AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Coyote]

I was concerned they would shut down my casting?   I suppose with the a Grey Seer I can count on 1 spell a turn.

I have kind of a crazy idea, but not sure how it would fly.  My plan is to assassinate the Slann on turn 1, need to be a little lucky if I’m to get a WLC in range.  Another thought was getting 2 Ratling guns (and engineer) in range, but they move 6” and shoot 12” so that’s not a statistically sound enough plan. 

 

How about a 4 drop list -

Deceiver

Grey Seer

15x Gutter  Runner

10x Gutter Runner

Edited July 13, 2019 by Coyote

[Gwendar]

@Coyote I mean, Slann can unbind board wide so that's always a threat but.. with the 30" unbind range of everyone else I find that my spellcasting is almost always threatened regardless, but that's why the Gnawholes, re-rolls, Master of Magic, etc. help with this. There are plenty of other armies who can shut down your casting far easier than Seraphon.

Between those 2 options, I would go with the WLC idea.. but I'm not certain your proposed Gutter Runner one will work. That really depends on the competency of who you're playing against. I know my Seraphon player would never dream of letting a melee unit like Gutter Runners get anywhere near it.. and even if they did, they would need to make a 9" charge at best when they come in from the edge. Sure, you can Skitterleap the Deceiver in on top of that and you may get lucky with rolls, but overall he won't put out enough damage to kill it on his own unless you bring SoJ and get a couple of nice 6's.

The best advice I can give is just to try it out, see what works and then adjust for next time. 

Edited July 13, 2019 by Gwendar

[Nikobot]

Issue with WLC is trying to get in range of a slaan with a 27" threat range. The slaan can virtually hide as its just a summoning engine. A smart player will deploy out of range and then its an uphill battle from there trying to get him without something else to threaten him e.g. gutter runners etc

Might be an idea to place  2 gnawholes up the sides of the board and see if you get an opportunity for him to drift within range of one of those and then slip your WLC through, but a wise slaan should  know the main threat on the board and avoid this trap.

[Gwendar]

Absolutely, which is why I prefer Jezzails + Deranged Inventor\MMMWP for a 36" threat range. Most of the time I've played against a Slann, it's going up on a balewind and it can't hide. The best you can do is, like you said, get a Gnawhole with a good sight-line to their deployment and hope they don't put Skinks on top of it... but they will.

Seriously, short of this your best bet is getting a T1 WLV off and hope you can kill it off right away with that alone. All of the arguments about them staying out of range and hiding can still be said for Gutter Runners. They can easily screen themselves off from them and then after the GR's kill all the Skinks, they just teleport away assuming they get the next turn.

[Coyote]

Brutal, brutal game.  I’ll try to give a better write up later, 750 points and I killed 2 Troglodons,1 Engine of the Gods, 1 Unit of 10 skinks, and 4/5 of Saurus Knights.

The board was 48x48 inches - diagonal... which could have put the Slann deep into the deployment zone, and we deployed standard 24” apart.

i brought Grey Seer, Snoutgrovel, Death Frenzy, Master of Magic

Warplock Bombadier who I think got most valuable Skaven of the night

2x Ratling Guns - sooo much damage generated

1 x Warpfire Thrower - immediately killed

1x 20 Clanrats

1x40 Clanrats 

Great game, no real errors, flat out beat me only on objective points for the campaign scenario.  I had most units on board at the end ( !) 

At one point she was down to only the Slann.  

 

[Gwendar]

@Coyote That sucks, but it sounds like you did pretty well all in all. That warpfire thrower got about what I expected it to get.. I brought it for 2 games when we first got the tome and, well, even with almost no shooting my local meta knows to kill it before it can do anything... and that's pretty easy to do.

What would you say you learned and what to try next?

[Seihoff]

Hi everyone.

With the recent changes to our points, is the Warpseer still the best verminlord option for a mixed/skryre list? I tend to use 60/80 clanrats, 40 monks, screaming Bell, arch-warlock, jezzails, WLC, acolytes/stormfiends, etc.

