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From Dave C on Dakka - prices for the pre-orders!

Carrion Empire £95 $160 

Skaven Battletome £25 $40 
Skaven Endless Spells £20 $35 
Skaven Dice £17.50 $30 
Skaven Gnawholes £32.50 $55 
Skaven Clanrats (repack) £20.50 $35 
Skaven Warscroll Cards £15 $25 

FEC Battletome £25 $40 
FEC Endless Spells £20 $35 
FEC Charnel Throne £20.50 $35 
FEC Warscroll Cards £10 $15 

 

Also https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/02/04/feb4-this-week-at-the-lvogw-homepage-post-3/

Sounds like we should be hearing some big news on Thursday! Considering that with Skaven and Flesh Eaters leaping out of the pot right now I'd expect a fair bit of AoS news considering that GW has now got everything they've hinted at on the table except for "More Slaanesh in 2019" comments. 

Edited by Overread
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2 hours ago, DanielFM said:

Yeah, we must wait. But it doesn't look that good (in balance terms) to begin with.

It's way WAY too early to start worrying about imbalance. Literally all you've seen is a good spell. There are tons of good spells throughout the existing battletomes and warscrolls. This is no different. 

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The comparison to Lord of tides is strange. There is another command ability in the same book that is literally 3 times as good. 

In addition the round the extra attack goes off Idoneth all hit first so you can guarantee your chosen unit will use it to full effect. The Idoneth special rule let's you keep your general alive until the vital moment, etc etc

As for the FEC the new guy will probably be six wounds with a 4 up save. One lucky shot from the Skaven hero and he is dead. End of problem. 

Also we don't know points yet. 

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I find it it hilarious that the choice of argument about balance is Idoneth vs FEC. Like you do realize that Idoneth are a top tier army and FEC are no where near their power level, right? You can’t just flatly compare one specific ability vs another specific ability, you’ve got to include the whole package as Idoneth seem to be getting by just fine with that command ability the way it is now, whereas FEC definitely need something to boost them up.

The way things are now that spell alone would not be enough to bring FEC onto the top tables, but it’s a start depending on what else they get. Remember what was said before, FEC have a very limited selection of units and very little variety between those few units. If the army is a one trick pony, then it needs to be able to do that trick better than most other armies, so you will find situations where yes this one spell/command ability is just flat out better than the one in this other army, but there will be other factors in play to help balance it.

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1 hour ago, Chikout said:

 

As for the FEC the new guy will probably be six wounds with a 4 up save. One lucky shot from the Skaven hero and he is dead. End of problem. 

Also we don't know points yet. 

well there also Deathless Courtier saves but whatever

I more surprise that they made it more risky for the Skaven hero to supercharge Warp lighting if an enemy dispels it.

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1 hour ago, Chikout said:

As for the FEC the new guy will probably be six wounds with a 4 up save. One lucky shot from the Skaven hero and he is dead. End of problem. 

Also we don't know points yet. 

They showed his stats in the warscroll card preview.  7 wounds, 4+ (heals 3 in the hero phase), so yea definitely in the squishy range.

Edited by TheWilddog

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5 hours ago, JackStreicher said:

 

The part about the strigoi:Well that‘s just wrong

For the rest: not exactly but in a way you confirmed what I said.

if you are interested in every detail they added with two clicks just pm me and I‘ll gladly explain it to you (as soon as I don‘t have to type on a cell phone)

Saying these guys look alike is like saying the megaboss looks like a brute. Of course they do because they're the same race. However nearly every element of this guy is clearly not the same as the other. Like the other commenter, I'll grant you the 1 foot is probably reused.

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CGI design can make use of other designs. There is no secret to that. Hand designers also copy or get inspired by existing designs. Here, recycling is just easier and, well, perfect. Of course, except on very specific cases, only parts get reused, which need to be put into a completely different whole than its origin. Depending on how good the designer is, this can lead to mindblowing products or meh products. 

 

Bottomline: recycling capability of CGI technology is not per se good or bad. It is a great tool in the right hands and can lead to lazy designs in bad hands.

