AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[shinros]

3 hours ago, Enoby said:

That's fair enough I personally think they're okay pricing wise from GW (but GW prices jump all over the place so it's hard to say what's okay). I guess I don't mind the toning down and I think most of the proof in this army will be in playing it

 

Unrelated but fair warning to all, apparently the Slaanesh dice are selling out pretty quickly

Seems like you're right, on the UK GW site the dice are gone, so is the limited edition tome for Hedonites. For the tome they only made like 500 I recall.

Edited February 13, 2021 by shinros

[Enoby]

2 minutes ago, shinros said:

Seems like you're right, on the UK GW site the dice are gone, so is the limited edition tome for both DOK and Hedonites. For the tomes they only made like 500 I recall.

That was quick! The limited edition DoK tome is still in stock from what I can see, but our dice and LE tome aren't. Probably the fastest I've seen an AoS LE tome sell out - might be because of low stocks

[shinros]

Just now, Enoby said:

That was quick! The limited edition DoK tome is still in stock from what I can see, but our dice and LE tome aren't. Probably the fastest I've seen an AoS LE tome sell out - might be because of low stocks

Yeah I made an edit on the DoK, my bad, but you're right they went fast, I checked the pre-order article again and they seem to have only made 560 copies of the tome, I think they should of at least made 1k. Funny enough, I was debating whether to buy the dice or not, glad I took the bullet on that front. 😄

[Enoby]

Just now, shinros said:

Yeah I made an edit on the DoK, my bad, but you're right they went fast, I checked the pre-order article again and they seem to have only made 560 copies of the tome, I think they should of at least made 1k. Funny enough, I was debating whether to buy the dice or not, glad I took the bullet on that front. 😄

Me too! I was debating on the dice and LE tome - I like them a lot but was iffy on whether they're worth the extra cost, but I'm very glad I bit the bullet early! 

The LE tome is sold out in all countries with available preorders except Australia - so if anyone's desperate for the tome, there are a few going for $140

Thankfully all models are still available (for now) - I've heard some people have had delays so it'd suck for them to have to wait even longer.

[shinros]

3 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Me too! I was debating on the dice and LE tome - I like them a lot but was iffy on whether they're worth the extra cost, but I'm very glad I bit the bullet early! 

The LE tome is sold out in all countries with available preorders except Australia - so if anyone's desperate for the tome, there are a few going for $140

Thankfully all models are still available (for now) - I've heard some people have had delays so it'd suck for them to have to wait even longer.

Ah, that's good, checking on the dice it seems that it's also sold out across several pre-order pages on the site. I personally didn't get one of each model, since it was highly likely they are going to remain in stock for awhile, which seems to be the case. 

[Lucentia]

I missed out on the dice!  Bit unfortunate but I guess it saves me a few quid on novelty cubes.

[Klamm]

Looking at everything, I've written up a list of the kind of stuff I want to make work, a lot of which I already have done or on the hobby table. 

Spoiler

 

Invader host
Leaders: 930

• Lord of pain 150 (General)
• Shardspeaker 150
• Daemon Prince 210 (General)
• Daemon Prince 210 (General)
• Contorted Epitome 210

Units: 910 

• 10 Painbringers 300 (Battleline)
• 5 Painbringers 150 (Battleline)
• 5 Twinsouls 170 (Battleline)
• 20 Chaos Marauders 150 (Battleline)
• 3 Slaangor 140

Battalions: 140

• Nobles of excess 140

Total: 1980 Points. 

 

That unit of Slaangor is hilarious wishful thinking, but it's in there as a placeholder bit of chaff that I might replace with some endless spells. Double Daemon Prince in invaders is probably workable, not super competitive but it's what I want to run. I guess I could drop a hero for some extra Twinsouls, since the Nobles of Excess are gonna be the hitty core of the army. 

That's kind of affected by my financial budget though, 2 boxes of painbringers is pretty costly (I'm planning to proxy my Slaanesh warriors as the 10 strong painbringer unit). 

