AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[Belmail]

2 minutes ago, Hebroseph said:

How does the mutilating blades ability on seeker chariots work with units? Do you roll d3 for the whole unit, or d3 per seeker chariot that ends the charge move with in 1"? 

Each model in a chariot unit has a chance to deal mortals.

[SwampHeart]

1 hour ago, Poryague said:

Apparently they believe we lack the out put to deal with large block.

I don't know that they're wrong? Without dragging back the conversation from the last thread a unit of Daemonettes in Epicureans will kill 22 models assuming a unit with a regular 4+ save with no other saves to speak of (which is actually a pretty rare unit these days). Against say GGRs they'll kill 17, against 30 Pbears that drops to 14 (-1 to hit hurts). Obviously with double fight you can effectively double those numbers (give or take for possibly reduced models fighting due to space) but realistically screens are a solid answer to our out put. I say all that to say I agree that taking the Thermal Rider cloak is a solid answer, I've also had a lot of success with a generic daemon prince as well. 
 

1 hour ago, Poryague said:

The other thing is there is a belief by IDK we lack ability to deal with ishlan gaurd the defensive eels. They think we lack volume of attacks or mortal wound out put. 

This I don't agree with, one of my regular opponents is a good IDK player and while Ishlaen are sticky they're not sticky enough to not melt against a KoS. One 6 from the Claws is enough to make the unit quickly begin to wither. 

[Poryague]

50 minutes ago, SwampHeart said:

I don't know that they're wrong? Without dragging back the conversation from the last thread a unit of Daemonettes in Epicureans will kill 22 models assuming a unit with a regular 4+ save with no other saves to speak of (which is actually a pretty rare unit these days). Against say GGRs they'll kill 17, against 30 Pbears that drops to 14 (-1 to hit hurts). Obviously with double fight you can effectively double those numbers (give or take for possibly reduced models fighting due to space) but realistically screens are a solid answer to our out put. I say all that to say I agree that taking the Thermal Rider cloak is a solid answer, I've also had a lot of success with a generic daemon prince as well. 
 

This I don't agree with, one of my regular opponents is a good IDK player and while Ishlaen are sticky they're not sticky enough to not melt against a KoS. One 6 from the Claws is enough to make the unit quickly begin to wither. 

Plague bears can be annoying because they are tough. They will find it hard to keep us of their territory because the body count will be to low. Plagueberers are not cheap. They can end up sacrificeing one thing in exchange of another.

I think skaven the worst to deal with for horde they can easily drop 120+ bodies on the table with solid hero choices, easy battle shock immunity, good spells and more. They can really squeze in a lot of things they want sacrificing little.

Think its worth talking about some of the most unfavorable match ups we can think of and our options. Granted we dont have a ton of play under our belt yet.

[themortalgod]

2 hours ago, Hebroseph said:

I tried a mix in my godseeker list last night. Sinistrous hand, Progeny of Damnation, Thermal Rider cloak and Speed-Chaser. the 2d3 wounds kept him up and the retreat and charge with fly let me run away from things that could reliably kill me in one turn while getting to the juicy stuff i wanted. 

 

I've been theorizing a similar build while running a second Keeker in my Godseeker list with Ignax Scales and the Slothfull spell to be a tank. I really am starting to feel Godseekers is going to be the host of choice even though most of their item options sort of suck. Pretenders will be too easy to just snipe down the super Keeper I think and having a situation where Keepers can't support each other for Invaders feels like too much of a downside. 

Also getting +3 charge after being summoned for units is just so tasty. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by themortalgod

[Enoby]

Just now, themortalgod said:

I've been theorizing a similar build while running a second Keeker in my Godseeker list with Ignax Scales and the Slothfull spell to be a tank. I really am starting to feel Godseekers is going to be the host of choice even though most of their item options sort of suck. Pretenders will be too easy to just snipe down the super Keeper I think and having a situation where Keepers can't support each other for Invaders feels like too much of a downside. 

As well, importantly, while the Godseekers items suck, all items can be traded out for rerolls to hit by the fane, or just taking a realm artefact. 

[themortalgod]

Just now, Enoby said:

As well, importantly, while the Godseekers items suck, all items can be traded out for rerolls to hit by the fane, or just taking a realm artefact. 

Exactly, my plan being Thermal Rider on one and Ignax on the other. 

[Enoby]

1 minute ago, themortalgod said:

Exactly, my plan being Thermal Rider on one and Ignax on the other. 

Both very good choices. As realm artefacts are iffy in the group I play in, I'll likely take the cameo to use and sacrifice to the fane; 1cp and rerolling all failed hits isn't bad at all for an artefact. 

