AoS 2 - Aelves Discussion

[dekay]

Fun fact, with new shadow warrior cost, they're now more cost effective when it comes to inflicting ranged wounds than both spireguard and reavers. As long as they shoot from cover, at least (but considering their 12' pre game move, why wouldn't they be in cover?). And discounting the fact that both of that units hold different advantages over them.

They're still not great is what I'm trying to say, but definitely have some worth as precise forepower tool. They're also vastly less vulnerable to -1 to hit modifiers than their competition.

[Azamar]

To share a more optimistic view:

 

The frost Phoenix going up again in cost is a blow, but not surprising as it was pretty common to see 2-3 of them in any competitive mixed order army, let alone Phoenix temple armies. 

But there’s quite a few nice point drops elsewhere- sisters of the watch are an absolute bargain at 160 points, and drakespawn and dragon blades feel like they’re at a better point cost as well. Plus whoever set these points have once again failed to spot how amazing Phoenix guard are. The bleaksword discount is really helpful (and long overdue)

Any of my lists without a Phoenix generally have 60-80 points more to play with, and the ones where I took a frostheart work out about the same, so I’m ok with this. 

My Darklings meanwhile, suddenly have dropped about 90 points (120 point black guard? What were they thinking?!?) so I can fit an extra 10 bleakswords in there- or up my black guard to 30 models (probably a safer bet).  I was hoping for a new spell lore for them but sounds like that was wishful thinking. Maybe next year. 

 

[Thiagoma]

26 minutes ago, Azamar said:

The frost Phoenix going up again in cost is a blow, but not surprising as it was pretty common to see 2-3 of them in any competitive mixed order army, let alone Phoenix temple armies. 

Well, it is not like a PT army has many options.

[Thiagoma]

1 hour ago, dekay said:

Fun fact, with new shadow warrior cost, they're now more cost effective when it comes to inflicting ranged wounds than both spireguard and reavers. As long as they shoot from cover, at least (but considering their 12' pre game move, why wouldn't they be in cover?). And discounting the fact that both of that units hold different advantages over them.

They're still not great is what I'm trying to say, but definitely have some worth as precise forepower tool. They're also vastly less vulnerable to -1 to hit modifiers than their competition.

Still quite expensive at 160 imo, specially as a BL option. 140pts on Phoenix Guard looks waaay more attractive.

 

[Thiagoma]

Tournament List

Mixed Order 1500 pts

Anointed on Frosty (general, master of defense)

Drakeseer (ignax scale)

Loremaster

Archmage on horse

 

Highborn Spearman x10 (battleline)

Highborn Spearman x10 (battleline)

Celestar Ballista

Swordmasters x30

 

Total 1500 pts. (We using 1250 pts rules, so only 2 BL necessary)

Plan is to use the Spearmen to hold objectives and guard the Ballista. 

Loremaster can play around 3 targets for his spell, the Ballista,  Phoenix or the Drakeseer.

The Swordmasters because i feel like fielding then really 🤣

Any toughts?

[MrZakalwe]

Looks good to me and that caster wedge should keep the 'Nix tough. 

What inspired the choice of Drakeseer over Archmage on Dragon? 20 points gets you an extra cast/unbind and the bonus to unbind (although I guess it also comes with the need to rely on realm spells). 

[Thiagoma]

Points really.  My total was 1500 exactly .

Plus i like the excitement of the phoenix spell

[MrZakalwe]

Yeah I guess if you get lucky it can be a bit crazy.

 

50% chance for 3+ mw, 25% for 6+, 12.5% for 10+

I guess those aren't terrible odds but of course it's got a 50% chance of doing exactly 1 so you've got to love to gamble  

[chord]

2 hours ago, MrZakalwe said:

Yeah I guess if you get lucky it can be a bit crazy.

 

50% chance for 3+ mw, 25% for 6+, 12.5% for 10+

I guess those aren't terrible odds but of course it's got a 50% chance of doing exactly 1 so you've got to love to gamble  

Yeah the odds are not great but I once had my drakeseer do 15 MW's at once with the spell.  Nothing like seeing a horde unit just vanish when combined with battleshock!   It's a fun spell. 