As for my summoning pool, I have a unit of fiends and a viceleader (or resurrecting the epitome). I'm not gonna do anything to maximise depravity anyway. 

I also have an unfinished unit of hellstriders, I could switch them for the Slaangors. 

[Nezzhil]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

Interestingly, I think RAW the Syll'Esske host is still legal - enjoy our excessive summoning for the two weeks this is allowed  

No, the DPs abilities are both different triggers. The Syll'Esske ability never triggers when you obtain DPs with the new rules.

[Enoby]

Just now, Nezzhil said:

No, the DPs abilities are both different triggers. The Syll'Esske ability never triggers when you obtain DPs with the new rules.

Ahh good point! Still think that means the battalions may be viable, mind

[Jaskier]

This is what I'm looking at running for a GT in the near future; 

Invaders
Keeper of Secrets - Icon of Infinite Excess, Progeny of Damnation - 340
Syll'Esske - Invaders General, Born of Damnation - 200
Infernal Enrapturess - Invaders General, Glory Hog, Rod of Misrule - 150
Chaos Warriors (20) - 360
Chaos Warriors (5) - 90
Chaos Warriors (5) - 90
Slickblade Seekers (5) - 200
Slickblade Seekers (5) - 200
Slickblade Seekers (5) - 200
Seeker Cavalcade - 140
Quicksilver Swords - 30
2000/2000

Syll'Esske's re-roll aura isn't affected by Chaos Warriors, so I've actually got an even number of units to trigger it - in practice, the Enrapturess will likely fall out of range pretty quickly, so in that case I can just move one of the Slickblade units out of range so everyone else can benefit. I purposefully didn't make the Keeper my third general so that her and Syll'Esske can go together without issue (and so that Syll'Esske will get to benefit from Excess of Violence now that they're actually a good recipient for it!) The main reason Syll'Esske is in the list otherwise is for their incredible 18" battleshock immunity command ability, which is perfect for Slickblade Seekers and should save me a boat load of CP in the long run so that my CP farm can be put to good use on double pile-ins and so on. 

The general plan is that the Chaos Warrior anvil escorts Syll'Esske and act as my big objective grabbing blob - new Depravity suits them to a tee because they're super tough and not very killy - while the two smaller units do what cheap Battleline do and screen or camp objectives. The Slickblades are my hammer units that will be running around with the Keeper, with the idea being that my first 'charge' - i.e. 6" pile-in to ensure they all get to fight first - is buoyed by Syll'Esske's re-roll 1s aura and the +1 to-hit from the Icon. In theory they will form a super mobile, super elusive, decently beefy and fairly hard hitting bruiser squad that can pull some crazy shenanigans with the combination of the Keeper using her Locus and their own 6" pile-ins (which will allow for effective retreats into new combats!) The Enrapturess is my Depravity and Command Point farmer that will stay happily out of the way of everything else and guard the Fane, meaning she'll ideally be giving me 2DP and 2CP each turn - if she gets focused down, that's attention that isn't going to the Keeper or Syll'Esske. I've also got the Quicksilver Swords as a long-ranged mortal wound source to hopefully sneak a few extra Depravity points here and there. The superior alternative is of course the Geminids, but it would mean cutting down the 20 blob to 15 models, which, while I don't mind, would leave me with 60 points spare and not a whole lot to spend them on - I guess an extra CP would be fine? On second thought, sacrificing 5 Warriors to upgrade the Quicksilver Swords to Geminids and get an extra CP is probably the better option. Anywho...

Dunno how strong the list will be in practice, but it sounds like a lot of fun to me on paper; extremely mobile and plenty tough. It has 148 wounds in it, count 'em, 148 in a Slaanesh list. For reference, my typical Slaanesh lists with the old book were around the 80-90 wound mark! 

Edited February 13, 2021 by Jaskier

[stratigo]

6 hours ago, yukishiro1 said:

It's gonna be really funny if the second half of the Lumineth book comes out and makes Lumineth even more powerful in even gimmickier ways right after they toned down DoK and Slaanesh gimmicks. 

