AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Skreech Verminking]

38 minutes ago, Manxs said:

I got to use the hpa last night and wow is he way better now

Yeah so how many died to his 3inch Avalanche of flesh attack in your game?

[Manxs]

Got 10 out of 12  that was in range then killed the rest of the unit it was chain rasp

[Amradiel]

Verminlord Warpseer  (General) 

Grey Seer

Clawlord 

Arch warlock 

Engineer or Warlock bombardier 

40 Clanrats 

40 Clanrats 

20 Clanrats 

Warp lightening cannon 

Warp lightening cannon 

Doomwheel 

Warpfire thrower 

Endless spell: Warp lightening vortex 

1950 

Thinking of a balewind vortex for the Grey seer or some other cheap endless spell as I don't think I need one extra cp? 

 

[Kirjava13]

Get the Balewind! The extra 6" is so helpful with the Warp Lightning Vortex.

[Amradiel]

How do you equip your Clanrats? 

 

[Gwendar]

Hey again everyone. I'll be taking this list to a small tourney this Saturday and it will be the first with the tome. Hopefully Warscroll builder gets updated soon so I can post lists easier, anyway:

Allegiance: Skaventide

Verminlord Warpseer
-General
-Trait: Verminous Valor
-Artifact: Suspicious Stone

Thanquol
-Spell: Death Frenzy

Grey Seer
-Spell: Plague

Warlock Bombadier\Engineer
-Spell: Warp Lightning Shield
____________________________________________
1x40 Clanrats - Spears
2x20 Clanrats - Swords
1x20 Gutter Runners
Warp Lightning Cannon
Warp Lightning Cannon
________________________________________
Warp Lightning Vortex
Soulsnare Shackles


Engineer will babysit a WLC and threaten with gnawholes. Thanquol will probably run up with the Clanrats and dare someone to charge him with a horde. My local meta has almost no shooting in it if I recall, but plenty of variation like BoK, DoK, Tzeenth and Seraphon. To be honest, the melee heavy armies scare me a bit, so we'll see what happens. I have also considered removing 1 WLC and bulking the Clanrats up to 3x40 which leaves room for a Balewind instead of shackles. Either way, I'll be pretty horrific in the combat phase since I'm relying on 20 Gutter Runners to do the heavy lifting. Spells are not set in stone but seem good enough and the Warpseers traits have me stuck between Valour, Master of Magic and Cunning.

I have a few alternate takes on this and I was honestly stuck between the above and another minus the Shackles, 1 WLC and Gutter Runners in place of 6 Rat Ogors + Master Moulder which would seemingly give me a better combat phase over just 20 Gutter Runners. Anyway CC is welcome as usual, we'll see how this goes.

[wander]

Thought I'd ask here to maybe get more of an answer on this one:

What's your opinion on an otherwise pure Pestilens army (with the allowed Monks as battleline for all it's Skaventide units being Pestilens) taking Nurgle in it's allies points and the army able to keep Monks as battleline?

Some say it's okay as the allies aren't involved in the main army or allegiance, others are saying no as the allied units don't have Pestilens as a keyword.

The allies section just says they can be taken if the General has Pestilens as a keyword, RAW does say 'all other units' must be Pestilens to get Monks as battleline.

Seems odd as the lone Clan Pestilens and Nurgle clearly allied in the past in-fluff and Clanrats etc weren't in the old Pestilens battletome as part of the army.

If you were facing someone including Nurgle in a pure Pestilens army and they were classing Monks as battleline, would you be okay with it?

[States]

1 hour ago, Gwendar said:

Engineer will babysit a WLC and threaten with gnawholes. Thanquol will probably run up with the Clanrats and dare someone to charge him with a horde. My local meta has almost no shooting in it if I recall, but plenty of variation like BoK, DoK, Tzeenth and Seraphon. To be honest, the melee heavy armies scare me a bit, so we'll see what happens. I have also considered removing 1 WLC and bulking the Clanrats up to 3x40 which leaves room for a Balewind instead of shackles. Either way, I'll be pretty horrific in the combat phase since I'm relying on 20 Gutter Runners to do the heavy lifting. Spells are not set in stone but seem good enough and the Warpseers traits have me stuck between Valour, Master of Magic and Cunning.

