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1 hour ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Something which is probably never going to happen considering how much some of these old units cost

A prime example being the 1 per $15 Skryre Acolytes. At the tournament Saturday, a lot of people were commenting about my Stormvermin\Irondrake converted Acolytes and asking what they were. I couldn't help but tell them I don't buy the real ones as it would cost me $450 for a unit of 30. The look on their faces 😄

21 minutes ago, Diemer84 said:

Hey folks

I ha e a tournament coming up, and a deadline for sending in the army rooster in 3 days... 

I have no idea of what to play😆

-snip-

I need some advice, what do you think? 
best regards

To be honest, I prefer the 2nd and that's with me thinking Thanquol isn't worth taking anymore after the WLV range reduction. 4x Warpfire could be nice, but man I would really like to sneak in a WLV somewhere for that, but it's not needed. Not to say the 1st isn't strong as well.. double Death Frenzying Monks or Stormvermin (or 1 for each) would be pretty nuts. I think either way you could do reasonably well. I would try to fit a Clawlord into the 1st for the +1 attack CA.. but again, double death frenzy could help enough without it.

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So I thought it would be a great idea to talk about points-changes in total with the skaven faction, since some of our units literally never see the battlefield.

to well find a solution to that with at least in points increases/decreases, I opened a thread and have put my own thoughts to those problems.

If you think that I’m literally talking nonsense, or just think the problem for certain units can be fixed differently or just want to agree/disagree with my, I would love to hear your own thoughts and ideas😁😁

 

Edited by Skreech Verminking

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1 hour ago, Gwendar said:

To be honest, I prefer the 2nd and that's with me thinking Thanquol isn't worth taking anymore after the WLV range reduction. 4x Warpfire could be nice, but man I would really like to sneak in a WLV somewhere for that, but it's not needed. Not to say the 1st isn't strong as well.. double Death Frenzying Monks or Stormvermin (or 1 for each) would be pretty nuts. I think either way you could do reasonably well. I would try to fit a Clawlord into the 1st for the +1 attack CA.. but again, double death frenzy could help enough without it.

What would you suggest instead of thanquol then? It’s impossible for me to fit in the WLV... 

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3 minutes ago, Diemer84 said:

What would you suggest instead of thanquol then? It’s impossible for me to fit in the WLV... 

I'm not saying you need WLV by any means, I just like it a lot.. but it works "best" by having a Grey Seer Skitterleap an Engineer\Arch-Warlock near a Gnawhole close to their deployment to fire it right into a them T1 and then escape in the movement phase. Grey Seer can do this too, but the 3d6-take-out-1 mathematically isn't as good as a re-roll from a Spark that will also get the +1 from being near the Gnawhole; the Grey Seer cannot use the 3d6 roll and get the +1 modifier.

Again, Thanquol is just fine.. I like him for what he can do which is murder hordes\elite units reasonably well. I just always saw him as a method of casting WLV when it was 26" setup and since then I never use him as those 400 points can be spent on the above + Clanrats or more endless spells.

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should I drop the stormfiends instead for more reliable shooting as say 9 jezzails? 

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9 minutes ago, Diemer84 said:

should I drop the stormfiends instead for more reliable shooting as say 9 jezzails? 

Nah, I wouldn't do that. I had success this past weekend without Fiends, but I think if you dropped them for 9 Jezzails you would definitely feel it. 9 Jezzails are not clearing 1-2 units per turn like 6 Fiends will; they whittle down\kill Heroes with 5-14 wounds but I rarely fire them at anything else unless they're in a bad spot and can't shoot at they prefer.

Honestly, the best thing you can do is what I do; just get 1-3 games in with a list, tweak it as you see fit and keep notes\memorize what went wrong and why. That's largely why I do battle reports (on top of I just enjoy doing them in general). If it isn't working for you then try a completely different list. Practice makes perfect is a true statement 😉

Also, I couldn't say what your local meta looks like. I make my lists with the idea that they will work in major tournaments (I'll likely be attending Nashcon and Nova this year at a minimum) so I don't build anything towards my local guys. If you only play locally, that will influence what anyone here can suggest.

