Inquisitorsz Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Anyone have any thoughts or suggestions about this list? Obviously very shooty and magic heavy. I'd love to take Tanquol and/or a Hellpit too but struggling to fit any of that in. I guess with 9 Jezzails I can probably drop the cannons, but I want to try this at least. LEADERS Verminlord Warpseer (260) - General - Command Trait : Master of Magic Warlock Bombardier (100) - Artefact : Vigordust Injector - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! Grey Seer (120) - Lore of Ruin : PlagueUNITS 9 x Warplock Jezzails (420) 40 x Clanrats (200) - Rusty Spear 40 x Clanrats (200) - Rusty Spear 20 x Clanrats (120) - Rusty Spear 1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)WAR MACHINES Warp Lightning Cannon (180) Warp Lightning Cannon (180)ENDLESS SPELLS Warp Lightning Vortex (100) Aethervoid Pendulum (40) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashes Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 16 hours ago, Asamu said: So... Plague monks with woe staves with both Furnace prayers (+1 attack and re-roll wounds) and the Verminlord corruptor command ability (Re-roll hits) make 7 attacks and average ~6.6 damage apiece on the charge. Hard to beat 40 plague monks doing an average 264 wounds in one combat phase, and making a second attack for each model that dies if death frenzy went off (with the warpstone token rule and +1 from a gnawhole, it should go off ~80% of the time, and on a 10+ over 50% of the time). 20 buffed plague monks is still enough to kill basically anything they touch, and it's not hard to get a lot of models in with 25mm bases. With gnawholes, you can teleport alpha strike on the first turn, and with cogs, it's a 6+ to charge instead of an 8+. You might not get the re-rolls to hit from the verminlord, but they probably aren't needed anyway. Allegiance: SkaventideMortal Realm: Ulgu or HyshGrey Seer (120)- General- Trait: Master of Magic- Lore of Ruin: Death FrenzyPlague Priest on Plague Furnace (180)- Artefact: Liber Bubonicus Plague Priest on Plague Furnace (180)Verminlord Corruptor (260)- Artefact: Sword of Judgement or Aetherquartz Brooch40 x Plague Monks (240) - Woe-stave40 x Plague Monks (240) - Woe-stave40 x Plague Monks (240) - Woe-stave40 x Plague Monks (240) - Woe-stave10 x Plague Monks (70) - Woe-staveCongregation of Filth (160)Chronomantic Cogs (60)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 223 This list has 4 drops; all of the plague monks and the 2nd furnace are part of the battalion; though it may be worth cutting the battalion to bump the small unit of plague monks up to 40. With the 1 Attack of staves how do you get to 7 attacks? Even with all buffs I don´t get to that number. What do you mean by warpstone token rule, isn´t that only helpful for Skyre units? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheadTheOgorSlayer Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 So uh been toying around with lists and stuff and this is the one I like the most for a pure pestilens army: plague furnace (general and prolly the relic holder, thinking of giving the liber bubonicus for max prayers) plague priest*2 plague monks*40 (the “Death Star” of the list) plague monks*10 plague monks*10 plague monks*10 plague monks*10 plague monks*10 plague monks*10 should be 1000 points (I don’t have the new tome so idk what changed points wise for pestilens) the thing I need help on is what’s command to give my units of 10 and what trait my warlord should have (leaning towards rerolls on prayers for a higher chance at 6s for great plagues) I’m also open to grabbing a different relic of course since the auto dispell endless spells seems useful when you got no wizards. game plan is to use gnaw holes and 3 units of 10 as initial pressure (kinda in a way that if they charge them they only get one unit in range and have to deal with at least one of them counter charging) on a flank as to disrupt but not be the actual threat. Most likely 2 units of ten blocking charges for the 40 block and the last unit of 10 doing whatever on the defensive or when faced with alpha strikes similar plan but the distraction is no longer used, instead stringing more ten mans on my lines to take initial charges before counter charging as much as possible to death and when facing gunlines gnawholes will provide the means to instantly bring as much to their face as possible and maybe even making some charges to provide instant messy death and disruption to either me or my opponent. With the 6 inch space around gnawholes should allow for at least 40 guys to go at once also idk how gnawholes are placed so perhaps this is all impossible and my game plan will always be to run up the table and kill everything lol! The way they were explained online it seems like they can be placed in a way to try getting first turn charges but idk as I don’t have the book so hows my list 😆 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 It’s funny even after we got the skaven battletome which are making the rattling guns amazing with all the