Thank you very much!

[Skreech Verminking]

26 minutes ago, Seihoff said:

Hi everyone.

With the recent changes to our points, is the Warpseer still the best verminlord option for a mixed/skryre list? I tend to use 60/80 clanrats, 40 monks, screaming Bell, arch-warlock, jezzails, WLC, acolytes/stormfiends, etc.

Thank you very much!

Dunno, although he still might be the better caster between the verminlords thanks to his axes to the  Masterclan warlordtraits and his dreaded warpgale spell.

And with his command ability he still seems to be a good option for any skaven army

[AlexanderGonzo]

Hey everyone! 

Just got some skaven from a friend of mine! Can anyone explain to me how this army functions and what some must haves! Also what are some notable combos that the rats process?! 

 

Thanks everyone!

[Skreech Verminking]

33 minutes ago, AlexanderGonzo said:

Hey everyone! 

Just got some skaven from a friend of mine! Can anyone explain to me how this army functions and what some must haves! Also what are some notable combos that the rats process?! 

 

Thanks everyone!

Well there are tons of combination and tricks we can use thanks to the battletome we now have.

I think the recently used tactic for the skaven in the tournament scene was to use a ton of magic caster, who would the. Lay traps like the Warplightning vortex and other endless spells to damage or hinder enemy from moving up.

as it is right now, no pry really knows, best bet is to just try a few things out and go with what you like the most.

 

[wander]

Hi everyone,

I posted this yesterday in the Pestilens topic, though I think I may get a quicker answer here with what could work in updating my Pestilens Skaventide list now we have the new points. I've needed to drop some things and I'm really lax to drop the Corruptor as it's my lone Wizard to counter enemy spell-casting. I used to have Chronomantic Cogs to get everyone in quickly too and at 80pts with the point increases, I'm struggling to figure how and if to include them. My current list does include a Plagueclaw Catapult, though as I mostly face off against Nighthaunt, I use that to character snipe and it's my lone ranged support so even with it being shakey hitting things, I don't really want to cut it out.

Current list atm looks something like this:

Plague Furnace (General) + master of rot and ruin, +liber bubonicus (200)

Plague Furnace (200)

Verminlord Corruptor (280) + 2nd relic (undecided atm, sword of judgement perhaps?)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

20x Monks (staves) (160)

Plagueclaw Catapult (160)

Congregation of Filth (160)

--

I could replace the Congregation with another Plagueclaw though I'm happy with the one as 320pts is a lot for two shaky catapults. The 2nd artifact isn't a huge thing to lose, though more concerned on what to shift around for the Cogs or if I even should (fairly sure my friend's Nighthaunt list will have them, so I can get movement from him casting that).

Though I could drop the Congregation, bump the last Monk group to x30 and get the Cogs that way. I'm not sure if losing the protective buff from it (also extra command point) is that good a trade.

Also how does the list look? With contrast paints, doing the Monks is quick enough now.

Cheers everyone.

[Unter]

16 hours ago, wander said:

Hi everyone,

I posted this yesterday in the Pestilens topic, though I think I may get a quicker answer here with what could work in updating my Pestilens Skaventide list now we have the new points. I've needed to drop some things and I'm really lax to drop the Corruptor as it's my lone Wizard to counter enemy spell-casting. I used to have Chronomantic Cogs to get everyone in quickly too and at 80pts with the point increases, I'm struggling to figure how and if to include them. My current list does include a Plagueclaw Catapult, though as I mostly face off against Nighthaunt, I use that to character snipe and it's my lone ranged support so even with it being shakey hitting things, I don't really want to cut it out.