I have a few alternate takes on this and I was honestly stuck between the above and another minus the Shackles, 1 WLC and Gutter Runners in place of 6 Rat Ogors + Master Moulder which would seemingly give me a better combat phase over just 20 Gutter Runners. Anyway CC is welcome as usual, we'll see how this goes.

Just curious, do you use rat ogors from the giant + packmaster kit? The ugly ones 

[Gwendar]

15 hours ago, Ajay29 said:

Still missing the rules for the plague monks scroll for the leader...

Absolutely not, I use the IoB\SoD ones. I don't mind multiple of the same 2 poses.

Edited February 18, 2019 by Gwendar

[eliminatorjr]

Hey all,

Editing my list in light of the new book and I’m looking for some input. What’s the developing consensus on stormfiends? I’m considering running a block of six (2 doomflayers / 2 projectors / 2 cannons) but I’m not sure if they’ll be worth the points now that you can’t tool them for a specific role. 

Rat ogres are looking far more viable than before — I’m considering dropping the fiends and adding in a blob of ogres, packmasters for support and potentially an extra warpfire thrower to back up the clanrats. 

Thoughts on stormfiends versus rat ogres? 

[angrycontra]

Had a 1500p game fairly recently with primarily skryre army vs khorne. Lost the match and here's some observations:

Thanquol is great but he got stuck fighting way too many turns against this big chaos knight blob (doing 30+ wounds with him in single turn is not exactly easy with 4 fists). His inclusion ultimately didn't work out well in my already small unit/model count army as I had lackluster ability to cap objectives. His biggest issue is that spell of his. It's not very impressive spell tbh so having an endless spell or two is highly recommended with him.

Stormfiends felt a bit meh. I honestly think best way forward with them is to make one big group of 6, buff them up with full hit/wound rerolls and that +1 hit artifact plus warp spark to do incredibly damage. Besides that I'm planning on having single small harassing stormfiend unit with warpgrinder for deepstriking.

Doomwheel didn't get to drive over anything but man that thing can still do some damage. Managed to roll 11 with super charged missile weapon and completely destroyed this unit of 10 chaos warriors in 1 turn. Doomwheel is now genuinely powerful when given chance.

Skyre acolytes are great now. Run + shoot is so huge for them and that +1 damage with warpspark as well. The fact that I can quarantee run of 6 is useful, because Skyre rarely needs other command abilities and they're horde(ish) unit too so it all works quite well. I'm definetly going to convert some bloodbowl teams to make more acolytes for myself.

Terrain piece were useless with the exception of making slight threat on the board (for early game deepstriking). I think that in larger games with more units to spare, they.ll be more useful but in this game they just didn't work out.

Ultimately though my biggest mistake was spreading my forces too thin. I should've focused down on specific units rather than try to deal with everything at once. Also khorne is kinda annoying opponent vs skryre, that automatic unbinding basically means that I'll never get to use super charged warp spells. I'm also gonna leave thanquol out from smaller games. As nice as he is, 400 is too much to spend on a single model in objective based games. I also really hope that gw will errata atleast option to spend ally points to get other skaven units for pure skyre army. Getting even 1 or 2 20 clanrats would solve a lot (I feel a 3rd unit would take too many points of the army) of problems with holding objectives and screening/protecting skryre units.