They hardcore toned up one of Slaanesh's primary gimicks. 

 

4 hours ago, Feii said:

Both battletomes (Hedonites and DoK) feel on the lazy side. 

 

I fear that GW thinks they can just patch this product in the future with a broken realm like release. Really weird that 40k battletomes change and tweak more than AoS ones these days.

 

DoK (ubderstandably) have lost their battalion with the stormcast but nothing new was added back. I would expect that a 3 billion company would come up with a battalion for DoK and CoS/Idoneth, 

 

PS I still think Hedonites might be a good army (not OP) but there are elements that will make longterm players feel bad when playing this army now and it is a very restrictive battletome for new potential players (rule wise, model wi$e)

40k codexes have always been more sweeping and expansive in their changes than AoS battletomes. 40k has more moving parts by a fair margin

 

4 hours ago, Benkei said:

I have 0 doubts that's what's gonna happen. Hedonites mortals feel like just boring toned down LRL. 

By the way, if GW is so worried about power creep and broken armies (they aren't), how come they didn't release an AoS FAQ? 

Don't you watch the Honest Wargamer? IS cause they didn't have enough data, obviously.

 

[Poryague]

The idea summoning is why the army is pointed higher seems suspicious. It SEEMS we can only make 1 summon at the end of move. So no daisy chains or dropping a bunch of units. So summoning is nothing scary.

A lot nerfs rule wise and point hikes on units. This makes it more likely units are pointed terribly for no reason. So point drops are happening down the line.

Edited February 13, 2021 by Poryague

[SorryLizard]

How do these mortal Hedonites look in an StD army rather than in their own Battletome?

E.g.: dropping in some Myrmidesh or Blissbarbs to an StD army. Do they get the benefits from the Warshrine or the Hero Auras in StD? Or is that specifically tied to keyword bingo within the book(s)?

[Enoby]

4 minutes ago, SorryLizard said:

How do these mortal Hedonites look in an StD army rather than in their own Battletome?

E.g.: dropping in some Myrmidesh or Blissbarbs to an StD army. Do they get the benefits from the Warshrine or the Hero Auras in StD? Or is that specifically tied to keyword bingo within the book(s)?

Normally, they won't be great in StD as they don't benefit from StD keyword locks. However, I can see the Shardspeaker being good (they aren't keyword locked and have a nice generic spell), as well as Glutos being a bit of a spicey take - at 400 points he's just within range to ally in, and his spell's a very nice debuff and his CA is great on Archaon.

[SorryLizard]

4 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Normally, they won't be great in StD as they don't benefit from StD keyword locks. However, I can see the Shardspeaker being good (they aren't keyword locked and have a nice generic spell), as well as Glutos being a bit of a spicey take - at 400 points he's just within range to ally in, and his spell's a very nice debuff and his CA is great on Archaon.

That's a shame.

I might use Myrmidesh as chaos warriors or chosen then. Though their flat warscroll at least carries most of its abilities on itself - reroll saves and mortals on 6s. Losing the double hits on 6 will hurt their output though.

[Enoby]

3 minutes ago, SorryLizard said:

That's a shame.

I might use Myrmidesh as chaos warriors or chosen then. Though their flat warscroll at least carries most of its abilities on itself - reroll saves and mortals on 6s. Losing the double hits on 6 will hurt their output though.

Yeah, it's unfortunate but they're still decent enough and look very cool Worst comes to worst, they're the best looking proxxies in the game 

[SorryLizard]

10 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Yeah, it's unfortunate but they're still decent enough and look very cool Worst comes to worst, they're the best looking proxxies in the game 

Presicely.  I have yet to meet a TO who would complain about something like this and a quick chat (and courtesy reminders during the game) with your opponent should keep things clear.

[Klamm]

8 minutes ago, SorryLizard said:

I might use Myrmidesh as chaos warriors or chosen then. 

