AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[Popisdead]

On 6/7/2021 at 5:43 PM, Benkei said:

We have no priests; we have ONE caster with casting bonuses (talking about our book, no S2D). I absolutely fail to see how these rules changes benefit Hedonites more than several other factions that are not in need of help. 

And regardless of power level I'm still baffled at the absolute lack of fluff for our book, both in new lore or in the warscrolls (usually defaulting to "6s to wound = MW") in what   seems to be unwillingness to come up with fluffy interesting rules -see comet landing Annihilators- or just a rushed product. I would love to field Myrmidons and feel like they are a distinct unit and not just worse Slick blades, f. E. 

Shrugs, not all armies have priests, I see no reason to get this upset about things at this moment.  

23 hours ago, Nagashfan said:

Unless they nerf it and the mirror…. Which I bet will happen

Since those are battle tome units the only nerf would be points that aren't helpful in building a list.  Keep in mind if Predatory Endless Spells are every hero phase and potentially do double damage a points hike isn't unreasonable or unexpected.  

7 hours ago, Enoby said:

One pretty nice thing to note is that daemonettes can still screen in a straight line with the new rules. 

They'll win the chaff vs chaff war, might see a return of them.  It is an exciting time, lots of change and experimentation to find what works.  People should look forward with anticipation to a solid 6 months of new discoveries not be negative about sweeping comments of doom they make up.

[Sorrow]

I really doubt that they will touch faction specific Endless Spells and looking at the new rules, thus far, I am quite happy with them.

Let us hope GW stays on this course. 

[TimeToWaste85]

If our spells stay untouched, I am ABSOLUTELY running all three of them! They’ll be bonkers good!

[Sorrow]

I think this is new, I do not see it here: https://www.warhammer-community.com/broken-realms/

Anyway, Sigvald and Glutos went against each other, that is why no Hedonites reached the city.

Story: https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/GoOdPej7qcXOKbTT.pdf

[Rawenwing]

Hi everyone,

I’m hoping to play my very first game with slaanesh next week just to learn the basics of the faction in the little time left before aos 3.0. I built about 1600 points based on what I have and I haven’t a lot of stuff to summon at the moment (mainly 2 Heralds on exalted chariots though)

so the list I will bring will look something like this 

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Invaders Host

Leaders
Keeper of Secrets (340)
- Sinistrous Hand
- Spell: Progeny of Damnation
Lord of Pain (150)
- General
- Command Trait: Glory Hog  
- Artefact: The Rod of Misrule  
- Host Option: General 
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260) (it is actually Synessa, yes right, Synessa!)
The Contorted Epitome (210)
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy

Battleline
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (340)

Total: 1580 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 71
 

I have 420 points left that I don’t know how to fill actually and based on those I will plan my last purchases. What do you think of this list and what do you suggest me to include and buy? Please also note that I voluntarily chose to not include a battalion in preparation for aos 3.0 . 
thanks in advance!

[TimeToWaste85]

54 minutes ago, Rawenwing said:

Hi everyone,

I’m hoping to play my very first game with slaanesh next week just to learn the basics of the faction in the little time left before aos 3.0. I built about 1600 points based on what I have and I haven’t a lot of stuff to summon at the moment (mainly 2 Heralds on exalted chariots though)

so the list I will bring will look something like this 

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Invaders Host

Leaders
Keeper of Secrets (340)
- Sinistrous Hand
- Spell: Progeny of Damnation
Lord of Pain (150)
- General
- Command Trait: Glory Hog  
- Artefact: The Rod of Misrule  
- Host Option: General 
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260) (it is actually Synessa, yes right, Synessa!)
The Contorted Epitome (210)
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy

Battleline
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (340)

Total: 1580 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 71
 

I have 420 points left that I don’t know how to fill actually and based on those I will plan my last purchases. What do you think of this list and what do you suggest me to include and buy? Please also note that I voluntarily chose to not include a battalion in preparation for aos 3.0 . 
thanks in advance!

Lurid haze (you’re already an invader) and bring Sigvald for sure! And maybe Dread Pagent (underworlds warband). People have said they’re a surprisingly hard hitting unit that looks insignificant. 

[Jaskier]

If this really does end up being the MSU edition and damage gets scaled down due to the removal of buff stacking, our summoning theoretically could very well improve significantly with more units on the board and those units surviving a bit longer, and plus using chip damage to generate Depravity is still an efficient way of handling/depleting MSU as opposed to big scary blobs. Our mechanics really are making a lot more sense in a 3.0 context so far. 

[Nagashfan]

So I just watched a battle report by MWG stormcast vs krag ogres…. SC was able to kill krag pretty easy with a big unit of evocators and mortal wounds do we have anything that can deal with him like that?