buffs they can get, I never really saw them as powerful as they are. hitting and wounding on 4s just never really appealed to me, although you could double the amount of shoots that possibility to roll a double was to high for my taste. still after watching the last battle report from mini wargaming I realized how great they are. rerolling all Hits rolls if you have a skyre General with the special trait is fantastic and giving up to three units +1damage is amazing in the shooting phase making them probably one of the heaviest elite Infanterie killers. I’ll probably include a few of these in my next match up, since they seem to be a lot of fun for both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) This new chaos model could make a great conversion for a skaven warlord on a hellish maschinery made Brood horror. I think it’s time our tinkerrats got some kind of mount. seems like a perfect opportunity for us. Edited March 13, 2019 by Skreech Verminking 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asamu Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 7 hours ago, Ashes said: With the 1 Attack of staves how do you get to 7 attacks? Even with all buffs I don´t get to that number. What do you mean by warpstone token rule, isn´t that only helpful for Skyre units? They still have the blades in addition to staves; they just don't get re-rolls to hit without a corruptor nearby using the command ability, where 2 blade monks always get re-rolls to hit. The bonuses giving extra attacks apply to both weapons, so the 2+1 attacks becomes 4+3. In a unit of 40, they're also getting +1 to hit and wound, so 3+/3+ for the blade, and 3+/4+ for the staff; the other prayer gives re-rolls to wound, and the Verminlord corruptor command ability gives re-rolls to hit. Additionally, 6s to wound cause 2 damage instead of 1, so they do attacks*chance to hit*(chance to wound + chance that wound roll is a nat 6): 4*8/9*10/9+3*8/9*4/4 = ~6.617 This is probably the highest damage per point of any unit in the game, and the buffs aren't hard to get off. The warpstone tokens rule allows Grey Seers to roll 3d6 to cast a spell instead of 2d6. If they roll a 13, the spell is cast automatically and can't be dispelled, but the grey seer dies. Otherwise, you remove 1 of the dice (always the lowest) and use the remaining 2 for the casting roll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashes Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) Wow this is huge! Totally missed that they have both weapons. Thanks!!! Those monks are amazing! Edited March 13, 2019 by Ashes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmimzie Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 13 hours ago, Inquisitorsz said: Anyone have any thoughts or suggestions about this list? Obviously very shooty and magic heavy. I'd love to take Tanquol and/or a Hellpit too but struggling to fit any of that in. I guess with 9 Jezzails I can probably drop the cannons, but I want to try this at least. LEADERS Verminlord Warpseer (260) - General - Command Trait : Master of Magic Warlock Bombardier (100) - Artefact : Vigordust Injector - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! Grey Seer (120) - Lore of Ruin : PlagueUNITS 9 x Warplock Jezzails (420) 40 x Clanrats (200) - Rusty Spear 40 x Clanrats (200) - Rusty Spear 20 x Clanrats (120) - Rusty Spear 1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)WAR MACHINES Warp Lightning Cannon (180) Warp Lightning Cannon (180)ENDLESS SPELLS Warp Lightning Vortex (100) Aethervoid Pendulum (40) I wonder why the vigordust injector??? I'm not 100% sure on this, but i feel like you don't really have any good targets for it?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitorsz Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, mmimzie said: I wonder why the vigordust injector??? I'm not 100% sure on this, but i feel like you don't really have any good targets for it?? It's for the jezzails. +1 to hit makes them 3+/3+ with rerolls to hit and wound doing 3 damage with rend 2 (when fully buffed). 9 guys deal an average of 17 wounds and including 3 mortal wounds. At range 30". Edited March 14, 2019 by Inquisitorsz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted March 14, 2019 Author Share Posted March 14, 2019 Anyone got any tips for using the Warpseer? I’m guessing we keep him loosely chained to big blobs of rats for the CA and otherwise use him as a hard to kill CP farm? Can he do much in melee or is he more of a backfield support piece with the spells etc.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 @5kaven5lave I tend to keep mine mid-field depending on the objective for that bubble. Verminous Valor + Suspicious Stone lets you use him a bit more aggressively due to his survivability. He took about half the wounds off a Vortex beast one game but would've done more had I not whiffed all attacks one combat phase.. which kind of speaks to his combat ability. Is he as good in combat as other Verminlords? Nope. But he can definitely hold his own and be a good distraction piece if you need one, assuming you give him the trait and artifact. Warpgale is very powerful with solid range so it really depends on the matchup and how you think you need to use him. I've thrown the orb twice before in a desperate attempt to kill off a hero once I felt I was safe from not needing re-rolls and it's paid off well enough. Even if it doesn't kill them, it lets my WLC's get an easier kill. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Num Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 Anyone using rat swarms? I'm building the vermintide spell but thought of using it as 4 rat swarms instead. What do you use rat swarms and/or vermintise for? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 @Num I can't say whether or not Rat Swarms are worth it. I really disliked that they can only return slain models now, but with 8 being 240 points over 40 Giant Rats for 200 (who can't replenish unless by a Master Moulder roll after being wiped out) I would say they're both pretty decent tarpits and swarms are giving you back 4 wounds every hero phase. The Giant Rats would be ahead in terms of coverage but the Swarms could be more annoying if they last long enough. As for the spell, I've only used it once and it was... alright? It's useful for blocking an area or forcing someone to decide if they want to risk taking MW's by moving near it or not. I like it in conjunction with WLV but I don't know that it's better than the shotgun blast that is the Pendulum (which also works well with WLV). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skavelynn Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 On 3/13/2019 at 6:50 AM, Skreech Verminking said: rerolling all Hits rolls if you have a skyre General with the special trait is fantastic and giving up to three units +1damage is amazing in the shooting phase making them probably one of the heaviest elite Infanterie killers. I’ll probably include a few of these in my next match up, since they seem to be a lot of fun for both sides. They're very fun and very powerful with warpstone sparks, just be careful if the enemy has shooting, ratling guns are very squishy and can be easily shot down before they can do much. The overcharge is honestly pretty safe though, I think out of 4-5 games have they only blown themselves up twice on me. My strategy as of late has been 6 rat ogres, 2-3 ratling guns, and warp lightning cannons buffed by their engineers and master moulder, and behind a big horde of clanrats. Lots of damage! 1 hour ago, Num said: Anyone using rat swarms? I'm building the vermintide spell but thought of using it as 4 rat swarms instead. What do you use rat swarms and/or vermintise for? Thanks I personally don't really see any use in rat swarms. They just remind me of nurglings, but worse. They might be good at tarpitting but we have so many hordes that can fulfill that role if needed, alongside being able to screen and deal more damage. I've only used vermintide once, it didn't really do much but it's a safe endless spell I guess. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitorsz Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 (edited) 16 hours ago, 5kaven5lave said: Anyone got any tips for using the Warpseer? I’m guessing we keep him loosely chained to big blobs of rats for the CA and otherwise use him as a hard to kill CP farm? Can he do much in melee or is he more of a backfield support piece with the spells etc.? I've heard people also take him with the Ethereal Amulet. Now you've got a 4+ save, 12 wound monster who is immune to rend and can reroll that 4+. Throw in Protection of the Horned Rat (5+ ward save) and now he needs to suffer 144 72 wounds to die (on average). You can throw him at pretty much anything and he's going to last a long time. As long as that thing doesn't do a silly amount of mortal wounds. Especially if he's that tough, I'd put him front/mid center for the CA bubble and gives him the most choice with his long range spells. I plan on running master of magic as well, maybe stand near a gnawhole and drop endless spells (and warpgale) at +2 to cast And at the end of the day, the doom glaive is still pretty awesome. He's still getting 6 attacks 3+/2+/-1/D3 Plus the tail attacks. He's not the best in melee but he'll still worry a lot of things. Especially if he has an ethereal save and it's tough to drop his damage table down. Don't forget that the doom glaive is range 3" so if you're careful with positioning you can have clan rats around him and no take any attacks back. Edited March 14, 2019 by Inquisitorsz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron Wastelands Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Inquisitorsz said: I've heard people also take him with the Ethereal Amulet. Now you've got a 4+ save, 12 wound monster who is immune to rend and can reroll that 4+. Throw in Protection of the Horned Rat (5+ ward save) and now he needs to suffer 144 wounds to die (on average). Think you’ve unintentionally halved the odds again. I make it 72 wounds on average. 4+ rerollable means one in every 4 goes through, so 12 damage needs 48 (on average). Ward of 5+ means 2 in 3 go through, so 48 becomes 72 needed on average. Still a tough cookie though 😊 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitorsz Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, Baron Wastelands said: Think you’ve unintentionally halved the odds again. I make it 72 wounds on average. 4+ rerollable means one in every 4 goes through, so 12 damage needs 48 (on average). Ward of 5+ means 2 in 3 go through, so 48 becomes 72 needed on average. Still a tough cookie though 😊 Yep... I think I stuffed up the 5+ ward save. I did (4/6) instead of (2/6) It should be 72 wounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
States Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 35 minutes ago, Inquisitorsz said: Yep... I think I stuffed up the 5+ ward save. I did (4/6) instead of (2/6) It should be 72 wounds. Is ethereal better than the suspicious stone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitorsz Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, States said: Is ethereal better than the suspicious stone? Depends on what's causing the wounds. If it's mortal wounds... then yes, the stone is better. If my maths is correct: With suspicious stone: 0 Rend = 108 wounds to kill him -1 Rend = 61 wounds to kill him -2 Rend = 39 wounds to kill him -3 rend and/or MW = 27 wounds to kill him With ethereal amulet: 0/-1/-2/-3 Rend = 72 wounds to kill him MW = 18 wounds to kill him So basically the ethereal amulet is better against Rend -1, -2 and -3 stuff and the difference between rend 0 stuff (72 wounds vs 108 wounds) is probably irrelevant in practice. So it's going to come down to whether or not your expecting more mortal wounds or more rend stuff. If you're playing an army with a lot of rend -1 or higher, then ethereal is better. Otherwise the stone is better. I'm assuming that the suspicious stone stacks with protection of the horned rat... Perhaps that might get FAQed because the rule wording is identical. I dunno if there's a precedent for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verminlord Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 (edited) I'm working on a competitive mixed list: Allegiance: SkaventideLeadersVerminlord Warpseer (260)- General- Trait: Master of Magic Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (200)- Lore of Ruin: SkitterleapGrey Seer (120)- Artefact: Suspicious Stone - Lore of Ruin: WarpgaleWarlock Bombardier (100)- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: Warp Lightning ShieldBattleline40 x Clanrats (200)- Rusty Spear40 x Clanrats (200)- Rusty Spear20 x Clanrats (120)- Rusty SpearUnits10 x Gutter Runners (120)BehemothsHell Pit Abomination (220)War MachinesWarp Lightning Cannon (180)Warp Lightning Cannon (180)Endless SpellsWarp Lightning Vortex (100)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 173 Thoughts? Anyone use the new HPA yet? Seems very strong but I'm not sure if it's auto-include material. I usually run gutter runners in groups of 20, but couldn't fit them without removing HPA. Anyone use 10ers? Edited March 15, 2019 by Verminlord Changed list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galdenistal Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 6 hours ago, States said: Is ethereal better than the suspicious stone? In a mostly / exclusive Skryre army, I'd say the Ethereal Amulet is better, as you have plenty of long range sniper ability to weaken any mortal wound output that you are afraid of. It will be my go to artifact in all games I play in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 (edited) So I've been thinking on building this list for clan Moulder Spoiler Allegiance: MoulderLeadersMaster Moulder (100)Master Moulder (100)Verminlord Warpseer (260)BattlelineUnits40 x Giant Rats (200)6 x Rat Ogors (300)6 x Rat Ogors (300)20 x Wolf Rats (400)3 x Packmasters (60)BehemothsHell Pit Abomination (220)Endless SpellsVermintide (40)Total: 1980 / 2000 It's mostly an excuse to let me put 20 wolfrats on the table at once! The only thing I dislike about it is that heavy investment in rat ogres it requires to work Another option is to take two rat ogres out of each ogre unit and get a second hellpit abomination. That adds another ibg monster, but it does knock both ogre groups down to only 4 ogres each, at which point i'd worry that they are a threat but not enough of a threat. Edited March 15, 2019 by Overread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 Did that Forgeworld email this morning get anyone else thinking? Potential Giant Rats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said: Did that Forgeworld email this morning get anyone else thinking? Potential Giant Rats? I got an email but it went squeakboom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said: Did that Forgeworld email this morning get anyone else thinking? Potential Giant Rats? Do you mean those rats with the bombs? No wonder my computer isn’t working anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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