[Poryague]

 

9 minutes ago, themortalgod said:

I've been theorizing a similar build while running a second Keeker in my Godseeker list with Ignax Scales and the Slothfull spell to be a tank. I really am starting to feel Godseekers is going to be the host of choice even though most of their item options sort of suck. Pretenders will be too easy to just snipe down the super Keeper I think and having a situation where Keepers can't support each other for Invaders feels like too much of a downside. 

Also getting +3 charge after being summoned for units is just so tasty. 

 The keepers in invaders can support each other there is no issue there. Invaders CAN have multiple generals NOT MUST have. They also have the most cp so some movement shenanigans  and cp means the most multiple activation in every combat phase.

I do find thermal rider cloak making it into multiple list combine with the fane to kill something that needs to die now.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Poryague

[Enoby]

How are people finding the Fane in general? I know before the book everyone was a bit on the fence about it (some loving some hating), but know we see the full picture I'd like to know what the concensus is on it now? Obviously always worth taking for 0 points, but do you find yourself using it?

[themortalgod]

11 minutes ago, Poryague said:

 

 The keepers in invaders can support each other there is no issue there. Invaders CAN have multiple generals NOT MUST have. They also have the most cp so some movement and do means the most multiple activation on on every players combat phase.

I do find thermal rider cloak making it into multiple list combine with the fane to kill something that needs to die now.

Ha, interesting, I didn't even consider that it was optional hahaha. I do agree lots of CP is critical. (also a big knock against the Pretenders host)

So it more comes down to more CP vs more mobility. I will have to test both. I think I still lead towards the mobility though as more speed offers more opportunities to win tactically whereas more CP is just more bulldozing power which may turn out to be more powerful but it is less fun.

 

6 minutes ago, Enoby said:

How are people finding the Fane in general? I know before the book everyone was a bit on the fence about it (some loving some hating), but know we see the full picture I'd like to know what the concensus is on it now? Obviously always worth taking for 0 points, but do you find yourself using it?

I think the Fane is a nice bonus but not game-changing. It is obviously a "must take" because it is a free bonus but it also isn't going to be game changing either. I think anyone who hates it's only grounds is they wanted more power out of a free terrain piece. Re-rolls in our army is super powerful though and that wound is so easy to heal back and free DP is never a bad thing. 

All that said, I HATE the big daemon head. I wish it was just the Slaanesh symbol. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by themortalgod

[Poryague]

2 minutes ago, Enoby said:

How are people finding the Fane in general? I know before the book everyone was a bit on the fence about it (some loving some hating), but know we see the full picture I'd like to know what the concensus is on it now? Obviously always worth taking for 0 points, but do you find yourself using it?

I'm finding more beneficial then people gave credit. After building it and measuring the range of its abilities its bigger then people gave it credit. Depending on the battle plan its possible to put in spots to use the reroll mechanic all the time. The idea of sacrificng a wound for rerolls and then launching flying keeper over there front line is funny because that puts you opponent in a sucky situation.

[Pompe]

Just now, themortalgod said:

Snip

You also dont have to pick all of the big guys as your general. Go for an enrapturess or a epitome as one of them and you are getting that second keeper to stick with the general one.

[Enoby]

I've found Godseekers not too bad for CP. Not quite as good as invaders, but not bad; if you have a 5 hero SS battalion, 50 pts under, and use the cameo, you'll start your turn 1 with 5 CP on a roll of a 5 or under (or 4 if you fail that). While subsequent CP is lower, that huge boost at the beginning may carry you through both your turn and your opponent's turn with ease.   

Edited May 8, 2019 by Enoby

[SwampHeart]

12 minutes ago, Enoby said:

How are people finding the Fane in general? I know before the book everyone was a bit on the fence about it (some loving some hating), but know we see the full picture I'd like to know what the concensus is on it now? Obviously always worth taking for 0 points, but do you find yourself using it?

I've been using it to boost an Enrapturess, gives her re-rolls plus she now generates 2 DP a turn (1 for being an Enrapturess and 1 for the MW she takes from the Fane). Its free and I like the magic defense and DP boost from the Enrapturess so the Fane seems like a natural spot for her hang out. 