[CeleFAZE]

4 hours ago, Jaskier said:

If this really does end up being the MSU edition and damage gets scaled down due to the removal of buff stacking, our summoning theoretically could very well improve significantly with more units on the board and those units surviving a bit longer, and plus using chip damage to generate Depravity is still an efficient way of handling/depleting MSU as opposed to big scary blobs. Our mechanics really are making a lot more sense in a 3.0 context so far. 

Hearing the reinforcement point rumor, it finally makes sense to me how the new edition could be a buff for us where it wouldn't also elevate the strength of existing powerhouse armies. Most of our units are optimized for running at either minimum size, or one increment up in the case of fiends. The only exception to this is daemonettes, which I imagine would bypass the restrictions by being summoned. This gives us a huge edge in objective play compared to other armies, and the larger number of enemy units being fielded give us ample opportunities for depravity generation. It also forces really difficult list building decisions for currently strong shooting armies, as they tend to rely on force multipliers applied to large units of shooters, which are now going to be either smaller, or a single deathstar. By contrast our shooting has no such limitation, and our buffs are largely debuffs that target an enemy unit with something that acts as a force multiplier for us, effectively allowing us to utilize multiple units as though they were one, where other armies don't have the same capability.

Combined with the changes to endless spells, wheels of excruciation is going to be an incredibly strong tool for us to generate depravity and in general cause damage across the board. As we're immune to the damage it does we can simply cascade it across the battle, and with artifacts like the enrapturing circlet on something like an exalted bladebringer we can keep the opponent locked into a meatgrinder dealing constant mortal wounds, with the bladebringer potentially healing every hero phase between heroic actions and born of damnation. The mesmerizing mirror could be added on top of this, punishing the enemy with more mortal wounds for retreating, and otherwise having more opportunities to snipe out heroes. Granted this is all dependent on our ability to cast and maintain the endless spells, but we have decent tools for that with glutos and the epitome.

I immediately retract my doom and gloom regarding 3rd ed. This looks like it could be great for us.

[LeonBox]

2 hours ago, Nagashfan said:

So I just watched a battle report by MWG stormcast vs krag ogres…. SC was able to kill krag pretty easy with a big unit of evocators and mortal wounds do we have anything that can deal with him like that?

We are lacking mass MWs. In my opinion this is less an indictment of Hedonites and more an indictment of those armies that can do this (looking at you, LRL). 

[Rawenwing]

9 hours ago, TimeToWaste85 said:

Lurid haze (you’re already an invader) and bring Sigvald for sure! And maybe Dread Pagent (underworlds warband). People have said they’re a surprisingly hard hitting unit that looks insignificant. 

Lurid haze was my first choice for sure but, since I’m not bringing a battalion I can’t take the rod which is super important. Also, is sigvald auto include regardless of the number of heroes? I don’t want to load up on heroes too too much as with only 3 battlelines I’m in kinda hurry to summon daemonettes asap to grab objectives and maintain my presence on the board. Another thing I was considering was to bring either blissbarb archers or blissbarb seeker as skirmishers and kinda ok low-tier hero snipers thanks to the +1 from Synessa (if it goes off) and the rerolling 1s from acquiescence to guarantee hits and fish for MWs afterwards.

[Sorrow]

1 hour ago, CeleFAZE said:

Hearing the reinforcement point rumor, it finally makes sense to me how the new edition could be a buff for us where it wouldn't also elevate the strength of existing powerhouse armies. Most of our units are optimized for running at either minimum size, or one increment up in the case of fiends. The only exception to this is daemonettes, which I imagine would bypass the restrictions by being summoned. This gives us a huge edge in objective play compared to other armies, and the larger number of enemy units being fielded give us ample opportunities for depravity generation. It also forces really difficult list building decisions for currently strong shooting armies, as they tend to rely on force multipliers applied to large units of shooters, which are now going to be either smaller, or a single deathstar. By contrast our shooting has no such limitation, and our buffs are largely debuffs that target an enemy unit with something that acts as a force multiplier for us, effectively allowing us to utilize multiple units as though they were one, where other armies don't have the same capability.

Combined with the changes to endless spells, wheels of excruciation is going to be an incredibly strong tool for us to generate depravity and in general cause damage across the board. As we're immune to the damage it does we can simply cascade it across the battle, and with artifacts like the enrapturing circlet on something like an exalted bladebringer we can keep the opponent locked into a meatgrinder dealing constant mortal wounds, with the bladebringer potentially healing every hero phase between heroic actions and born of damnation. The mesmerizing mirror could be added on top of this, punishing the enemy with more mortal wounds for retreating, and otherwise having more opportunities to snipe out heroes. Granted this is all dependent on our ability to cast and maintain the endless spells, but we have decent tools for that with glutos and the epitome.

I immediately retract my doom and gloom regarding 3rd ed. This looks like it could be great for us.