 

Although it ia not part of the mindblowing lot, I would certainly rank the new FEC guy as a success. Here is any part was reused, it does not affect quality.

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4 hours ago, Nighthaunt Noob said:

Saying these guys look alike is like saying the megaboss looks like a brute. Of course they do because they're the same race. However nearly every element of this guy is clearly not the same as the other. Like the other commenter, I'll grant you the 1 foot is probably reused.

Said the 3D specialist who knows exactly the workflow. - typical dunning-krueger-effect. 

the base strigoi was rigged, reposed and then they fiddled with making some features bulkier (that‘s 2 clicks for gods sake, most likely already happened in the T/Y-Pose). Shorter claws which were separate meshes anyway, a few more details on the head and broader teeth. Done.

now make the loincloth more fabulous and add the shoulderpad.

 

-> Standard reuse of old assets. Very good reuse you can‘t complain about. -> The way it‘s supposed to be done

 

@Turgol 

exactly. Though time investment and time put into finding a design is also very important (2 essential parts these new spells and the throne lack)

Edited by JackStreicher

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9 hours ago, DanielFM said:

Yeah, we must wait. But it doesn't look that good (in balance terms) to begin with.

Dont you remember how much of a storm the moon doing mortal wounds caused?

Amd how everyone that cried OP looked silly once the whole context was released.

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6 hours ago, Chikout said:

The comparison to Lord of tides is strange. There is another command ability in the same book that is literally 3 times as good. 

In addition the round the extra attack goes off Idoneth all hit first so you can guarantee your chosen unit will use it to full effect. The Idoneth special rule let's you keep your general alive until the vital moment, etc etc

Yes, and it's on a unique character, that people automatically takes over the regular one. Maybe that speaks worse of internal than external balance.

Forgotten Nightmares protect against shooting. Hero phase mortal wounds and spells will kill it just fine (not Volturnos, but I hate the guy! 🤣

5 hours ago, Neinball said:

I find it it hilarious that the choice of argument about balance is Idoneth vs FEC. Like you do realize that Idoneth are a top tier army and FEC are no where near their power level, right? You can’t just flatly compare one specific ability vs another specific ability, you’ve got to include the whole package as Idoneth seem to be getting by just fine with that command ability the way it is now, whereas FEC definitely need something to boost them up.

The way things are now that spell alone would not be enough to bring FEC onto the top tables, but it’s a start depending on what else they get. Remember what was said before, FEC have a very limited selection of units and very little variety between those few units. If the army is a one trick pony, then it needs to be able to do that trick better than most other armies, so you will find situations where yes this one spell/command ability is just flat out better than the one in this other army, but there will be other factors in play to help balance it.

What it's hilarious is that top tier IDK lists are spam of 1 units (spear eels) with support characters. How is that any different from FEC being limited in unit choices?

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@JackStreicher

Dude...

You complain in every Channel about the quality... Fürther, your Dunning-Kruger comparison is utterly arrogant. You are the awesome 3D Specialists and knows best.

To tell the truth, this ist what the Dunning-Kruger effect is about... think about it!

 

We understand that you dont appreciate the effort with this release. Others do...

Criticism is always okay and needed.

But stop accepting your opinion as the only truth.

 

 

 

Edited by rosa
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59 minutes ago, rosa said:

@JackStreicher

Dude...

You complain in every Channel about the quality... Fürther, your Dunning-Kruger comparison is utterly arrogant. You are the awesome 3D Specialists and knows best.

To tell the truth, this ist what the Dunning-Kruger effect is about... think about it!

 

We understand that you dont appreciate the effort with this release. Others do...

Criticism is always okay and needed.

But stop accepting your opinion as the only truth.

 

 

 

Danning-Krueger: Not having the know-how for the task and getting self-confidence from it and therefor thinking they know best. No it's not the same with me. I've been doing this for a decade and then s.o. comes around the corner telling me that I am wrong because they look different (shorter claws, apparently broader and a different head)
 

 

jackie_chan_meme_by_firefox2014-d8p19a4.jpg.85cc4b30c92403e1c8dfdf839210ff93.jpg

 

It has nothing to do with arrogance. I explained how it works and how those miserable miniatures came to be (lack of time, effort and design).
I see my opinion as the only opinion being based on actual experience with the subject of CONCERNING 3D Modeling /3D Sculpts and not about whether the models look good or not.

