enrapturess, Herald of Slaanesh (140)*
Lord of Pain (155)*
- General
- Command Trait: Skilled Leader
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Universal Spell Lore: Levitate

Battleline
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (370)**
- Reinforced x 1

Units
6 x Fiends (400)**
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Slickblade Seekers (230)**

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Total: 1985 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 113
Drops: 4

I would say it Maybe work agansint most casuall Games (not against 2x30 Sentinels+Teclics List, Not against doppel Mawcrusher, not Against full KO One drop, not against Morathi+25Stalker but...Maybe gainst beast of Chaos or Nighthaunts)

But i had to agreee with my Speaker above me u Need more Units to Summon! here is my List on Modells an the Sideboard for Summon in a 2k Game:

1 Keeper of Secret, 30+ Dämonetten, 1 Exalted Chariot, 1 Viceleader, 1 Infernal Enrapture, 1 Epitome

So just my 2cents

[JackStreicher]

3 hours ago, ibel said:

Hi,

so let me Say it is actually not easy to Play with Hedonits and are not Tabled, better speak: U Always Start with a Handicap of 3-450 Points in a 2k Game. With the Modell List u owen i defintl say u Need a Lord of Pain to make Painbringer and Twinsouls Batteline. Than i would give this List to u:

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Godseekers Host
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Syll'Esske, the Vengeful Allegiance (210)*
- Lore of Slaanesh: Born of Damnation
Infernal Enrapturess, Herald of Slaanesh (140)*
Lord of Pain (155)*
- General
- Command Trait: Skilled Leader
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Universal Spell Lore: Levitate

Battleline
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
5 x Myrmidesh Painbringers (160)*
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (370)**
- Reinforced x 1

Units
6 x Fiends (400)**
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Slickblade Seekers (230)**

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Total: 1985 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 113
Drops: 4

I would say it Maybe work agansint most casuall Games (not against 2x30 Sentinels+Teclics List, Not against doppel Mawcrusher, not Against full KO One drop, not against Morathi+25Stalker but...Maybe gainst beast of Chaos or Nighthaunts)

But i had to agreee with my Speaker above me u Need more Units to Summon! here is my List on Modells an the Sideboard for Summon in a 2k Game:

1 Keeper of Secret, 30+ Dämonetten, 1 Exalted Chariot, 1 Viceleader, 1 Infernal Enrapture, 1 Epitome

So just my 2cents

This looks good! I guess I'll give it a shot!
Thanks!

[azdimy]

I ve been giving the forgeworld keeper more game time. So far he s outperformed the regular keeper every game. The spare points is just the cherry on top. I ve found the excess of violence ca that he lacks I never used anyway because of how it got rewritten and the limitations of ca usage in aos3 I tend to always go for all out defense or all out attack instead

The better bracket means he still can do some  damage after he s taken some wounds and the tendrils are fun when relevant in a hero on hero fight. The d3 depravity generated every combat phase from it makes your opponent think twice about sticking around 

[Enoby]

Hopefully a good deal for anyone wanting to jump in to Hedonites

Tbh, besides Slaangors, all of these can see play.

[zombiepiratexxx]

The studio love Slaanesh so much, they can't even be bothered to properly edit the photos of the units into the box art! Look at that mysterious mirror hovering above the Twinsouls! 

[Lucentia]

That's just a part of the studio Slaanesh terrain they use for photoshoots, you can see another angle on some of the pics in the battletome.

[Enoby]

Apparently there's an FAQ coming in December to boost weaker units - let's hope our survey paid off!

[KrispyXIV]

24 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Apparently there's an FAQ coming in December to boost weaker units - let's hope our survey paid off!

Exciting prospect.  I've got big hopes for things like cheaper Keepers, since I've had decent luck with them as an Uber support that was tragically held back (at list building) by the absurd cost. 

I'd be mostly happy with points update, but the 40k update also included significant rules buffs in a couple cases as well - so the skies the limit. 

Edited November 19, 2021 by KrispyXIV

[azdimy]

I still have hope for a Slaangor Fiendbloods warscroll update. It would be a nice companion with the HoS battlebox!

[Enoby]

I think I'll be sending them the survey results again tonight/tomorrow - just as a last final push to try heighten the odds if they've somehow forgotten us.

I mean, I don't think I've seen a more bemoaned unit than Slaangors, but you never know...

[Sorrow]

@Enoby

This is the result of our surveys, both of them to be precise.

GW does listen to feedback if it is properly constructed and articulated. Ours was.

-----------------------------------------------------

She Who Thirsts is generous to her devotees!

[KrispyXIV]

17 minutes ago, azdimy said:

I still have hope for a Slaangor Fiendbloods warscroll update. It would be a nice companion with the HoS battlebox!

I had had the thought that if I were an evil, money focused corporation a balance update for the majority of the units in that box - especially the Slaangors, but also painbringers/twinsouls, slickblades, and the shardcaster - might ensure that box sells out super quick...

Not that those units don't need it, but...

I'm not saying that GW is motivated that way, but its another reason to hope for a good balance update

Edited November 19, 2021 by KrispyXIV

[zombiepiratexxx]

Still think that the Christmas box is going on my list for family. Not that I need more plastic but this is literally packed with the units I don't own and actually want so it's a big win I think. 

[MothmanDraws]

I dont expect faq to do much outside of points, if i could have minor warscroll tweaks with big impacts id ask for

Blissbarb archers + blissbarb seekers to get move after shooting as i think this is more effevtive at keeping them safe  and plays to skirmisher/fragile playstyle

Myrmidesh and twinsouls just need to be cheaper, maybe inate battle line might help as they are expensive already +lop tax. I still like idea of gving painbringers a formation like shining company that makes them super tanky. Or keep myrmidesh expensive and have a "on 6s they get sigvalds ignore saves", piercing damage should be our forte, leave explosive attacks to khorne.