[Bashpan]

Any advices for a pretenders list:

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Pretenders Host
Mortal Realm: Ghur
Keeper of Secrets (360)
- General
- Trait: Strength of Goodhood 
- Artefact: Sliverslash 
- Host Option: Hunter of Godbeasts (Pretenders Host Second Command Trait)
- Spell: Progeny of Damnation
Keeper of Secrets (360)
- Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm 
- Spell: Slothful Stupor
The Contorted Epitome (200)
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy
Infernal Enrapturess, Herald of Slaanesh (140)
30 x Daemonettes (300)
30 x Daemonettes (300)
10 x Daemonettes (110)
Epicurean Revellers (180)
Aethervoid Pendulum (40)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 110

[Enoby]

6 minutes ago, Bashpan said:

*snip*

Seems good to me, but it may be worth losing the Aethervoid pendulum for one more CP. An extra pile in during your opponent's turn will do much more than the pendulum imo.

[themortalgod]

9 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Seems good to me, but it may be worth losing the Aethervoid pendulum for one more CP. An extra pile in during your opponent's turn will do much more than the pendulum imo.

Yeah but worth considering that the pendulum can reach places melee cannot. (Say if you need to get at a hag behind a ton of witches) Also, pendulums seem to scare opponents a lot. Just having one in a list can completely change how the opponent deploys/moves. 

[Grimrock]

9 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Seems good to me, but it may be worth losing the Aethervoid pendulum for one more CP. An extra pile in during your opponent's turn will do much more than the pendulum imo.

Interesting point for the pendulum though: if you're in need of the last few points of depravity for a big summon you can hit your own heroes with it. A little risky for sure, but that extra 1 or 2 d6 can make a big difference. 

[Overread]

2 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

Interesting point for the pendulum though: if you're in need of the last few points of depravity for a big summon you can hit your own heroes with it. A little risky for sure, but that extra 1 or 2 d6 can make a big difference. 

It actually gives a neat reason to encourage your opponent not to swing any predatory endless spell in your direction. "Oh you want to hurt me with my own spell - ok that's fine my keeper will love it! She'll generate a load of depravity points!" 

[Bashpan]

I want to use the pendulum in the first game and see if im gonna need the extra command point in a pretenders list i think i dont gonna need it but who knows anyway the pretender keeper is enough to kill any big monster in the table without a double round of attacks.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Bashpan

[Poryague]

I think there is some list play in shyish. The ethereal amulet. The goblet of draining this will do d3mw to a hero you wounded on a 5+. The thing is it says wounded meaning if we give it to the enrapturess she can become a better sniper since her shooting will trigger it. Banshee blade is a maybe each time you roll a 6+ to hit you roll against the units bravery equal to or higher to do d3 mw in addition to its normal damage.

[Kasper]

1 hour ago, themortalgod said:

Ha, interesting, I didn't even consider that it was optional hahaha. I do agree lots of CP is critical. (also a big knock against the Pretenders host)

So it more comes down to more CP vs more mobility. I will have to test both. I think I still lead towards the mobility though as more speed offers more opportunities to win tactically whereas more CP is just more bulldozing power which may turn out to be more powerful but it is less fun.

 

I think the Fane is a nice bonus but not game-changing. It is obviously a "must take" because it is a free bonus but it also isn't going to be game changing either. I think anyone who hates it's only grounds is they wanted more power out of a free terrain piece. Re-rolls in our army is super powerful though and that wound is so easy to heal back and free DP is never a bad thing. 

All that said, I HATE the big daemon head. I wish it was just the Slaanesh symbol. 

You can skip out on the head/portal easily and just have a giant Slaanesh icon standing in a pile of goodies.

[themortalgod]

3 minutes ago, Kasper said:

You can skip out on the head/portal easily and just have a giant Slaanesh icon standing in a pile of goodies.

Sorta, the portal has the imprint of the head and the head is embedded in the frame so would probably require sacrificing the portal completely and lots of filing but it can work.  filling in the imprint would be more difficult for non-sulpters if you wanted portal but no head.

[Kasper]

15 hours ago, Rentar said:

Effectively, the first has The Masque as a unit to harass enemy support heroes. Cavalry speed (10"+D6) and low profile (25 mm) lets The Masque squeeze around the edges of enemy lines to hit a priest/wizard/sniper unit, and those typically have 5" movement.

Isnt the Masque on a 32mm base? The new model comes with a 32mm at least. Im guessing the Vice Leader Herald is 32mm now too, even though the list from december 2018 says both are 25mm. I suppose it is outdated though.

[Undeadly]

Anybody seeing some use of Mortals in their army? I've been thinking about maybe bringing a Chaos Lord as a way to get some more DP through his Reaper Blade, but the fact he doesn't get Locus nor does he really have any buffs, it makes it hard to pick him. However, only being 20 points more than a herald does kinda make him tempting.