Current list atm looks something like this:

Plague Furnace (General) + master of rot and ruin, +liber bubonicus (200)

Plague Furnace (200)

Verminlord Corruptor (280) + 2nd relic (undecided atm, sword of judgement perhaps?)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

40x Monks (staves) (280)

20x Monks (staves) (160)

Plagueclaw Catapult (160)

Congregation of Filth (160)

--

I could replace the Congregation with another Plagueclaw though I'm happy with the one as 320pts is a lot for two shaky catapults. The 2nd artifact isn't a huge thing to lose, though more concerned on what to shift around for the Cogs or if I even should (fairly sure my friend's Nighthaunt list will have them, so I can get movement from him casting that).

Though I could drop the Congregation, bump the last Monk group to x30 and get the Cogs that way. I'm not sure if losing the protective buff from it (also extra command point) is that good a trade.

Also how does the list look? With contrast paints, doing the Monks is quick enough now.

Cheers everyone.

If you want to take the Corruptor with SoJ, I'd advise a Masterclan General with Skitterleap to at least get him to 9" away, otherwise you just gotta waddle across the board and hope they don't screen their heroes.

Bell would be the better choice as it would give you a larger zone of battleshock immunity, which would otherwise be a problem with a monk army.

[wander]

I was thinking if I did keep the Congregation that the Shyish artefact 'Ethereal Amulet' could be a fair choice for the Corruptor, to make him a little tankier, though I'm not really going to miss the 2nd artefact if I drop it for 10 more Monks and the Chronomantic Cogs.

I'm going specifically Pestilens with this army (it's updating what I already have), so I have no interest in adding Masterclan in and a Screaming Bell into the army. The other option is dropping the 2nd Plague Furnace to get the 4th unit of Monks to x40 and adding in the Cogs, keeping the Plagueclaw and Congregation, though I'm lax to do that as the Plague Furnace is too good for the buffs to drop now.

[Crowvus]

If you make a masterclan hero your general you retain the clans pestilens army benefits.  Just fyi

[Blitzd]

I'm just starting out skaven, could someone tell me what's good about the warpseer? I'm not sure if I'm missing something, but I can save 80 points and take 2x bells instead of warpseer and bell. 

[Skreech Verminking]

6 minutes ago, Blitzd said:

I'm just starting out skaven, could someone tell me what's good about the warpseer? I'm not sure if I'm missing something, but I can save 80 points and take 2x bells instead of warpseer and bell. 

Warpseer:

-generates a cp on a 3+ And D3 on a 6 every turn at the beginning of the herophase.

-can cast two spells, knows the dreaded warpgale spell, which deals d6 mortal wounds on a enemy units within 26inches, as well as halving the run and chargeroll of that unit.

-has the Masterclan keyword, giving him some great warlordtraits and artefacts like master of magic (+1on the cast), suspicious stone (5+ feel no pain), etc.

-has a 26wholy within ranche of battleshock immunity aura, when spending a cp in the battleshockphase.

-can be almost unkillable when given the suspicious stone artefact (4+ reroll able save, 5++ and another 5++ feel no pain)

[Nikobot]

Don't forget his handy once per game 13" missile auto-hit for d6 mortal wounds.. so auto d6 MWs with a 12" MV + 13" threat range

but then you lose the re-rollable save

he's a really useful and handy toolkit for the skaven army

[Num]

OK I'm going to enroll in a summer league ran by my local shop. One needs lists that can evolve from 1k to 2k.

As I haven't played for a while, may I ask for some feedback on the following evolving list please? I am especially unsure about which trait/artifact to take.

 

1000pts

Allegiance: Skaventide
Arch-Warlock (160)
- General
- Trait: Verminous Valour
- Artefact: Vigordust Injector
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
Warlock Engineer (100)
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: Warp Lightning Shield
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Spear
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
15 x Skryre Acolytes (180)
Warp Lightning Cannon (180)
Warp Lightning Vortex (100)
Soulsnare Shackles (40)

 

1500pts:

+ Balewind Vortex (40)

+ 20 clanrats (120)

+ 1 War Lightning Cannon (180)

+ 1 Grey Seer (140) with Skitterleap

 

2000pts:

+ 6 stormfiends (520)

(Change the arch warlock trait to deranged inventor?)