You can also think about it this way: Soem random stranger comes around the corner to your workplace. Tells you what you are doing is wrong because it looks different than he/she expected, though you know for a fact that it's right. Would it be arrogant now if you tell the person that what you are doing is right, while showing the person why it's right? Well but that person insists that's it's wrong. How do you react now?

You can like the models or don't like them that's fine my opinion whether the models look good or not is just an opinion.
In the realm of 3D modelling what they did is subjectively lazy and bad practise, impudent even towards their consumers.
So if people come up with "recycleing is fine" and the likes I feel obligated to tell them the subjective truth about it: Yes it is fine, but here it is too much, with too little effort and lazily done. So it's far from fine in this case.
Often it seems to me people just like it because it's "New" and it's from "GW". (which btw never recycled on that abnormal scale)

Edited by JackStreicher
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+++ Mod Hat On +++

@JackStreicher - just a simple warning. You have made your point. No need to labour it any more. This forum is for everybody and nobody wants to listen to somebody going on about the same thing.

Cheers

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This bit from the warhammer-community article is interesting

 

"We can’t reveal anything about this year’s LVO preview yet, save that it’s going to blow you away, whatever you collect."

 

Whatever we collect sounds like some new things not bound to a specific faction. 

Edited by obaobaboss
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7 minutes ago, obaobaboss said:

This bit from the warhammer-community article is interesting

 

"We can’t reveal anything about this year’s LVO preview yet, save that it’s going to blow you away, whatever you collect."

 

Whatever we collect sounds like some new things not bound to a specific faction. 

Yes, yes. Either that or they are specifically talking to me.

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Morning folks!

Thought this was the best place to post this up.  I've been away at the HH Weekender this weekend and although not an AoS event, am able to provide a bit of feedback on a few FW things.

First off, the way Forge World provides items for AoS and 40k has been changed.  There is no longer a dedicated team of people creating content for the two game systems.  Instead the rules elements now is being handled by the appropriate design studio.  This is a fairly recent change from the seem of it (within the last month or so).  What does this mean for us?  Nobody yet knows, we never saw what the old team were capable of as it only existed for a few months.  However, the change should help to ensure that future warscrolls have more consistency, but could equally change what we see being produced and may mean some of the interesting items (like multi faction keywords) may never come to fruition.

Secondly, we've seen our first "Ruinstorm Daemon" as an exclusive base for Sanguinius and it looks amazing.  To surmise, Ruinstorm Daemons are basically "generic daemons", they don't fit into the chaos alignment as we understand it.  Why am I telling you this?  Because the new daemons are going to be rife to be integrated into our existing Chaos (or similar ;)) armies as champions and heroes!

Lastly Warhammer Fest is happening at the Richo again on the 11th & 12th of May.  Speaking to the gent organising it (and the Weekender), its having "revolutionary" changes - what they are is anybodies guess, however with 8 Games Days under his belt and seeing how well the majority of the Weekender went I'm really looking forward to it.  I just need to work out what GD entries to do ;)

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18 minutes ago, obaobaboss said:

This bit from the warhammer-community article is interesting

 

"We can’t reveal anything about this year’s LVO preview yet, save that it’s going to blow you away, whatever you collect."

 

Whatever we collect sounds like some new things not bound to a specific faction. 

GW always says this and usually 99% chance it just means more marines lol. 

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14 minutes ago, Barkanaut said:

GW always says this and usually 99% chance it just means more marines lol. 

true XD

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I'm sort of worried that FW disbanded the idea of separate delivery teams before, it seems, the separate delivery team could deliver anything for AoS save for a handful of heads for Stormcast. I wonder what the rational behind that change was and I wonder what will come in the future. Chaos demons are always easy for them because they fit both game systems without any issues. 