I am not going to get on hype train just yet, but I think we would be a real powerhouse in AoS 3 by what we have seen thus far.

[Enoby]

10 hours ago, Rawenwing said:

Hi everyone,

I’m hoping to play my very first game with slaanesh next week just to learn the basics of the faction in the little time left before aos 3.0. I built about 1600 points based on what I have and I haven’t a lot of stuff to summon at the moment (mainly 2 Heralds on exalted chariots though)

so the list I will bring will look something like this 

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Invaders Host

Leaders
Keeper of Secrets (340)
- Sinistrous Hand
- Spell: Progeny of Damnation
Lord of Pain (150)
- General
- Command Trait: Glory Hog  
- Artefact: The Rod of Misrule  
- Host Option: General 
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260) (it is actually Synessa, yes right, Synessa!)
The Contorted Epitome (210)
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy

Battleline
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (340)

Total: 1580 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 71
 

I have 420 points left that I don’t know how to fill actually and based on those I will plan my last purchases. What do you think of this list and what do you suggest me to include and buy? Please also note that I voluntarily chose to not include a battalion in preparation for aos 3.0 . 
thanks in advance!

 

5 minutes ago, Rawenwing said:

Lurid haze was my first choice for sure but, since I’m not bringing a battalion I can’t take the rod which is super important. Also, is sigvald auto include regardless of the number of heroes? I don’t want to load up on heroes too too much as with only 3 battlelines I’m in kinda hurry to summon daemonettes asap to grab objectives and maintain my presence on the board. Another thing I was considering was to bring either blissbarb archers or blissbarb seeker as skirmishers and kinda ok low-tier hero snipers thanks to the +1 from Synessa (if it goes off) and the rerolling 1s from acquiescence to guarantee hits and fish for MWs afterwards.

Hey

As @TimeToWaste85 said Sigvald would be a nice choice, but you're right that it's a risky one as you'd lose the rod and glory hog and they are super important.

The replacement for Sigvald in this case would probably be Dexcessa as they have the speed not to rely on Lurid Haze. With Dex you could have a unit of Chaos Warriors and the Wheels of Excruciation (which, if they see no change, will be crazy good next edition). 

However, two units of Slickblade Seekers may serve you better - or one unit of Slickblades, one of blissbarb archers, and an extra CP/Wheels.

I think either would provide a fast, immediate threat for the opponent to deal with. Without a KoS, I'd recommend the Slicks

[Rawenwing]

28 minutes ago, Enoby said:

 

Hey

As @TimeToWaste85 said Sigvald would be a nice choice, but you're right that it's a risky one as you'd lose the rod and glory hog and they are super important.

The replacement for Sigvald in this case would probably be Dexcessa as they have the speed not to rely on Lurid Haze. With Dex you could have a unit of Chaos Warriors and the Wheels of Excruciation (which, if they see no change, will be crazy good next edition). 

However, two units of Slickblade Seekers may serve you better - or one unit of Slickblades, one of blissbarb archers, and an extra CP/Wheels.

I think either would provide a fast, immediate threat for the opponent to deal with. Without a KoS, I'd recommend the Slicks

Thanks for your suggestions! I could try something like this 

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Invaders Host
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260)
- Host Option: General 
Lord of Pain (150)
- General
- Command Trait: Glory Hog  
- Artefact: The Rod of Misrule  
- Host Option: General 
The Contorted Epitome (210)
- Host Option: General 
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy
Keeper of Secrets (340)
- Sinistrous Hand
- Spell: Born of Damnation
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (340)
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
11 x Blissbarb Archers (160)
5 x Slickblade Seekers (200)
Wheels of Excruciation (50)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 102
 

[Enoby]

2 hours ago, Rawenwing said:

Thanks for your suggestions! I could try something like this 

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Invaders Host
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260)
- Host Option: General 
Lord of Pain (150)
- General
- Command Trait: Glory Hog  
- Artefact: The Rod of Misrule  
- Host Option: General 
The Contorted Epitome (210)
- Host Option: General 
- Lore of Slaanesh: Hysterical Frenzy
Keeper of Secrets (340)
- Sinistrous Hand
- Spell: Born of Damnation
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
10 x Symbaresh Twinsouls (340)
5 x Hellstriders with Claw-spears (140)
11 x Blissbarb Archers (160)
5 x Slickblade Seekers (200)
Wheels of Excruciation (50)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 102
 

That looks good to me Only thing you may have an issue with is Hellstriders - they're speedy, but I'm wondering if saving 100 points by making them both chaos warriors would be better? I'm unsure as striders are better than warriors, but that extra 100 (or even just extra 50 by swapping 1) could buy you an extra cp.