Slaangor and shalaxi need rewrite. As do some of the relics and spells, too many are just mortal wounds. I would be happy to see summoning gutted and focus of faction being "fast, teases you with archers staying barely out of reach for 2 turns then winning with single perfect strike" 

I will be picking up that battleforce though hopefullt my dream army of 10 painbringers 2 units of blissbarb sigvald and mixed cav ends up working out with the faq.

Edit- Actually my theory, slaanesh ends up nerfed in faq, they remove our summoning and only give a 5% point decrease on all units, give slaangor a full rewrite but mess up keywords so they cant be fielded

Edited November 22, 2021 by MothmanDraws

[Enoby]

3 hours ago, MothmanDraws said:

Edit- Actually my theory, slaanesh ends up nerfed in faq, they remove our summoning and only give a 5% point decrease on all units, give slaangor a full rewrite but mess up keywords so they cant be fielded

I can't imagine we'll be nerfed (certainly, I really hope not), but my worry is we'll be ignored totally. In a way, that would be almost worse - it'd show that they don't think there's an issue at all, rather than a botched attempt to fix an issue (which would likely be attempted to be fixed later).

I am going to be baffled should Slaangors not get touched up in the 'warscroll fixes' they're planning on doing.

[Sorrow]

32 minutes ago, Enoby said:

I can't imagine we'll be nerfed (certainly, I really hope not), but my worry is we'll be ignored totally. In a way, that would be almost worse - it'd show that they don't think there's an issue at all, rather than a botched attempt to fix an issue (which would likely be attempted to be fixed later).

I am going to be baffled should Slaangors not get touched up in the 'warscroll fixes' they're planning on doing.

I know for a fact that they were "actively scrutinizing" the survey data we sent them. That being said, anything beyond that is a enigma to me. They might have looked at data and said, "This should be fixed." or they could have said "These are clearly the results of fan wishing."

Still, I would be very, very much surprised if we got totally ignored.

[Enoby]

5 minutes ago, Sorrow said:

I know for a fact that they were "actively scrutinizing" the survey data we sent them. That being said, anything beyond that is a enigma to me. They might have looked at data and said, "This should be fixed." or they could have said "These are clearly the results of fan wishing."

Still, I would be very, very much surprised if we got totally ignored.

Yeah, I would also be surprised if we were totally ignored - I do think, especially with what has been said to you - something will change.

If I were to guess, we'll get:

+ A moderate points decrease, especially on the mortal side

+ A minor but significant warscroll change to Slaangors; something like an additional -1 rend and +1 damage 

I don't think we'll get:

- Any full warscroll changes, even if only because they'd rather have new warscrolls in print

- A very large points drop (e.g. below our old points); while this may happen in time, I don't think they'll do it too quickly 

- An allegiance ability change, including any changes to summoning (I think if these do change, it'll be in a White Dwarf)

 

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

13 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Yeah, I would also be surprised if we were totally ignored - I do think, especially with what has been said to you - something will change.

If I were to guess, we'll get:

+ A moderate points decrease, especially on the mortal side

+ A minor but significant warscroll change to Slaangors; something like an additional -1 rend and +1 damage 

I don't think we'll get:

- Any full warscroll changes, even if only because they'd rather have new warscrolls in print

- A very large points drop (e.g. below our old points); while this may happen in time, I don't think they'll do it too quickly 

- An allegiance ability change, including any changes to summoning (I think if these do change, it'll be in a White Dwarf)

 

I would have agreed before the 40k Balance Dataslate update, now I'm not so sure. If the AoS FAQ has a similar scope to that, we might actually see tweaks to allegiance abilites, as well.

[azdimy]

They clearly indicated they want to boost warscrolls that don t see play so I now expect plenty of warscroll rewrites because the faction as a whole doesn t  see play at events the way it is and its not just point

[MothmanDraws]

I will use my ability to see future, faq is just a single line "revert to codex points, slangore +1 bravery while in combat"

 

[Enoby]

15 minutes ago, MothmanDraws said:

I will use my ability to see future, faq is just a single line "revert to codex points, slangore +1 bravery while in combat"

 

Well I hope you're ability to see the future is malfunctioning

That said, revert to battletome points would actually help a decent amount. Not the Slaangors, but it'd be a massive boon for Glutos and the KoS. 

[KrispyXIV]

20 minutes ago, MothmanDraws said:

I will use my ability to see future, faq is just a single line "revert to codex points, slangore +1 bravery while in combat"

 

I hope not.  Not everything actually went up, and some of the things that dropped needed it.  And not everything that went up was insane - Contorted Epitome at 210 is silly, and Glutos is worth every bit of 475 especially if things around him get cheaper.  

And considering the use I get out of Blissbarb Seekers currently, 180 on them is definitely in the realm of too good to be true...

Some things, like Daemonettes, probably can go all the way back down... but I'm worried about Keepers as a God Tier support piece if they were only 340...

Edited November 22, 2021 by KrispyXIV

[zombiepiratexxx]

Their own tournament meta data shows Slaanesh as circling the drain so hopefully they'll do something to correct things. Not a swing that gets us back to the original 2.0 book but hopefully not the trash tier they're perceived as being right now. 

[Popisdead]

On 11/19/2021 at 11:49 AM, Sorrow said:

GW does listen to feedback if it is properly constructed and articulated. Ours was.

Well that's debatable but I would agree with the point they are more inclined to listen to feedback in the manner you described.  

And I trust Enoby 100% to present with clarity and good intentions.  I'm hoping it goes well.