Edited by Gwendar

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13 hours ago, Gwendar said:

I'm not saying you need WLV by any means, I just like it a lot.. but it works "best" by having a Grey Seer Skitterleap an Engineer\Arch-Warlock near a Gnawhole close to their deployment to fire it right into a them T1 and then escape in the movement phase. Grey Seer can do this too, but the 3d6-take-out-1 mathematically isn't as good as a re-roll from a Spark that will also get the +1 from being near the Gnawhole; the Grey Seer cannot use the 3d6 roll and get the +1 modifier.

How often do you find you can get this off. I've had a couple of game where I've actually been able to do this but more often than not I can't get gnawholes into a place where i can get close enough to get the buff and still be close enough to drop the WLV on what I want. Is the combo really worth investing in? This is something I have been considering lately, as I'm usually on the fence as to whether I should take it or not. 

It's still one of those spells that can be game changing when it gets off, but a pretty big points investment. 

Interesting to see the LVO list didnt take it. 

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So I’ve been using the new rules for terrain-features and noticed that our gnaw-holes still seem to be pretty illegal.

for some reason I’m unable to fit a gnawhole exactly 3 away from the edge of the battlefield and wholly within 8.

does anybody else have a similar problem?

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37 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

So I’ve been using the new rules for terrain-features and noticed that our gnaw-holes still seem to be pretty illegal.

for some reason I’m unable to fit a gnawhole exactly 3 away from the edge of the battlefield and wholly within 8.

does anybody else have a similar problem?

They did some FAQ for this, lets see:

Page 56 – Pitched Battles, Battlefields
Change the third paragraph to:
‘The players then roll off and alternate setting up their terrain features one at a time, starting with the player that won the roll-off. Terrain features must be set up more than 3" from the edge of the battlefield, more than 6" from any other terrain features and more than 1" from any objectives. Sometimes this will make it impossible for a terrain feature to be set up; in this case, it is not used.’

Page 56 – Pitched Battles, Faction Terrain
Change the first and second paragraphs to:
‘Sometimes the allegiance abilities for an army will allow it to include one or more terrain features, or a warscroll will allow you to set up one or more terrain features once the battle has begun. These are set up in addition to the Pitched Battle terrain features the player must set up as described above.

In a Pitched Battle, faction terrain must be set up more than 3" from any other terrain features and more
than 1" from any objectives, in addition to any other restrictions that apply to it. Sometimes this will make it impossible for a faction terrain piece to be set up; in this case, it is not used.’

Edited by Darkhan

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41 minutes ago, Darkhan said:

In a Pitched Battle, faction terrain must be set up more than 3" from any other terrain features and more
than 1" from any objectives, in addition to any other restrictions that apply to it. Sometimes this will make it impossible for a faction terrain piece to be set up; in this case, it is not used.’

Ok thanks,

I didn’t know that this rule a both existed.

I definitely have to have a look at them again

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22 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Ok thanks,

I didn’t know that this rule a both existed.

I definitely have to have a look at them again

They messed everything up..so now it is something like, 3 from other terrain, 1 from objective, while wholly within 8 of the board edge.

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10 minutes ago, Darkhan said:

They messed everything up..so now it is something like, 3 from other terrain, 1 from objective, while wholly within 8 of the board edge.

Well i’ts better then I thought it was.

I’ve been playing the gnawholes with the terrain rules, were you have to be basically more then 6inches away from other terrain feature wholly within 8of the edge and more then 3 away from the edge.
 

If you wouldn’t have told me that this isn’t the case I would have kept playing it wrong for probably this whole edition😂

 

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5 hours ago, fishwaffle2232 said:

How often do you find you can get this off. I've had a couple of game where I've actually been able to do this but more often than not I can't get gnawholes into a place where i can get close enough to get the buff and still be close enough to drop the WLV on what I want. Is the combo really worth investing in? This is something I have been considering lately, as I'm usually on the fence as to whether I should take it or not. 

It's still one of those spells that can be game changing when it gets off, but a pretty big points investment. 

Interesting to see the LVO list didnt take it. 

