Cosmicsheep Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, wakadaka said: Been working on clan moulder for skaven always loved the pack animal theme they had going and I have assembled a list for them that I was looking for comments on. Unsure at this point who to make the general. Fleshmeld Meangerie Master Moulder Master Moulder Grey Seer on Bell 3x Packmasters 20x Giant Rats 20x Giant Rats 20x Giant Rats 4x Rat Swarms 6x Rat Ogres Hell-Pit Abomination Hell-Pit Abomination Bell of Doom The Bell has to be your general in order to be legal. Any other choice means that the remainder of your list isn’t 100% Moulder and you wouldn’t be allowed to use giant rats or rat ogres as battleline. Personally I would have units of 40 giant rats to take full advantage of the Rabid Crown which you should be putting on a master Moulder near them Edited February 24, 2020 by Cosmicsheep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted February 26, 2020 Share Posted February 26, 2020 (edited) So I’ll be trying my tournament list against that of a friend of mine, this sat. out. I’ll give you guys a good report after the battle. Edited February 26, 2020 by Skreech Verminking 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJS Posted February 26, 2020 Share Posted February 26, 2020 Hi all, Have a local 1500 pnt tourney coming up here and am tinkering with my list a bit and would love some feedback. The list below is what i have pretty much, and my main concern is that i should be including a bombardier to buff jezzails properly.. i could also have the following units at my disposal not in the list currently: Hellpit abomination, warplightning cannon, arch warlock and the remainder of endless spells for skaven. - Grey seer on screaming bell // 240 - 3 units of 20 clanrats // 360 - 6 warplock jezzails // 280 - Doomwheel // 160 - 3 stormfiends // 260 - 20 plague monks // 160 - Vermintide // 40 Match ups will likely be against Ironjawz, KO, OBR, Slaanesh and Nighthaunt so any help would be appreciated Should i be dropping the plague monks and get the bombardier and WLV instead for example? My concern is i need more bodies on the field and dont have more clanrats available atm.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gronnelg Posted February 26, 2020 Share Posted February 26, 2020 My Verminlord warpseer is FINALLY done! Been working on this guy since early November 😛 Bonus picture of my spare warpseer 😉 6 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmicsheep Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 (edited) 23 hours ago, TJS said: Hi all, Have a local 1500 pnt tourney coming up here and am tinkering with my list a bit and would love some feedback. The list below is what i have pretty much, and my main concern is that i should be including a bombardier to buff jezzails properly.. i could also have the following units at my disposal not in the list currently: Hellpit abomination, warplightning cannon, arch warlock and the remainder of endless spells for skaven. - Grey seer on screaming bell // 240 - 3 units of 20 clanrats // 360 - 6 warplock jezzails // 280 - Doomwheel // 160 - 3 stormfiends // 260 - 20 plague monks // 160 - Vermintide // 40 Match ups will likely be against Ironjawz, KO, OBR, Slaanesh and Nighthaunt so any help would be appreciated Should i be dropping the plague monks and get the bombardier and WLV instead for example? My concern is i need more bodies on the field and dont have more clanrats available atm.. The general consensus on here is that jezzails can operate on their own without buffs, although a warpspark to add damage is nice. However, your 3 stormfiends really do need a buff and would benefit from an engineer (or bombardier) As for plague monks, most people will only ever run these in units of 40. Skaven benefit highly from being in units of 30+ At that size they get +1 to hit and +1 to wound. You really have to lean into the buffs when it comes to Skaven. As tempting as it is to take all your favourite units, you need to save some points for the leaders to buff them. Other than that, I’d say your list looks fun. 6 jezzails can easily snipe a support hero, and doomwheels can really give your enemy something to think about. Think of your clanrats as expendable and use them as shields. Let your enemy charge into those rather than your fiends or monks Have fun 😀 Edited February 27, 2020 by Cosmicsheep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkhan Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 Skaven really dropping down on the rankings:/ https://thehonestwargamer.com/february-23rd-2020-aos-stats/?fbclid=IwAR0GvV4DDF8cfUQoLfJUqPZs-17VSc3Sq70RmbCMyGksIF9-MF6Nx2o0jF0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 29 minutes ago, Darkhan said: Skaven really dropping down on the rankings:/ https://thehonestwargamer.com/february-23rd-2020-aos-stats/?fbclid=IwAR0GvV4DDF8cfUQoLfJUqPZs-17VSc3Sq70RmbCMyGksIF9-MF6Nx2o0jF0 Well I guess that’s what happens when the skaven only get point hikes instead of drops😂. jokes aside, there are a few new armies out there like the new dead-things of nagash etc. Who are dominating the meta right now. But considering how many tools we have to our disposal, I think we just need some time to readjust ourselves and find another way or list to climb back up to the top. After-all a pest never really stops to cease to exist, especially if they are rats. Yes-yes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 Ps: Right, I thought a few pics of my newly (at least most of them are) painted doombrigade: I finally finished painting the last wheel Although I very likely won’t be using any contrast paints, the next time I’ll be painting a wheel. It’s just so hard to cover all those white sneaky almost impossible to get to places with paint. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drcrabs Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said: Well I guess that’s what happens when the skaven only get point hikes instead of drops😂. jokes aside, there are a few new armies out there like the new dead-things of nagash etc. Who are dominating the meta right now. But considering how many tools we have to our disposal, I think we just need some time to readjust ourselves and find another way or list to climb back up to the top. After-all a pest never really stops to cease to exist, especially if they are rats. Yes-yes That and I also believe there are plenty of competitive skaven players out there trying different lists ever since the 9 stormfiend list became not a thing anymore. I think once an internal meta for skaven is figured out again they will bounce back. I'm sure once the dust settles I believe Clan Skryre will once again be the reason for doing so with some combination of Jezzails, Acolytes and Doom Wheels along with, like some others are testing here, a hell pit abomination with or without a unit of 40 monks. Edited February 27, 2020 by Drcrabs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 8 hours ago, Darkhan said: Skaven really dropping down on the rankings:/ https://thehonestwargamer.com/february-23rd-2020-aos-stats/?fbclid=IwAR0GvV4DDF8cfUQoLfJUqPZs-17VSc3Sq70RmbCMyGksIF9-MF6Nx2o0jF0 Skaven rankings have always been along the same lines as CoS ones; lots of casual players taking subpar lists made of what they had or getting into it because of various media and they just think Skaven are cool. Nothing wrong with that by any means, but having a high meta % played when only specific builds can be considered competitive really drives down the win %. I don't think this is necessarily the biggest contributing factor. You always have to remember individual player skill means a lot. I agree with Drcrabs in that since losing the 9 Fiend list, people have been experimenting (myself included) and trying to find something else that fits in to the current meta. The lists that have been doing well are still running 6 Fiends and 40 Monks with nearly half their points in heroes on top of that and Clanrats tend to go no more than 60 with some running 80. I'm preferring the Hell Pit, but honestly if Stormvermin dropped some more I would easily include them... I just don't know that I would give up 6 Fiends and 6\9 Jezzails for 40 of them unless they really dropped in price and they have to be careful about doing that. We're still easily considered A-tier but I feel Skaven require a good pilot to pull things off and they certainly aren't just a point-and-click army like how Slaanesh was for the longest time. Go back to when we first got our tome; lots of people were running lists made up of 100-120 Clanrats, 1-2 Doomwheels, 20-30 Acolytes and 6-9 Jezzails or 2 WLC's. These performed well, but a core part of each of this was WLV absolutely shredding people in their deployment until people figured out how to deal with it.. and then it (rightfully) got nerfed. But so has everything else.. and all that cumulatively has drug us down a bit. I dunno.. I think we're in a good spot overall but some things may need to be tweaked around. I've been doing well locally with the list I posted previously and I aim to continue working with it and getting games in with some more competitive locals (including some guys that ranked high at adepticon the last few years and a certain WW co-host). Will I drop the Hellpit for 40 Monks or maybe run them together? Will I keep the Fiends or swap them for 30 Acolytes and a Doomwheel and\or WLC? Who knows... but I think we're still looking pretty good. Really need my Eshin\Skryre Rat-pirates tome to come out though 😉 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 My gunline got its butt kicked by pink horror blob today. Someone send help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishwaffle2232 Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Vesper said: My gunline got its butt kicked by pink horror blob today. Someone send help. What happened? I've lost a couple against tzeentch but both times in the last turn and both games could have been won had I not made big mistakes. I think the key to taking down tzeentch changehost is target priority and proper screening. First game i targeted pinks to take them off an objective instead of ignoring them, taking other objectives and sniping off heroes. 2nd game I didn't screen well enough, but target priority was much better. Unfortunately not screening well enough meant my shooting wasnt as strong turn 1 and I couldn't take down his LoC. I also prioritised flamers so in both games they didnt have a huge impact. They are quite easy to kill and if you screen them from your key targets you can nullify them. I would say key things ill be taking into my next game against them are: 1. Making sure I have clanrats deployed to screen out teleporting flamers and deepstriking changeling. Paired with battleshock immunity aura to make sure my chaff doesnt go down in one turn. 2. Making sure i have enough ranged firepower to snipe off characters ASAP to nullify casting. Jezzails and fiends seemed to work great. 3. Make sure I don't get locked into fights with horrors but use clanrats to tie them up retreat and charge to get to other objectives. It's gonna be a tough fight regardless. Tzeentch are top of the meta for good reason. Edited February 28, 2020 by fishwaffle2232 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gronnelg Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 @fishwaffle2232Some good pointers here. Concerning clanrats retreat and charge - I thought Tzeentch had some "you can't retreat" mechanic going on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gronnelg Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 Jezzail kitbash. I see most people use skitarii and stormvermin. Is it possible to use clanrats? I dont like the heavily armored stormvermin for jezzails... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 1 hour ago, gronnelg said: @fishwaffle2232Some good pointers here. Concerning clanrats retreat and charge - I thought Tzeentch had some "you can't retreat" mechanic going on? 15 minutes ago, gronnelg said: Jezzail kitbash. I see most people use skitarii and stormvermin. Is it possible to use clanrats? I dont like the heavily armored stormvermin for jezzails... Tzeentch can run Hosts Duplicitous which gives them the innate ability to not allow units to retreat if they're within 3" I believe. It's one of the more common Hosts to run next to Eternal Conflag. While I use the same Skitarii + Stormvermin method, I think Clanrats could work but you would need to put a bit more effort in. I definitely don't think you can make it look decent if you try to just use Clanrat arms; I've seen far too many Jezzails conversions that have the right Clanrat arm holding a rifle by itself and they just look... odd. If you're talking about using the Skitarii arms then I definitely think it could work but the proportions may be strange? Some of those Clanrat models are shorter than the Stormvermin who are already naturally posed to hold 2 handed weapons which is why the Skitarii arms work well with them.. with the Clanrats, the left arm is modeled on and is just meant to hold a shield so you would need to file\cut it off and do a lot of work on that end. It would be worth it to try with a couple models.. it boils down to what you think looks good and not anyone else; so long as people know what model it's conveying then they're generally okay with it. Skaven don't have grenade-launchers (yet) and the Warpfire throwers are a team so.. my Acolyte conversion has yet to cause any controversy on what they are meant to be 😅 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 Ever wondered what the perfect, most skaveni list at 1500points would look like? Well I guess I just found it: Allegiance: Skaventide - Mortal Realm: Chamon LEADERS Warlock Bombardier (120) - General - Command Trait : Deranged Inventor - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! Warlock Bombardier (120) - Artefact : The Brass Orb - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! Warlock Bombardier (120) - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! Warlock Bombardier (120) - Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism : More-more-more Warp Power! UNITS 3 x Stormfiends (260) 3 x Stormfiends (260) 1 x Doomwheel (160) 1 x Doomwheel (160) 1 x Warp Lightning Cannon (180) TOTAL: 1500/2000 EXTRA COMMAND POINTS: 0 WOUNDS: 80 ARTILLERY: 1/4 LEADERS: 4/6 BATTLELINES: 2 (3+) BEHEMOTHS: 2/4 ARTEFACTS: 1/1 ALLIES: 0/40 this list counts exactly 13 models, and literally everything, except the stomfiends, can blow up in a single turn, if you are truly unlucky. Perfect for any true believer of the great horned rat😉 (😂) 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiotrW Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Hi there, guys I've finally got to reading the lore parts of Skaven Battletome and I have some questions... First, a general question (which may be a bit weird): when playing Skaven, do you think of them exactly as they are depicted in the book? The fluff there is atmospheric, but it really shows the Skaven as absolutely creepy, deranged monsters. Meanwhile, when I think of my Skaven army, I can't help seeing them as... well, my cute little ratfolk I mean, sure, I do think of them as being crazy and on the evil side - but there's cuteness and fun involved, too. So, how it's with you? Also, I have two specific lore questions: 1. Is it known where the Horned Rat came from and how exactly did he become a Chaos God? The book doesn't really go into details in relation to those matters. 2. As it's not mentioned, I understand that the Old World concept of "almost nobody believes the Skaven actually exist" didn't carry over to the Mortal Realms? And a final question, related to the way you might head-canon your personal armies - if you're playing using an all-Skaven army (in contrast to an army of just one Clan), then how do you explain all those rats working together? I mean, aren't Skryre folk and Pestilens folk meant to be at each other throats? How would you explain them being a part of one army? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nactigal Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Skaven are always at each other's throat even when working together. Each skaven is there because they are either too scared to retreat, are being paid, are in the process of filling a scheme, or are waiting for their opportunity to backstab someone of higher tank and take their place. Usually it's for all of those reasons at the same time. For example a Clan Skryre Engineer might hire some Clan Pestilens plague monks because they serve as meat shields for the precious warplightning cannon. Meanwhile a plague priest has sent the plague monks to spy on the engineer and spread a great plague on both the freecity and Clan Skryre. There are always multiple levels of schemes with Skaven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michu Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, PiotrW said: 1. Is it known where the Horned Rat came from and how exactly did he become a Chaos God? The book doesn't really go into details in relation to those matters. We don't exactly know how GHR came to existence but he ascended as chaos god shortly after End Times. When he moved Skavenblight (Blight city) to another dimension, skaven multiplied even more and their faith empowered GHR. 9 hours ago, PiotrW said: 2. As it's not mentioned, I understand that the Old World concept of "almost