That said, I think striders would be fine in this list

--- 

Also, using that +1 to hit command ability on twinsouls makes their damage skyrocket. A unit of 10 (rerolling hits) does 29 damage against a 4+ save and a very respectable 19 against a 3+ (so still killing Alarialle in one go). Being able to attack in two ranks and having potential battleline status puts them in a really good place for AoS 3, especially if the battalions require battleline. 

To be honest, if the generic battalions are based of specific units or keywords (e.g. "1 hero with a mount and three units with a mount", or "1 hero, three battleline", or "1-4 monsters"), we'll be in a really nice spot as we have a very wide list.

[Rawenwing]

24 minutes ago, Enoby said:

That looks good to me Only thing you may have an issue with is Hellstriders - they're speedy, but I'm wondering if saving 100 points by making them both chaos warriors would be better? I'm unsure as striders are better than warriors, but that extra 100 (or even just extra 50 by swapping 1) could buy you an extra cp.

That said, I think striders would be fine in this list

--- 

Also, using that +1 to hit command ability on twinsouls makes their damage skyrocket. A unit of 10 (rerolling hits) does 29 damage against a 4+ save and a very respectable 19 against a 3+ (so still killing Alarialle in one go). Being able to attack in two ranks and having potential battleline status puts them in a really good place for AoS 3, especially if the battalions require battleline. 

To be honest, if the generic battalions are based of specific units or keywords (e.g. "1 hero with a mount and three units with a mount", or "1 hero, three battleline", or "1-4 monsters"), we'll be in a really nice spot as we have a very wide list.

Unfortunately I have to stick with hellstriders because that’s all I have at the moment, but, ironically enough I am going to face Alarielle next week! As always thanks for every advice, if I’m lucky next week I’ll try and post a batrep with proper pictures!

[Yoid]

7 hours ago, Nagashfan said:

So I just watched a battle report by MWG stormcast vs krag ogres…. SC was able to kill krag pretty easy with a big unit of evocators and mortal wounds do we have anything that can deal with him like that?

Evocators is still the most reliable way to deal massive MWs in the game. But said so, that was 600+ pts of Evocators. You can use 3 non-hero Exalted Chariots for less points and as long as you make the charge you easily kill Kragnos on averages. Synessa may also help if Kragnos charge a screen in front of her you can do the generic command to double shoot him and is a MW mechanic that dosnt have penalties. Just be very careful to not be charged being a monster or he will simply delete you. The Chariots are more reliable because they deal a lot of MWs even if Kragnos charge (but probably not enough to kill him unless you are the one charging).

That is our only MWs spam unit as far as I know. Our spells aren't bad either (Pavane and Hysterical Frenzy) but Kragnos is inmune to spells.

I don't recomend Infernal Enrapturess just for that, but if you happen to have her to counter magic, her attack with -3 rend is not bad to do 1d3 damage to Kragnos. Your ideal summon would be an Exalted Chariot that inmediately charge him, but a Infernal Enrapturess can shoot the turn she es summoned too.

[Enoby]

The new leaks confirm reinforcement limits, which suggests that next edition will be full of MSU. This is very good for us, and our wheels of excruciating 

[Feii]

The time stop got me 
 

 

[Enoby]

Looking at the new battalion rules, Synessa is better losing the extra wound and being able to fit in as a 'sub commander', allowing them and Dexcessa and/or a Keeper to all fit in one battalion 

[Nagashfan]

2 hours ago, Enoby said:

Looking at the new battalion rules, Synessa is better losing the extra wound and being able to fit in as a 'sub commander', allowing them and Dexcessa and/or a Keeper to all fit in one battalion 

Where these rules at

[Stormy1486]

 Anyone's army mostly look safe even with all the new edition changes? Was worried that my 6 fiends would take a hit with the cap of +1/-1 but I feel with monsters potentially becoming more of a thing they will still be useful.

Otherwise glutos, sigvald, slickblades and blissbarb archers all still looking pretty good. Might even try one of new twins if I can figure out something good

[Nagashfan]

11 minutes ago, Stormy1486 said:

 Anyone's army mostly look safe even with all the new edition changes? Was worried that my 6 fiends would take a hit with the cap of +1/-1 but I feel with monsters potentially becoming more of a thing they will still be useful.

Otherwise glutos, sigvald, slickblades and blissbarb archers all still looking pretty good. Might even try one of new twins if I can figure out something good

I was worried the new coherency would hurt the fiends, but I think they will be alright 

[LeonBox]

Today's (tomorrow's for some of you?) Warcom article is going to focus on Hedonites and how we interact with the new edition. 

[Jaskier]

Unleash Hell is gonna be great on our Blissbarbs; pay a CP to generate a Depravity point before the ranged chaff unit gets munched - yes please! 

The loss of Seeker Cavalcade does sting a bit, but that one drop battalion is looking mighty spicy for us. 

Edited June 11, 2021 by Jaskier