[medivouk]

Hi all, been reading the thread and  I was thinking of rebasing my old high elf army and running something like this:

Allegiance: Order
Dragonlord (380)
- Shield & Dragon Blade
Archmage on Dragon (320)
General - strategic genius (+1cp)
- Magestaff, book. 
Archmage (100)
Tenebrael Shard (120)
-Blade of Judgement
5 x Reavers (140)
5 x Reavers (140)
5 x Reavers (140)
10 x Dragon Blades (240)
30 x Swordmasters (380)
Quicksilver Swords (30)
Malevolent Maelstrom (10)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 118

 

One of my gamer friends hinted that the must weaver and tenebrael shard no longer have matched play points. I don't have my  copy of ghb 2019 yet, but can anyone confirm this? 

[Azamar]

5 minutes ago, medivouk said:

One of my gamer friends hinted that the must weaver and tenebrael shard no longer have matched play points. I don't have my  copy of ghb 2019 yet, but can anyone confirm this? 

They’re both still in there right at the start of the order profiles. Doesn’t seem that their points have changed.

Edited June 25, 2019 by Azamar

[medivouk]

4 minutes ago, Azamar said:

They’re both still in there right at the start of the order profiles. Doesn’t seem that their points have changed.

Sweet. Teleporting hero hunter is still an option then thanks a million. 

[MrZakalwe]

Such a terrible profile without the BoJ but so great with it.

Having trouble converting the model into something I like the look of, though. Not so keen on the hyper edgy look.

[Thiagoma]

4 hours ago, medivouk said:

Hi all, been reading the thread and  I was thinking of rebasing my old high elf army and running something like this:

Allegiance: Order
Dragonlord (380)
- Shield & Dragon Blade
Archmage on Dragon (320)
General - strategic genius (+1cp)
- Magestaff, book. 
Archmage (100)
Tenebrael Shard (120)
-Blade of Judgement
5 x Reavers (140)
5 x Reavers (140)
5 x Reavers (140)
10 x Dragon Blades (240)
30 x Swordmasters (380)
Quicksilver Swords (30)
Malevolent Maelstrom (10)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 118

 

One of my gamer friends hinted that the must weaver and tenebrael shard no longer have matched play points. I don't have my  copy of ghb 2019 yet, but can anyone confirm this? 

It will work just fine, but be aware that High Elves arent in a good shape right now. While we wiat for a BT, do not expect to be all that competitive.

 

Other than that, it is a solid list!

[medivouk]

9 hours ago, Thiagoma said:

It will work just fine, but be aware that High Elves arent in a good shape right now. While we wiat for a BT, do not expect to be all that competitive.

 

Other than that, it is a solid list!

Thanks for the input for competitive play I've got a massive khorne list with deamons, std, bloodbound and BoC as my main army, and I have even messed about putting archaon on the table and buffing him to the heavens and smashing face. 

Tbh, I've had my high elves since 7th Ed fantasy and wanted to play with them again, so if it's less competitive I look forward to the challenge! 

If we do get a battle tome I'll be happy, but I think the list has some tools to do OK in the 2019 meta (depending on the July faq ofc) 

[MrZakalwe]

OK looking at the War Hydra and I'm I'mdering why they aren't seen more in Mixed Order lists- for 170 points and 1 behemoth slot you seem to get quite a bit of punch for your points and with the flat 3 wound regen in your hero phase it's going to be pretty resistant to erosion. 

They aren't quick enough to be a true  offensive piece but for contesting mid field objectives it seems quite adequate (and great at the cost) so what am I missing?

Curious what the flaw is before I drop £40 on one and never use it again.

Edited June 27, 2019 by MrZakalwe

[Tiger]

Thinking on meeting engagements:

Annointed on Frostheart Phoenix

Evocators on Dracolines

Reavers x 2

Swordmasters

Comes at neatly 1000 points. 

[Thiagoma]

5 hours ago, MrZakalwe said:

OK looking at the War Hydra and I'm I'mdering why they aren't seen more in Mixed Order lists- for 170 points and 1 behemoth slot you seem to get quite a bit of punch for your points and with the flat 3 wound regen in your hero phase it's going to be pretty resistant to erosion. 

They aren't quick enough to be a true  offensive piece but for contesting mid field objectives it seems quite adequate (and great at the cost) so what am I missing?

Curious what the flaw is before I drop £40 on one and never use it again.

I keep wondering that myself. It seen pretty good on paper, but i never managed to get the model on my country to try it out. 

[Thiagoma]

25 minutes ago, Tiger said:

Thinking on meeting engagements:

Annointed on Frostheart Phoenix

Evocators on Dracolines

Reavers x 2

Swordmasters

Comes at neatly 1000 points. 

I wonder if Frosty is a good call on ME. 

Too many points and i am not sure if resilience is the key on ME abd her cost us pretty high.