Depends on the battleplan, honestly. If my opponent is clustering on the left or right side, I can do it.. if they deploy more center then obviously I'm not really doing it and reserve it for later.

It's been disappearing a lot more since the change and I don't think it's necessary.. I mean, I didn't use it this past weekend and I did just fine. That said, I think in the IJ game it would've been incredibly useful.. but the other 2 it wasn't needed. Not having it allowed me to have another 20 Clanrats which is great as it allowed me to have a unit of 40 to counter against an opponents heavy deployment on a particular side.

I think with the Bridge it's still a nice pairing, but.. we also aren't seeing the Bridge in every list anymore.

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Hi Guys and Girls. Since 2020 ist the Seat of the rat I am going to start a Skaven Army. I would Love to get some advice on my list.

Grey Seer (skitterleap)

Warpseer (Master of Magic; jumps in front, casts and disapears through holes)

Engineer (mmmwp, injector)

Engineer (mmmwp)

3×20 Clanrats

6 Stormfiends

Vortex and Soulscream Bridge

I now have 280points left and i am Not Sure what to Take. I thought about 40 plaguemonks, a hell Pit or 6 jezzails. What would you recommend?

I would Love to hear some tipps and suggestions .

Cheers,

Henry

 

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Scroll up, Gwendar has recently discussed the merits of skitterleaping a warlock to cast WLV. Nothing against warpseer but he’s better kept near your clanrats for battleshock protection. Your second warlock is backup for your primary warlock (with the vigordust) so he can hang around near the gnawhole without fear of being out of position.

Both 40 Plague Monks or 6 Jezzails would be a great choice for your remaining 280pts. Why not buy both to give you more flexibility?

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6 hours ago, HNDRXX9717 said:

Hi Guys and Girls. Since 2020 ist the Seat of the rat I am going to start a Skaven Army. I would Love to get some advice on my list.

Grey Seer (skitterleap)

Warpseer (Master of Magic; jumps in front, casts and disapears through holes)

Engineer (mmmwp, injector)

Engineer (mmmwp)

3×20 Clanrats

6 Stormfiends

Vortex and Soulscream Bridge

I now have 280points left and i am Not Sure what to Take. I thought about 40 plaguemonks, a hell Pit or 6 jezzails. What would you recommend?

I would Love to hear some tipps and suggestions .

Cheers,

Henry

 

As @Cosmicsheep said I would at least go back and read the last few pages; we've been having a lot of various list discussions. (You can also read through some of my Skaven batreps if you want to get some ideas of things 😉)

But yeah, Monks and Jezzails are both great compliments.. though I'm currently considering hopping off the Monk train and onto other things, but that isn't to say they're bad by any means. I just experiment a lot.. but 6 Jezzails will help cover your Hero sniping option; 9 will be better if you can squeeze it in though. Either way, welcome.

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On 1/27/2020 at 6:05 PM, Gwendar said:

After this weekend, I wasn't too keen on Monks. The last 5 games or so I've used them in I just... really wasn't a fan. I hated the dice rolling of their previous iteration, and I'm not saying they're terrible in their current but they just haven't worked well for me. As I said in my batreps, I really think I could've used them more aggressively, especially with Death Frenzy.. but I never wanted them to get hit first and against my first 2 opponents, that was a high probability. So, they got stuck behind Clanrats and when they could've done something, they either under-performed or the game was already over thanks to the Acolytes\Jezzails.

I have a few ideas bouncing around in my head, but the 3rd place win at LVO (Hellpit, 6 Fiends, 40 Monks) had me thinking about the Hellpit in place of Monks. It's unfortunate no-one seemed to cover LVO so we have no footage.. but getting 3rd seems a nice feet, although there were complaints about the matchups being weird such as a #5 going against a #70-something in game 4, etc.

Anyway, here's what I'm currently thinking:

  Hide contents

Allegiance: Skaventide

Leaders
Verminlord Warpseer (320)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic
Warlock Engineer (100)
- Artefact: Vigordust Injector
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
Warlock Engineer (100)
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!