I'm in the opposite camp, gonna use chaos warrior conversions as Myrmidesh coz I wanna run Nobles of Excess without spending 200 pounds lol 

BTW, I do think that the Slaangor Fiendbloods are underwhelming even taken in isolation (even compared to other Beasts of Chaos units tbh), but I think the reason it was such a surprise is that Dread Pagent warscroll. The underworlds slaangor had 4 -2 rend 2 damage attacks!

Our thoughts and prayers are with the Slaaneshi beastmen who mourn their greatest ever hero wandering into a chasm. 

[Gistradagis]

I'm already doing some work thinking lists and must say that Depraved Carnival absolutely baffles me in its requirement.

3 units of archers? Cool. 3 heroes between Lord of Pain or Shardspeaker? Why? The Shardspeaker is nice, but really short range focused, which kinda runs counter to wanting the archers to keep their distance at all times, especially with run and shoot. But the Lord of Pain is just straight up silly. A melee-only hero with a FnP and a CA that only works in combat phase (so can't give his re-rolls to the archers). Man, they really want to sell more Lords of Pain huh? Because they absolutely do not fit into this battalion.

[SorryLizard]

6 minutes ago, Gistradagis said:

I'm already doing some work thinking lists and must say that Depraved Carnival absolutely baffles me in its requirement.

3 units of archers? Cool. 3 heroes between Lord of Pain or Shardspeaker? Why? The Shardspeaker is nice, but really short range focused, which kinda runs counter to wanting the archers to keep their distance at all times, especially with run and shoot. But the Lord of Pain is just straight up silly. A melee-only hero with a FnP and a CA that only works in combat phase (so can't give his re-rolls to the archers). Man, they really want to sell more Lords of Pain huh? Because they absolutely do not fit into this battalion.

Lack of other unnamed mortal heroes is my guess.

[Gistradagis]

1 minute ago, SorryLizard said:

Lack of other unnamed mortal heroes is my guess.

I guess, but they could have made it at least 2 heroes or smth. 3 is such a tax, when they don't even fit.

[umpac]

1 minute ago, Gistradagis said:

I guess, but they could have made it at least 2 heroes or smth. 3 is such a tax, when they don't even fit.

Yeah unless you REALLY want that +CP, artifact and fewer drops you are just way better off taking more archers than spending 160 on a battalion and another 450 in character taxes, I was playing around with it trying to make a list I like but in order to make decent use of the bonus shooting at least one unit has to be 33 and by then you're battalion is up to 1410 pts  and even with only the minimum units its 1090. 

[Rors]

Looking at the slangors and while they're insanely fragile, they're also extremely scary. The ability to pick a unit with 3 and roll a 4+ mortal wound for every model is probably the best horde killer in seen in a warscroll. Due to being at 3 inches they can easily do this from behind a screen.

Very fragile, but if you stick them with glutos, who could also cast gemids for a total of -2 to hit and help them heal with his command ability...  Probably not going to work but I feel like the right combo could make this unit functional.

 

[Rivener]

4 minutes ago, Rors said:

Looking at the slangors and while they're insanely fragile, they're also extremely scary. The ability to pick a unit with 3 and roll a 4+ mortal wound for every model is probably the best horde killer in seen in a warscroll. Due to being at 3 inches they can easily do this from behind a screen.

Very fragile, but if you stick them with glutos, who could also cast gemids for a total of -2 to hit and help them heal with his command ability...  Probably not going to work but I feel like the right combo could make this unit functional.

 

The ability doesn’t work on enemy models, it works on the number of slaangor models. It’s like one MW, maybe, if any paper thin slaangors even survive.

[SorryLizard]

Could try something with Glutos, a shardspeaker (or two) and some big units of Fiends. Runs into issues with speed I think and keeping it all aligned with each other for the buff auras. Add in Geminids.

Now the -1 to hit from Glutos, -1 from Geminids, passive -1 from Fiends and their additional -1 to be wounded form being a big units AND potentially the spell from the Shardspeaker could see them surprisingly durable.

Any ways of adding more attacks to the Fiend's Stinger? +1 to hit should not be too tough to find.