nobody believes the Skaven actually exist" didn't carry over to the Mortal Realms? That probably depends on the region. For example city of Excelsis is constantly besieged by skaven, so they definitely know they are real. Gloomspite Gitz are the new boogeyman. That old skaven fear probably still exist in the Realm of Azyr but not because they don't believe in their existence but they don't believe skaven could infiltrate the only safe Realm (they can, they have spies even in Sigmar's palace, besides you've definitely read in our BT that some aelven prince was murdered by Eshin IN AZYRHEIM!). Edited March 1, 2020 by michu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Aaaand the skaven have gained victory twice against a buddies flesh eater courts tournament list. although my roles were pretty bad at our first game. anyways I’ll give you guys a full report tomorrow or a few days later. here are a few pics 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 Well, officially signed up for Nova.. with new Seraphon, Lumineth, Giants + whatever else and a new GHB by the time September comes around I couldn't say what I'll bring.. I don't envision my potential lists changing too drastically until I see what the GHB changes. Speaking of.. wonder what we'll see. I still really wouldn't mind using Stormvermin but I don't think I'll ever be able to justify it at the cost. There's also that potential for the double-turn to be changed or removed. I only say this due to having the conversation with a local guy the other day when picking up my Fyreslayers... I could see some reasonable changes made but who knows. Either way, I have lots of practice for the next 6-7 months and lots of batreps to get up for you all 😅 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishwaffle2232 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 46 minutes ago, Gwendar said: Speaking of.. wonder what we'll see. I still really wouldn't mind using Stormvermin but I don't think I'll ever be able to justify it at the cost. There's also that potential for the double-turn to be changed or removed. I only say this due to having the conversation with a local guy the other day when picking up my Fyreslayers... I could see some reasonable changes made but who knows. I would love for them to do something crazy with the priority roll similar to what they do with warcry where, there are clear benefits for having priority but also for not getting it. So roll multiple dice and double, triples etc. Could be "cashed in" for abilities or buffs. As it stands I don't mind the double turn but I get why people don't like it. There is definitely the potential for bad play experiences. On the topic of tournaments I just signed up for Sydney GT all the way on October! Its in the realm Ghur so we have to bring along a beast. Tossing up between a hellpit abomination or a gargant that has been "skavenised" by clans moulder and skryre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendar Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 48 minutes ago, fishwaffle2232 said: I would love for them to do something crazy with the priority roll similar to what they do with warcry where, there are clear benefits for having priority but also for not getting it. So roll multiple dice and double, triples etc. Could be "cashed in" for abilities or buffs. As it stands I don't mind the double turn but I get why people don't like it. There is definitely the potential for bad play experiences. On the topic of tournaments I just signed up for Sydney GT all the way on October! Its in the realm Ghur so we have to bring along a beast. Tossing up between a hellpit abomination or a gargant that has been "skavenised" by clans moulder and skryre. I had thought of a similar thing before.. but just not sure how it would work in AoS without rewriting or adding a lot of rules. I had seen and was for something like if you double\get doubled then from then you are guaranteed the next double... though you would need to be careful with that as at that point you could probably just make it back and forth. The suggestion my guy made and a popular opinion was to make it close to that other game where you roll off after deployment (instead of it being whoever finishes first, nullifying low-drop lists) and you instead get a + to the roll if you finish first. On top of that, you can even throw in a Seize the Initiative mechanic for each turn if you have the CP for it if you really want to try to get that double. I actually wouldn't mind it honestly.. I feel it could make it more competitive and without the level of shooting 40k has, would potentially less feelsbad than getting shot off T1. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obeisance Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 Okay, so I straight up hate building lists at 1000pts. I have a doubles at the end of the month (with my wife who is using my OBR) and I can't decide what to take. Plus I haven't run Skaven in a while. Are Monks still good? Seer on Bell: Frenzy or Gale, Master of Magic, Skavenbrew. 20 Clanrats: Blades. 20 Clanrats: Blades 40 Monks: Blade/Staff. Hellpit Abomination. (Anti-infantry/heavy hitter.) =1000 Corruptor: Sword of Judgement, Verminous Valor. 20 Clanrats: Blades. 20 Clanrats: Blades. 40 Monks: Blade/Staff. Warpfire Thrower. (Expecting lots of infantry) Warpfire Thrower. Geminids. (Had 60 left.) =1000. I don't know, looking for ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Obeisance said: Monks still good? Yes, monks still are good, as long as your not using them against another bonereaper player with a 3+ reroll everything save. they will probably also struggle to Pierce through the armour of city of sigmar Ironbreaker units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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