With that said i didnt play ME yet. I am working on an Eldtrich Council myself to see how it works.

[medivouk]

5 hours ago, MrZakalwe said:

OK looking at the War Hydra and I'm I'mdering why they aren't seen more in Mixed Order lists- for 170 points and 1 behemoth slot you seem to get quite a bit of punch for your points and with the flat 3 wound regen in your hero phase it's going to be pretty resistant to erosion. 

They aren't quick enough to be a true  offensive piece but for contesting mid field objectives it seems quite adequate (and great at the cost) so what am I missing?

Curious what the flaw is before I drop £40 on one and never use it again.

It'd make a great "distraction carnifex" use it like a super chariot to get our cav and elite infantry out of grindy fights with hordes. The ranged attack is cool, but the lack of rend might be an issue vs anything but chaff/hordes

[Tiger]

19 hours ago, Thiagoma said:

I wonder if Frosty is a good call on ME. 

Too many points and i am not sure if resilience is the key on ME abd her cost us pretty high.

With that said i didnt play ME yet. I am working on an Eldtrich Council myself to see how it works.

I'm not certain myself. I have the model and I will likely face BCR. Not sure what I'd use instead of her (❤️), if I add more SCE characters I might as well go fully into SCE. I do have High Warden from the discounted Spire of Dawn but, again, not really certain if this adds anything. 

One of the points was to build an elite list, something that I can paint and build in a reasonable time.

Good luck with EC! Post a result when you manage to get a game. 

[Thiagoma]

5 minutes ago, Tiger said:

if I add more SCE characters I might as well go fully into SCE.

Oh dont do that please, no need to be radical about it !🤣

Now you mentioned an BCR adversary, you are probably gona face few units, but those pack a punch. 

The reavers are probably going to get you some points early game and the Phoenix can buy time engaging his behemoth.

Against that i think you got a pretty solid list!

[Thiagoma]

Battle report of my local Tournament!

My list:

Mixed Order

Loremaster/Drakeseer/archmage/Frosty

Highborn Spearmen x10 (x2 for battlelines)

30 Swordmaster and 1 celestar Ballista 

1500/1500

 

First fight: Gloomspite Gitz

4 objectives,  2 on each side. Each gives 1 point per round you control it.

I placed the spearmen on both my objectives.  Frosty, casters and dragon engaged his Squigs on mid after i buffed all i could. The Swordmasters rushed to an objective held by 5 squigs.

First round, 2 points each and frosty wrecked his big unit of Squigs. His mega huge squig swallowed 8 of 10 spearmen but the 2 granted me the point for the objective that round. His boss on squig ate my balista, archmage and 10 Spearmen from objective 2.

Round 2, he scored 3 , i got 1. My Drakeseer decided to make a grand entrance. His Breath made 6 MW, and his spell a WOOPING 9 MWs, devouring the gigant squig and placing himself on a way to block the path for the other boss to conquer the objective. 

SM held their objective. He had only 1 Squig boss x my entire Army,  but we tied in points.

I killed 1200 points of his 1500 and  scored a Minor Victory!

[Thiagoma]

Second Game: Khorne

3 objectives. Whoever had majority by the end get major. Hold all 3 and win the game.

This was a disaster. He placed his Skull Prayers on the middle,  blocking my terrible Swordmaster conga line. No sucessfull spell castings, i decided to go for his heroes. Took 3 down but my forces were taking major losses and he flanked and killed my poor spearmen.

I completly forgot about the objectives and in a really stupid way i lost because by turn 2 he conquered all 3.

My adversary was really good and i royally screwed up soooo

Loss!

[Thiagoma]

Third game : Civil War!

High Elves x High Elves!

 

Kid is new to the hobby and still doesnt have behemoths. He loved elves as much as me so i gave him a lot of advice and was a chill game with a lot of lore and models chat.

He was unlucky on the objective : grab the artifact in middle and move it around without getting the holder killed. I got initiative and frosty grabbed the ball. 

In an incredible display of my young apprentice, he actually managed to beat my Bird to 6 hps with his High Warden, Dragon Noble and Phoenix Guard he kept . He got Double turn and made my bird bald spots!

Used the Dragon to block his pursuit while the wounded bird fled for his life! Spearmen jumped on to mess things up too.

The Swordmasters were making a long isolation hope for the area i planed to take the Phoenix but it never got there or engaged any enemy. 

Overall we both had a great time and if gets dragons and Phoenix i would had a lot of trouble.

Props to my adversary!

Result : Major Victory!