 

The main "trick" is the skitterleap + spells + back with a gnawhole.

The balewind is either for the grey seer, or for the warlock engineer. On top of a balewind, the engineer can cast its spell twice (so 2d6 if overcharged, which isn't very risky). The engineer also has time to come back through a gnawhole in time to buff a WLC in the shooting phase.

What do you think?

Cheers

[Coyote]

On 7/14/2019 at 7:02 PM, Gwendar said:

@Coyote 

What would you say you learned and what to try next?

I’ve been meditating quite a bit about the question- and still having trouble articulating.

- My second enemy in every game is terrain.  

- Opponent cast 1 spell - Cogs - that I tried twice to unbind- on a 7.  

- We agreed that the 3 dice from Warpstone from Grey Seer not used for unbinding by rules, all my other rolling was extraordinarily good so not disappointed.

- Bombadier- Who *never* hits, and when he does *never wounds* - 1 shot killed a Troglodon.  So that helped.

- Probably will not see shooting that good again.

- Army theme was “Rats with Machine Guns” -

- Always will max out Ratling guns, +1 Damage from Bombadier is fantastic, Ability to re-roll 14 hits and wounds will average 7ish -1 wounds is Majestic

- Doubt I’ll see rolls like that again so don’t build list with expectation Guns won’t die

 

[Gwendar]

@Coyote Right, the tokens only work "when this model attempts to cast a spell" so you got that right. Unbinds can be a fickle thing; even with my magic heavy list and +'s I struggle to roll above 5-6 when I try to unbind.

Bombardier is generally seen as better just because of the longer range but, overall it's preference.. neither are particularly consistent about hitting and it's plink damage you shouldn't count on anyway. You're on point with maxing out the Ratlings but keep in mind they can be killed quite easily. Best bet most of the time is when they're used through a Gnawhole or defensively if you can keep them out of range.. but that probably means they'll be out of range as well.

All in all it's a dice game so you'll see plenty of times where they do absolutely nothing and other times where you could pack 2 WLC's, overcharge both of them and they both roll a 1 on power dice and don't roll any 1's and your opponent calls BS. If you want reliability and range, as always I will recommend 6-9 Jezzails since they don't even need to be buffed. 20-30 Acolytes will remove literally anything they shoot at when buffed and act as close-medium range hammers while the Jezzails plink off at heroes\elites and this combo hasn't failed me yet.

[Blitzd]

8 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Warpseer:

-generates a cp on a 3+ And D3 on a 6 every turn at the beginning of the herophase.

-can cast two spells, knows the dreaded warpgale spell, which deals d6 mortal wounds on a enemy units within 26inches, as well as halving the run and chargeroll of that unit.

-has the Masterclan keyword, giving him some great warlordtraits and artefacts like master of magic (+1on the cast), suspicious stone (5+ feel no pain), etc.

-has a 26wholy within ranche of battleshock immunity aura, when spending a cp in the battleshockphase.

-can be almost unkillable when given the suspicious stone artefact (4+ reroll able save, 5++ and another 5++ feel no pain)

But screaming bell can take the same artifacts, a lightly, but not by much, worse spell, 13" battleshock immunity to everything for free and would be a 2nd peal of Doom. 

Don't mean to sound combative or anything, just trying to learn everything I can admit the army and unit choices, I really appreciate it. 

[Skreech Verminking]

8 hours ago, Blitzd said:

But screaming bell can take the same artifacts, a lightly, but not by much, worse spell, 13" battleshock immunity to everything for free and would be a 2nd peal of Doom. 

Don't mean to sound combative or anything, just trying to learn everything I can admit the army and unit choices, I really appreciate it. 