Edited February 18, 2019 by angrycontra

[Num]

5 hours ago, Gwendar said:

Hey again everyone. I'll be taking this list to a small tourney this Saturday and it will be the first with the tome. Hopefully Warscroll builder gets updated soon so I can post lists easier, anyway:

Allegiance: Skaventide

Verminlord Warpseer
-General
-Trait: Verminous Valor
-Artifact: Suspicious Stone

Thanquol
-Spell: Death Frenzy

Grey Seer
-Spell: Plague

Warlock Bombadier\Engineer
-Spell: Warp Lightning Shield
____________________________________________
1x40 Clanrats - Spears
2x20 Clanrats - Swords
1x20 Gutter Runners
Warp Lightning Cannon
Warp Lightning Cannon
________________________________________
Warp Lightning Vortex
Soulsnare Shackles


Engineer will babysit a WLC and threaten with gnawholes. Thanquol will probably run up with the Clanrats and dare someone to charge him with a horde. My local meta has almost no shooting in it if I recall, but plenty of variation like BoK, DoK, Tzeenth and Seraphon. To be honest, the melee heavy armies scare me a bit, so we'll see what happens. I have also considered removing 1 WLC and bulking the Clanrats up to 3x40 which leaves room for a Balewind instead of shackles. Either way, I'll be pretty horrific in the combat phase since I'm relying on 20 Gutter Runners to do the heavy lifting. Spells are not set in stone but seem good enough and the Warpseers traits have me stuck between Valour, Master of Magic and Cunning.

I have a few alternate takes on this and I was honestly stuck between the above and another minus the Shackles, 1 WLC and Gutter Runners in place of 6 Rat Ogors + Master Moulder which would seemingly give me a better combat phase over just 20 Gutter Runners. Anyway CC is welcome as usual, we'll see how this goes.

Cool plan

I'm afraid about the melee impact too. The death frenzy on thanquol won't do much with 20 clannrats, or with 40 unbuffed.

What if, instead of the 20 gutter runners and the soulsnare (-220), you pump one unit of clanrats to 40, add a clawlord and a balewind (+220)?

You would get more shooting and also more value out of the death frenzy.

Cheers

[Skreech Verminking]

5 hours ago, eliminatorjr said:

Hey all,

Editing my list in light of the new book and I’m looking for some input. What’s the developing consensus on stormfiends? I’m considering running a block of six (2 doomflayers / 2 projectors / 2 cannons) but I’m not sure if they’ll be worth the points now that you can’t tool them for a specific role. 

Rat ogres are looking far more viable than before — I’m considering dropping the fiends and adding in a blob of ogres, packmasters for support and potentially an extra warpfire thrower to back up the clanrats. 

Thoughts on stormfiends versus rat ogres? 

I can’t really say.

the stormfiends have really gotten less interesting since you now have to choose different weapons for each.

they have become  a jack of all trade unit, which makes them in their own way unic.

the Problem just is, why would you want to give a stormfiend a flamer, when you could  literally take it’s cheaper cousin the weapon team and just put it directly hidden in a unit of clanrats, which also can be overcharged and then does much more damage?

although the flamer seems to be worse than the warpflamer weapon team now, Stormfiends still have the rattling gun and the wind launcher which also got better. Buffed by a warlocks magic and the extra damage, I could see some potential hero killing or even the possibility of destroying big chunks of an elite units. And if needed they will even be ready for combat.

but in f you want a unit which intention is nothing but combat, I would take just like you said the rat ogres.

buffed by a packmasters, they will be able to hit on that 3+ which will make a big different.

Giving a master moulder the crown of something (a moulder artefact) will Garantie that your units of ratogres will be able to wound your enemy.

and than casting deathfrenzy or the dreaded deathfrenzy on them will give you a change to hit back even when they die.

so if it comes down, Stormfiends are proabably a good unit if you really want to overuse the warpstone shards damage buff.

Rat ogres in the other hand can and will tear trough the enemy line, like if they would be made out of paper, and can also be buffed to the prime.

in other words wanting to build an armie around melee I would take ratogres as your hammer and the warpflamers weapon teams as a back up for the clanrats.

[Congratz]

So how good are skaven with the new Battletome? I am thinking about buying the Carrion Empire box, but i do not know which army to play!
Thoughts?

[Kramer]

2 hours ago, Congratz said:

So how good are skaven with the new Battletome? I am thinking about buying the Carrion Empire box, but i do not know which army to play!
Thoughts?

Rats rule! I say that without any games with the new tome but with a lot of enthusiasm. So do with that what you will  

but genuinly, Skaven have always been a cool and fun army to play and now look to be pretty good as well! 