It's just really odd to me and I wonder if FW hasn't either found itself stretched too thin with the rising popularity of specialist games that they found they couldn't afford/staff two separate teams (very possible) or that they just don't have any fantasy designers left within their ranks and that they are all heavily sci-fi/Dune/space focused to the point where they either can't come up with ideas or even lack the skill set to achieve them (eg AoS makes far more use of human poses and monsters - both of which are likely very different sculpting skill sets). 

 

 

Naw this time around I think its more Chaos Marines ;)

But yeah marketing talk always bigs things up. You'll be blown away by 1 new dice if marketing get their free hand at promoting things ;)

Edited by Overread

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14 hours ago, DanielFM said:

Idoneth Deepkin Lord of Tides Command Ability:

Wholy within 12", only +1 attack (you must spend extra CPs to get extra attacks) and only useable during the third turn.

How is that not uber lift? Only downside is that the FEC you can try to dispel.

Late to the discussion, but the idoneth ability will usually be on units that are more powerful than the FEC ones. +1 attack on a morrsarr’s weapons hurts more than +2/3 attacks on a ghoul and so on, and even the stronger FEC units usually have a worse hit roll. Speaking as an idoneth player with no interest in collecting FEC it doesn’t seem so very bad to me (undoubtedly strong but not broken).

time will tell though I guess. 

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1 minute ago, Overread said:

I'm sort of worried that FW disbanded the idea of separate delivery teams before, it seems, the separate delivery team could deliver anything for AoS save for a handful of heads for Stormcast. I wonder what the rational behind that change was and I wonder what will come in the future. Chaos demons are always easy for them because they fit both game systems without any issues. 

It's just really odd to me and I wonder if FW hasn't either found itself stretched too thin with the rising popularity of specialist games that they found they couldn't afford/staff two separate teams (very possible) or that they just don't have any fantasy designers left within their ranks and that they are all heavily sci-fi/Dune/space focused to the point where they either can't come up with ideas or even lack the skill set to achieve them (eg AoS makes far more use of human poses and monsters - both of which are likely very different sculpting skill sets). 

Maybe they just dont want to branch AoS into Forgeworld stuff in a big way?   They seem to be back on the 30k train, and with specialist games also getting a lot of support they might be scaling back developing a lot of stuff for 40k and AoS.  The last things they produced for 40k were a Necron Knight sized thing and the Primaris supertank (ok so the new titan is also 40k but primarily 30k). 

I wonder if there are any more rumours for Forgeworld stuff that went under the radar, and might indicate what they are planning.  Those Stormcast heads kinda came out on nowhere.

 

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I don't know if it's true, but I've heard that FW now will be making only HH and Specialist games. No new things for 40k or AoS. Is that true @RuneBrush?

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Thing is HH might sell decently but its nothing like 40K nor AoS; plus a lot of the HH stuff still sells to 40K players who use it as counts as in games. 

I'd be surprised if FW didn't make anything for AoS nor 40K. It just seems such an odd move considering the history of the studio. If specialist games are really selling that strongly I'd expect them to take on a few more staff to cover that rather than shut down avenues. Of course the AoS stuff might not be selling that strongly, but then Fantasy was ignored for ages and GW hasn't pushed the FW stuff that strongly for AoS as yet. They've even only done one pass at the rules and even then admitted that many werent' where they wanted. Why things like hte Myrwurm hasn't got Idoneth set as as a key word baffles me. A 5 second edit of the file and they'd likely make a lot more sales of the very iconic model to the pure undersea iconic army. 

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31 minutes ago, michu said:

I don't know if it's true, but I've heard that FW now will be making only HH and Specialist games. No new things for 40k or AoS. Is that true @RuneBrush?

I would imagine they will continue to do one-offs,  certainly they seem to have scaled back on 40k compared to other systems.  I hope they do some AoS, i really want Stormcast upgrade packs, and KO packs or vehicles would be beyond amazing!  But im cool with them not churning out loads of options and new units with crazy OP rules and points 🤣

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