Well I would go for the bell anyway since it cost less points then the warpseer, but in the end you’ll have to face the truth and that is that the warpseer is probably the ultimate survivor of the game.

unlike the screaming bell, which needs support of massive hordes of Infanterie to move the Verminlord can scurry away without any help.

sure the screaming bell has a 13wholly within inch Aura ability of free battlshock immunity, but should you ever go the full horde style play, many to some of us have chosen to play, you’ll notice that a 26wholly within aura will be better then the 13inch bubble. 

But what really makes the Warpseer so great, is his cp farming ability, which is even better then that of the fungoid cave Shaman.

now in total I would probably say that both are a good, choices, since there are more than just the warpseer command-ability that can deal with battle-shock (like the doom bell, my favorite endless spell). In the end it only depends which model you like more and what role you have given it.

I mean if you need a reliable caster that has the option to take spells from the lore of the grey seer, you’re better of taking the bell.

another reason for the bell would be those 80juicy points, that could be spend on something differently, like pumping your small unit of 20clanrats to 40, or taking a plague priest or one of our many wonder weapons from clan skryre.

also unlike the Verminlord, the bell is a much easier purchase, since it is available in our  starter collecting, which gives you next to that even a warplightning cannon and some of our most cheesiest killing units in the whole game “plague monks”

[Blitzd]

2 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Well I would go for the bell anyway since it cost less points then the warpseer, but in the end you’ll have to face the truth and that is that the warpseer is probably the ultimate survivor of the game.

unlike the screaming bell, which needs support of massive hordes of Infanterie to move the Verminlord can scurry away without any help.

sure the screaming bell has a 13wholly within inch Aura ability of free battlshock immunity, but should you ever go the full horde style play, many to some of us have chosen to play, you’ll notice that a 26wholly within aura will be better then the 13inch bubble. 

But what really makes the Warpseer so great, is his cp farming ability, which is even better then that of the fungoid cave Shaman.

now in total I would probably say that both are a good, choices, since there are more than just the warpseer command-ability that can deal with battle-shock (like the doom bell, my favorite endless spell). In the end it only depends which model you like more and what role you have given it.

I mean if you need a reliable caster that has the option to take spells from the lore of the grey seer, you’re better of taking the bell.

another reason for the bell would be those 80juicy points, that could be spend on something differently, like pumping your small unit of 20clanrats to 40, or taking a plague priest or one of our many wonder weapons from clan skryre.

also unlike the Verminlord, the bell is a much easier purchase, since it is available in our  starter collecting, which gives you next to that even a warplightning cannon and some of our most cheesiest killing units in the whole game “plague monks”

 

Awesome, thanks for all the advice

This is what I'm currently looking at. If like to get a cp to start, but I think I can deploy it of charge range when I need to instead

Allegiance: Skaventide

Leaders
Arch-Warlock (160)
- General
- Trait: Deranged Inventor 
- Artefact: Vigordust Injector 
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Verminlord Warpseer (300)
Grey Seer (140)
- Lore of Ruin: Skitterleap

Battleline
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Spear
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Spear
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Spear

Units
40 x Plague Monks (280)
- Foetid Blades
- 1x Icon of Pestilence
- 1x Contagion Banner
- 1x Doom Gongs
- 1x Bale Chimes
9 x Warplock Jezzails (420)

Endless Spells / Terrain
Warp Lightning Vortex (100)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 154
 

[Unter]

Very solid, I like it

[deumosd]

Hi All,

Just wondered if I could please pick some of your brains?

I have entered the meeting engagements tournament this Sunday. Now I have not actually played any meeting engagements battles yet (I know bad preparation) (also first proper tournament) but have been tinkering with lists. What do people think of the following please- if you have any ideas.

List 1:

Spearhead:  20x clan rats

Main Body:

Warpseer- general

40x clan rats

 

Rear guard:

Warplock engineer

3x stormfeinds

 

List 2: (more for fun)

3x stormfeinds

Main Body:

Warplock engineer- general

6x stormfeinds

 

Rear guard:

Rattling cannon

Any thoughts would be appreciated- thanks.