Battleline
40 x Clanrats (200)
- Rusty Blade
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade

Units
30 x Skryre Acolytes (320)
9 x Warplock Jezzails (420)

Behemoths
Hell Pit Abomination (240)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 162
 

 

I have a 6 hour deadline to send in my tournament list, so panicking😆

Which lists would you consider most competitive at the moment?

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1 hour ago, Diemer84 said:

I have a 6 hour deadline to send in my tournament list, so panicking😆

Which lists would you consider most competitive at the moment?

What I ran with last weekend seems good.. definitely up there and could podium in my opinion (of course lots of factors there) but you're also still seeing quite a lot of 6 Fiends + 40 Monks lists doing well. 1 of these had a Hellpit in it and took 3rd at LVO which is pretty major.

There have been a few other tournaments this past week that I can't find any list data on; Waaaghpaca specifically, which had a 1st and 3rd place Skaven win. I know the 1st list had 6 Fiends, 6? Jezzails as well as Thanquol + a Bell (and 1-2 Engineers) with Clanrats but that's all I could gather from pictures.. that guy in particular has done well going 5-0 in 5 tournaments 2019\2020. So, is Thanquol a competitive choice? Maybe.. but I don't think he's worth the 400 points when we need to fit in 2-3 other threats.

Overall, I think you have to consider the core of these lists that are pulling the weight: 6 Fiends is still doing quite well, with\without a Bridge (but if you can fit it, it's nice to have for utility sake) and post-nerf Monks are still good with Death Frenzy. We have our own hard counters so it's important not to have all your eggs in 1-basket. Being able to take Monks + Jezzails + X is wonderful for focus splitting and redundancy. 6 Fiends will still delete 1-2 units per turn if given the chance but they die quicker now. Supplement that with Monks for weak saved unit clearing and\or 6-9 Jezzails for an additional hero threat (along with the Windlauncher shots) and I think you have a solid list. WLV isn't really needed anymore.. I enjoy it but once it's down it generally stays there; it definitely makes your opponent wary of grouping things together, so it has a mental-game aspect to it.

I play rather passively, but I think outside of pure Pestilens\Verminous lists, the Skryre-based lists strengths are positioning and counter-play. Anyone who reads my batreps sees that I tend to play it back T1\2, apply pressure where it's needed and go in late game with Clanrats stealing objectives once the enemy threat is mostly gone from the board with the above 2-3 hammers you bring along.

Sorry that was.. a bit rambly, but I tend to put all my thoughts out there 😉

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Going to a small point tournement here soon and i was wondering what is best for 1200 points. What do people think about this list? Is the Bell too much maybe?
 

  Hide contents

Allegiance: Skaventide

Leaders
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (240)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Arch-Warlock (160)
- Artefact: Vigordust Injector
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!

Battleline
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
- 1x Standard Bearers
- 1x Standard Bell Ringers
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
- 1x Standard Bearers
- 1x Standard Bell Ringers

Units
30 x Skryre Acolytes (320)

Behemoths
Hell Pit Abomination (240)

Total: 1200 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 101
 

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Just went 3/0 at a one dayer and won with my Eshin fellow rats, went 3/2 at heat 1 as the only rat player.

So far I’ve gone

3/0 twice

4/2 once

3/2 once

2/1 once

Its working for me!

Who needs monks and fiends when you have gutter runners 😉

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3 minutes ago, Bank-C said:

Just went 3/0 at a one dayer and won with my Eshin fellow rats, went 3/2 at heat 1 as the only rat player.

So far I’ve gone

3/0 twice

4/2 once

3/2 once

2/1 once

Its working for me!

Who needs monks and fiends when you have gutter runners 😉

Who needs any of those when you’ve got 400clanrats😋🤪😜
 

edit: still that sounds amazing.

I would love to here your tales and stories of the infamous clans eshins victorious days!😁

Edited by Skreech Verminking

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2 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Who needs any of those when you’ve got 400clanrats😋🤪😜
 

edit: still that sounds amazing.

I would love to here your tales and stories of the infamous clans eshins victorious days!😁

Yes-yes we kill-slay in the year of the horned rat! We are the greater clan we saved the mortal realms from dead-god thing Nagash. Our operatives infiltrated his black pyramid and stopped him!