[5kaven5lave]

Any thoughts on this as a mixed Skaventide?

Grey Seer

Arch Warlock

Verminlord Corruptor with Sword of Judgement

Clawlord / Bombardier

40 Clanrats

2x20 Clanrats

40 Plague Monks

3x WLC

Warp Lightning Vortex, Balewind

Big hero phase, lots of bodies and some mortal wounds thrown in for good measure. Maybe not enough hammer for my anvils?

[Gwendar]

9 hours ago, Num said:

Cool plan

I'm afraid about the melee impact too. The death frenzy on thanquol won't do much with 20 clannrats, or with 40 unbuffed.

What if, instead of the 20 gutter runners and the soulsnare (-220), you pump one unit of clanrats to 40, add a clawlord and a balewind (+220)?

You would get more shooting and also more value out of the death frenzy.

Cheers

True, the spells weren't set in stone so I was most likely going to give him something else regardless like Scorch or Splinter since he would be relatively close anyway.

I think at this point, I'm between your suggestion or just throwing in 6 Ogors + Master Moulder at the cost of a WLC and shackles, though I would still be at 80 Clanrats total. That said, I do really love my double WLC's and I think I may be underestimating what Death Frenzy can do considering Clanrats die in droves. Speaking of which, since I don't have the book in front of me right now, would Death Frenzy still allow the unit size bonus to take effect? I think no as they already count as having been slain if I recall.

[Skreech Verminking]

3 hours ago, Congratz said:

So how good are skaven with the new Battletome? I am thinking about buying the Carrion Empire box, but i do not know which army to play!
Thoughts?

Like @Kramer said, the rats are ruling the realms right now (they at least feel like it) they are very fun to play, you have a gigantic variety of units you can use, and the thing that made the skaven so fantasticly fun to play is their very strong maschinery that can explode anytime when overused.

But what makes the skaven really special is that you can literally go mixed as I’m doing it right now and probaly will be playing them until they somehow vanish (probably never!) or just go for one clan.

Warscrollrules have been updated, which made most of the units much better (for example the doom wheel, screaming bell or even the hell pit abomination, which almost nobody wanted to use) and yeah they are a great armie, whith which listbuilding can only be limited by your imagination, and still we have less than those poster-things (soon to be dead Yes-yes)

 

[tman3257]

21 hours ago, Kirjava13 said:

Get the Balewind! The extra 6" is so helpful with the Warp Lightning Vortex.

I keep seeing this mentioned here, but are people aware of the FAQ?

 

Q: Do things that increase the range of a caster’s spells also apply to the distance at which an endless spell can be set up from the caster?

A: No. Things that increase the range of a spell’s effects do not apply to the distance at which an endless spell can be set up. By the same token, things that allow you to measure the range of a spell from a different location to the caster cannot be used when setting up an endless spell.

[Kirjava13]

I hate everything about this.

[Overread]

It does, however, reduce endless spell abuse; don't forget all those people trying to use Gates to range boost endless spells too - can't do that either. 

[Num]

18 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

I hate everything about this.

There seems to be match between your recurring disappointments and your face-palming avatar though 😆

[tman3257]

33 minutes ago, Overread said:

It does, however, reduce endless spell abuse; don't forget all those people trying to use Gates to range boost endless spells too - can't do that either. 

It really is for the better.  Early AoS2.0 before the FAQ I ran an Arkhan the Black build with 5-6 endless spells using his increased range command. The result was so many spells my opponent couldn’t actually get across the board to me. It can become pretty abusive.

Besides, you can always skitterleap first then cast the vortex!

[wander]

Warhammer Community has updated the warscroll builder to include Skaventide and the battletome point adjustments now. Should be even easier to throw together some lists to test the new stuff now.

I also ran through a list and it confirms Monks do not count as battleline if you add in Nurgle units as Allies to a Pestilens list.

Guess my next project will be the Plagueclaw Catapult from my SC box after all.

[GeneralZero]

Skyre acolytes : how to get them for cheap/hordes? How to convert monks in acolytes?