My personal highlights are my slinktalon deathmaster with sword of judgement, his fighting claws 7 attacks re-rolling hits ( not failed hits) have claimed many victims, 19 wounds to an exalted greater daemon of Khorne! Stonehorns, carnosaurs and many little characters have met their deaths to him.

And Cube of Mists is THE best item on a deathmaster. Just have a look at it. Saved me so many times from a charge.

400 Clanrats could be problematic, would you like a clawsworn eshin slinktalon haha!

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3 hours ago, Bank-C said:

Just went 3/0 at a one dayer and won with my Eshin fellow rats, went 3/2 at heat 1 as the only rat player.

So far I’ve gone

3/0 twice

4/2 once

3/2 once

2/1 once

Its working for me!

Who needs monks and fiends when you have gutter runners 😉

Interesting.. what does your local meta look like and what are you running for a list? It would work against some of the more casual players in my area but I haven't really felt like trying it since I've been practicing for Nashcon and Nova.




Speaking of; ran the 6 Fiends\40 Monks list again today against OBR and lost all priority rolls and got double turned going into 2. 40 Monks killed 13 Mortek with Death Frenzy pile in and explosions from dying but.. meh. They would still do well against other things that don't have 3+ RR's but I'm still not sold. 1 key reason being that it's another spell that really needs to go off and when it doesn't the damage goes down a lot. Having something like a Hell Pit that didn't require buffing and can act on it's own (like the Jezzails) I think could be a nice addition. I looked at replacing the Monks with 20 Gutter Runners but.. no contest really, as unfortunate as it is. Even the Fiends didn't do much; a unit of 10 Kavalos kept them tied up after them + 2 Crawlers melted the 40 Clanrats in 2 turns. Ah well.

Anyway, another game vs. Sylvaneth tomorrow and will probably run the same setup and give it 1 more chance. I'll have a full batrep for that one done.

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16 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

Interesting.. what does your local meta look like and what are you running for a list? It would work against some of the more casual players in my area but I haven't really felt like trying it since I've been practicing for Nashcon and Nova.




Speaking of; ran the 6 Fiends\40 Monks list again today against OBR and lost all priority rolls and got double turned going into 2. 40 Monks killed 13 Mortek with Death Frenzy pile in and explosions from dying but.. meh. They would still do well against other things that don't have 3+ RR's but I'm still not sold. 1 key reason being that it's another spell that really needs to go off and when it doesn't the damage goes down a lot. Having something like a Hell Pit that didn't require buffing and can act on it's own (like the Jezzails) I think could be a nice addition. I looked at replacing the Monks with 20 Gutter Runners but.. no contest really, as unfortunate as it is. Even the Fiends didn't do much; a unit of 10 Kavalos kept them tied up after them + 2 Crawlers melted the 40 Clanrats in 2 turns. Ah well.

Anyway, another game vs. Sylvaneth tomorrow and will probably run the same setup and give it 1 more chance. I'll have a full batrep for that one done.

My local meta is the UK scene, I play all over. I’ve beaten bonereapers, big waaagh, mawtribes, yet to play tzeentch, it works for me and I’m happy it does. If it doesn’t for you doesn’t matter 😉 it’s all for the horned rat. I’m also in positive wins every event so it’s not that bad but it depends on player skill I suppose, it’s not a point and click army.

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8 minutes ago, Bank-C said:

My local meta is the UK scene, I play all over. I’ve beaten bonereapers, big waaagh, mawtribes, yet to play tzeentch, it works for me and I’m happy it does. If it doesn’t for you doesn’t matter 😉 it’s all for the horned rat. I’m also in positive wins every event so it’s not that bad but it depends on player skill I suppose, it’s not a point and click army.

Well, I'm just saying on paper it doesn't work out for me but I love Eshin and would like to run them more; played them a lot in 1st ed AoS. In practice I know it could be different which is why I'm curious at what your list looks like. I imagine it's a Deathmaster, Deceiver, 40-80 Night Runners and the rest Gutter Runners? Not a wide variance in Eshin so what you do see is generally samey.

Edited by Gwendar

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